Minimum wage rate and labors’ market prices.

Toddsterpatriot

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Can you say that again.....in English?

If the minimum wage is eliminated, will employers cut low end wages or not?
ToddsterPatriot, yes, certainly employers will reduce the purchasing power of low wage rates. The reductions will likely occur incrementally over time.

Regardless of whatever is a current purchasing power of the U.S. dollar at any time in the future, if there's no minimum wage rate law or some other legally supported government legally supported provision, (i.e. quasi government provision) to serve the purpose of minimum wage rate laws wage rate laws, low wage rates purchasing powers will certainly be less than otherwise; (otherwise being if there's a minimum wage rate law of sufficient purchasing power).
Respectfully, Supposn
ToddsterPatriot, yes, certainly employers will reduce the purchasing power of low wage rates. The reductions will likely occur incrementally over time.

Why not immediately?
Isn't the impact critical to substantial?
 
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Supposn

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ToddsterPatriot, yes, [if the minimum wage rate is eliminated,] certainly employers will reduce the purchasing power of low wage rates. The reductions will likely occur incrementally over time. ...
Why not immediately?
Isn't the impact critical to substantial?
ToddsterPatriot, Minimum wage rates do not “impact” employers. Enterprises must deal with their local labor markets if there is or isn’t a minimum wage rate. Enterprises are not more or less shielded from their competitors who must deal with the same USA labor markets. But low-wage rate employees in particular, are less fearful and insecure due to minimum wage rates; (i.e. it denies employers some of the advantages that would please them).

Suddenly confronting opponents is poor policy if it that evokes your opponents’ immediate increases of strength and motivations. If USA’s aggregate employers foolishly acted as you suggest, (i.e. “immediately”), it could, and not unlikely would evoke restoring the federal minimum wage rate, but of a vengefully high purchasing power that will thereafter be perpetually retained.

For most enterprises the minimum wage rate is not a matter of such substantial importance comparative to all their other expenses.
For employees earning low wage rates, their entire incomes are usually due to their wages and the minimum wage rate’s proportional effects upon their entire incomes range from critical to substantial.

I do not believe you’re ignorant of these matters; you asked the question just to “pull my chain”?
Respectfully, Supposn[/QUOTE]
 

Toddsterpatriot

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ToddsterPatriot, yes, [if the minimum wage rate is eliminated,] certainly employers will reduce the purchasing power of low wage rates. The reductions will likely occur incrementally over time. ...
Why not immediately?
Isn't the impact critical to substantial?
ToddsterPatriot, Minimum wage rates do not “impact” employers. Enterprises must deal with their local labor markets if there is or isn’t a minimum wage rate. Enterprises are not more or less shielded from their competitors who must deal with the same USA labor markets. But low-wage rate employees in particular, are less fearful and insecure due to minimum wage rates; (i.e. it denies employers some of the advantages that would please them).

Suddenly confronting opponents is poor policy if it that evokes your opponents’ immediate increases of strength and motivations. If USA’s aggregate employers foolishly acted as you suggest, (i.e. “immediately”), it could, and not unlikely would evoke restoring the federal minimum wage rate, but of a vengefully high purchasing power that will thereafter be perpetually retained.

For most enterprises the minimum wage rate is not a matter of such substantial importance comparative to all their other expenses.
For employees earning low wage rates, their entire incomes are usually due to their wages and the minimum wage rate’s proportional effects upon their entire incomes range from critical to substantial.

I do not believe you’re ignorant of these matters; you asked the question just to “pull my chain”?
Respectfully, Supposn

Minimum wage rates do not “impact” employers.

You're wrong. Every idiotic regulation an employer has to follow impacts them.

If USA’s aggregate employers foolishly acted as you suggest,

It was your suggestion, not mine, that ending the minimum wage would lead to a race to the bottom.

For most enterprises the minimum wage rate is not a matter of such substantial importance comparative to all their other expenses.

No kidding, over 98% of hourly workers make more.
If it were gone it would only have a tiny impact on a tiny number of workers.

the minimum wage rate’s proportional effects upon their entire incomes range from critical to substantial.

You're such a drama queen.
 
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Supposn

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For most enterprises the minimum wage rate is not a matter of such substantial importance comparative to all their other expenses.

No kidding, over 98% of hourly workers make more.
If it were gone it would only have a tiny impact on a tiny number of workers.
ToddsterPatriot, you quote and respond to my statement regarding the minimum’s effects upon employers, with an ungermane response of the numbers of employees earning rates above $7.25 per hour?
Your statement regarding employees is incorrect.

The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. Respectfully, Supposn
 

Toddsterpatriot

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For most enterprises the minimum wage rate is not a matter of such substantial importance comparative to all their other expenses.

