Must we thank (1) Jefferson’s God, or (2) Trump’s God or (3) no God or (4) or just the founders themselves

[NotfooledbyW]

NFBW: Premise: The religious belief’s of the founding fathers are tied to the politics of abortion the past 50 years / you will have to read the CATHOLIC condemnation of Jefferson and his cult of secular religion if you are interested in finding out why - and more.

ELEKTRA220503-#63 “Abortion is murder if there is a heartbeat”

Must we thank (1) Jefferson’s God, or (2) Trump’s God or (3) no God or (4) just the founders themselves for the creation of exceptional America - The greatest nation in history

NFBW: My choice is (4) because they made (1) thru (3) possible which is what makes America exceptional above all other nations in history.

elektra by default picks (2) based on the fact that the God of Jesus is Trump’s pick not TJ’s

ELEKTRA160524-#2 “One must thank God, we are Americans”

ELEKTRA140501-#129 “Why does Thomas Jefferson, state, "So much for your quotation of Calvin's `mon dieu! jusqu'a quand' in which, when addressed to the God of Jesus, and our God, I join you cordially, and await his time and will with more readiness than reluctance."

NFBW: Those who read books about Jefferson’s religion would know that Jefferson was revolted by any man made thought that falsely converted Jesus into a God. The following portrait based on his writing is a great link into the great rational and enlightenment libersl mind of Jefferson

Catholic view / The Relevance of Thomas Jefferson by Donald J. D'Elia Christendom College Press, Fall 1977In the analysis of Thomas Jefferson, which follows, Dr. D 'Elia lays the groundwork for a truly Catholic perception of American history in general, in addition to unveiling an accurate portrait of the man.​

​

Library : The Relevance of Thomas Jefferson​

​

Among the Founding Fathers of the American nation there appears to be none more deserving of the title of "modern man" than the Virginian, Thomas Jefferson, author of the Declaration of Independence and third President of the United States. His tall, god-like figure looms over the American past, his name continues to be celebrated in endless books and after-dinner speeches, and his democratic authority must be invoked by every aspiring statesman and grasping politician. Indeed, Jefferson's attraction for modern man has led to the development of a veritable cult whose shrine on the banks of the Potomac draws worshippers from all over the world.​

​

Often it has happened in history and in life itself that a good but naive man's principles have been mercilessly exposed by time to reveal logical implications, which he would have condemned in his own lifetime. Such was notably the case with Thomas Jefferson who, bereft of the Church's wisdom and maternal protection, fell victim to false principles long ago unmasked by Revelation and true philosophy. These false principles, known collectively as liberalism, were made by Jefferson into a kind of religion, as we shall see; and in using the prestige of the presidency to advance this secular religion, Jefferson unwittingly proved himself to be the first of a long line of abusers of the highest office of the land. For the Jeffersonian mentality, despite all good intentions, leads inexorably to moral nihilism and the abortionist Supreme Court of the 1970'​

END2210050259

 

[NotfooledbyW]

One must thank God, we are Americans.

NFBW: As a very thankful American agnostic / humanist I prefer to thank the human Madison for religious freedom and all who were convinced by him to write the Constitution with the freedom of conscience principles contained therin. END2310050345

Thomas Jefferson respected Christianity. He contributed financially to an Episcopal church near his home in Monticello. He attended Episcopal services when he was President. He believed that the New Testament presented a good model of moral living. Nevertheless, he did not believe in the Trinity.

NFBW: Like Jefferson, Adam’s, Washington and Madison, I respect Liberal Christianity and liberal Catholics when they are on at least their moderate Jesus emulating behavior. Not so much when Christians are all show and no go when they forget the simple truths of Jesus - But I am not a Christian. END2310050345

 

[elektra]

NFBW: Premise: The religious belief’s of the founding fathers are tied to the politics of abortion the past 50 years / you will have to read the CATHOLIC condemnation of Jefferson and his cult of secular religion if you are interested in finding out why - and more.

