The Consequences of a Post-Christian America Revealed by COVID-19

[Coyote]

I have never understood the logic behind believing that unless everyone is kept safe or nothing bad can ever happen that there can be no God.

Could one of you good people explain that to me?

Coyote Montrovant JoeB131 ESay

I am no theologian, why are you asking me?

Because of your comment that "the masses didn't have it any better when God ruled their lives."

My comment doesn’t really line with your query. It is simply a statement that when religion was in the forefront of public life and government the masses were not any better off.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Liberal gotcha games, is it? I didn't know liberals created gotcha games, nor that trying to get you to clarify the things you've said was either liberal or a gotcha game.

Also, if you're better at it, why not play?

I'm still trying to wrap my head around the claim that Christians know no other human can keep them safe. That's a new one, and seems to make little sense. I guess if you explain it I've got ya!

Okay genius, I'll play your little game, since you insist.

Please tell me how Your Precious Government can keep us safe, every day, in every circumstance, from this virus, if we comply.

That's your game, pal. It's called strawmanning. Embrace it, since you took such glee in ramping it up for me.

The difference with your post, of course, is that you didn't base your questions on anything I said. You just made them up. I, on the other hand, have quotes from you saying that Christians know no human can keep them safe (post #59), and you responding with a yes when I asked you if Christian children know their parents cannot keep them safe (post #67).

You didn't actually answer my questions, but I'm happy to answer yours.

The US government is my government and your government, assuming you are a US citizen. I don't think of it as precious. I certainly don't think it can keep everyone safe every day in every circumstance, from this virus or anything else. On the other hand, I also don't think that this is a binary equation in which the government either keeps everyone safe from everything all of the time, or does nothing.

Of course, I also think it's possible for one person to keep another person safe, at least in some circumstances.

You expect me to actually respond to your stupid, inane, junior high level strawman argument

And include a winky sign because you think you actually GOT ME. That's embarrassing, for you. But okay.

I'm going to start again with the OP, alright there, pal? The FUNCTION of the US govt is not to "keep us safe". That's why we have the 2nd amendment. It is only a small measure of safety against "enemies, foreign and domestic". You somehow now want to twist this into gotcha games with human beings and parents-children, as if you prove some kind of point that parents can, in some measure, keep children safe, you have won a Constitutional argument, or proven what the government's role should be.

The Constitution was written, and works, because the American populace never NEEDED the government to "keep us safe". I'm really going to end there because your skills at argumentation are beyond frustrating, to be honest.

Aren’t you making an argument to disband the military?

The military is a government institution that keeps us safe.

Same with the local and state police.

Sure, on an national and societal level.

They do not keep us safe on a personal level as their chief function, and were not intended to. Our gov't chief function is to protect individual rights conferred by God.

You are a mental case Your "rights" are not universal. Why would God give only the US to own guns ? And what part of the Bible points to the fifth amendment ?

 

[ding]

I have never understood the logic behind believing that unless everyone is kept safe or nothing bad can ever happen that there can be no God.

Could one of you good people explain that to me?

Coyote Montrovant JoeB131 ESay

I am no theologian, why are you asking me?

Because of your comment that "the masses didn't have it any better when God ruled their lives."

My comment doesn’t really line with your query. It is simply a statement that when religion was in the forefront of public life and government the masses were not any better off.

My apologies to the lady.

 

[ESay]

Would a more Christian country not have done anything, because that would just have been a fear response? Do you think Christians are never fearful?

It is not about what 'country' (ie government) should do. It is about what people themselves should or shouldn't do. For example, I can't imagine that a Christian can allow themselves to buy a two month stock of some goods knowing they leave others without even one day amount of it.

But they are.

Who they are? Christians? No, they are CINOs.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

I have never understood the logic behind believing that unless everyone is kept safe or nothing bad can ever happen that there can be no God.

Could one of you good people explain that to me?

Coyote Montrovant JoeB131 ESay

Strawman fallacy.

What you don’t understand is that to acknowledge the fact that there is no ‘god’ as perceived by theists has nothing to do with being kept safe or nothing bad ever happening.

 

[ding]

I have never understood the logic behind believing that unless everyone is kept safe or nothing bad can ever happen that there can be no God.

Could one of you good people explain that to me?

Coyote Montrovant JoeB131 ESay

Strawman fallacy.

What you don’t understand is that to acknowledge the fact that there is no ‘god’ as perceived by theists has nothing to do with being kept safe or nothing bad ever happening.

And yet that is exactly the argument that atheists make.

 

[Montrovant]

I have never understood the logic behind believing that unless everyone is kept safe or nothing bad can ever happen that there can be no God.

Could one of you good people explain that to me?

Coyote Montrovant JoeB131 ESay

Strawman fallacy.

What you don’t understand is that to acknowledge the fact that there is no ‘god’ as perceived by theists has nothing to do with being kept safe or nothing bad ever happening.

And yet that is exactly the argument that atheists make.

You should ask atheists that make that argument the question, then.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

We have no higher ideals in 21st century, post-Christian America than our own personal safety, and perhaps the safety of our nearest loved ones.

