Zone1 Should Christians make an effort to understand and learn from Jewish dietary restrictions?

[Seymour Flops]

Note I do not ask "to follow Jewish dietary restrictions."

Here's my point: Jesus said that he was not here to change one jot or one tittle of the law - jot and tittle being small marks in letters, such as the dot above a lower case i. I'll leave the history lesson about why early Christian missionaries did not require non-Jewish converts to honor Jewish dietary restrictions as they did the Ten Commandments to more knowledgeable folk.

I will say that it would seem strange that Christians would often openly flout laws by eating bacon cheeseburgers, for example. Of course the answer to that is that most Christians do not know why a bacon cheeseburger would be such an anathema. It a deliberate ignorance, in my opinion. Not on the part of the followers, but on the part of the leaders, eager to avoid giving their flock a reason to leave the fold.

Modern science shows that most, if not all, of the dietary restrictions lead to a healthier diet. Should not Christian pastors cite this as an example of God's wisdom? Should they not speak of shellfish and other proscribed foods as tolerated, if not consumed to excess, much as many Christians view alcohol?

 

[1srelluc]

Give-up BACON?.....Never!

 

[Tunafish]

Note I do not ask "to follow Jewish dietary restrictions."

Here's my point: Jesus said that he was not here to change one jot or one tittle of the law - jot and tittle being small marks in letters, such as the dot above a lower case i. I'll leave the history lesson about why early Christian missionaries did not require non-Jewish converts to honor Jewish dietary restrictions as they did the Ten Commandments to more knowledgeable folk.

I will say that it would seem strange that Christians would often openly flout laws by eating bacon cheeseburgers, for example. Of course the answer to that is that most Christians do not know why a bacon cheeseburger would be such an anathema. It a deliberate ignorance, in my opinion. Not on the part of the followers, but on the part of the leaders, eager to avoid giving their flock a reason to leave the fold.

Modern science shows that most, if not all, of the dietary restrictions lead to a healthier diet. Should not Christian pastors cite this as an example of God's wisdom? Should they not speak of shellfish and other proscribed foods as tolerated, if not consumed to excess, much as many Christians view alcohol?

Hell no

 

[Meriweather]

Modern science shows that most, if not all, of the dietary restrictions lead to a healthier diet. Should not Christian pastors cite this as an example of God's wisdom? Should they not speak of shellfish and other proscribed foods as tolerated, if not consumed to excess, much as many Christians view alcohol?

Do you consider diet a spiritual matter?

 

[Seymour Flops]

Do you consider diet a spiritual matter?

Me?

Does God, is the question.

EDIT:

But it makes sense, if we believe that the body is a temple, yes?

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Should Christians make an effort to understand and learn from Jewish dietary restrictions?​

Restrictions? You theocratic fascist.

 

[Meriweather]

Me?

Does God, is the question.

EDIT:

But it makes sense, if we believe that the body is a temple, yes?

Diet is not one of the Ten Commandments. Yes, a tribe of Jews decided some foods were not fit to eat. Combining meat and cheese was traced back to not cooking the offspring in its mother's milk.

People are probably in more danger from eating too much sugar than eating meat and cheese together. And sugar can cause mood swings!

We agree that the body is a Temple, and isn't that the reason gluttony (too much of anything) is considered a deadly sin?

 

[Dekster]

Note I do not ask "to follow Jewish dietary restrictions."

Here's my point: Jesus said that he was not here to change one jot or one tittle of the law - jot and tittle being small marks in letters, such as the dot above a lower case i. I'll leave the history lesson about why early Christian missionaries did not require non-Jewish converts to honor Jewish dietary restrictions as they did the Ten Commandments to more knowledgeable folk.

I will say that it would seem strange that Christians would often openly flout laws by eating bacon cheeseburgers, for example. Of course the answer to that is that most Christians do not know why a bacon cheeseburger would be such an anathema. It a deliberate ignorance, in my opinion. Not on the part of the followers, but on the part of the leaders, eager to avoid giving their flock a reason to leave the fold.

Modern science shows that most, if not all, of the dietary restrictions lead to a healthier diet. Should not Christian pastors cite this as an example of God's wisdom? Should they not speak of shellfish and other proscribed foods as tolerated, if not consumed to excess, much as many Christians view alcohol?

The dietary restrictions were largely how not to die in the age before modern preservation technology.

 

[jackflash]

Note I do not ask "to follow Jewish dietary restrictions."

Here's my point: Jesus said that he was not here to change one jot or one tittle of the law - jot and tittle being small marks in letters, such as the dot above a lower case i. I'll leave the history lesson about why early Christian missionaries did not require non-Jewish converts to honor Jewish dietary restrictions as they did the Ten Commandments to more knowledgeable folk.

