More Trickle Down? Get Real Trump Supporters!

[owebo]

Open your ears and listen very carefully, not to my words but words uttered by President Trump, and the words not said.

The Dow rose to over 21,000 today, and who did that benefit? Only those who have parked their savings into equities; the result of his words increased the wealth of the investment class overnight, but not those who have been left behind and watched the greatest inequity since the Gilded Age of wealth grow.

Will Trickle Down improve your economic situation? Will it open up new and well paid jobs for the working poor, the middle class and those now in college or recent grads with massive debt?

Will the repeal of the PPACA (notice Trump called it "Obamacare" (for obvious political purpose) and not called it the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, and in the process lied about the rise in cost when what came before rose annually too, and left too many behind.

Let's see if The Congress, so concerned with the massive debt, will pass a budget with the "largest military increase in history" cut taxes to business and spent one TRILLION Dollars on our nation's failing infrastructure.

IMO putting a Trillion Dollars into rebuilding, renewing and repairing our nation's infrastructure make sense, but not when taxes are cut and an increase in the military spending also cuts domestic spending (consider what domestic spending will be cut when a trillion is put into fixing our infrastructure? Whose taxes will be cut, what fees will be increased and added, and whose money will be used for all of this?)

Versus your liberal trickle up poverty.......

Idiot-gram ^^^

How poor is the person who signs your ur paycheck? Or do I?

 

[Wry Catcher]

I guess the rising stock market under Obama was a failure now?

Of course not. But it was not the panacea you seem to think and Trump wants you to believe. Do you not see how it aids the investment class and Wall Street, but has little or no positive impact on Main Street and families whose wages do not allow for investing?

Calling for Health Savings Accounts as Trump did last night would put more economic stress on Middle Class workers and the working poor would end up in the ER.

I really wonder why such obvious outcomes are so difficult for the conservative set to comprehend.

There are a lot of middle class, Union members who have money invested in the stock market, do they count?

In fact, his "the stock market only benefits the rich' meme is a joke.

There are over 88 million working class people invested in the stock market through some form of retirement vehicle.

http://www.americanbenefitscouncil.org/pub/e613e1b6-f57b-1368-c1fb-966598903769

Do you believe that insider information is a rare occurrence? Yes or No?

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

I guess the rising stock market under Obama was a failure now?

Of course not. But it was not the panacea you seem to think and Trump wants you to believe. Do you not see how it aids the investment class and Wall Street, but has little or no positive impact on Main Street and families whose wages do not allow for investing?

Calling for Health Savings Accounts as Trump did last night would put more economic stress on Middle Class workers and the working poor would end up in the ER.

I really wonder why such obvious outcomes are so difficult for the conservative set to comprehend.

There are a lot of middle class, Union members who have money invested in the stock market, do they count?

In fact, his "the stock market only benefits the rich' meme is a joke.

There are over 88 million working class people invested in the stock market through some form of retirement vehicle.

http://www.americanbenefitscouncil.org/pub/e613e1b6-f57b-1368-c1fb-966598903769

Do you believe that insider information is a rare occurrence? Yes or No?

If the working American could be immune from the laws that the Establishment Liberals(R) and (D) set themselves up for, then there would be a lot more insider trading. When a congressmen enters congress at $250,000 a year and after 4 years has over $10,000,000 it isn't because they worked hard to get it..... but then liberals don't give a shit about their political hacks, as long as they are in the fight, and the stupid voters keep them in....

 

[Wry Catcher]

Open your ears and listen very carefully, not to my words but words uttered by President Trump, and the words not said.

The Dow rose to over 21,000 today, and who did that benefit? Only those who have parked their savings into equities; the result of his words increased the wealth of the investment class overnight, but not those who have been left behind and watched the greatest inequity since the Gilded Age of wealth grow.

Will Trickle Down improve your economic situation? Will it open up new and well paid jobs for the working poor, the middle class and those now in college or recent grads with massive debt?

