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Torah cannot be taught on a message board.I'm here to study at your feet but you refuse to teach. I've read the Torah, the NT, some Eastern stuff, and a bit of the Koran (probably <20 suras). They all seem equally believable.I suggest studying.
You say good idea, but no buying books.
Today you insist on not studying.
Which is the real you?
I haven't read ALL the scriptures. Who has besides someone with no life or a religious scholar of some kind? Anyhow, I don't need to read all the scriptures because it is the entire concept that I don't believe, not the particulars.
I am not saying that there are not some good things contained within these scriptures and some good advice and lessons. I just don't buy into the concept of a god is all.
That shouldn't matter since you cannot predict anything about how one will turn out, religious or non-religious. All children should have an opportunity to be cleansed of the original sin if there was one. They are not guilty of anything. Does this also mean that a stillborn fetus is not going to heaven because they are cursed with a sin because Eve ate a damn apple off the tree of knowledge and evil (let's note how they put knowledge and evil together- that's no accident). What about a young newborn who hasn't been baptized yet? I suppose there are some exceptions to the rules?
That shouldn't matter since you cannot predict anything about how one will turn out, religious or non-religious. All children should have an opportunity to be cleansed of the original sin if there was one. They are not guilty of anything. Does this also mean that a stillborn fetus is not going to heaven because they are cursed with a sin because Eve ate a damn apple off the tree of knowledge and evil (let's note how they put knowledge and evil together- that's no accident). What about a young newborn who hasn't been baptized yet? I suppose there are some exceptions to the rules?
Correct. Free will means one can change one's mind. Remember, Baptism is the visible sign of an invisible reality. Just because some never had the opportunity to act out the signs of the invisible reality, doesn't mean they were not "cleansed" (as you say). Original Sin is not a statement of guilt. Rather, it is a statement of awareness of the human condition, a recognition that humans have choices, and that those choices matter. Eve discovered that, and so has everyone else.
Scripture doesn't address what happens if. We leave that to God.
That shouldn't matter since you cannot predict anything about how one will turn out, religious or non-religious. All children should have an opportunity to be cleansed of the original sin if there was one. They are not guilty of anything. Does this also mean that a stillborn fetus is not going to heaven because they are cursed with a sin because Eve ate a damn apple off the tree of knowledge and evil (let's note how they put knowledge and evil together- that's no accident). What about a young newborn who hasn't been baptized yet? I suppose there are some exceptions to the rules?
Correct. Free will means one can change one's mind. Remember, Baptism is the visible sign of an invisible reality. Just because some never had the opportunity to act out the signs of the invisible reality, doesn't mean they were not "cleansed" (as you say). Original Sin is not a statement of guilt. Rather, it is a statement of awareness of the human condition, a recognition that humans have choices, and that those choices matter. Eve discovered that, and so has everyone else.
Scripture doesn't address what happens if. We leave that to God.
The purpose of the Good Shepherd, is that should you stray and be lost, he will look for you.They call us "sheep" in some of these holy books. I know that much. Lol. The "flock". Don't stray from the flock! Knowledge is bad. Knowledge is the equivalence of evil pretty much (unless it includes a god being involved). The burning in hell for all eternity and the punishment for not being a believer aspect. I know these things may vary from book to book, but they are all basically the same, no?
The purpose of the Good Shepherd, is that should you stray and be lost, he will look for you.They call us "sheep" in some of these holy books. I know that much. Lol. The "flock". Don't stray from the flock! Knowledge is bad. Knowledge is the equivalence of evil pretty much (unless it includes a god being involved). The burning in hell for all eternity and the punishment for not being a believer aspect. I know these things may vary from book to book, but they are all basically the same, no?
There is a choice before us. Love God (or Godly ways for non-believers); love and serve one another. This is the way to an eternity with God. God is not going to force anyone into an eternity of loving and serving Him and one another. If evil, hate, and selfishness is what makes you happy, you won't want to spend eternity with God.So what about all the talk of Hell then? Which sins do you believe would be worth burning and tormenting someone for all eternity in a place called Hell with "gnashing teeth" and "writhing agony"?
