The Culture of Rape

[Gracie]

Maybe I need coffee too cuz I don't understand the question.

 

[alan1]

Unless they are in the military, apparently.

That's a lie.

So I will prove it is not a lie, and you will prove it is, yes? I believe that's how we go about debating.

Prove it is culturally accepted.

Good luck with that.

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

At one time rape was about power. It's moving away from that into being about rights. If there is a right to have sex, rape becomes a method of exercising that right. Otherwise sex is merely a privilege permitted only at the whim of another.

Lol @ right to sex.

Ridiculous, but realistically fairly similar to a lot of new "rights" proposed these days.

Right to housing.

Right to medical treatment.

Right to sex is only different from these because people typically feel that being made to have sex with someone is far more intrusive than being made to give them money. I would agree, but it's really only opinion.

Ultimately all of these things guarantee people access to the property of other people who may or may not be willing to give them access to that property.

Obamacare is the name they've given to the newest method Uncle Sam's using to allow those he feels are needy enough to rape my wallet.

Hyperbolic, but I defy you to prove me wrong without resorting to your dogma or morality.

Edit: Oh yeah! So, yes. I feel we have a rape culture, mostly metaphorically, and we're moving into greater and greater degrees of it as we capitulate with the government enforcing more and more mainstream, nonreligious morality upon us.

 

[Michelle420]

What is the “Rape Culture?”

Rape Culture is an environment in which rape is prevalent and in which sexual violence against women is normalized and excused in the media and popular culture. Rape culture is perpetuated through the use of misogynistic language, the objectification of women’s bodies, and the glamorization of sexual violence, thereby creating a society that disregards women’s rights and safety.

Rape Culture | Women's Center

I do see some instances of "rape culture" mentality in the media where the victim is blamed for being raped.

I don't think rape is limited to women only, and so not sure about this websites definition of it, because it excludes the idea that men can be stigmatized and shamed or silenced to not speak out if they have experienced rape.

sorry.... their definition of "rape culture" does not work for me.

rape is not "prevalent" here.

I do agree that there is problem with trying to blame a woman for being raped by what she was wearing, was she drinking, where she was, was no really no....ect...

but that has nothing to do with the rape..... nor is it about "rape culture"

If we were to agree to define it in this way, that rape culture is about how a society, social media treats a person who was raped by making statements or commentary or analysis on why he/she was somewhat to blame or deserving for having had that experience of rape, then I would say yes rape culture exists.

At what level and how prevalent it exists people could probably debate that.

Does it exist, I believe so yes, but I am basing my opinion on how I have outlined rape culture in this post.

 

[BDBoop]

Rape Culture | Women's Center

I do see some instances of "rape culture" mentality in the media where the victim is blamed for being raped.

I don't think rape is limited to women only, and so not sure about this websites definition of it, because it excludes the idea that men can be stigmatized and shamed or silenced to not speak out if they have experienced rape.

sorry.... their definition of "rape culture" does not work for me.

rape is not "prevalent" here.

I do agree that there is problem with trying to blame a woman for being raped by what she was wearing, was she drinking, where she was, was no really no....ect...

but that has nothing to do with the rape..... nor is it about "rape culture"

If we were to agree to define it in this way, that rape culture is about how a society, social media treats a person who was raped by making statements or commentary or analysis on why he/she was somewhat to blame or deserving for having had that experience of rape, then I would say yes rape culture exists.

At what level and how prevalent it exists people could probably debate that.

Does it exist, I believe so yes, but I am basing my opinion on how I have outlined rape culture in this post.

I am actually seeking clarification for my own thoughts/mindset, but so far, at least from the males, all I'm getting is ... nothing helpful. Nothing to explain why my perceptions are in error. Just the blame/shame game.

 

[syrenn]

There are those who believe there is no culture of rape, just as they believe there is no war on women (or their rights over their own bodies). If you believe there is no culture of rape, I would like to discuss that with you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlb4Pu23kqw

The question has to be clarified. Are you talking about easy to figure out, violent rape, or the fuzzy, I'm drunk, she's drunk and in the morning one of the parties isn't happy about it "rape"

Of course the 2nd one has to be quantified with any form of spiking, and maybe even if the male isn't drunk. The spiking makes it 100% a crime, the not being drunk I am not so sure.

If there a "culture" of rape, if you consider the I'm drunk, you're drunk interaction "rape" then maybe there is. of course we brought this upon ourselves with the loosening of sexual restrictions, which while were never really effective, at least made promiscuity a taboo topic, and men were at least trained to be respectful to women.

But that may be another debate.

You're right, the 'he said/she said' can do a lot of damage to a poor sod who thinks he just had a drunken revelry, that is absolutely true. This thread is about societal excusing of rape when it clearly happened. But how she was dressed apparently forgives it, or 'she had it coming,' or this entire military mess.

How can rape possibly be excused or justified? Yet it is.

ok....so now you get to it and here is what you wanted to talk about...

i am pretty sure they would prosecute any rapist who said...she had it coming.
I am pretty sure they would prosecute any rapist who said... i did it becasue of the way she was dressed.

you got two drunk people, now you have a problem.