Will the repeal of the PPACA (notice Trump called it "Obamacare" (for obvious political purpose) and not called it the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, and in the process lied about the rise in cost when what came before rose annually too, and left too many behind.

Let's see if The Congress, so concerned with the massive debt, will pass a budget with the "largest military increase in history" cut taxes to business and spent one TRILLION Dollars on our nation's failing infrastructure.

IMO putting a Trillion Dollars into rebuilding, renewing and repairing our nation's infrastructure make sense, but not when taxes are cut and an increase in the military spending also cuts domestic spending (consider what domestic spending will be cut when a trillion is put into fixing our infrastructure? Whose taxes will be cut, what fees will be increased and added, and whose money will be used for all of this?)

Versus your liberal trickle up poverty.......

Idiot-gram ^^^

How poor is the person who signs your ur paycheck? Or do I?

I retired at 57; at the time I retired I was paying into the retirement association $1,700.00 per month. The money I receive now is money which accrued by the association's investments and the contributions of those currently employed (as my contributions were used for those who retired before me).

 

[Wry Catcher]

Trump wants 54 billion for military, am for any amounts spent on our vets, or support of people on active duty. we spend 598 billion dollars now, the next biggest spender is China, at around 146 billion. and where is the 54 billion dollars coming from? Trump said from EPA & FOREIGN aid budget. if we take all the EPA money ( close it down) that's only 8 billion. some one needs to check the math.

It will be borrowed and balloon the deficit.

And let's not forget that cutting critical domestic programs will increase the number of unemployed, and created a deficit which all 50 states will need to replace.***

***In my first year year of employment as a LE Officer while reading FBI rap sheets (records of arrest), the notation under the heading of Disposition, had this comment: "Floated".

I asked other more seasoned members of my unit what that meant. I learned that when black men were arrested for minor crimes, and even some felonies, they were given a bus ticket to California. It saved the states in the south from incarcerating, feeding and paying for trials - a good solution for the local community, a bad solution for Justice in America.

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Open your ears and listen very carefully, not to my words but words uttered by President Trump, and the words not said.

The Dow rose to over 21,000 today, and who did that benefit? Only those who have parked their savings into equities; the result of his words increased the wealth of the investment class overnight, but not those who have been left behind and watched the greatest inequity since the Gilded Age of wealth grow.

Will Trickle Down improve your economic situation? Will it open up new and well paid jobs for the working poor, the middle class and those now in college or recent grads with massive debt?

Will the repeal of the PPACA (notice Trump called it "Obamacare" (for obvious political purpose) and not called it the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, and in the process lied about the rise in cost when what came before rose annually too, and left too many behind.

Let's see if The Congress, so concerned with the massive debt, will pass a budget with the "largest military increase in history" cut taxes to business and spent one TRILLION Dollars on our nation's failing infrastructure.

IMO putting a Trillion Dollars into rebuilding, renewing and repairing our nation's infrastructure make sense, but not when taxes are cut and an increase in the military spending also cuts domestic spending (consider what domestic spending will be cut when a trillion is put into fixing our infrastructure? Whose taxes will be cut, what fees will be increased and added, and whose money will be used for all of this?)

Versus your liberal trickle up poverty.......

Idiot-gram ^^^

How poor is the person who signs your ur paycheck? Or do I?

I retired at 57; at the time I retired I was paying into the retirement association $1,700.00 per month. The money I receive now is money which accrued by the association's investments and the contributions of those currently employed (as my contributions were used for those who retired before me).

The union Ponzi Scheme , got to love it.

I am retired and with my contributions to my 401 and investments I receive over $200,000 a year plus, work part time renovating depressed properties and not worrying if I get Social Security or not. I don't have to worry if the Ponzi Scheme runs out of money but I am vigilant on keeping up with the market, and make my choices, for myself, not have some schlub deciding for me.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Open your ears and listen very carefully, not to my words but words uttered by President Trump, and the words not said.

The Dow rose to over 21,000 today, and who did that benefit? Only those who have parked their savings into equities; the result of his words increased the wealth of the investment class overnight, but not those who have been left behind and watched the greatest inequity since the Gilded Age of wealth grow.