No kidding, over 98% of hourly workers make more.
If it were gone it would only have a tiny impact on a tiny number of workers.
ToddsterPatriot, you quote and respond to my statement regarding the minimum’s effects upon employers, with an ungermane response of the numbers of employees earning rates above $7.25 per hour?
Your statement regarding employees is incorrect.

The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. Respectfully, Supposn
Your statement regarding employees is incorrect.

Really? How many earn minimum wage or less?

The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates.

Why do you feel their statement conflicts with mine?
 
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Supposn

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Minimum wage rates do not “impact” employers.

You're wrong. Every idiotic regulation an employer has to follow impacts them.
ToddsterPatriot, Minimum wage rates do not “impact” employers. Enterprises must deal with their local labor markets if there is or isn’t a minimum wage rate. Enterprises are not more or less shielded from their competitors who must deal with the same USA labor markets. But low-wage rate employees in particular, are less fearful and insecure due to minimum wage rates; (i.e. it denies employers some of the advantages that would please them). ... Respectfully, Supposn
Excerpted from Definition of impact | Dictionary.com :
... 1. the striking of one thing against another; forceful contact; collision:The impact of the colliding cars broke the windshield.
2.
an impinging:the impact of light on the eye. ...
 

Toddsterpatriot

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Minimum wage rates do not “impact” employers.

You're wrong. Every idiotic regulation an employer has to follow impacts them.
ToddsterPatriot, Minimum wage rates do not “impact” employers. Enterprises must deal with their local labor markets if there is or isn’t a minimum wage rate. Enterprises are not more or less shielded from their competitors who must deal with the same USA labor markets. But low-wage rate employees in particular, are less fearful and insecure due to minimum wage rates; (i.e. it denies employers some of the advantages that would please them). ... Respectfully, Supposn
Excerpted from Definition of impact | Dictionary.com :
... 1. the striking of one thing against another; forceful contact; collision:The impact of the colliding cars broke the windshield.
2.
an impinging:the impact of light on the eye. ...
1602876947478.png
 
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Supposn

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... The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates.

Why do you feel their statement conflicts with mine?
Toddsterpatriot,
... If it, [i.e. the minimum wage rate law] were gone it would only have a tiny impact on a tiny number of workers. ...
ToddsterPatriot, ... your statement regarding employees is incorrect.
The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. ...
 

Toddsterpatriot

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... The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates.

Why do you feel their statement conflicts with mine?
Toddsterpatriot,
... If it, [i.e. the minimum wage rate law] were gone it would only have a tiny impact on a tiny number of workers. ...
ToddsterPatriot, ... your statement regarding employees is incorrect.
The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. ...
The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. ...

Over 98% of workers already make more than minimum wage.
If the Federal Minimum Wage is currently $7.25 and a worker today makes $10, what effect would dropping the minimum wage to $6 have on that worker? What effect would eliminating the minimum wage entirely have on that worker?
 
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Supposn

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The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. ... Over 98% of workers already make more than minimum wage.

If the Federal Minimum Wage is currently $7.25 and a worker today makes $10, what effect would dropping the minimum wage to $6 have on that worker? What effect would eliminating the minimum wage entirely have on that worker?
Toddsterpatriot,
ToddsterPatriot, you quote and respond to my statement regarding the minimum’s effects upon employers, with an ungermane response of the numbers of employees earning rates above $7.25 per hour? ...
... The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. Respectfully, Supposn
 
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Supposn

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ToddsterPatriot, you quote and respond to my statement regarding the minimum’s effects upon employers, with an ungermane response of the numbers of employees earning rates above $7.25 per hour? ...
... The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. Respectfully, Supposn
 

Toddsterpatriot

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The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. ... Over 98% of workers already make more than minimum wage.

If the Federal Minimum Wage is currently $7.25 and a worker today makes $10, what effect would dropping the minimum wage to $6 have on that worker? What effect would eliminating the minimum wage entirely have on that worker?
Toddsterpatriot,
ToddsterPatriot, you quote and respond to my statement regarding the minimum’s effects upon employers, with an ungermane response of the numbers of employees earning rates above $7.25 per hour? ...
... The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. Respectfully, Supposn
Excellent non-answer!!!
 

Toddsterpatriot

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ToddsterPatriot, you quote and respond to my statement regarding the minimum’s effects upon employers, with an ungermane response of the numbers of employees earning rates above $7.25 per hour? ...
... The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. Respectfully, Supposn
Look, even the CBO said the average increase in family income for the lowest wage earners
from a $15 minimum wage would be $600 a year.

And you've admitted that you can't prove your "critical to substantial" claim.

Maybe you should quit while you're behind?
 
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Supposn

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The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. ...