I will say that it would seem strange that Christians would often openly flout laws by eating bacon cheeseburgers, for example. Of course the answer to that is that most Christians do not know why a bacon cheeseburger would be such an anathema. It a deliberate ignorance, in my opinion. Not on the part of the followers, but on the part of the leaders, eager to avoid giving their flock a reason to leave the fold.

Modern science shows that most, if not all, of the dietary restrictions lead to a healthier diet. Should not Christian pastors cite this as an example of God's wisdom? Should they not speak of shellfish and other proscribed foods as tolerated, if not consumed to excess, much as many Christians view alcohol?

It's too late for many of us already look like an out of shape Dolly Parton(both guys/gals). Bacon/pork okay if cooked hot enough to fry the Trichinella parasites. Consumable alcohol is best totally avoided as it opens a window for unwanted spirits to come into a person. That's why alcohol, ESPECIALLY GRAIN ALCOHOL is often called "spirits". Believe me on this one like horses KNOW the diff between Roy Rodgers riding them or if Jack Daniels is riding them! I don't know about goats & deer as I would never allow anyone with alcohol inside them to even get close to such precious pets. I hear U on the Pastors as there are good ones but also the greedy pastor$ that operate the denomination of the "Fir$t Church Of The Immaculate Collection Plate".

 

[Seymour Flops]

Diet is not one of the Ten Commandments. Yes, a tribe of Jews decided some foods were not fit to eat. Combining meat and cheese was traced back to not cooking the offspring in its mother's milk.

Yes, playing skeptics' advocate, many of those laws were codification of things that Jewish cooks had discovered through trial and error.

People are probably in more danger from eating too much sugar than eating meat and cheese together. And sugar can cause mood swings!

Fair point. Artificial sweetener is basically an addictive poison, IMHO, and that is not mentioned of course.

We agree that the body is a Temple, and isn't that the reason gluttony (too much of anything) is considered a deadly sin?

Agreed. Thanks for the well thought-out response!

 

[ReinyDays]

"Our delight is the Law of the Lord, and in his Law doth we meditate both day and night" ...

It's certainly wrong to use the Bible's dietary laws as stumbling blocks for others ... a good Christian would accept the invitation of his neighbor, just to show how loving and caring good Christians are ... even if the neighbor serves you pork ... or catfish ... or mushrooms ... anything approved by the USDA as human food you sit there and eat and enjoy and be a good Christian ...

One point ... foods labeled as Kosher tend to be better quality, healthier and tends to be less processed ... taking care of yourself is part part of "love your brother as you love yourself" ...

 

[jackflash]

Diet is not one of the Ten Commandments. Yes, a tribe of Jews decided some foods were not fit to eat. Combining meat and cheese was traced back to not cooking the offspring in its mother's milk.

People are probably in more danger from eating too much sugar than eating meat and cheese together. And sugar can cause mood swings!

We agree that the body is a Temple, and isn't that the reason gluttony (too much of anything) is considered a deadly sin?

I REALLY like your AVATAR!!! " Below: I had the "Short Eared" owl species '72-'74 then had to surrender Barny to the youngest of my three older sisters due to out of town employment. Broken left wing due to being scatter-gunned so full time indoor "house owl". Chicken necks, gizzards & live mice(they need to regurgitate fur balls). Our vet told me they are the only species of owl that nest on the deck. Too much to list here about him but included the link below if interested.

Short-eared owl - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[hobelim]

Should not Christian pastors cite this as an example of God's wisdom? Should they not speak of shellfish and other proscribed foods as tolerated, if not consumed to excess,

Yes and no. Christians should realize that when Jesus said "eat my flesh" he was revealing that kosher law is not about food, but teaching. The animals described as vile and loathsome creatures because their flesh (teaching) defiles and contaminates the mind represent human archetypes, people, who by their displayed attributes, beliefs and behavior, resemble lower beasts, everything from swine that do not ruminate, because they do not ruminate, (think rationally and deeply), to teeming vermin who go down on all fours, to bottom feeders, vultures, wolves, dogs, worms, maggots etc. Metaphors still in use worldwide in every nation, kingdom, people, country, tribe, including every single language ever spoken ever since people could talk

The law did not become obsolete, only the wrong way to follow the law became obsolete after Jesus first came and revealed that the words used in the divine commands are figurative and the subjects are hidden, not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used. Its the same figurative language spoken by all the prophets. God is not a capricious and puerile petty tyrant obsessed with what people eat what people wear or the sexual preferences of consenting adults. He is however more like a benevolent loving and dedicated Father whose concern is the quality of life of his children shown by teaching how to stand guard over the sanctity of ones own mind to remain or become sane in the chaos of a world without shape or form, lawless, and void.

