No 'Deals' With Israel, Unless We Get Everything We Want

[Kondor3]

Bullshit hypotheticals? My 'bullshit hypothetical' is why the Occupied Territories ARE STILL OCCUPIED, almost 50 years later. Because nobody cares enough about the Mad-Dog Palestinians to go to war over it. If the world DID give a damn about the Palestinians, the Occupation would have been forced to an end DECADES ago. The results speak for themselves. THAT's Reality, boy.

If I was President, I'd end it after 90 days.

Speaking of "hypothetical bullshit".........

 

[Kondor3]

Fantasy on top of fantasy. Ain't gonna happen. But your tax-dollar contribution to civilian and military aid to Israel is greatly appreciated.

I've already written to my representatives telling them I have no intention of voting for anyone sending military aid to Israel. Humanitarian aid is okay. Military aid, no fuckin' way!

In all likelihood, your letter is now part of your Congressman's Office emergency supply of toilet paper, once they spat-out the obligatory 'we share your concerns' blather.

 

[MHunterB]

Fantasy on top of fantasy. Ain't gonna happen. But your tax-dollar contribution to civilian and military aid to Israel is greatly appreciated.

I've already written to my representatives telling them I have no intention of voting for anyone sending military aid to Israel. Humanitarian aid is okay. Military aid, no fuckin' way!

In all likelihood, your letter is now part of your Congressman's Office emergency supply of toilet paper, once they spat-out the obligatory 'we share your concerns' blather.

Ah, a case of 'sweets FROM the sweet'........

 

[RoccoR]

Billo_Really, et al,

You don't really expect me to fall for this trap; do you?

Your position has consistently been that, as you state, supra, that the conflict rests with "a bunch of criminals did not go to Palestine to take over their country." That is what we call blame. And it is highly over simplified, since the territory was not Palestinian sovereign to begin with.

Well, if you wanna discuss the issue of sovereignty in a more generic perspective, we can do that with the following:

If we were the UN and were going to decide sovereignty over an area between two groups of people, which group has more of a right to that claim:

1. an indigenous majority population that had been living there for centuries, or
2. a minority population of immigrants who recently moved into the area, some of which illegally migrated there

Of those two groups, who has more of a right to claim sovereignty?

(COMMENT)

This is a set-up known as the "False Dilemma or Dichotomy;" AKA: Excluded Middle. It is a product of "black-and/or-white thinking."

It assumes that the question is entirely balanced and unbiased.

It is a strategy that is aimed at forcing me to admit that the Palestinian, an Ottoman derivative population, had some mastery or control over the territorial sovereignty over Mandate of Palestine, and thereby are the victims.

The Palestinian are a people with absolutely no history of leadership or social advancement to form a cohesive nation in the last millennium of time. They are a brutal and embittered people in chaos that have no collective ability to form a heritage of any value or substance.

Are they a people that have indicated, in any way - shape - or form - that they are a capable of standing on their own two feet and reasonably handle "sovereignty?"

The Answer is "NO." Thus, you support the culture that has proven itself to be a benefit to humanity; without regard to the slanted Arab view of their immigration status, which attempts to deny them the right of self-determination.

If there is a case of discrimination, of apartheid, of segregation, and an unwillingness to adjust to 21st Century morals and turpitude, then the Arab-Palestinian should look in the mirror to recognize it. But, the rest of the world needs to understand that the very last thing we need is an out-of-control, parasitic, Jihadist based sovereign Islamic Waqf backed by a bunch of unproductive Fedayeen that don't know anything other than to create havoc; that can give no other excuse than - the world didn't turn-out the way they wanted it.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Perception and experience guides us all.

And always perfectly aligned with Israeli propaganda.

(COMMENT)

I know that mine is not "Israeli Propaganda." I seriously doubt that there is a true Israeli Propagandist in the forum. Not even those that are from Israel.

Perspective is something we all share, yet, albeit --- not through the same lens.

The achievement of a worthy goal such as peace, can only be fulfilled through diligence, hard work, dedication and the sacrifice to see the task through. Few successful entrepreneurs of tower and stature had everything handed to them on a silver platter. So it is with diplomacy striving for peace and prosperity for themselves and a nation.

