Shake Hands for a New America

[BlackAsCoal]

So long as it's constructive.

I agree .. but rarely is it handed to you.

Social Security, civil rights, Medicaid/Medicare .. and a host of safety nets for the American people had to be fought for.

 

[editec]

Black as Coal keeps pointing out that Obama is not a leftist, and I think he's correct.

Of coruse from the perspective of many on this board, Obama is far left.

But then too, those people also think BUSH II is a leftist.

So here we are again, falling for the framing game.

We have been taught to see politics as either left or right.

Despite ALL the EVIDENCE from the actions of BOTH PARTIES that neither of them fits that left/rightmodel, we cling to it, because its EASIER to think in those terms THAN IT IS TO THINK.

Obama AND McCain

1. both signed on to the bail out
2. both agreed they'd keep troops in Iraw til it stabilized.
3. both come from parties which sign on to FREE TRADE internationism

Now where is this huge difference that some of you think you see between these candidates or the parties they are members of?

PARTISANS ARE DUPES​

 

[Lycurgus]

Nothing,, this is just another one of those "we won the election now we should all work together" bullshit pieces from the liberals who wouldn't do jack shit about working together for the last 8 years, just smile and nod.

Exactly!

They sure didn't want to shake my hand last year or three years ago or 6 years ago!

Save the bull shit.

 

[WillowTree]

Black as Coal keeps pointing out that Obama is not a leftist, and I think he's correct.

Of coruse from the perspective of many on this board, Obama is far left.
But then too, those people also think BUSH II is a leftist.

So here we are again, falling for the framing game.

We have been taught to see politics as either left or right.

Despite ALL the EVIDENCE from the actions of BOTH PARTIES that neither of them fits that left/rightmodel, we cling to it, because its EASIER to think in those terms THAN IT IS TO THINK.

Obama AND McCain

1. both signed on to the bail out
2. both agreed they'd keep troops in Iraw til it stabilized.
3. both come from parties which sign on to FREE TRADE internationism

Now where is this huge difference that some of you think you see between these candidates or the parties they are members of?

PARTISANS ARE DUPES​

No, actually that notion comes from his voting record in Illinois State Senate and the US Senate.. Even the Press has dubbed him with the most left voting record of any Senator in Washington. So, I think he earned it.. And he did come from the alter of KOS

 

[BlackAsCoal]

Black as Coal keeps pointing out that Obama is not a leftist, and I think he's correct.

Of coruse from the perspective of many on this board, Obama is far left.

But then too, those people also think BUSH II is a leftist.

So here we are again, falling for the framing game.

We have been taught to see politics as either left or right.

Despite ALL the EVIDENCE from the actions of BOTH PARTIES that neither of them fits that left/rightmodel, we cling to it, because its EASIER to think in those terms THAN IT IS TO THINK.

Obama AND McCain

1. both signed on to the bail out
2. both agreed they'd keep troops in Iraw til it stabilized.
3. both come from parties which sign on to FREE TRADE internationism

Now where is this huge difference that some of you think you see between these candidates or the parties they are members of?

PARTISANS ARE DUPES​

 

[BlackAsCoal]

No, actually that notion comes from his voting record in Illinois State Senate and the US Senate.. Even the Press has dubbed him with the most left voting record of any Senator in Washington. So, I think he earned it.. And he did come from the alter of KOS

You make editec's point perfectly

 

[DiamondDave]

It is always wise to pay attention to what a politician does, not what comes out of his mouth.

Name the liberals in Obama's cabinet.

It would be most certainly unwise to believe that his every appointment comes from the center/right, then believe that he'll govern from the left.

Obama is a centrist by every definition.

His record dictates otherwise.. and his cabinet does not sign law, nor creat law... they follow his direction... his record is about as far left in history as can be... and those actions show he is not centrist... it is not likely he will change his spots

 

[WillowTree]

No,, voting for partial birth abrotion is far left

voting to withold medical treatment for a live baby is far left

to withdraw the troops immediately is far left,,, (he has backpedalled on that one but that was his origianal stance..


to dedicated 9 billion a year to fight global poverty is far left


to ban clean coal from America is far left


he is far far left,, he is just gonna try to walk the middle so as not to piss off the middle,, he needs the middle

 

[BlackAsCoal]

His record dictates otherwise.. and his cabinet does not sign law, nor creat law... they follow his direction... his record is about as far left in history as can be... and those actions show he is not centrist... it is not likely he will change his spots

I recognize that for republicans anything to the left of Newt Ginghrich is the "far left" .. and I recognize that republicans base their hopes for renewal on Obama being far left .. but NOTHING, absolutely ZERO he has done since the end of the primaries paint him as far left .. and as I've said many times, much of his opposition will come from the left, not the right.

To most republicans, Bill Clinton, who created the republican wing of the Democratic Party, was a leftist.

As someone who resides on the far left .. and did not vote for Obama because he does not represent the left, let alone the far left, I find this all amusing.

 

[BlackAsCoal]

No,, voting for partial birth abrotion is far left

voting to withold medical treatment for a live baby is far left

to withdraw the troops immediately is far left,,, (he has backpedalled on that one but that was his origianal stance..


to dedicated 9 billion a year to fight global poverty is far left


to ban clean coal from America is far left


he is far far left,, he is just gonna try to walk the middle so as not to piss off the middle,, he needs the middle

Abortion is the issue of the far-right and there are plenty of republicans and centrists who do not tow the abortion line.

Ron Paul wanted US troops removed from Iraq immediately and he's nowhere close to being on the left.

Do I need to post the list of republicans who have opposed coal .. and shouldn't you already know them?

" Just 14 percent of Texas adults favor fast-tracking the approval process for new coal-fired power plants, while more than four out of five state residents (81 percent) want the health and environmental concerns associated with any potential new power plants addressed first. Governor Perry's fast-tracking approach is favored by a slim 22 percent of Republicans, 13 percent of Independents and 8 percent of Democrats."
Environmental Integrity Project - Texans Oppose Dirty Coal-Fired Power Plants

Is Texas a "leftist" state?

This is why I said you make editec's point perfectly. You're so hung up on partisanship you don't even know your own side's position and reality escapes you.

The far-left does not vote for bailouts of Wall Street .. ask Kucinich why

The far-left does not vote for war .. as in chasing ghosts into Pakistan or threatening Iran

The far-left does not vote for FISA and illegal government spying

Partisans are stupid people who have no use for logic, facts, or even common sense.

 

[TR_GOP]

Ahh... but... name the centrist history and voting history of Obama...

A tiger just does not quickly change their stripes... it is not wise to think Obama will govern from the middle

Obama is a political chameleon. It's a coping mechanism learned early in life when born of biracial parents. Exposure to a wide swath of ethnic communities reinforces the ability.

The Barack Obama of South Chicago politics (not to mention Sunday sermons by Rev. Wright) isn't the same Barack Obama of 1600 Pennsylvania Ave., Wash DC.

 

[Munin]

I agree. Liberals spent 2001-2009 claiming the Bush Presidency was illegitimate, held up the mantra "Bush lied, Thousands died," and as early as 2001, Democrats were set in their way to combat the Republican majority. That liberals should ask us to lay down our arms and to work with them to enact their liberal utopia is amusing.

The way Bush got elected in the first term was somehow a bit strange though.
Then hearing Bush talk about protecting democratic values, even more strange.

 

[Munin]

More willow wallow. Bush pushed his agenda and told the rest of US to go to hell. When democrats tried to work with him, he didn't. Dick Taters are not really ready to be bi-partisan.

I guess he isn't much of a team player, that pretty much how he acted on the international scene too.