Zone1 The Best Evidence For The Resurrection

[ding]

I actually hope God does exist and I get to meet him. I have some serious questions for him.

I don't believe you have thought that through. If you were in the presence of an all powerful force that is beyond your comprehension that is responsible for creating existence, I'm not sure copping an attitude or questioning his creation would be your first response. But putting that aside, almost all of your "serious" questions would be answered with the flesh is of no avail and I paid my debt. You aren't smarter than the creator of existence. You'd have to be pretty darn arrogant and dumb to believe you were. Maybe a better tack would be to beg for mercy. Practice the following phrase, "Lord I am not worthy to enter under your roof but only say the word and I shall be healed." Otherwise expect Job 40.

 

[BreezeWood]

"Lord I am not worthy to enter under your roof but only say the word and I shall be healed."

the desert religions of: servitude and denial ... no spine in any of them.

 

[ding]

the desert religions of: servitude and denial ... no spine in any of them.

Couldn't be happier for you to believe that.

 

[BreezeWood]

Couldn't be happier for you to believe that.

sure -

just find someone that's innocent, not hard to do there are many and begin persecuting them, you'll be just fine.

 

[ding]

sure -

just find someone that's innocent, not hard to do there are many and begin persecuting them, you'll be just fine.

Are you available?

 

[alang1216]

I don't believe you have thought that through. If you were in the presence of an all powerful force that is beyond your comprehension that is responsible for creating existence, I'm not sure copping an attitude or questioning his creation would be your first response. But putting that aside, almost all of your "serious" questions would be answered with the flesh is of no avail and I paid my debt. You aren't smarter than the creator of existence. You'd have to be pretty darn arrogant and dumb to believe you were. Maybe a better tack would be to beg for mercy. Practice the following phrase, "Lord I am not worthy to enter under your roof but only say the word and I shall be healed." Otherwise expect Job 40.

Good advice since, as outlined in Job 40, might makes right, something ever present in God's creation.

 

[Hypatia415]

I disagree. There's tons of evidence.

No there is not.

There are 24,000 written manuscripts which chronicle the 3 1/2 year ministry of Christ and document the many miracles performed by Christ and his resurrection; the Babylonian Talmud confirms the crucifixion and the reason for the crucifixion which corroborate the NT accounts;

The Babylonian Talmud was compiled between the third and seventh centuries CE.

Crucifixion was a Roman punishment. If the crimes had been purely of a religious nature then the punishment would have been stoning.

Being acclaimed as, or claiming to be the Messiah was a capital crime. Only Rome had the authority to create kings within its orbit.

there's the dramatic change in the behavior of the disciples coming out of hiding fearing for their lives to proclaim Jesus is Lord despite persecution, imprisonment and death which corroborate his resurrection;

What persecution? And Jesus was not considered to be God in the early decades of the first century. Even Paul never directly equates the Son with the Father.

there's the empty tomb which no one disputed was empty; there are no texts which dispute the miracles and resurrection of Christ;

Have you read the many quotations from Celsus that appear in Origen's Contra Celsus?

non-Christian historians recorded the first Christians worshipped Jesus as God;

What specific non-Christian historians are you citing?

there are no texts which dispute Jesus was worshipped as God by the first Christians who were his apostles and disciples..

There are no texts from the first half of the first century that demonstrate a belief that Jesus of Nazareth was also God.

It's not faith I take this on. I have good reasons.

You use Christian texts to prove the Christian texts. That is circular reasoning.

 

[ding]

Good advice since, as outlined in Job 40, might makes right, something ever present in God's creation.

The bias in you is strong. Job 40 does not argue that "might makes right." God's is addressing human limitations. God humbles Job not by asserting raw power, but by revealing the limits of human knowledge, morality, and ability to comprehend the universe. You think you know everything but you don't. You are blinded by your bias.

 

[ding]

No there is not.

The Babylonian Talmud was compiled between the third and seventh centuries CE. Crucifixion was a Roman punishment. If the crimes had been purely of a religious nature then the punishment would have been stoning. Being acclaimed as, or claiming to be the Messiah was a capital crime. Only Rome had the authority to create kings within its orbit. What persecution? And Jesus was not considered to be God in the early decades of the first century. Even Paul never directly equates the Son with the Father. Have you read the many quotations from Celsus that appear in Origen's Contra Celsus? What specific non-Christian historians are you citing? There are no texts from the first half of the first century that demonstrate a belief that Jesus of Nazareth was also God. You use Christian texts to prove the Christian texts. That is circular reasoning.

There's tons of evidence and you dismiss it.

There are 24,000 written manuscripts which chronicle the 3 1/2 year ministry of Christ and document the many miracles performed by Christ and his resurrection; the Babylonian Talmud confirms the crucifixion and the reason for the crucifixion which corroborate the NT accounts; there's the dramatic change in the behavior of the disciples coming out of hiding fearing for their lives to proclaim Jesus is Lord despite persecution, imprisonment and death which corroborate his resurrection; there's the empty tomb which no one disputed was empty; there are no texts which dispute the miracles and resurrection of Christ; non-Christian historians recorded the first Christians worshipped Jesus as God; there are no texts which dispute Jesus was worshipped as God by the first Christians who were his apostles and disciples..