Will Trickle Down improve your economic situation? Will it open up new and well paid jobs for the working poor, the middle class and those now in college or recent grads with massive debt?

Will the repeal of the PPACA (notice Trump called it "Obamacare" (for obvious political purpose) and not called it the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, and in the process lied about the rise in cost when what came before rose annually too, and left too many behind.

Let's see if The Congress, so concerned with the massive debt, will pass a budget with the "largest military increase in history" cut taxes to business and spent one TRILLION Dollars on our nation's failing infrastructure.

IMO putting a Trillion Dollars into rebuilding, renewing and repairing our nation's infrastructure make sense, but not when taxes are cut and an increase in the military spending also cuts domestic spending (consider what domestic spending will be cut when a trillion is put into fixing our infrastructure? Whose taxes will be cut, what fees will be increased and added, and whose money will be used for all of this?)

Versus your liberal trickle up poverty.......

Idiot-gram ^^^

How poor is the person who signs your ur paycheck? Or do I?

I retired at 57; at the time I retired I was paying into the retirement association $1,700.00 per month. The money I receive now is money which accrued by the association's investments and the contributions of those currently employed (as my contributions were used for those who retired before me).

The union Ponzi Scheme , got to love it.

I am retired and with my contributions to my 401 and investments I receive over $200,000 a year plus, work part time renovating depressed properties and not worrying if I get Social Security or not. I don't have to worry if the Ponzi Scheme runs out of money but I am vigilant on keeping up with the market, and make my choices, for myself, not have some schlub deciding for me.

P#1: Ponzi Scheme? Hardly: "a form of fraud in which belief in the success of a nonexistent enterprise is fostered by the payment of quick returns to the first investors from money invested by later investors."

P#2: I don't believe you!

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Versus your liberal trickle up poverty.......

Idiot-gram ^^^

How poor is the person who signs your ur paycheck? Or do I?

I retired at 57; at the time I retired I was paying into the retirement association $1,700.00 per month. The money I receive now is money which accrued by the association's investments and the contributions of those currently employed (as my contributions were used for those who retired before me).

The union Ponzi Scheme , got to love it.

I am retired and with my contributions to my 401 and investments I receive over $200,000 a year plus, work part time renovating depressed properties and not worrying if I get Social Security or not. I don't have to worry if the Ponzi Scheme runs out of money but I am vigilant on keeping up with the market, and make my choices, for myself, not have some schlub deciding for me.

P#1: Ponzi Scheme? Hardly: "a form of fraud in which belief in the success of a nonexistent enterprise is fostered by the payment of quick returns to the first investors from money invested by later investors."

P#2: I don't believe you!

You want to see stupid???

The money I receive now is money which accrued by the association's investments and the contributions of those currently employed (as my contributions were used for those who retired before me).
the success of a nonexistent enterprise is fostered by the payment of quick returns to the first investors from money invested by later investors."

See, the guy didn't even realize how stupid he really is.. Just cant get more stupid than a liberal....

 

[healthmyths]

Trump wants 54 billion for military, am for any amounts spent on our vets, or support of people on active duty. we spend 598 billion dollars now, the next biggest spender is China, at around 146 billion. and where is the 54 billion dollars coming from? Trump said from EPA & FOREIGN aid budget. if we take all the EPA money ( close it down) that's only 8 billion. some one needs to check the math.

It will be borrowed and balloon the deficit.

Not if the business acumen of Trump is used to look at this:

Waste not, want not: Report exposes hundreds of BILLIONS every year in duplicate govt. spending

 

[LeftofLeft]

Open your ears and listen very carefully, not to my words but words uttered by President Trump, and the words not said.

The Dow rose to over 21,000 today, and who did that benefit? Only those who have parked their savings into equities; the result of his words increased the wealth of the investment class overnight, but not those who have been left behind and watched the greatest inequity since the Gilded Age of wealth grow.