ELEKTRA220503-#63 “Abortion is murder if there is a heartbeat”

Must we thank (1) Jefferson’s God, or (2) Trump’s God or (3) no God or (4) just the founders themselves for the creation of exceptional America - The greatest nation in history

NFBW: My choice is (4) because they made (1) thru (3) possible which is what makes America exceptional above all other nations in history.

elektra by default picks (2) based on the fact that the God of Jesus is Trump’s pick not TJ’s

ELEKTRA160524-#2 “One must thank God, we are Americans”

ELEKTRA140501-#129 “Why does Thomas Jefferson, state, "So much for your quotation of Calvin's `mon dieu! jusqu'a quand' in which, when addressed to the God of Jesus, and our God, I join you cordially, and await his time and will with more readiness than reluctance."

NFBW: Those who read books about Jefferson’s religion would know that Jefferson was revolted by any man made thought that falsely converted Jesus into a God. The following portrait based on his writing is a great link into the great rational and enlightenment libersl mind of Jefferson

Catholic view / The Relevance of Thomas Jefferson by Donald J. D'Elia Christendom College Press, Fall 1977In the analysis of Thomas Jefferson, which follows, Dr. D 'Elia lays the groundwork for a truly Catholic perception of American history in general, in addition to unveiling an accurate portrait of the man.​

​

Library : The Relevance of Thomas Jefferson​

​

Among the Founding Fathers of the American nation there appears to be none more deserving of the title of "modern man" than the Virginian, Thomas Jefferson, author of the Declaration of Independence and third President of the United States. His tall, god-like figure looms over the American past, his name continues to be celebrated in endless books and after-dinner speeches, and his democratic authority must be invoked by every aspiring statesman and grasping politician. Indeed, Jefferson's attraction for modern man has led to the development of a veritable cult whose shrine on the banks of the Potomac draws worshippers from all over the world.​

​

Often it has happened in history and in life itself that a good but naive man's principles have been mercilessly exposed by time to reveal logical implications, which he would have condemned in his own lifetime. Such was notably the case with Thomas Jefferson who, bereft of the Church's wisdom and maternal protection, fell victim to false principles long ago unmasked by Revelation and true philosophy. These false principles, known collectively as liberalism, were made by Jefferson into a kind of religion, as we shall see; and in using the prestige of the presidency to advance this secular religion, Jefferson unwittingly proved himself to be the first of a long line of abusers of the highest office of the land. For the Jeffersonian mentality, despite all good intentions, leads inexorably to moral nihilism and the abortionist Supreme Court of the 1970'​

END2210050259

You have no thoughts of your own, just a long cut/paste.

Abortion, something the founders never fathomed.. Abortion not a right.

 

[kyzr]

I'm a pro-choice Republican...don't ask why...

 

[Votto]

I wonder, would Jefferson have aborted all those black slave babies he conceived?

 

[Votto]

I'm a pro-choice Republican...don't ask why...

Those that don't agree to abortion in any circumstance I think are few and far between, which is why SCOTUS said states must have this conversation amongst themselves

But to not assess the humanity of the unborn is equally absurd

Again, these conversations must be had instead of hiding behind the veil of a woman's privacy.

 

[kyzr]

Those that don't agree to abortion in any circumstance I think are few and far between, which is why SCOTUS said states must have this conversation amongst themselves
But to not assess the humanity of the unborn is equally absurd
Again, these conversations must be had instead of hiding behind the veil of a woman's privacy.

Exactly.
I hope most states opt for abortion laws like the civilized EU countries have:
Abort up to a limit, 12-15 weeks, then no abortions allowed.

 

[easyt65]

The premise is wrong, an attempt to politicize / gaslight people regarding a liberal need to.kill babies, to discard life when it inconveniences them.

 

[Votto]

Exactly.
I hope most states opt for abortion laws like the civilized EU countries have:
Abort up to a limit, 12-15 weeks, then no abortions allowed.

But why at that stage of development?

Not that you have to answer, my point here is that this is why Roe vs Wade failed. It's not about a woman's privacy, it's about the humanity of the unborn.

 

[Votto]

The premise is wrong, an attempt to politicize / gaslight people regarding a liberal need to.kill babies, to discard life when it inconveniences them.

All DNC policies promote depopulation, so there is that.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Abortion, something the founders never fathomed..

NFBW: OK BookReader, what book backs up your statement of fact that Jefferson or any of the Founding fathers never fathomed abortion.

You are wrong, Jefferson understood that abortion terminated a pregnancy as the observation he made with respect to native Americans was written in his journal.