 

[alang1216]

The bias in you is strong. Job 40 does not argue that "might makes right." God's is addressing human limitations. God humbles Job not by asserting raw power, but by revealing the limits of human knowledge, morality, and ability to comprehend the universe. You think you know everything but you don't. You are blinded by your bias.

You too are blinded by your bias. We all are.

 

[Hypatia415]

There's tons of evidence and you dismiss it.

There are 24,000 written manuscripts which chronicle the 3 1/2 year ministry of Christ and document the many miracles performed by Christ and his resurrection; the Babylonian Talmud confirms the crucifixion and the reason for the crucifixion which corroborate the NT accounts; there's the dramatic change in the behavior of the disciples coming out of hiding fearing for their lives to proclaim Jesus is Lord despite persecution, imprisonment and death which corroborate his resurrection; there's the empty tomb which no one disputed was empty; there are no texts which dispute the miracles and resurrection of Christ; non-Christian historians recorded the first Christians worshipped Jesus as God; there are no texts which dispute Jesus was worshipped as God by the first Christians who were his apostles and disciples..

You have just reposted comments to which I have already replied.

So perhaps you would like to address my points rather than repeating what you have already written.

 

[ding]

You have just reposted comments to which I have already replied.

So perhaps you would like to address my points rather than repeating what you have already written.

Yes, I reposted the evidence. Evidence you dismissed. I don't need to address your arguments against the evidence. You have no evidence for your beliefs. You only have arguments against the evidence that exists.

 

[GLASNOST]

The Babylonian Talmud was compiled between the third and seventh centuries CE.

I consider that to be true.

Crucifixion was a Roman punishment.

Yes.

If the crimes had been purely of a religious nature then the punishment would have been stoning.

Yes, again.

..... Jesus was not considered to be God in the early decades of the first century. Even Paul never directly equates the Son with the Father.

I consider that to be true.

What specific non-Christian historians are you citing?

You've got him against the ropes now.

There are no texts from the first half of the first century that demonstrate a belief that Jesus of Nazareth was also God.

I consider this to be true.

You use Christian texts to prove the Christian texts. That is circular reasoning.

A textbook definition/example.

Being acclaimed as, or claiming to be the Messiah was a capital crime.

Absolutely correct and this is the most important issue of the whole Christo-Juda debate. Anyone claiming Jesus was the Messiah was (and still is) a blaphemer of the highest order.

 

[ding]

You too are blinded by your bias. We all are.

On the specific point we are discussing Job 40 does not argue that "might makes right." God is addressing human limitations. That's not bias. That is reality.

Lest you forget your own hypothetical situation begins with you meeting the creator of existence. In that scenario, do you really believe you will question the creator of existence? Because as I read what you wrote, you implied you know better than the creator of existence.

 

[ding]

You too are blinded by your bias. We all are.

Now to address your statement in the general sense. Yes, almost all people are blinded by bias... SOMETIMES. Not always is that the case.

 

[Hypatia415]

Yes, I reposted the evidence. Evidence you dismissed. I don't need to address your arguments against the evidence. You have no evidence for your beliefs. You only have arguments against the evidence that exists.

Your post ignores basic facts of the known history of Roman Judaea and the early decades of the Christian religion, and you have still supplied the names of those "non-Christian historians" who "recorded the first Christians worshipped Jesus as God".

 

[ding]

I consider that to be true.

Yes.

Yes, again.

I consider that to be true.

You've got him against the ropes now.

I consider this to be true.

A textbook definition/example.

Absolutely correct and this is the most important issue of the whole Christo-Juda debate. Anyone claiming Jesus was the Messiah was (and still is) a blaphemer of the highest order.

Who doesn't love echo chambers.

 

[ding]

Your post ignores basic facts of the known history of Roman Judaea and the early decades of the Christian religion, and you have still supplied the names of those "non-Christian historians" who "recorded the first Christians worshipped Jesus as God".

I'm not going to argue with you about it. I don't care what you believe. You think 2 billion people have no basis for their beliefs. That just isn't so. Jesus was worshipped as God by the first Christians for good reasons. They didn't submit themselves to beatings, persecution, imprisonment and death for no good reason.

 

[BreezeWood]

Are you available?

of course, just stop by while im mowing w/ my new zero turn lawn mower and we will see how fast you can run ...

 

[Hafar1014]

I'm not going to argue with you about it. I don't care what you believe. You think 2 billion people have no basis for their beliefs. That just isn't so. Jesus was worshipped as God by the first Christians for good reasons. They didn't submit themselves to beatings, persecution, imprisonment and death for no good reason.

They were afraid of going to hell. The basis is fear