Will Trickle Down improve your economic situation? Will it open up new and well paid jobs for the working poor, the middle class and those now in college or recent grads with massive debt?

Will the repeal of the PPACA (notice Trump called it "Obamacare" (for obvious political purpose) and not called it the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, and in the process lied about the rise in cost when what came before rose annually too, and left too many behind.

Let's see if The Congress, so concerned with the massive debt, will pass a budget with the "largest military increase in history" cut taxes to business and spent one TRILLION Dollars on our nation's failing infrastructure.

IMO putting a Trillion Dollars into rebuilding, renewing and repairing our nation's infrastructure make sense, but not when taxes are cut and an increase in the military spending also cuts domestic spending (consider what domestic spending will be cut when a trillion is put into fixing our infrastructure? Whose taxes will be cut, what fees will be increased and added, and whose money will be used for all of this?)

We tried your way for the past 8 years. Middle Class take home pay went down and healthcare costs increased. What's your plan?

Who is the "We"? The only effort I observed during the Obama Administration was the R's effort to return the party to the White House and in that way have a conservative Supreme Court, one Corporation Friendly and anti-democratic (NOTE the lower case "d"; not the Democratic Party, per se).

You don't say? At the same time, you did not observe the Democratic Party's attempt to secure a seemingly perpetual hold on The Hill, The White House and The Court? Are you that blinded that both parties have the same aspirations? The Democrats had the White House and enough of the Court. I quoted results which you did not refute. Your way required Healthcare reform to be a vehicle for redistribution of wealth. Result? Trump.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Open your ears and listen very carefully, not to my words but words uttered by President Trump, and the words not said.

The Dow rose to over 21,000 today, and who did that benefit? Only those who have parked their savings into equities; the result of his words increased the wealth of the investment class overnight, but not those who have been left behind and watched the greatest inequity since the Gilded Age of wealth grow.

Will Trickle Down improve your economic situation? Will it open up new and well paid jobs for the working poor, the middle class and those now in college or recent grads with massive debt?

Will the repeal of the PPACA (notice Trump called it "Obamacare" (for obvious political purpose) and not called it the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, and in the process lied about the rise in cost when what came before rose annually too, and left too many behind.

Let's see if The Congress, so concerned with the massive debt, will pass a budget with the "largest military increase in history" cut taxes to business and spent one TRILLION Dollars on our nation's failing infrastructure.

IMO putting a Trillion Dollars into rebuilding, renewing and repairing our nation's infrastructure make sense, but not when taxes are cut and an increase in the military spending also cuts domestic spending (consider what domestic spending will be cut when a trillion is put into fixing our infrastructure? Whose taxes will be cut, what fees will be increased and added, and whose money will be used for all of this?)

We tried your way for the past 8 years. Middle Class take home pay went down and healthcare costs increased. What's your plan?

Who is the "We"? The only effort I observed during the Obama Administration was the R's effort to return the party to the White House and in that way have a conservative Supreme Court, one Corporation Friendly and anti-democratic (NOTE the lower case "d"; not the Democratic Party, per se).

You don't say? At the same time, you did not observe the Democratic Party's attempt to secure a seemingly perpetual hold on The Hill, The White House and The Court? Are you that blinded that both parties have the same aspirations? The Democrats had the White House and enough of the Court. I quoted results which you did not refute. Your way required Healthcare reform to be a vehicle for redistribution of wealth. Result? Trump.

I do say. Nothing you posted refuted my statement about the efforts of the R Party to block Obama and their agenda - of course nothing you can state could refute that basic truth.

IMO, the R Party wants power to benefit their constituents - the wealthy, wall street and corporate America; the D's want power to expand a new bill of rights, giving equal rights to all, not the few.

 

[JoeNormal]

Open your ears and listen very carefully, not to my words but words uttered by President Trump, and the words not said.

The Dow rose to over 21,000 today, and who did that benefit? Only those who have parked their savings into equities; the result of his words increased the wealth of the investment class overnight, but not those who have been left behind and watched the greatest inequity since the Gilded Age of wealth grow.

