Roe v. Wade getting overturned!!

[NotfooledbyW]

00264 23MAY23 NFBW #264 {to: 00,263 bgn} “Do you actually believe it’s just a privilege for a pregnant woman to decide to prevent harm or risk of death to her body?”

00268 23MAY24 martybegan ¥ #268 {to: 00,264 nfbw} It's the same question, only a heart transplant doesn't involve another human life.

NFBW: We know a heart transplant operation does not involve a fetus. So why did you bring it up as part of this discussion?

This is a constitutional human rights conflict between a fetus and its mother. It has nothing to do with a good heart versus a bad heart. You are on record that a fetus does not have a right to life during the first 16 weeks of gestation. So why do you support the political party that bans abortions prior to that number of weeks of gestation?

 

[martybegan]

00264 23MAY23 NFBW #264 {to: 00,263 bgn} “Do you actually believe it’s just a privilege for a pregnant woman to decide to prevent harm or risk of death to her body?”

00268 23MAY24 ¥martybgn¥ #268 {to: 00,264 nfbw} It's the same question, only a heart transplant doesn't involve another human life.

NFBW: We know a heart transplant operation does not involve a fetus. So why did you bring it up as part of this discussion?

This is a constitutional human rights conflict between a fetus and its mother. It has nothing to do with a good heart versus a bad heart. You are on record that a fetus does not have a right to life during the first 16 weeks of gestation. So why do you support the political party that bans abortions prior to that number of weeks of gestation?

Learn to use the quote function properly or don't get a response from me.

 

[Frankeneinstein]

I’m just waiting for a response to my question in post 00,264 (see above}

big deal, you still haven't answered my question...how do you feel about the way Christians have historically treated communists?

I'm still waiting.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

The answer to the first question at the top
Is “one”.

You express your personal morality on abortion as being that you consider the medical procedure of abortion at ten weeks to be murder. That is based on your reply third from the top.

Whereas criminal law being based upon common law finds one individual causing death to a separate individual who is legally established as alive by record of survival ving birth and living as a result of brain function including those in need of life sustaining medical support. But for a fetus to be murdered by its mother and doctor it has to be able to survive life outside the womb. That is a stage of development whereas as a minimum the fetus must have its own functional brain and neurological connections that regulate monitor and control all bodily functions of its own.,

When a woman is 10 weeks pregnant it is a fact that inside her body there is only one brain and one neurological system sustaining life. Is is therefore impossible for a woman to be charged with murder fir terminating her own pregnancy at that time?

Unless the law specifies otherwise.
Which it can.

No. Laws that allow government to deprive law abiding citizens of liberty or loss of property are based on common law and there must be an individual victim who is harmed by a separate individual.

Common law, at the time of the founding of America, was that life begins at quickening, which is now referred to in our modern day as viability as established in Roe versus Wade. If a woman aborted her fetus prior to quickening in 1780, there was no crime in common law. If she aborted it after quickening, it was considered a misdemeanor not murder.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

23MAY09 NFBW: Many Jewish Americans believe scientific life begins at conception as do I. Many Jewish Americans believe metaphysical life or human life derives its unique value because human beings have a relationship with GOD. Jews believe the soul is pure and from GOD. We receive our souls when we take our first breath. I am a rational theist whose conscience says it is none of my business what a woman does with a brainless material organism in her body before it has a brain and is capable of taking a first breath therefore instilled with the purity of God.

I live in Virginia where Jewish consciences remains free. So it is with me? Why do you ¥hvdvt¥ want to take my freedom of conscience away to be aligned with your MAGA white Christian conscience on abortion when Jesus is silent on the matter?

Why do you think states with majority white Christian anti-choice legislators should impose a sanctity of life beginning at conception on Jewish people?

That was just gibberish.

Let Alabama be Alabama

I would prefer 12, but 16 seems to be a bigger vote getter.

This is fact not gibberish: Jewish Americans believe metaphysical life or human life derives its unique value because human beings have a relationship with GOD. Jews believe the soul is pure and from GOD. We receive our souls when we take our first breath.

You say you want Alabama to be Alabama. Alabama has a bunch of white Christians who can pass laws based upon their belief that the sanctity of life begins at conception.

Those laws give the government in Alabama the power to force a Jewish woman to gestate a fetus against her will when she does not believe the majority religious idea that life begins at conception.