The mind through which everything is perceived cannot ever find peace without this knowledge.

Here is the wisdom of God.

 

[Meriweather]

I REALLY like your AVATAR!!! " Below: I had the "Short Eared" owl species '72-'74 then had to surrender Barny to the youngest of my three older sisters due to out of town employment. Broken left wing due to being scatter-gunned so full time indoor "house owl". Chicken necks, gizzards & live mice(they need to regurgitate fur balls). Our vet told me they are the only species of owl that nest on the deck. Too much to list here about him but included the link below if interested.

Thank you! I enjoy photographing owls...and this one seems sleepy and happy.

 

[Clyde 154]

Note I do not ask "to follow Jewish dietary restrictions."

Here's my point: Jesus said that he was not here to change one jot or one tittle of the law - jot and tittle being small marks in letters, such as the dot above a lower case i. I'll leave the history lesson about why early Christian missionaries did not require non-Jewish converts to honor Jewish dietary restrictions as they did the Ten Commandments to more knowledgeable folk.

I will say that it would seem strange that Christians would often openly flout laws by eating bacon cheeseburgers, for example. Of course the answer to that is that most Christians do not know why a bacon cheeseburger would be such an anathema. It a deliberate ignorance, in my opinion. Not on the part of the followers, but on the part of the leaders, eager to avoid giving their flock a reason to leave the fold.

Modern science shows that most, if not all, of the dietary restrictions lead to a healthier diet. Should not Christian pastors cite this as an example of God's wisdom? Should they not speak of shellfish and other proscribed foods as tolerated, if not consumed to excess, much as many Christians view alcohol?

The exact statement of Jesus is located in Matthew 5:17-20. You omitted the most important part of Jesus' statement concerning the Law (of Moses). "Thank not that I come to destroy the law, or the prophets, I DID NOT COME TO DESTROY BUT TO FULFILL (the Law of Moses)." Jesus "fulfilled the requirement of the Law in offering a PERFECT sacrifice.....Himself as the lamb of God whose mission to earth is made clear......explicitly clear. Jesus declared that He had fulfilled all that the Father required under the Law (of Moses). -- John 17:4 When Jesus breathed His last breath He declared, "It is finished.........." -- John 19:30 When a thing is finished all that is required is fulfilled or its not finished. The Law was not destroyed...........Jesus lived the perfect life from cradle to grave without sinning once and fulfilled the requirements of the LAW. God made Him (Jesus) who was without sin.........to become sin for us in fulfilling the Law (1 Cor. 5:21)

Jesus also declared that His birth, life and death fulfilled the prophecy from the Law and the prophets, "But all this had taken place to fulfill the scriptures of the prophets.........." (Matthew 26:56, Luke 21:22)

John the Baptist declared of Jesus, "Behold the Lamb of God, who takes away the sins of the world...." -- John 1:29 Jesus did not destroy the Law and the Prophets.........not one title or dot was left unfulfilled just as Jesus stated. Jesus ushered in the New Covenant promised in scripture (Jer. 31:31-34). The scriptures declare that the Law and the prophets were but temporary and a shadow of things to come. -- Hebrews 10:1-12. The Law could not remove sin unless it was fulfilled by living a perfect sin free life.........the blood of animals simply carried sin over from one year to the next.......thus, the Old Law was replaced by the perfect Sacrificial Lam of God....as explained in detail in Hebrews 10

The Gospel of Luke makes it vividly clear with no ambiguity whatsoever. "The Law and the Prophets were until John (the baptist): since that time the Kingdom of God (i.e, the church established by Jesus Christ -- Matt. 16) is preached (as coming soon....at hand -- Matt. 3:2), and every man is being pressed into it." -- Luke 16:16 (the new testament covenant of God as described by Jer. 31:31-34)

Jesus stated that the New Covenant...i.e, the kingdom of God/church, would come within that very generation that He was preaching, the 1st century (Mark 9:1) Some standing there hearing Jesus would not taste of death until they witnessed the Kingdom come with POWER.