... If the Federal Minimum Wage is currently $7.25 and a worker today makes $10, what effect would dropping the minimum wage to $6 have on that worker? What effect would eliminating the minimum wage entirely have on that worker?
ToddsterPatriot, to the extent of its purchasing power and effectiveness of its enforcement, the minimum wage rate can benefit a job’s rate. The extents of those benefits to jobs’ rates, are inversely related to the proportional differences between the minimum and jobs’ rates; (i.e. low-wage rates greater, and higher rates lesser benefit from the minimum rate).

To those extents, minimum wage rates reduce incidences and extents of poverty among the working-poor.

Reducing the minimum wage rate:
When the purchasing power of USA’s minimum wage rates are permitted to be reduced, the purchasing power of USA’s low-wage rate employees, (32% of our entire work forces’) wage rates are particularly less than otherwise.
Reducing minimum rate’s purchasing power also (with good reason) reduce employees’ senses of financial security and they become justifiably more fearful.

These are the general consequences of reducing the purchasing power of the minimum wage rate. Respectfully, Supposn
 

Toddsterpatriot

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The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. ...

... If the Federal Minimum Wage is currently $7.25 and a worker today makes $10, what effect would dropping the minimum wage to $6 have on that worker? What effect would eliminating the minimum wage entirely have on that worker?
ToddsterPatriot, to the extent of its purchasing power and effectiveness of its enforcement, the minimum wage rate can benefit a job’s rate. The extents of those benefits to jobs’ rates, are inversely related to the proportional differences between the minimum and jobs’ rates; (i.e. low-wage rates greater, and higher rates lesser benefit from the minimum rate).

To those extents, minimum wage rates reduce incidences and extents of poverty among the working-poor.

Reducing the minimum wage rate:
When the purchasing power of USA’s minimum wage rates are permitted to be reduced, the purchasing power of USA’s low-wage rate employees, (32% of our entire work forces’) wage rates are particularly less than otherwise.
Reducing minimum rate’s purchasing power also (with good reason) reduce employees’ senses of financial security and they become justifiably more fearful.

These are the general consequences of reducing the purchasing power of the minimum wage rate. Respectfully, Supposn
When the purchasing power of USA’s minimum wage rates are permitted to be reduced, the purchasing power of USA’s low-wage rate employees, (32% of our entire work forces’) wage rates are particularly less than otherwise.

Despite the 32% arbitrary claim by the CBO, the minimum wage only effects a tiny number of employees, as shown by the fact that so few earn that wage.

If, as you've claimed, eliminating it would lead to a race to the bottom, harming a large portion of our workforce, you'd have to explain why employers haven't already reduced more of that 32% to the level of the minimum wage.

If the $10 worker would see his wages reduced after the elimination of the current $7.25 FMW,
what's stopping his employer from reducing his wage now, today, to a lower wage?
 
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Supposn

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The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. ...

... If the Federal Minimum Wage is currently $7.25 and a worker today makes $10, what effect would dropping the minimum wage to $6 have on that worker? What effect would eliminating the minimum wage entirely have on that worker?
Eliminating minimum wage rate:

ToddsterPatriot, eliminating minimum wage rate laws without providing something to perform its purposes, is the ultimately extreme case of reducing the rate which evokes detrimental effects to the most extreme extents. Because there is no longer a definite legally enforced minimum, there’s an indefinite market determined minimum.

Our experience during severe economic depressions, (i.e. prior to the enactment of the federal minimum wage rate), has been of a much broader than only the low-wage rate bracket of wage rates, all spiraling down, while incidences and extent of poverty increased. These detrimental effects occurred to drastic extents in our nation.

Every nation capable of enforcing their commercial and labor laws, have government or quasi-government provisions that are similar to, and/or serve the purposes of USA’s federal minimum wage rate laws. Respectfully, Supposn
 

Toddsterpatriot

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The U.S. Congressional Budget Office states 32% of USA’s entire employees earn rates within the low-wage bracket of wage rates. Employees earning within the low-wage bracket of wage rates are those most effected by the minimum rate. ...

... If the Federal Minimum Wage is currently $7.25 and a worker today makes $10, what effect would dropping the minimum wage to $6 have on that worker? What effect would eliminating the minimum wage entirely have on that worker?
Eliminating minimum wage rate:

ToddsterPatriot, eliminating minimum wage rate laws without providing something to perform its purposes, is the ultimately extreme case of reducing the rate which evokes detrimental effects to the most extreme extents. Because there is no longer a definite legally enforced minimum, there’s an indefinite market determined minimum.

Our experience during severe economic depressions, (i.e. prior to the enactment of the federal minimum wage rate), has been of a much broader than only the low-wage rate bracket of wage rates, all spiraling down, while incidences and extent of poverty increased. These detrimental effects occurred to drastic extents in our nation.