 

[Michelle420]

sorry.... their definition of "rape culture" does not work for me.

rape is not "prevalent" here.

I do agree that there is problem with trying to blame a woman for being raped by what she was wearing, was she drinking, where she was, was no really no....ect...

but that has nothing to do with the rape..... nor is it about "rape culture"

If we were to agree to define it in this way, that rape culture is about how a society, social media treats a person who was raped by making statements or commentary or analysis on why he/she was somewhat to blame or deserving for having had that experience of rape, then I would say yes rape culture exists.

At what level and how prevalent it exists people could probably debate that.

Does it exist, I believe so yes, but I am basing my opinion on how I have outlined rape culture in this post.

I am actually seeking clarification for my own thoughts/mindset, but so far, at least from the males, all I'm getting is ... nothing helpful. Nothing to explain why my perceptions are in error. Just the blame/shame game.

Well rape culture is about blaming and shaming and showing sympathy to the perp ignoring the crime that was committed on the rape victim.

I don't think all men or all women do that, I see it perpetuated in social media venues but I also see backlash from other social media venues when that happens because people are becoming either more willing or more aware to speak out against that kind of behavior.

In this example the reporter shows sympathy for the sentenced rapists but no mention of the rape victim.

 

[Katzndogz]

There are people trying to hang onto rape being a vicious and violent crime when it is moving more in the direction of a social faux pas, perhaps a misunderstanding. Men and women are expected to be promiscuous. If they are the new normal men and women are expected to have sex with men and women. There is a right to have sex with whoever you want, whenever and wherever you want. If the targeted partner is unwilling, why? Perhaps she is a racist and refuses only black men. Maybe he is homophobic, prejudiced enough to only want women. Should people be allowed to remove themselves from the pool of possible sex partners thereby depriving some innocent person of their rights based on racism and homophobia?

I actually had this same discussion with an ACLU liberal so I know exactly what they have.

 

[R.C. Christian]

As a functional man being, I'd gladly be raped by any of Syrenn's avatars. It's 1 of those American Pie moments.

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

The question has to be clarified. Are you talking about easy to figure out, violent rape, or the fuzzy, I'm drunk, she's drunk and in the morning one of the parties isn't happy about it "rape"

Of course the 2nd one has to be quantified with any form of spiking, and maybe even if the male isn't drunk. The spiking makes it 100% a crime, the not being drunk I am not so sure.

If there a "culture" of rape, if you consider the I'm drunk, you're drunk interaction "rape" then maybe there is. of course we brought this upon ourselves with the loosening of sexual restrictions, which while were never really effective, at least made promiscuity a taboo topic, and men were at least trained to be respectful to women.

But that may be another debate.

You're right, the 'he said/she said' can do a lot of damage to a poor sod who thinks he just had a drunken revelry, that is absolutely true. This thread is about societal excusing of rape when it clearly happened. But how she was dressed apparently forgives it, or 'she had it coming,' or this entire military mess.

How can rape possibly be excused or justified? Yet it is.

ok....so now you get to it and here is what you wanted to talk about...

i am pretty sure they would prosecute any rapist who said...she had it coming.
I am pretty sure they would prosecute any rapist who said... i did it becasue of the way she was dressed.

you got two drunk people, now you have a problem.

This is an interesting angle, this intoxication thing.

Let me start by clarifying. . . I -do not- sleep with girls who are shitfaced unless its been established beforehand (while she was lucid) that it was all good, and even then, unless I know her well, it would have to be established by previous and recent sexual activity.

That said, if a girl that I'm currently in sexual relationship with decides to get shitfaced and then we happen to be horny, I'ma bang away. If she decided somewhere between the last time we'd done something and the event in question that she wasn't good with doing it anymore, she should've clarified. If the answer's been yes and you don't say no, then you get drunk and say yes, sorry, but you got no room for anger at anyone but you.

Now, -all- that said, the reason that I don't bang drunk girls isn't because I feel that there's something inherently morally wrong with it. Granted, a person's decision making processes are hampered under the influence of alcohol. This is, however, common knowlege. You know you're gonna make bad decisions while drunk, yet you proceed to get drunk around people of the opposite sex who are similarly partying and then, in your drunken haze, you choose to be more promiscuous than you would normally. . . you truly have nobody to blame but yourself.

No, no, no, the reason that I don't bang drunk girls is because, to me, my awareness of the situation -makes- it wrong. I've done a few fucked up things while drunk that I would never have done otherwise and I know the horror of waking up and realizing that you've seriously screwed the pooch (or the girl with tweeker teeth that you apparently met at the bar on the corner, but who is not your girlfriend or even anyone you can really remember seeing before). Personally, being party to somebody else feeling that way would make me feel fuckin horrible.

Rape, though? Nah. I don't care how drunk you were, if you did that to yourself and then said yes, that's all on you.

That's like if a tweeker gets high and tries to steal the copper wiring out of my fuze box, I'm not gonna give him a pass because it's the drug's fault.