The perspective comes with the recognition that the Palestinian is completely on the wrong track, and have not just sabotaged themselves, but entire future generations of their clan through the pursuit of systematically raising the next generation of Jihadist and Fedayeen.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

Billo_Really, et al,

You don't really expect me to fall for this trap; do you?

Your position has consistently been that, as you state, supra, that the conflict rests with "a bunch of criminals did not go to Palestine to take over their country." That is what we call blame. And it is highly over simplified, since the territory was not Palestinian sovereign to begin with.

Well, if you wanna discuss the issue of sovereignty in a more generic perspective, we can do that with the following:

If we were the UN and were going to decide sovereignty over an area between two groups of people, which group has more of a right to that claim:

1. an indigenous majority population that had been living there for centuries, or
2. a minority population of immigrants who recently moved into the area, some of which illegally migrated there

Of those two groups, who has more of a right to claim sovereignty?

(COMMENT)

This is a set-up known as the "False Dilemma or Dichotomy;" AKA: Excluded Middle. It is a product of "black-and/or-white thinking."

It assumes that the question is entirely balanced and unbiased.

It is a strategy that is aimed at forcing me to admit that the Palestinian, an Ottoman derivative population, had some mastery or control over the territorial sovereignty over Mandate of Palestine, and thereby are the victims.

The Palestinian are a people with absolutely no history of leadership or social advancement to form a cohesive nation in the last millennium of time. They are a brutal and embittered people in chaos that have no collective ability to form a heritage of any value or substance.

Are they a people that have indicated, in any way - shape - or form - that they are a capable of standing on their own two feet and reasonably handle "sovereignty?"

The Answer is "NO." Thus, you support the culture that has proven itself to be a benefit to humanity; without regard to the slanted Arab view of their immigration status, which attempts to deny them the right of self-determination.

If there is a case of discrimination, of apartheid, of segregation, and an unwillingness to adjust to 21st Century morals and turpitude, then the Arab-Palestinian should look in the mirror to recognize it. But, the rest of the world needs to understand that the very last thing we need is an out-of-control, parasitic, Jihadist based sovereign Islamic Waqf backed by a bunch of unproductive Fedayeen that don't know anything other than to create havoc; that can give no other excuse than - the world didn't turn-out the way they wanted it.

Most Respectfully,
R

Holy smokescreen, Batman.

It was a simple question. Who has the right to the country?

The people who have lived there for generation?

Or

Foreigners from Europe?

 

[Indeependent]

Billo_Really, et al,

You don't really expect me to fall for this trap; do you?

Well, if you wanna discuss the issue of sovereignty in a more generic perspective, we can do that with the following:

If we were the UN and were going to decide sovereignty over an area between two groups of people, which group has more of a right to that claim:

1. an indigenous majority population that had been living there for centuries, or
2. a minority population of immigrants who recently moved into the area, some of which illegally migrated there

Of those two groups, who has more of a right to claim sovereignty?

(COMMENT)

This is a set-up known as the "False Dilemma or Dichotomy;" AKA: Excluded Middle. It is a product of "black-and/or-white thinking."

It assumes that the question is entirely balanced and unbiased.

It is a strategy that is aimed at forcing me to admit that the Palestinian, an Ottoman derivative population, had some mastery or control over the territorial sovereignty over Mandate of Palestine, and thereby are the victims.

The Palestinian are a people with absolutely no history of leadership or social advancement to form a cohesive nation in the last millennium of time. They are a brutal and embittered people in chaos that have no collective ability to form a heritage of any value or substance.

Are they a people that have indicated, in any way - shape - or form - that they are a capable of standing on their own two feet and reasonably handle "sovereignty?"

The Answer is "NO." Thus, you support the culture that has proven itself to be a benefit to humanity; without regard to the slanted Arab view of their immigration status, which attempts to deny them the right of self-determination.