There is a choice before us. Love God (or Godly ways for non-believers); love and serve one another. This is the way to an eternity with God. God is not going to force anyone into an eternity of loving and serving Him and one another. If evil, hate, and selfishness is what makes you happy, you won't want to spend eternity with God.So what about all the talk of Hell then? Which sins do you believe would be worth burning and tormenting someone for all eternity in a place called Hell with "gnashing teeth" and "writhing agony"?
True in my case at least. I was not yet a teenager when I thought why would one God allow so many religions to exist? They couldn't all be right since they were so different. I couldn't believe a loving God would allow someone to be sent to hell because they were born into the wrong religion and never learned about the 'right' one. The only logical conclusion, at least to me, was that they were ALL wrong. Since that day, I've never found a reason to change my mind. .Atheists do have reasons why they became atheists.
In other words, you're a child in an adult body.True in my case at least. I was not yet a teenager when I thought why would one God allow so many religions to exist? They couldn't all be right since they were so different. I couldn't believe a loving God would allow someone to be sent to hell because they were born into the wrong religion and never learned about the 'right' one. The only logical conclusion, at least to me, was that they were ALL wrong. Since that day, I've never found a reason to change my mind. .Atheists do have reasons why they became atheists.
I remember thinking the same thing. All gods and all religions say theirs is the only one, the only way so, what it finally comes down to is either you are indoctrinated buy your parents or you find the religion that serves your needs. Before that can happen though, you must start with the basic belief in an invisible super being.
And that's as far as I could go. No matter how much I went to church or Sunday school, I could not get past that. I really remember, as a child, Sunday school in the church basement. Little cut outs of various characters, including Jesus and god. It was always cold down there, always the strong smell of mimeograph ink (anyone else remember that smell? Or the clunky machine that made the copies?). A middle aged woman in a flowery dress and silly hat, preaching and sticking the paper cut outs on a felt covered board. I was about 12 when I decided I was done with that.
Later, college course in comparative religions made it all the more obvious that none of them held any attraction to me and I still couldn't wrap my head around the whole invisible flying sky fairy thing.
Through the years, I've come to hate the innate divisive nature of religion as well as the really toxic and cruel beliefs held by christians - that they can do anything, commit any crime but if they ask forgiveness, all is forgiven and they can just go out and do it all again. Compare that to the belief that if a baby dies with out having been baptized, god will burn them in hell forever. Same with decent adults. You can spend your life doing good works but, according to chrisitans, if you don't takegodasyourpersonalsavior, you'll burn in hell forever.
Serious question: WHY would anyone worship THAT??? Even ISIS lets the torture end with death. How is the christian god "merciful"?
Nowadays, fundies have turned christianity into the giant hate group I believe it has always been. There is little similarity between what Jesus supposedly taught and the way christians believe.
Sorry to have written so much. I believe that being atheist is the natural state of human beings. That's they we are born. Believing in any of the gods or religions must be a very difficult thing indeed.
There is a choice before us. Love God (or Godly ways for non-believers); love and serve one another. This is the way to an eternity with God. God is not going to force anyone into an eternity of loving and serving Him and one another. If evil, hate, and selfishness is what makes you happy, you won't want to spend eternity with God.So what about all the talk of Hell then? Which sins do you believe would be worth burning and tormenting someone for all eternity in a place called Hell with "gnashing teeth" and "writhing agony"?
I don't want someone who would torture people for an eternity to find me. I would be fearful of this "god" and that would be the only reason why I would be worshipping him, out of FEAR and not respect. Is that good?
We are social animals and want to be part of something bigger than just us. We also imprint on our parents and follow them for the rest of our lives.Serious question: WHY would anyone worship THAT???