Will Trickle Down improve your economic situation? Will it open up new and well paid jobs for the working poor, the middle class and those now in college or recent grads with massive debt?

Will the repeal of the PPACA (notice Trump called it "Obamacare" (for obvious political purpose) and not called it the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, and in the process lied about the rise in cost when what came before rose annually too, and left too many behind.

Let's see if The Congress, so concerned with the massive debt, will pass a budget with the "largest military increase in history" cut taxes to business and spent one TRILLION Dollars on our nation's failing infrastructure.

IMO putting a Trillion Dollars into rebuilding, renewing and repairing our nation's infrastructure make sense, but not when taxes are cut and an increase in the military spending also cuts domestic spending (consider what domestic spending will be cut when a trillion is put into fixing our infrastructure? Whose taxes will be cut, what fees will be increased and added, and whose money will be used for all of this?)

Versus your liberal trickle up poverty.......

Idiot-gram ^^^

How poor is the person who signs your ur paycheck? Or do I?

I retired at 57; at the time I retired I was paying into the retirement association $1,700.00 per month. The money I receive now is money which accrued by the association's investments and the contributions of those currently employed (as my contributions were used for those who retired before me).

The union Ponzi Scheme , got to love it.

I am retired and with my contributions to my 401 and investments I receive over $200,000 a year plus, work part time renovating depressed properties and not worrying if I get Social Security or not. I don't have to worry if the Ponzi Scheme runs out of money but I am vigilant on keeping up with the market, and make my choices, for myself, not have some schlub deciding for me.

If your 401K consists of stocks, you're engaging in a Ponzi Scheme too. Current employees are working to provide value and growth with the money you put into their system.

 

[Deleted member 53821]

The left can't really demonstrate that anything they do economically works. This country has been suffering from high unemployment for the last eight years. It use to be when recessions ended unemployment went down but now the number of people that have been unemployed has stayed consistently high. Just ask anyone who goes looking for job and don't tout the numbers that the government is telling you because those are distorted in order to hide the failure of the ecnomic policies for the last eight years. I'm sure you want to believe them so you can go around to tell everyone how much the free enterprise system doesn't work but the minute you are unemployed will mean that you will be unemployed for six months. The people who tell you those numbers are on your team but what is the point of believing something that may ultimately harm you and your friends other than a desperate belief that collectivism works.

 

[Andylusion]

Versus your liberal trickle up poverty.......

Idiot-gram ^^^

How poor is the person who signs your ur paycheck? Or do I?

I retired at 57; at the time I retired I was paying into the retirement association $1,700.00 per month. The money I receive now is money which accrued by the association's investments and the contributions of those currently employed (as my contributions were used for those who retired before me).

The union Ponzi Scheme , got to love it.

I am retired and with my contributions to my 401 and investments I receive over $200,000 a year plus, work part time renovating depressed properties and not worrying if I get Social Security or not. I don't have to worry if the Ponzi Scheme runs out of money but I am vigilant on keeping up with the market, and make my choices, for myself, not have some schlub deciding for me.

If your 401K consists of stocks, you're engaging in a Ponzi Scheme too. Current employees are working to provide value and growth with the money you put into their system.

Very different.

First in a ponzi scheme, you have a guaranteed return regardless of anything.

For example, Social Security there is a guaranteed rate of return.

In an investment, there is no guaranteed rate of return ever. The rate of return depends on the success of the investment. If I buy stock in Apple, and Apple computer fails, I get zero.

Second, in a ponzi scheme, there usually isn't an actual investment at all. The money brought into today, is paid out to former investors. It is never used to buy... an investment.

In traditional investment, it involves putting money into something that produces income. For example, using the money to buy a truck, which can be used to haul lawn equipment to make money doing landscaping.

This is basically what a 401K does. The company sells stock, which is used by the company to produce income.

That's the difference. A ponzi scheme does not invest the money to create growth. A 401K does. A ponzi scheme simply moves money around. A 401K invests money to create income.