If there is a case of discrimination, of apartheid, of segregation, and an unwillingness to adjust to 21st Century morals and turpitude, then the Arab-Palestinian should look in the mirror to recognize it. But, the rest of the world needs to understand that the very last thing we need is an out-of-control, parasitic, Jihadist based sovereign Islamic Waqf backed by a bunch of unproductive Fedayeen that don't know anything other than to create havoc; that can give no other excuse than - the world didn't turn-out the way they wanted it.

Most Respectfully,
R

Holy smokescreen, Batman.

It was a simple question. Who has the right to the country?

The people who have lived there for generation?

Or

Foreigners from Europe?

The Cherokee.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Perception and experience guides us all.

And always perfectly aligned with Israeli propaganda.

(COMMENT)

I know that mine is not "Israeli Propaganda." I seriously doubt that there is a true Israeli Propagandist in the forum. Not even those that are from Israel.

Perspective is something we all share, yet, albeit --- not through the same lens.

The achievement of a worthy goal such as peace, can only be fulfilled through diligence, hard work, dedication and the sacrifice to see the task through. Few successful entrepreneurs of tower and stature had everything handed to them on a silver platter. So it is with diplomacy striving for peace and prosperity for themselves and a nation.

The perspective comes with the recognition that the Palestinian is completely on the wrong track, and have not just sabotaged themselves, but entire future generations of their clan through the pursuit of systematically raising the next generation of Jihadist and Fedayeen.

Most Respectfully,
R

The Palestinians were attacked by foreigners out of Europe.

What are their options?

 

[Indeependent]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Perception and experience guides us all.

And always perfectly aligned with Israeli propaganda.

(COMMENT)

I know that mine is not "Israeli Propaganda." I seriously doubt that there is a true Israeli Propagandist in the forum. Not even those that are from Israel.

Perspective is something we all share, yet, albeit --- not through the same lens.

The achievement of a worthy goal such as peace, can only be fulfilled through diligence, hard work, dedication and the sacrifice to see the task through. Few successful entrepreneurs of tower and stature had everything handed to them on a silver platter. So it is with diplomacy striving for peace and prosperity for themselves and a nation.

The perspective comes with the recognition that the Palestinian is completely on the wrong track, and have not just sabotaged themselves, but entire future generations of their clan through the pursuit of systematically raising the next generation of Jihadist and Fedayeen.

Most Respectfully,
R

The Palestinians were attacked by foreigners out of Europe.

What are their options?

Catch up on your history.
They were asked to stay and the Jordanians told them to get out of the way or be run over Jordanian tanks.
But that's OK, God will tell you the truth when you die.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Perception and experience guides us all.


(COMMENT)

I know that mine is not "Israeli Propaganda." I seriously doubt that there is a true Israeli Propagandist in the forum. Not even those that are from Israel.

Perspective is something we all share, yet, albeit --- not through the same lens.

The achievement of a worthy goal such as peace, can only be fulfilled through diligence, hard work, dedication and the sacrifice to see the task through. Few successful entrepreneurs of tower and stature had everything handed to them on a silver platter. So it is with diplomacy striving for peace and prosperity for themselves and a nation.

The perspective comes with the recognition that the Palestinian is completely on the wrong track, and have not just sabotaged themselves, but entire future generations of their clan through the pursuit of systematically raising the next generation of Jihadist and Fedayeen.

Most Respectfully,
R

The Palestinians were attacked by foreigners out of Europe.

What are their options?

Catch up on your history.
They were asked to stay and the Jordanians told them to get out of the way or be run over Jordanian tanks.
But that's OK, God will tell you the truth when you die.

Not only is that not true, it doesn't address my post.

 

[MHunterB]

Billo_Really, et al,

You don't really expect me to fall for this trap; do you?

Well, if you wanna discuss the issue of sovereignty in a more generic perspective, we can do that with the following:

If we were the UN and were going to decide sovereignty over an area between two groups of people, which group has more of a right to that claim:

1. an indigenous majority population that had been living there for centuries, or
2. a minority population of immigrants who recently moved into the area, some of which illegally migrated there

Of those two groups, who has more of a right to claim sovereignty?