That violates the religious belief of a religious minority.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

00003 23APR19 ¥ johngaltshrugged ¥ #3 “Abortion is unquestionably much worse than slavery.”

23MAY26 NFBW: An abortion at ten weeks gestation does not deny liberty to a conscious human being. An abortion is the choice of a woman who makes that decision. An abortion causes no conscious human being to suffer.,

When a conscious human being is taken into slavery the slave has no choice. The slave is denied liberty and therefore caused to suffer.

 

[johngaltshrugged]

00003 23APR19 ¥ johngaltshrugged ¥ #3 “Abortion is unquestionably much worse than slavery.”

23MAY26 NFBW: An abortion at ten weeks gestation does not deny liberty to a conscious human being. An abortion is the choice of a woman who makes that decision. An abortion causes no conscious human being to suffer.,

When a conscious human being is taken into slavery the slave has no choice. The slave is denied liberty and therefore caused to suffer.

What you gaslight as "abortion" is actually the murder of an infant.
Infanticide kills a human being, the most innocent & vulnerable at that too.
The Baby Butcher Death Cult is evil & disgusting.
Take your baby butchering gaslights to the idiots that fall for that crap.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Which enumerated power gives Congress the ability to protect a woman's extra-constitutional right to an abortion?

IT’s a matter of what “government” cannot do to a law abiding individual just because she ends up with a fertilized egg in her body.

No government shall ever deprive a woman of the liberty to make decisions about what she chooses to do with her body. Forced gestation to full term by a government is forcing a woman to take on the risk of harm to her body including potential death.

No civilized society should force that on anyone. Ever,

nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty

Fourteenth Amendment​

Fourteenth Amendment Explained

Section 1​

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

. The Declaration of Independence says it has a right to life.

Where does The Declaration of Independence say a fetus has a right to life.?

When the Declaration was penned, English Common law held no criminality for an abortion prior to quickening ( showing and fetal movement ) After quickening an abortion was considered a misdemeanor:

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Did someone force her to spread her legs? I criticize conservatives for caring more about fetuses than the women that carry them and the babies they give birth to, supporting policies that undermine a single mother's ability to raise these children. Nonetheless, on the other side of the spectrum of responsibility, you have liberals pretending abortion is a trivial affair, and women should be encouraged to end their pregnancies, willy-nilly, to get rid of the inconvenience of carrying a human life.
Don't women know that if they have sex, they might conceive a human life?

Do women conceive worthless pieces of protoplasm? How does this elevate womanhood? Claiming women conceive trash, that can, willy-nilly, be ripped to pieces and thrown away in a dumpster. Is that what women conceive? Garbage?

Didn't we all go through the prenatal stage of development? Now we're flippantly dismissing the lives of others, going through that same stage of human development? We're out of the womb, safe and secure then we turn around and promote the destruction of prenatal human life. How RICH. How can a society remain civil when life in the womb is held with such disregard? Abortions of convenience are savagery.

Now to the conservatives I say. You expect the state to force a woman to remain pregnant but then you abandon her when she gives birth, defunding government programs that assist single mothers. Everything from Medicaid to daycare and school lunches. They lose it all when conservatives are in charge. Maybe due to the pregnancy, she lost her job, and now where is the light and salt of the Earth? Where are the born-again, spirit-filled disciples of Jesus Christ? Where are the conservatives when she needs assistance to get back on her feet? God isn't impressed with your concern for fetuses if you abandon single mothers and their babies in squalor. The infrastructure has to be in place to help single mothers and their babies (you know, those former fetuses that you supposedly loved so much when they were in their mother's wombs).

If you're "Pro-life" then actually be that, for human life, both in and outside of the womb. ​

23MAY27 NFBW: To your first question it is none of your business if rape is not involved.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

I criticize conservatives for caring more about fetuses than the women that carry them and the babies they give birth to, supporting policies that undermine a single mother's ability to raise these children.

23MAY27 NFBW: You should. Everybody should. Most specifically the Christians on the extreme religious right should be criticized for making a private matter in the first 24 weeks their business and government’s business but not giving a shit after a baby takes its first breath. One out of five conservatives mind their own business when it comes to the private matter of abortion during the first 24 weeks. The only problem with them is they enable the religious extremists who want the government to force full term gestation on women against their will,

 

[Red Front]

23MAY27 NFBW: To your first question it is none of your business if rape is not involved.