 

[Seymour Flops]

The exact statement of Jesus is located in Matthew 5:17-20. You omitted the most important part of Jesus' statement concerning the Law (of Moses). "Thank not that I come to destroy the law, or the prophets, I DID NOT COME TO DESTROY BUT TO FULFILL (the Law of Moses)." Jesus "fulfilled the requirement of the Law in offering a PERFECT sacrifice.....Himself as the lamb of God whose mission to earth is made clear......explicitly clear. Jesus declared that He had fulfilled all that the Father required under the Law (of Moses). -- John 17:4 When Jesus breathed His last breath He declared, "It is finished.........." -- John 19:30 When a thing is finished all that is required is fulfilled or its not finished. The Law was not destroyed...........Jesus lived the perfect life from cradle to grave without sinning once and fulfilled the requirements of the LAW. God made Him (Jesus) who was without sin.........to become sin for us in fulfilling the Law (1 Cor. 5:21)

Jesus also declared that His birth, life and death fulfilled the prophecy from the Law and the prophets, "But all this had taken place to fulfill the scriptures of the prophets.........." (Matthew 26:56, Luke 21:22)

John the Baptist declared of Jesus, "Behold the Lamb of God, who takes away the sins of the world...." -- John 1:29 Jesus did not destroy the Law and the Prophets.........not one title or dot was left unfulfilled just as Jesus stated. Jesus ushered in the New Covenant promised in scripture (Jer. 31:31-34). The scriptures declare that the Law and the prophets were but temporary and a shadow of things to come. -- Hebrews 10:1-12. The Law could not remove sin unless it was fulfilled by living a perfect sin free life.........the blood of animals simply carried sin over from one year to the next.......thus, the Old Law was replaced by the perfect Sacrificial Lam of God....as explained in detail in Hebrews 10

The Gospel of Luke makes it vividly clear with no ambiguity whatsoever. "The Law and the Prophets were until John (the baptist): since that time the Kingdom of God (i.e, the church established by Jesus Christ -- Matt. 16) is preached (as coming soon....at hand -- Matt. 3:2), and every man is being pressed into it." -- Luke 16:16 (the new testament covenant of God as described by Jer. 31:31-34)

Jesus stated that the New Covenant...i.e, the kingdom of God/church, would come within that very generation that He was preaching, the 1st century (Mark 9:1) Some standing there hearing Jesus would not taste of death until they witnessed the Kingdom come with POWER.

So, are the Ten Commandments no longer in force?

If they are, how do we know which laws are still valid and which have already been fulfilled and can now be ignored?

 

[Clyde 154]

So, are the Ten Commandments no longer in force?

If they are, how do we know which laws are still valid and which have already been fulfilled and can now be ignored?

All the 10 commandments are carried forward into the N.T. covenant......with the exception of Sabbath Worship which was reserved expressly for Biblical Israel and did not apply to any gentile nation nor the ancestral lineage of Israel. (Deut. 5:1-3) The command to worship on the Sabbath (7th) is replaced by the Lord's Day in the N.T. (Rev. 1:10, Acts 20:7)

The N.T. scriptures declare, "So let no man judge you IN FOOD OR DRINK OR REGARDING FESTIVAL OR A NEW MOON OR SABBATHS, these are a shadow of things to come, but the substance of Christ." -- Col. 2:16-17 Your question concerning food is answered in this passage. What God has cleansed let no man call unclean (Acts 10:15). There was a reason God forbid Israel from eating certain foods.........at the time these animals carried deadly diseases........which have now been all but eliminated by preparing the meats better.

But, rest assured........all the righteousness of God's laws, which include 9 of the 10 commandments are carried forward into the Covenant of the Kingdom of Christ that ushered in the Last Days of mankind and the final covenant between man and God as promised in (Jer. 31:31-34). Peter declared these are the last days spoken of by the prophet Joel. (Acts 2:16-18) The scriptures state clearly that the New Covenant (kingdom) was at hand.....and men were being pressed into it (prepared/instructed) of its coming (Luke 16:16)

Commandment#1: Thou shalt have no other God before Me. (1 Cor. 10:21-22) Commandment#2: Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven images. (1 Cor. 6:9-10). Commandment#3. Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord in vain. (1 Cor. 6:9-10). 4. Remember the Sabbath (commanded only to Biblical Israel........there is no mention of anyone worshiping on the 7th day prior to the Law of Moses. There is no record of Adam, Noah, or Abraham worshiping on Saturday......if it exists show it to us. Again the Sabbath day is replaced by the Lord's day......the 1st day of the week when the congregations of Christ meet to break break (not eat, as Paul declared, do you not have homes to eat in?) but to take Communion in remembrance of Jesus's sacrifice until He returns.

Commandment#5. Honor thy father and mother. (Eph. 6:2-3). Commandment#6. Thou shall not kill (murder, spill innocent blood -- Romans 13:9). Commandment#7. Thou shalt not commit adultery. (Rom. 13:9) Commandment#8. Thou shalt not steal. (Rom. 13:9) Commandment#9. Thou shalt not bear false witness. (Rom. 13:9) Commandment#10. Thou shalt not covet. (Rom. 13:9).........Paul goes on to declare all these commandments of God can be summed up in simple terms. "Love your neighbor as yourself......"