(COMMENT)

This is a set-up known as the "False Dilemma or Dichotomy;" AKA: Excluded Middle. It is a product of "black-and/or-white thinking."

It assumes that the question is entirely balanced and unbiased.

It is a strategy that is aimed at forcing me to admit that the Palestinian, an Ottoman derivative population, had some mastery or control over the territorial sovereignty over Mandate of Palestine, and thereby are the victims.

The Palestinian are a people with absolutely no history of leadership or social advancement to form a cohesive nation in the last millennium of time. They are a brutal and embittered people in chaos that have no collective ability to form a heritage of any value or substance.

Are they a people that have indicated, in any way - shape - or form - that they are a capable of standing on their own two feet and reasonably handle "sovereignty?"

The Answer is "NO." Thus, you support the culture that has proven itself to be a benefit to humanity; without regard to the slanted Arab view of their immigration status, which attempts to deny them the right of self-determination.

If there is a case of discrimination, of apartheid, of segregation, and an unwillingness to adjust to 21st Century morals and turpitude, then the Arab-Palestinian should look in the mirror to recognize it. But, the rest of the world needs to understand that the very last thing we need is an out-of-control, parasitic, Jihadist based sovereign Islamic Waqf backed by a bunch of unproductive Fedayeen that don't know anything other than to create havoc; that can give no other excuse than - the world didn't turn-out the way they wanted it.

Most Respectfully,
R

Holy smokescreen, Batman.

It was a simple question. Who has the right to the country?

The people who have lived there for generation?

Or

Foreigners from Europe?

As more Jewish Israelis' prior addresses (before Israel) were in the ME than otherwise, your false dichotomy is ludicrous in its blatant inaccuracy and bias.

Let us know when you're willing to acknowledge the Arab League's international cabal for land theft, robbery, and genocide which contributed nearly a million stateless beggars to the world....... They were planning that even before the State of Israel was declared.

 

[MHunterB]

Catch up on your history.
They were asked to stay and the Jordanians told them to get out of the way or be run over Jordanian tanks.
But that's OK, God will tell you the truth when you die.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Not only is that not true, it doesn't address my post.

Where's the proof, either way?

 

[Indeependent]

P F, how can I address an issue based on inaccurate information?
Your historical ignorance can be easily overcome as you have the Internet at your fingertips.
All you have to do is go to at least two sites that don't have "Death to the Jews" in their banner.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Catch up on your history.
They were asked to stay and the Jordanians told them to get out of the way or be run over Jordanian tanks.
But that's OK, God will tell you the truth when you die.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Not only is that not true, it doesn't address my post.

Where's the proof, either way?

Jordan was promised $3M per year for five years and the West Bank if it did not attack in the upcoming 1948 war. Jordan merely moved into the area it was promised.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F, how can I address an issue based on inaccurate information?
Your historical ignorance can be easily overcome as you have the Internet at your fingertips.
All you have to do is go to at least two sites that don't have "Death to the Jews" in their banner.

I don't use any hate sites.

 

[Indeependent]

Catch up on your history.
They were asked to stay and the Jordanians told them to get out of the way or be run over Jordanian tanks.
But that's OK, God will tell you the truth when you die.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Not only is that not true, it doesn't address my post.

Where's the proof, either way?

Jordan was promised $3M per year for five years and the West Bank if it did not attack in the upcoming 1948 war. Jordan merely moved into the area it was promised.

Along with Syria (North) and Egypt (West) and tanks.
Was there a house warming party that history hasn't recorded yet?
The funny thing is that the Jews STILL kicked their butts!

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

That is where the perception fits in place.

Perception and experience guides us all.

And always perfectly aligned with Israeli propaganda.

(COMMENT)

I know that mine is not "Israeli Propaganda." I seriously doubt that there is a true Israeli Propagandist in the forum. Not even those that are from Israel.

Perspective is something we all share, yet, albeit --- not through the same lens.

The achievement of a worthy goal such as peace, can only be fulfilled through diligence, hard work, dedication and the sacrifice to see the task through. Few successful entrepreneurs of tower and stature had everything handed to them on a silver platter. So it is with diplomacy striving for peace and prosperity for themselves and a nation.