"Safety" is not a foundation upon which to build, or sustain, a republic. Our Founding Fathers understood that. Liberty, prosperity, even happiness does not flow from "safety". And yet, in this Coronavirus madness, the secularized masses look to their Government gods to keep them "safe", no matter the cost. Steal my liberties, lock me up, crash our economies...as long as I get another few years on this spinning rock, safe. Or I should really say, "safe".

I won't say we deserve this, but a lot of us saw this coming. When you unseat God from His Throne, you will have another god, even if you deny it. As the Bible says, "your god is your stomach" (Philippians 3:19). And now we see what happens.

SMH

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

By the way.......God is not religious......man is.....that is why you have 7,938,283 different religions -- God could have made it simple and told you which religion is the one he endorses......but as I said...God isn't religious...man is....

Religion is man's attempt to be God on Earth.....nothing more

 

[BreezeWood]

By the way.......God is not religious......man is.....that is why you have 7,938,283 different religions -- God could have made it simple and told you which religion is the one he endorses......but as I said...God isn't religious...man is....

Religion is man's attempt to be God on Earth.....nothing more

.

- God could have made it simple and told you which religion is the one he endorses.

they did, the religion of antiquity - the triumph of good vs evil - for admission to the Everlasting. long abandoned by all three desert religions.

 

[SweetSue92]

It seems pretty juvenile to blame one configuration of the gods for a virus that appears to be a product of biological processes.

Almost as silly as believing there can be no God because bad things happen to good people.

See enough of that, and it'll turn you Ding

~S~

Sounds like a choice to me.

You do know what an external locus of control is, right?

I know it feeds the blame game , and in the broader objective the 'saved' paradox Ding

~S~

Simply put, an external locus of control is a transfer of power or control to an external source.

The message of religion is the exact opposite though. We control our destiny. We control our progression. No one else. Now that doesn't mean I don't have help mind you, because I do. I have the spirit of God within me encouraging me to do the right thing, the right way for the right reason. Something I don't always do. And he is constantly pruning me so that new growth can occur. But ultimately it is up to me. If I blame others or make excuses, I can't possibly learn from my mistakes because I don't acknowledge they were MY mistakes.

So, I submit to you that your perception of religion is incorrect. But I will acknowledge that it wasn't without good cause. Because men are imperfect and don't always do the right thing, for the right reasons and the right way. So I can see how you could become confused.

Fair enough?

ding is on his Own Throne

Jesus Christ and God Himself are his subordinates, and exist to serve his journey

 

[SweetSue92]

The gov't main focus, per our nation's founding is only to PROTECT God-given individual rights. It is not to "bestow" anything.

As I did not mention government 'bestowing' anything, I do not get your point. Basically a national government should focus on the nation. This includes protecting the nation, trade, transportation, and communication. Thus far, the Federal government has not interfered with any of my personal freedoms.

I can't go to work. I can't go to any restaurant or bar. Soon, I will be told I can't go anywhere outside my house except for Z or Y

That's pretty restrictive. Of course, it's for my "safety", you understand.

Sigh

 

[SweetSue92]

The state is looking after us while God has gone fishing.

God's job is not to "look after us" Tommy. Well not His major job at any rate.

My goodness we are the most wimpified culture in the history of humanity. Exhibit A. WIMPS all of us

Sure it is. We are told to trust in him and submit to him, and in return for that company,etc acceptance of authority he looks after us...a shepherd and his sheep.

Do not confuse OUR chief role with HIS chief role

Then he lied to us eh?

I live for the day you would tell Muslims that Allah lied

 

[Tommy Tainant]

The gov't main focus, per our nation's founding is only to PROTECT God-given individual rights. It is not to "bestow" anything.

As I did not mention government 'bestowing' anything, I do not get your point. Basically a national government should focus on the nation. This includes protecting the nation, trade, transportation, and communication. Thus far, the Federal government has not interfered with any of my personal freedoms.

I can't go to work. I can't go to any restaurant or bar. Soon, I will be told I can't go anywhere outside my house except for Z or Y

That's pretty restrictive. Of course, it's for my "safety", you understand.

Sigh

Its not just for your safety. It is for the collective good. How selfish you are to ignore your responsibility to your neighbours.

 

[SweetSue92]

The gov't main focus, per our nation's founding is only to PROTECT God-given individual rights. It is not to "bestow" anything.

As I did not mention government 'bestowing' anything, I do not get your point. Basically a national government should focus on the nation. This includes protecting the nation, trade, transportation, and communication. Thus far, the Federal government has not interfered with any of my personal freedoms.

I can't go to work. I can't go to any restaurant or bar. Soon, I will be told I can't go anywhere outside my house except for Z or Y

That's pretty restrictive. Of course, it's for my "safety", you understand.

Sigh

Its not just for your safety. It is for the collective good. How selfish you are to ignore your responsibility to your neighbours.

It's selfish of you not to let me work Tommy

See how easy that is

 

[Tommy Tainant]

The gov't main focus, per our nation's founding is only to PROTECT God-given individual rights. It is not to "bestow" anything.