 

[hobelim]

I DID NOT COME TO DESTROY BUT TO FULFILL

TO FULFILL THE LAW IS TO COMPLY WITH ITS INSTRUCTION. Simple. By doing this Jesus removed sin and the death consequent for failure to comply for only those who understood his teaching about the hidden meaning of the law and fulfilled the law in the exact same WAY that Jesus did by complying with the same law seen in a new light that was lost to time ever since the death of Moses when people turned aside from THE WAY that he originally taught to follow LAW.

Its the same WAY that Jesus brought to light. There is no other WAY to receive salvation from sin

This is my flesh. Unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood you can have no life in you.

 

[Clyde 154]

TO FULFILL THE LAW IS TO COMPLY WITH ITS INSTRUCTION. Simple. By doing this Jesus removed sin and the death consequent for failure to comply for only those who understood his teaching about the hidden meaning of the law and fulfilled the law in the exact same WAY that Jesus did by complying with the same law seen in a new light that was lost to time ever since the death of Moses when people turned aside from THE WAY that he originally taught to follow LAW.

Its the same WAY that Jesus brought to light. There is no other WAY to receive salvation from sin

This is my flesh. Unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood you can have no life in you.

Its clear the Old Law and the Prophets covenant ended just as the prophet Jeremiah declared it would (Jer. 31:31-34)........Jeremiah stated the New Covenant would not be like the one written on stone (the Law of Moses). The Old Law was temporary........as it was for Biblical Israel only..........God was husbanded only to Biblical Israel, not their ancestors (such as Adam, Noah, Abraham....etc (Deut. 5:1-4). No gentile has ever been bound by the Law of Moses. It was ABOLISHED IN THE 1ST CENTURY.

If you attempt to Justify your doctrine/worship UNDER THE LAW.........you must follow the entire Law of Moses, if you fail in one title or dot.......you are guilty of breaking the entire law. (James 2:10). The apostle says it best........you have fallen from the grace of God if you attempt to justify yourself by the Law and prophets (Gal. 5:4) We are sure you offer burnt sacrifices when you worship on the 7th day (if not why not?) and one the 8th day after birth your circumcise your newborn male children(if not why not?).......you stone or even put to death those who commit crimes against humanity.........such as adultery. (if not why not?) Or do you just CHERRY PICK what parts of the Old Law you find simple to live with?

"For He (Jesus) is our peace, who has made both (Jew and Gentile) one, and has broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having ABOLISHED IN THE FLESH THE ENMITY, EVEN THE LAW OF COMMANDMENTS CONTAINED IN ORDINANCES (Jewish laws and custom, such as sabbath worship, burnt offering, circumcision on the 8th day after birth.....etc.) for to make of Himself of twain one new man, so making peace. And that He might reconcile both unto God in one body (the N.T. church....known as the body of Christ) BY THE CROSS (crucified), HAVING SLAIN THE ENMITY (the Jewish Laws) thereby (by His sacrifice as the Lamb of God......before Jesus there was no cure for sin, other to walk perfectly under the law (which no one in history has accomplished........or personally saved by God as was the circumstance in the Old Testament of the few or left earth to walk with God.

Jesus Christ........FULFILLED the requirements of the Law, He walked without sin under the Law and Prophets. "He committed no sin, neither was deceit found in His mouth." -- 2:22
Jesus came to redeem everyone born under the law, in order to accomplish this He became sin and took the sin of the world upon Himself (2 Cor. 5:21)

Its explained and simple (why attempt to twist the scripture to fit your mistranslated doctrine when the scripture explain themselves?) ".......God sent forth His Son, made of a woman, made under the law, to redeem them that were under the law (He fulfilled the requirements of the Law.......no sin from cradle to grave), that we might receive adoption of sons......." -- Gal. 4:4-5

Jesus Christ ended the Old Law, He torn down the wall that separated the Jew and the Gentile.

 

[hobelim]

Jesus Christ ended the Old Law, He torn down the wall that separated the Jew and the Gentile.

The only thing that ended for the intelligent was the wrong way to follow the Law, not the "old Law" itself. The Law has always been in effect and in full force whether or not anyone believes.

Many people watching will not taste of death until they see the kingdom of God in full power.

Just like karma, cause and effect, no humans are ever required to enforce the Law of God.

All people, descending or ascending, have their reward already, death for sin, life for compliance