Every nation capable of enforcing their commercial and labor laws, have government or quasi-government provisions that are similar to, and/or serve the purposes of USA’s federal minimum wage rate laws. Respectfully, Supposn
is the ultimately extreme case of reducing the rate which evokes detrimental effects to the most extreme extents.

You're wrong.

Because there is no longer a definite legally enforced minimum, there’s an indefinite market determined minimum.

There would be market rates, which are currently, mostly above the minimum already.

Every nation capable of enforcing their commercial and labor laws, have government or quasi-government provisions that are similar to

The fact that everyone has a similar bad law doesn't make it good.
 
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Supposn

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When the purchasing power of USA’s minimum wage rates are permitted to be reduced, the purchasing power of USA’s low-wage rate employees, (32% of our entire work forces’) wage rates are particularly less than otherwise. ...

... Despite the 32% arbitrary claim by the CBO, the minimum wage only effects a tiny number of employees, as shown by the fact that so few earn that wage.

If, as you've claimed, eliminating it would lead to a race to the bottom, harming a large portion of our workforce, you'd have to explain why employers haven't already reduced more of that 32% to the level of the minimum wage.
ToddsterPatriot, the U.S. Congressional Budget Office, (CBO) operates in a non-partisan fashion (by any reasonable standards of what’s non-partisan). Although you disagree with the CBO's reports' 32% figure, it’s not CBO's practice to operate in an “arbitrary” manner.

Employers generally practice wage differential as they determine what’s in their own net best interests, which usually coincides with their enterprises net best interests. Not acting in their enterprises’ best interests places their enterprises at competitive disadvantages.

Due to the practices of wage differentials, it’s usual for many, if not almost all low wage rate employees to be paid more than the applicable minimum rate.
But I suppose you’re already aware of all this. Respectfully, Supposn
 

Toddsterpatriot

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When the purchasing power of USA’s minimum wage rates are permitted to be reduced, the purchasing power of USA’s low-wage rate employees, (32% of our entire work forces’) wage rates are particularly less than otherwise. ...

... Despite the 32% arbitrary claim by the CBO, the minimum wage only effects a tiny number of employees, as shown by the fact that so few earn that wage.

If, as you've claimed, eliminating it would lead to a race to the bottom, harming a large portion of our workforce, you'd have to explain why employers haven't already reduced more of that 32% to the level of the minimum wage.
ToddsterPatriot, the U.S. Congressional Budget Office, (CBO) operates in a non-partisan fashion (by any reasonable standards of what’s non-partisan). Although you disagree with the CBO's reports' 32% figure, it’s not CBO's practice to operate in an “arbitrary” manner.

Employers generally practice wage differential as they determine what’s in their own net best interests, which usually coincides with their enterprises net best interests. Not acting in their enterprises’ best interests places their enterprises at competitive disadvantages.

Due to the practices of wage differentials, it’s usual for many, if not almost all low wage rate employees to be paid more than the applicable minimum rate.
But I suppose you’re already aware of all this. Respectfully, Supposn
Although you disagree with the CBO's reports' 32% figure, it’s not CBO's practice to operate in an “arbitrary” manner.

So explain, why 32%? Why not 33%? 34%?
There must be a solid reason for their non-arbitrary number.

Employers generally practice wage differential as they determine what’s in their own net best interests,

Wait, are you saying that even if they eliminate the minimum wage law, an employer may not cut all wages because it won't be in their own net best interest?

Due to the practices of wage differentials, it’s usual for many, if not almost all low wage rate employees to be paid more than the applicable minimum rate.

Oh, even though the law allows an employee to be paid $7.25, it's usual for most to make more?
Like......98% of them?

If employers find they need to pay $8, $9 or even $10 to fill all their positions, they won't cut those wages to $4, $5 or $6 in the event the minimum wage law goes away?

But I suppose you’re already aware of all this.

Yes, I am aware that when positions in a $7.25 environment go unfilled at $10, they
won't magically be filled at $5 with no minimum wage law.

That's why I'm able to mock your claims.

If you can't fill your jobs at $10, you won't fill them for less.
 
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Supposn

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[Eliminating the minimum wage rate laws,] is the ultimately extreme case of reducing the rate which evokes detrimental effects to the most extreme extents.

You're wrong.
Because there is no longer a definite legally enforced minimum, there’s an indefinite market determined minimum.

There would be market rates, which are currently, mostly above the minimum already. ...
ToddsterPatriot, regardless of opinions, the applicable legally enforced definite minimum wage rate, [just as rent, taxes, and material costs] are factors of current USA markets. The applicable minimum wage rate is also among is the current and definite market-determined factors within each of those USA marketplaces.
Only if there’s no applicable legally enforced minimum wage rate, does an indefinite market-determined minimum wage rate become established.
Respectfully, Supposn
 

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