In a ponzi scheme, you own nothing. In a 401K you own whatever the investment is that you are investing into. I own stock in companies like Ford, Walmart, Apple, and so on.

Very very different.

 

[Andylusion]

Open your ears and listen very carefully, not to my words but words uttered by President Trump, and the words not said.

The Dow rose to over 21,000 today, and who did that benefit? Only those who have parked their savings into equities; the result of his words increased the wealth of the investment class overnight, but not those who have been left behind and watched the greatest inequity since the Gilded Age of wealth grow.

Will Trickle Down improve your economic situation? Will it open up new and well paid jobs for the working poor, the middle class and those now in college or recent grads with massive debt?

Will the repeal of the PPACA (notice Trump called it "Obamacare" (for obvious political purpose) and not called it the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, and in the process lied about the rise in cost when what came before rose annually too, and left too many behind.

Let's see if The Congress, so concerned with the massive debt, will pass a budget with the "largest military increase in history" cut taxes to business and spent one TRILLION Dollars on our nation's failing infrastructure.

IMO putting a Trillion Dollars into rebuilding, renewing and repairing our nation's infrastructure make sense, but not when taxes are cut and an increase in the military spending also cuts domestic spending (consider what domestic spending will be cut when a trillion is put into fixing our infrastructure? Whose taxes will be cut, what fees will be increased and added, and whose money will be used for all of this?)

We tried your way for the past 8 years. Middle Class take home pay went down and healthcare costs increased. What's your plan?

Who is the "We"? The only effort I observed during the Obama Administration was the R's effort to return the party to the White House and in that way have a conservative Supreme Court, one Corporation Friendly and anti-democratic (NOTE the lower case "d"; not the Democratic Party, per se).

You don't say? At the same time, you did not observe the Democratic Party's attempt to secure a seemingly perpetual hold on The Hill, The White House and The Court? Are you that blinded that both parties have the same aspirations? The Democrats had the White House and enough of the Court. I quoted results which you did not refute. Your way required Healthcare reform to be a vehicle for redistribution of wealth. Result? Trump.

I do say. Nothing you posted refuted my statement about the efforts of the R Party to block Obama and their agenda - of course nothing you can state could refute that basic truth.

IMO, the R Party wants power to benefit their constituents - the wealthy, wall street and corporate America; the D's want power to expand a new bill of rights, giving equal rights to all, not the few.

Why would we refute that? I'm confused. The whole reason I voted for Republicans was to block Obama's bad agenda, which is a complete failure, and I wanted it stopped.

Of course I want power to benefit me, and people like me that oppose left-wing pro-wealthy agenda. That's not surprising. Why would any of us refute that? That's the whole reason we voted for them, was to oppose you and your economy destroying policies.

 

[LeftofLeft]

Open your ears and listen very carefully, not to my words but words uttered by President Trump, and the words not said.

The Dow rose to over 21,000 today, and who did that benefit? Only those who have parked their savings into equities; the result of his words increased the wealth of the investment class overnight, but not those who have been left behind and watched the greatest inequity since the Gilded Age of wealth grow.

Will Trickle Down improve your economic situation? Will it open up new and well paid jobs for the working poor, the middle class and those now in college or recent grads with massive debt?

Will the repeal of the PPACA (notice Trump called it "Obamacare" (for obvious political purpose) and not called it the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, and in the process lied about the rise in cost when what came before rose annually too, and left too many behind.

Let's see if The Congress, so concerned with the massive debt, will pass a budget with the "largest military increase in history" cut taxes to business and spent one TRILLION Dollars on our nation's failing infrastructure.

IMO putting a Trillion Dollars into rebuilding, renewing and repairing our nation's infrastructure make sense, but not when taxes are cut and an increase in the military spending also cuts domestic spending (consider what domestic spending will be cut when a trillion is put into fixing our infrastructure? Whose taxes will be cut, what fees will be increased and added, and whose money will be used for all of this?)

We tried your way for the past 8 years. Middle Class take home pay went down and healthcare costs increased. What's your plan?