 

[syrenn]

As a functional man being, I'd gladly be raped by any of Syrenn's avatars. It's 1 of those American Pie moments.

you have given consent.... so it would not be rape.

 

[Katzndogz]

Ask Whoopie Goldberg what she meant when she said that Roman Polanski was innocent of drugging, raping and sodomizing a 13 year old girl because it wasn't rape rape.

 

[alan1]

I am actually seeking clarification for my own thoughts/mindset, but so far, at least from the males, all I'm getting is ... nothing helpful. Nothing to explain why my perceptions are in error. Just the blame/shame game.

I haven't done any blame or shame.
You haven't proved anything.
You have ignored explanations about your perceptions.
Carry on with your willful disregard if it makes you feel better.

 

[Listening]

What is a "culture of rape" ?

What are it's defining characteristics.

I still think we should have the death penalty for rape.

 

[martybegan]

There are those who believe there is no culture of rape, just as they believe there is no war on women (or their rights over their own bodies). If you believe there is no culture of rape, I would like to discuss that with you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlb4Pu23kqw

The question has to be clarified. Are you talking about easy to figure out, violent rape, or the fuzzy, I'm drunk, she's drunk and in the morning one of the parties isn't happy about it "rape"

Of course the 2nd one has to be quantified with any form of spiking, and maybe even if the male isn't drunk. The spiking makes it 100% a crime, the not being drunk I am not so sure.

If there a "culture" of rape, if you consider the I'm drunk, you're drunk interaction "rape" then maybe there is. of course we brought this upon ourselves with the loosening of sexual restrictions, which while were never really effective, at least made promiscuity a taboo topic, and men were at least trained to be respectful to women.

But that may be another debate.

You're right, the 'he said/she said' can do a lot of damage to a poor sod who thinks he just had a drunken revelry, that is absolutely true. This thread is about societal excusing of rape when it clearly happened. But how she was dressed apparently forgives it, or 'she had it coming,' or this entire military mess.

How can rape possibly be excused or justified? Yet it is.

How a person dresses or where they hang out does not make her "have it coming" What it does is provides incentive in the first case and opportunity in the second for actual rapists. No one I have met has stated that "she had it coming" it was more, "the skell targeted her because she was dressed that way, or because she was in an unpopulated area."

Its not blaming the victim in this case, is finding out what cause was. Remember we are trying to figure out the motive of the rapist, something a normal person cannot comprehend.

The military rape situation is more harassment, actual sexual contact harassment, typically a senior pressuring a junior into sex. The threat of force or harassment or punishment may be there, but it is more coercion than force.

its still wrong, but not "rape" in the sense of a violent crime.

 

[Two Thumbs]

Unless they are in the military, apparently.

That's a lie.

So I will prove it is not a lie, and you will prove it is, yes? I believe that's how we go about debating.

I was in the Navy, 3 shipmates were accused of raping a local.

Instead of keeping them on the ship they were handed over to the Italians and put in prison.

In Italian prison, if someone doesn't bring you food, you don't eat.

after ~ 18 months, turned out she lied.



now please prove the military has a culture of rape.

 

[BDBoop]

That's a lie.

So I will prove it is not a lie, and you will prove it is, yes? I believe that's how we go about debating.

I was in the Navy, 3 shipmates were accused of raping a local.

Instead of keeping them on the ship they were handed over to the Italians and put in prison.

In Italian prison, if someone doesn't bring you food, you don't eat.

after ~ 18 months, turned out she lied.



now please prove the military has a culture of rape.

What a lovely story.

Can you prove it?

 

[Mad_Cabbie]

Men have acted badly towards women for a long time. It's very sad, but not all men are "do nothing" cads who encourage bad behaviour.

I have intervened many times in cases of domestic violence, calling the police or even putting myself between woman who were being threatened/abused and their attackers.

While woman should be careful and mindful of their surroundings, it is us older men that need to properly teach the young bucks what's acceptable or not.

Otherwise, the culture of rape gains unfettered access to the minds of the masses.

 

[Mad_Cabbie]

So I will prove it is not a lie, and you will prove it is, yes? I believe that's how we go about debating.

I was in the Navy, 3 shipmates were accused of raping a local.

Instead of keeping them on the ship they were handed over to the Italians and put in prison.

In Italian prison, if someone doesn't bring you food, you don't eat.

after ~ 18 months, turned out she lied.


now please prove the military has a culture of rape.

What a lovely story.

Can you prove it?

This is the unfortunate "other side of the coin" that ruins lives and does untold damage to actual victims of rape.

False claims of rape make it very difficult to help victims who need it. It jams up the judicial system and crowds prisons, making it more difficult to prosecute rapist.

 

[strollingbones]

have yall heard of steubenville? no culture of rape...this town is the petri dish to prove that wrong....

and rape in the military...

Because they can: Three rapes every hour in the military

i guess some of you find that acceptable....every 3 hours a rape occurs in the military

now i suggest you take read susan brownmiller's "against our will"