The perspective comes with the recognition that the Palestinian is completely on the wrong track, and have not just sabotaged themselves, but entire future generations of their clan through the pursuit of systematically raising the next generation of Jihadist and Fedayeen.

Most Respectfully,
R

The Palestinians were attacked by foreigners out of Europe.

What are their options?

(COMMENT)

I do not see the Jewish Immigrant as foreigners. I see them as displaced persons invited to immigrate in order to establish a Jewish National Home.

They were invited by the Allied Powers, having all the necessary reigns of power passed to them by Treaty.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[aris2chat]

Arab/palestinians were attacking jews in the late 1800s out of fear and ignorance. They were not being attacked back then by incoming europeans. Jews were allowed to buy property and move by the Ottoman rose agreement. Ottomans needed the money and needed a way to raise taxes by having people develop the economy and land. Jews were even allowed to pray at the wall under the agreement.
Even the quran recognizes Israel as the land of the jews, so why are arabs so afraid to let jews live there. King Faisal sent letters welcoming the jews back to their natural and religious homeland.
What happened with arab/palestinians was the inciting by the grand mufti of Jerusalem.

 

[MHunterB]

Speaking of the mass murder of Jews in Hebron in '29 - it was hardly something that 'just happened':

As a CAMERA report (based on documentation in a book by Jennie Lebel titled ‘The Mufti of Jerusalem: Haj-Amin el-Husseini and National-Socialism&#8216 makes clear, Haj Amin’s desire to ‘help the Palestinians’ was superseded by a greater passion – to annihilate the Jews.


Haj Amin El-Husseini, who was appointed Mufti of Jerusalem in 1921 aided by sympathetic British officials, advocated violent opposition to Jewish settlement in the Mandate for Palestine and incited the Arabs against the growing Jewish presence. Lebel describes the violence of 1929, where Haj Amin spread the story that the Jews planned to destroy the Dome of the Rock and the Aqsa mosque. Using falsified photos of the mosque on fire and disseminating propaganda that borrowed from the anti-Jewish forgery, the “Protocols of the Elders of Zion,” the mufti instigated a widespread pogrom against Jews in Palestine. On Aug. 23, Arabs streamed into Jerusalem and attacked Jews. Six days later, a second wave of attacks resulted in 64 dead in Hebron…

Hebron | CiF Watch (citation of source quoted in bold)

 

[Billo_Really]

Speaking of the mass murder of Jews in Hebron in '29 - it was hardly something that 'just happened':

As a CAMERA report (based on documentation in a book by Jennie Lebel titled ‘The Mufti of Jerusalem: Haj-Amin el-Husseini and National-Socialism&#8216 makes clear, Haj Amin’s desire to ‘help the Palestinians’ was superseded by a greater passion – to annihilate the Jews.


Haj Amin El-Husseini, who was appointed Mufti of Jerusalem in 1921 aided by sympathetic British officials, advocated violent opposition to Jewish settlement in the Mandate for Palestine and incited the Arabs against the growing Jewish presence. Lebel describes the violence of 1929, where Haj Amin spread the story that the Jews planned to destroy the Dome of the Rock and the Aqsa mosque. Using falsified photos of the mosque on fire and disseminating propaganda that borrowed from the anti-Jewish forgery, the “Protocols of the Elders of Zion,” the mufti instigated a widespread pogrom against Jews in Palestine. On Aug. 23, Arabs streamed into Jerusalem and attacked Jews. Six days later, a second wave of attacks resulted in 64 dead in Hebron…

Hebron | CiF Watch (citation of source quoted in bold)

The Hebron massacre started when a bunch of Zionists went down to the Wailing Wall and declared it theirs. You couldn't ******* share it. You had to be so god-damn selfish, it had to be "all" yours. Well, **** you!

BTW, what about the over 400 jews, whose lives were saved that night by their arab neighbors, hiding them in their basements? I like how one arab family was able to do it. When the roving bands of rioters came to their house, they told them, "But we've already killed our jews!" And the rioters moved on.