Who is the "We"? The only effort I observed during the Obama Administration was the R's effort to return the party to the White House and in that way have a conservative Supreme Court, one Corporation Friendly and anti-democratic (NOTE the lower case "d"; not the Democratic Party, per se).

You don't say? At the same time, you did not observe the Democratic Party's attempt to secure a seemingly perpetual hold on The Hill, The White House and The Court? Are you that blinded that both parties have the same aspirations? The Democrats had the White House and enough of the Court. I quoted results which you did not refute. Your way required Healthcare reform to be a vehicle for redistribution of wealth. Result? Trump.

I do say. Nothing you posted refuted my statement about the efforts of the R Party to block Obama and their agenda - of course nothing you can state could refute that basic truth.

IMO, the R Party wants power to benefit their constituents - the wealthy, wall street and corporate America; the D's want power to expand a new bill of rights, giving equal rights to all, not the few.

So you are saying that the D's are not about efforts to block Trump and the agenda?

 

[Andylusion]

I guess the rising stock market under Obama was a failure now?

Of course not. But it was not the panacea you seem to think and Trump wants you to believe. Do you not see how it aids the investment class and Wall Street, but has little or no positive impact on Main Street and families whose wages do not allow for investing?

Calling for Health Savings Accounts as Trump did last night would put more economic stress on Middle Class workers and the working poor would end up in the ER.

I really wonder why such obvious outcomes are so difficult for the conservative set to comprehend.

There are a lot of middle class, Union members who have money invested in the stock market, do they count?

In fact, his "the stock market only benefits the rich' meme is a joke.

There are over 88 million working class people invested in the stock market through some form of retirement vehicle.

http://www.americanbenefitscouncil.org/pub/e613e1b6-f57b-1368-c1fb-966598903769

Workers own just enough of the equity market it make it impossible to allow banks to fail.

Who Owns the Stock Market? -- The Motley Fool

What? What are you talking about?

If I own stock in Alibaba Group... which I do.... which is an internet services corporations based in China.....

Why would I care if "the banks" failed? When Countrywide financial failed... you know what happened to my equity? Nothing. If anything, the short term dip in values, allowed me to buy more equities, which is why my portfolio has dramatically increased.

What does one have to do with the other?

 

[JoeNormal]

Idiot-gram ^^^

How poor is the person who signs your ur paycheck? Or do I?

I retired at 57; at the time I retired I was paying into the retirement association $1,700.00 per month. The money I receive now is money which accrued by the association's investments and the contributions of those currently employed (as my contributions were used for those who retired before me).

The union Ponzi Scheme , got to love it.

I am retired and with my contributions to my 401 and investments I receive over $200,000 a year plus, work part time renovating depressed properties and not worrying if I get Social Security or not. I don't have to worry if the Ponzi Scheme runs out of money but I am vigilant on keeping up with the market, and make my choices, for myself, not have some schlub deciding for me.

If your 401K consists of stocks, you're engaging in a Ponzi Scheme too. Current employees are working to provide value and growth with the money you put into their system.

Very different.

First in a ponzi scheme, you have a guaranteed return regardless of anything.

For example, Social Security there is a guaranteed rate of return.

In an investment, there is no guaranteed rate of return ever. The rate of return depends on the success of the investment. If I buy stock in Apple, and Apple computer fails, I get zero.

Second, in a ponzi scheme, there usually isn't an actual investment at all. The money brought into today, is paid out to former investors. It is never used to buy... an investment.

In traditional investment, it involves putting money into something that produces income. For example, using the money to buy a truck, which can be used to haul lawn equipment to make money doing landscaping.

This is basically what a 401K does. The company sells stock, which is used by the company to produce income.

That's the difference. A ponzi scheme does not invest the money to create growth. A 401K does. A ponzi scheme simply moves money around. A 401K invests money to create income.

In a ponzi scheme, you own nothing. In a 401K you own whatever the investment is that you are investing into. I own stock in companies like Ford, Walmart, Apple, and so on.

Very very different.