It's my business if I make it so. Just like I don't want to live in a society where 50-year-old fathers are marrying their 25-year-old daughters, I don't want to live in a society that destroys human life in the womb, willy-nilly. I want to live in a society where people hold life sacred, both in and out of the womb. You may not want to live in that society or don't care, but I do care about that and hence I will do what I can to make society conform to my worldview. You can try to make it conform to yours.

A woman's choice is in the bedroom.​

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Nonetheless, on the other side of the spectrum of responsibility, you have liberals pretending abortion is a trivial affair, and women should be encouraged to end their pregnancies, willy-nilly,

23MAY27 NFBW: That is not my perspective nor is it the attitude of any pro-choice politician I have ever voted into office. . That is an absurd generalization on your part. Read my posts if you wish to understand the liberal pro-choice argument,

 

[NotfooledbyW]

you have liberals pretending {•••••••} women should be encouraged to end their pregnancies, willy-nilly, to get rid of the inconvenience of carrying a human life.

23MAY27 NFBW: You have no such thing. You should avoid usage of the word “pretending” when making a point. It shows you have no basis in facts and have just made something up,

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Do women conceive worthless pieces of protoplasm? How does this elevate womanhood? Claiming women conceive trash, that can, willy-nilly, be ripped to pieces and thrown away in a dumpster. Is that what women conceive? Garbage?

00036 23JAN ¥ Lesh ¥ #36 Jewish law does not consider the fetus to be a being with a soul until it is born. It does not have personhood. Furthermore, before 40 days, some poskim, or deciders of Jewish law, have a low bar for allowing an abortion. •••• The Talmud, in Yevamos 69b, cites the view of Rav Hisda that “until forty days from conception the fetus is merely water. It is not yet considered a living being.” •••• If there is a threat to a woman’s life, the safety of the mother takes precedence over continuing the pregnancy at any stage. Many sources illustrate this graphically and rather unambiguously, and all modern poskim, or religious decisors, agree on this. In fact, in certain circumstances, a fetus that endangers the life of the mother is legally considered a “murderer” in active pursuit.

23MAY27 NFBW: Biblically speaking however based on a Jewish perspective, a woman conceives a one cell living human organism that grows and splits cells at a tremendous pace. The living human organism does not have a soul until gestation is complete. That’s if you wish to go back to Jesus’ time for a proper perspective of what proponents of Judeo/ Christianity should believe. Having a soul at conception comes later in the history of Christianity sometime after the life of Saint Thomas Aquinas. I’m bad with dates.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

I make a distinction between the life of a human embryo and the life of the human being that conceived it. For me, the woman is the actual human being and the embryo or unformed fetus is but a potential human being. The woman decides whether she's going to lend her uterus and womb or not to a gestating embryo, not the government or anyone else.

Don't women know that if they have sex, they might conceive a human life?

You nor I have the right to force women to allow a zygote or embryo to actualize a course of development at their expense. The woman has a certain degree of sovereignty and freedom over her body, and a zygote, embryo or unviable fetus doesn't have the right to force a woman to actualize its course of development into personhood. That should be the woman's choice.

More you just proved my point that a zygote or embryo, even a fetus isn't a baby, it's just a potential that relies on an actual human being to actualize itself. It's an "it", not a "who", hence if the actual human person decides to abort their pregnancy, that's not murder. There was never a human person there to be murdered. If I throw an acorn in the trash bin, did I throw an oak tree in the trash? If an embryo is cut from the actual human being i.e. the woman, was a human being or person killed? No, because the human embryo is not a being or person. So your point is moot.

If you really cared so much about human life, you would be more concerned about the poor and the suffering of actual human beings, not embryos and fetuses. You pretend to be "pro-life" by defending life in other people's wombs yet have very little concern for life outside of the womb.

23MAY27 NFBW: When a woman ends up pregnant and I’m not involved then it is none of my business. I agree with you Mr. Commnstfrnt that she has the right to end the life of an unviable fetus.

 

[beagle9]

IT’s a matter of what “government” cannot do to a law abiding individual just because she ends up with a fertilized egg in her body.

No government shall ever deprive a woman of the liberty to make decisions about what she chooses to do with her body. Forced gestation to full term by a government is forcing a woman to take on the risk of harm to her body including potential death.