As I did not mention government 'bestowing' anything, I do not get your point. Basically a national government should focus on the nation. This includes protecting the nation, trade, transportation, and communication. Thus far, the Federal government has not interfered with any of my personal freedoms.

I can't go to work. I can't go to any restaurant or bar. Soon, I will be told I can't go anywhere outside my house except for Z or Y

That's pretty restrictive. Of course, it's for my "safety", you understand.

Sigh

Its not just for your safety. It is for the collective good. How selfish you are to ignore your responsibility to your neighbours.

It's selfish of you not to let me work Tommy

See how easy that is

It really isn't Sue. Why don't you assume the responsibilities of a rational adult and stop whining about a minor inconvenience?

 

[SweetSue92]

The gov't main focus, per our nation's founding is only to PROTECT God-given individual rights. It is not to "bestow" anything.

As I did not mention government 'bestowing' anything, I do not get your point. Basically a national government should focus on the nation. This includes protecting the nation, trade, transportation, and communication. Thus far, the Federal government has not interfered with any of my personal freedoms.

I can't go to work. I can't go to any restaurant or bar. Soon, I will be told I can't go anywhere outside my house except for Z or Y

That's pretty restrictive. Of course, it's for my "safety", you understand.

Sigh

Its not just for your safety. It is for the collective good. How selfish you are to ignore your responsibility to your neighbours.

It's selfish of you not to let me work Tommy

See how easy that is

It really isn't Sue. Why don't you assume the responsibilities of a rational adult and stop whining about a minor inconvenience?

You lose when you have to resort to name-calling Tommy. It means you don't have a case to make.

But you never really do.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

The gov't main focus, per our nation's founding is only to PROTECT God-given individual rights. It is not to "bestow" anything.

As I did not mention government 'bestowing' anything, I do not get your point. Basically a national government should focus on the nation. This includes protecting the nation, trade, transportation, and communication. Thus far, the Federal government has not interfered with any of my personal freedoms.

I can't go to work. I can't go to any restaurant or bar. Soon, I will be told I can't go anywhere outside my house except for Z or Y

That's pretty restrictive. Of course, it's for my "safety", you understand.

Sigh

Its not just for your safety. It is for the collective good. How selfish you are to ignore your responsibility to your neighbours.

It's selfish of you not to let me work Tommy

See how easy that is

It really isn't Sue. Why don't you assume the responsibilities of a rational adult and stop whining about a minor inconvenience?

You lose when you have to resort to name-calling Tommy. It means you don't have a case to make.

But you never really do.

Coronavirus infects 7 family members and kills 3 after they met for dinner

'It is so pitiful. They can't even mourn the way you would.'

metro.co.uk

Its serious stuff Sue.

 

[SweetSue92]

The gov't main focus, per our nation's founding is only to PROTECT God-given individual rights. It is not to "bestow" anything.

As I did not mention government 'bestowing' anything, I do not get your point. Basically a national government should focus on the nation. This includes protecting the nation, trade, transportation, and communication. Thus far, the Federal government has not interfered with any of my personal freedoms.

I can't go to work. I can't go to any restaurant or bar. Soon, I will be told I can't go anywhere outside my house except for Z or Y

That's pretty restrictive. Of course, it's for my "safety", you understand.

Sigh

Its not just for your safety. It is for the collective good. How selfish you are to ignore your responsibility to your neighbours.

It's selfish of you not to let me work Tommy

See how easy that is

It really isn't Sue. Why don't you assume the responsibilities of a rational adult and stop whining about a minor inconvenience?

You lose when you have to resort to name-calling Tommy. It means you don't have a case to make.

But you never really do.

Coronavirus infects 7 family members and kills 3 after they met for dinner

'It is so pitiful. They can't even mourn the way you would.'

metro.co.uk

Its serious stuff Sue.

So is a nationwide, crippling economic depression

 

[Tommy Tainant]

The gov't main focus, per our nation's founding is only to PROTECT God-given individual rights. It is not to "bestow" anything.

As I did not mention government 'bestowing' anything, I do not get your point. Basically a national government should focus on the nation. This includes protecting the nation, trade, transportation, and communication. Thus far, the Federal government has not interfered with any of my personal freedoms.

I can't go to work. I can't go to any restaurant or bar. Soon, I will be told I can't go anywhere outside my house except for Z or Y

That's pretty restrictive. Of course, it's for my "safety", you understand.

Sigh

Its not just for your safety. It is for the collective good. How selfish you are to ignore your responsibility to your neighbours.

It's selfish of you not to let me work Tommy

See how easy that is

It really isn't Sue. Why don't you assume the responsibilities of a rational adult and stop whining about a minor inconvenience?

You lose when you have to resort to name-calling Tommy. It means you don't have a case to make.

But you never really do.

Coronavirus infects 7 family members and kills 3 after they met for dinner

'It is so pitiful. They can't even mourn the way you would.'

metro.co.uk

Its serious stuff Sue.

So is a nationwide, crippling economic depression

Its unbelievable that you compare the two. You are just arguing for the sake of arguing.