They raise fewer children than we do. The woman causes of this are to be found, not in a difference of nature, but of circumstance. The women very frequently attending the men in their parties of war and of hunting, child-bearing becomes extremely inconvenient to them.​

​

Notes on the State of Virginia​

​

It is said, therefore, that they have learnt the practice of procuring abortion by the use of some vegetable; and that it even extends to prevent conception for a considerable time after. During these parties they are exposed to numerous hazards, to excessive exertions, to the greatest extremities of hunger. Even at their homes the nation depends for food, through a certain part of every year, on the gleanings of the forest: that is, they experience a famine once in every year. With all animals, if the female be badly fed, or not fed at all, her young perish: and if both male and female be reduced to like want, generation becomes less active, less productive. To the obstacles then of want and hazard, which nature has opposed to the multiplication of wild animals, for the purpose of restraining their numbers within certain bounds, those of labour and of voluntary abortion are added with the Indian. No wonder then if they multiply less than we do. Where food is regularly supplied, a single farm will shew more of cattle, than a whole country of forests can of buffaloes. The same Indian women, when married to white traders, who feed them and their children plentifully and regularly, who exempt them from excessive drudgery, who keep them stationary and unexposed to accident, produce and raise as many children as the white women. Instances are known, under these circumstances, of their rearing a dozen children. An inhuman practice once prevailed in this country of making slaves of the -187- Indians. It is a fact well known with us, that the Indian women so enslaved produced and raised as numerous families as either the whites or blacks among whom they lived. --​

​

END2210050558

 

[NotfooledbyW]

I'm a pro-choice Republican...don't ask why...

NFBW: You do realize the TRUMP LOONEY TOON MAGAgelicals and rightwing Papists will call you a baby killer when you say it’s up to the pregnant woman to terminate her “person in the womb” before 15 weeks after conception. Why do you believe that life begins at 15 weeks instead of a conception. ?ding says it’s DNA evidence

ding220728-#3,983 “After fertilization a new genetically distinct human being has come into existence. This is no longer conjecture. It is based upon empirical evidence. DNA.”

END2210050659

 

[Likkmee]

Tell me what they "found" and I'll then decide

 

[miketx]

NFBW: Premise: The religious belief’s of the founding fathers are tied to the politics of abortion the past 50 years / you will have to read the CATHOLIC condemnation of Jefferson and his cult of secular religion if you are interested in finding out why - and more.

ELEKTRA220503-#63 “Abortion is murder if there is a heartbeat”

Must we thank (1) Jefferson’s God, or (2) Trump’s God or (3) no God or (4) just the founders themselves for the creation of exceptional America - The greatest nation in history

NFBW: My choice is (4) because they made (1) thru (3) possible which is what makes America exceptional above all other nations in history.

elektra by default picks (2) based on the fact that the God of Jesus is Trump’s pick not TJ’s

ELEKTRA160524-#2 “One must thank God, we are Americans”

ELEKTRA140501-#129 “Why does Thomas Jefferson, state, "So much for your quotation of Calvin's `mon dieu! jusqu'a quand' in which, when addressed to the God of Jesus, and our God, I join you cordially, and await his time and will with more readiness than reluctance."

NFBW: Those who read books about Jefferson’s religion would know that Jefferson was revolted by any man made thought that falsely converted Jesus into a God. The following portrait based on his writing is a great link into the great rational and enlightenment libersl mind of Jefferson

Catholic view / The Relevance of Thomas Jefferson by Donald J. D'Elia Christendom College Press, Fall 1977In the analysis of Thomas Jefferson, which follows, Dr. D 'Elia lays the groundwork for a truly Catholic perception of American history in general, in addition to unveiling an accurate portrait of the man.​

​

Library : The Relevance of Thomas Jefferson​

​

Among the Founding Fathers of the American nation there appears to be none more deserving of the title of "modern man" than the Virginian, Thomas Jefferson, author of the Declaration of Independence and third President of the United States. His tall, god-like figure looms over the American past, his name continues to be celebrated in endless books and after-dinner speeches, and his democratic authority must be invoked by every aspiring statesman and grasping politician. Indeed, Jefferson's attraction for modern man has led to the development of a veritable cult whose shrine on the banks of the Potomac draws worshippers from all over the world.​