No civilized society should force that on anyone. Ever,

nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty

Fourteenth Amendment​

Fourteenth Amendment Explained

Section 1​

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

You and your bull crap.. lol

Again, for the millionth time on this thread or subject - no one is forcing (holding a gun to their head's), anyone to carry a child that was willfully created by two in agreement of, otherwise it shouldn't be that a consenting couple that has created a human being through an act that had been committed by the two consenting adults (in which brought about the process in which a human being has begun to develope inside of a woman's womb), would want to destroy that process or developing baby inside of the womb unless very unusual circumstances exist that would force the medical field to take necessary action in regards too the removal of the baby being developed.

What is being done basically, is the attempt to slow down or to remove the mechanism's that have been put in place that coerce, brainwash, convince, and then allow a procedure to take place that actually removes a healthy developing human being from a woman's body, and this while she is under some sort of emotional stress from being pregnant (vulnerable)....

She was convinced by it all to sadly do the unthinkable to herself, and to her developing baby within her womb.

The unthinkable was being done through processes that were put in place by knucklehead's or by the knucklehead "Margaret Sanger" who was ethnic cleansing by way of going after the babies in the womb.

Bottom line is that we the people along with our federal government, won't stand by or be involved in the process of a pregnancy being stopped willy nilly, and therefore a baby being destroyed just because a couple or mother comes begging for someone to assist them in an uncivilized thing.

If state's want to continue to accommodate women that want this form of birth control, then so be it, but the federal government doesn't have to be involved or it doesn't have to fund it or condone it.

What we the people are requiring, otherwise through our government, is for all processes and act's to be conducted and proceeded upon in an ethical, moral, and CIVILIZED manor.... It is how anything should always be conducted in a civilized SOCIETY and way.

Abortion had taken on an unethical and cruel uncivilized manor in which it was being conducted, and it only got worse and worse from there .. It had to be regulated heavily, otherwise we would be looked at by our creator as a failed people and nation that had sunken to a level of depravity in which we had no return from.

We have to turn back to a time where personal responsibility has to be taken by the two people deciding to engage in an act that could possibly create a pregnancy in which a healthy human being starts to develope.

As much as you Dem's love to regulate thing's, I am shocked that you aren't going along with at least the regulation of the out of control abortion industry.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

It's my business if I make it so.

23MAY27 NFBW: It’s not your business to impede the liberty of a law abiding person from conducting their own business when she decides to stop the development of the living human organism that has become a part of her body.

 

[Red Front]

23MAY27 NFBW: Ir’s not your business to impede the liberty of a law abiding person from conducting their own business when she decides to stop the development of the living human organism that has become a part of her bidy.

Law-abiding? Which law? Law of the jungle? Law of savages? Law of a meaningless, accidental, cosmic hic-up 13.7 billion years ago? Promiscuity undermines human survival and civil society because it leads to unwanted pregnancies. Since you and others of your ilk reduce human life to a meaningless accident, you have no sense of respect or compassion for prenatal human life. Society today has the technology to avoid unwanted pregnancies, hence if a woman chooses to be promiscuous there's no excuse for her to conceive a human life and then willy-nilly destroy it. She should've taken the pill. A society full of creepy women who disregard life in their wombs is uncivilized. A culture of savages.

Conservatives need to allow society to create the infrastructure to provide single mothers and their babies with the assistance that they need. Stop defunding government programs/social services. The poor need assistance (food, housing, medical care, education/job training, and an employment guarantee in the public sector), and that of course includes single mothers who can't afford to raise a child properly. There should also be the option to place the child up for adoption, the problem is that the foster care system is underfunded and horrible, leading to many young people being released at the age of 18, and becoming homeless, like this:

​

This must stop.

Government isn't inherently evil, it's a holy institution, created and inspired by God. The spirit of rebellion and hatred for legitimate authority is demonic. Even demons have a government, so these supposed Christians who keep crapping on government are even less and worse than demons. God loves order and those who provide provisions to the poor. There shouldn't be one homeless person in America.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

09019 23MAY27 ¥commnstfrnt ¥ #9,019 Law-abiding? Which law?

Law-abiding? Which law?

23MAY27 NFBW {09019} Common Law under the framework of the US Constitution which guarantees liberty to every freedom loving air breathing individual in this great country of ours. That includes women who get pregnant..

common law, also called Anglo-American law, the body of customary law, based upon judicial decisions and embodied in reports of decided cases, that has been administered by the common-law courts of England since the Middle Ages.​