There will always be people who want to maximize their profits and take unreasonable risks in doing so. Then when it all comes crashing down, they declare bankruptcy and the the problem becomes someone else's. SS funds are invested in very secure vehicles and while the return isn't as large or even guaranteed to keep up with changing demographics, it offers a stable form of base retirement for all US citizens.

 

[Andylusion]

How poor is the person who signs your ur paycheck? Or do I?

I retired at 57; at the time I retired I was paying into the retirement association $1,700.00 per month. The money I receive now is money which accrued by the association's investments and the contributions of those currently employed (as my contributions were used for those who retired before me).

The union Ponzi Scheme , got to love it.

I am retired and with my contributions to my 401 and investments I receive over $200,000 a year plus, work part time renovating depressed properties and not worrying if I get Social Security or not. I don't have to worry if the Ponzi Scheme runs out of money but I am vigilant on keeping up with the market, and make my choices, for myself, not have some schlub deciding for me.

If your 401K consists of stocks, you're engaging in a Ponzi Scheme too. Current employees are working to provide value and growth with the money you put into their system.

Very different.

First in a ponzi scheme, you have a guaranteed return regardless of anything.

For example, Social Security there is a guaranteed rate of return.

In an investment, there is no guaranteed rate of return ever. The rate of return depends on the success of the investment. If I buy stock in Apple, and Apple computer fails, I get zero.

Second, in a ponzi scheme, there usually isn't an actual investment at all. The money brought into today, is paid out to former investors. It is never used to buy... an investment.

In traditional investment, it involves putting money into something that produces income. For example, using the money to buy a truck, which can be used to haul lawn equipment to make money doing landscaping.

This is basically what a 401K does. The company sells stock, which is used by the company to produce income.

That's the difference. A ponzi scheme does not invest the money to create growth. A 401K does. A ponzi scheme simply moves money around. A 401K invests money to create income.

In a ponzi scheme, you own nothing. In a 401K you own whatever the investment is that you are investing into. I own stock in companies like Ford, Walmart, Apple, and so on.

Very very different.

There will always be people who want to maximize their profits and take unreasonable risks in doing so. Then when it all comes crashing down, they declare bankruptcy and the the problem becomes someone else's. SS funds are invested in very secure vehicles and while the return isn't as large or even guaranteed to keep up with changing demographics, it offers a stable form of base retirement for all US citizens.

Well that's why there shouldn't be bankruptcy laws, or bailouts.

That's not a problem of Capitalism. In Capitalism there is no bankruptcy or bailouts. The only way you have bankruptcy and bailouts, is if government intervenes and says "You don't owe anything anymore, and here's other people's money to hold you over". If the government intervenes.... that's socialism. Socialism is government ownership or control.... note: or control, over the method of production and distributions of goods and services.

Yeah, and the Pension funds of Detroit said the same thing. Government bonds are safe... oh wait, we went bankrtup because we couldn't pay those pensions.... guess they are not safe.

Greece said the same thing about their pension funds. Our government bonds are safe... oh wait, they went bankrupt because they couldn't pay those pension..... guess they are not that safe.

California too said the same thing. Until 2011, and California sent the state finance officer to the Federal Government, to ask that the Feds issue a guarantee of California debt, because they almost went bankrupt. Doesn't sound all that safe to me.

Argentina, the UK, France, numerous other places, all have teetered on the brink of defaulting on their government pensions.

It's not nearly as safe as you think it is. In 2011, Obama warned SS checks would be cut. Why? I thought they had hundreds of billions in their "trust fund". How can there be any danger of pensions being cut if there are hundreds of billions in the trust fund?

Because there isn't. They have government bonds. Does the government have hundreds of billions in cash available to make good on those bonds? No. They have trillions of debt.

They are not nearly as safe as you think.

 

[JBond]

Reagan averaged 3.5% growth over his eight years. 4.9% after the recession (interest rates were raised to slow inflation). Obama never managed to reach 3%. Doubling the debt to nearly $20 trillion failed miserably.