​

Often it has happened in history and in life itself that a good but naive man's principles have been mercilessly exposed by time to reveal logical implications, which he would have condemned in his own lifetime. Such was notably the case with Thomas Jefferson who, bereft of the Church's wisdom and maternal protection, fell victim to false principles long ago unmasked by Revelation and true philosophy. These false principles, known collectively as liberalism, were made by Jefferson into a kind of religion, as we shall see; and in using the prestige of the presidency to advance this secular religion, Jefferson unwittingly proved himself to be the first of a long line of abusers of the highest office of the land. For the Jeffersonian mentality, despite all good intentions, leads inexorably to moral nihilism and the abortionist Supreme Court of the 1970'​

END2210050259

None of them are God.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

my point here is that this is why Roe vs Wade failed. It's not about a woman's privacy, it's about the humanity of the unborn.

NFBW: At what stage does ‘humanity of the unborn’ become a person who has a right to public acknowledged life equal to or more so than it’s mother? Where in the Constitution does the one celled zygote human being assign such a right? END2210050710

 

[NotfooledbyW]

None of them are God.

NFBW; That is absolutely correct. Should we thank the god that Trump and his cult of continued believers worships; his revealed religion God or the God Washington Adams Jefferson Madison and Monroe who believed in a God who did not author a Holy Bible or have a special son sent to earth to die for a mankind bring saved from the sins that followed the eating of an apple, and then rise from the dead to prove it was all true. .END2210950725

 

[Moonglow]

You have no thoughts of your own, just a long cut/paste.

Abortion, something the founders never fathomed.. Abortion not a right.

That is because of English law covering abortion allowed it up to the quickening.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Tell me what they "found" and I'll then decide

They were the Founding Fathers of the American nation who did not believe in any one of the revealed religions of Christianity known during their time, Does that help?

 

[Grumblenuts]

NFBW: OK BookReader, what book backs up your statement of fact that Jefferson or any of the Founding fathers never fathomed abortion.

You are wrong, Jefferson understood that abortion terminated a pregnancy as the observation he made with respect to native Americans was written in his journal.

They raise fewer children than we do. The woman causes of this are to be found, not in a difference of nature, but of circumstance. The women very frequently attending the men in their parties of war and of hunting, child-bearing becomes extremely inconvenient to them.​

​

Notes on the State of Virginia​

​

It is said, therefore, that they have learnt the practice of procuring abortion by the use of some vegetable; and that it even extends to prevent conception for a considerable time after. During these parties they are exposed to numerous hazards, to excessive exertions, to the greatest extremities of hunger. Even at their homes the nation depends for food, through a certain part of every year, on the gleanings of the forest: that is, they experience a famine once in every year. With all animals, if the female be badly fed, or not fed at all, her young perish: and if both male and female be reduced to like want, generation becomes less active, less productive. To the obstacles then of want and hazard, which nature has opposed to the multiplication of wild animals, for the purpose of restraining their numbers within certain bounds, those of labour and of voluntary abortion are added with the Indian. No wonder then if they multiply less than we do. Where food is regularly supplied, a single farm will shew more of cattle, than a whole country of forests can of buffaloes. The same Indian women, when married to white traders, who feed them and their children plentifully and regularly, who exempt them from excessive drudgery, who keep them stationary and unexposed to accident, produce and raise as many children as the white women. Instances are known, under these circumstances, of their rearing a dozen children. An inhuman practice once prevailed in this country of making slaves of the -187- Indians. It is a fact well known with us, that the Indian women so enslaved produced and raised as numerous families as either the whites or blacks among whom they lived. --​

​

END2210050558

Funny stuff, considering how he fiddled with his own slave women as well. Spoke from experience, he did.

 

[kyzr]

NFBW: You do realize the TRUMP LOONEY TOON MAGAgelicals and rightwing Papists will call you a baby killer when you say it’s up to the pregnant woman to terminate her “person in the womb” before 15 weeks after conception. Why do you believe that life begins at 15 weeks instead of a conception. ?ding says it’s DNA evidence
ding220728-#3,983 “After fertilization a new genetically distinct human being has come into existence. This is no longer conjecture. It is based upon empirical evidence. DNA.”
END2210050659

My rationale' is much simpler than that.
Let the dems abort as many of their larvae as they want.
Abortion mostly affects democrats.

As the baby comes out of the chute, could you snip its head off like Gosnell?