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Liz Cheney speaks trump's attack on our Democracy

Tipsycatlover

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Liz Cheney will find herself exiled tomorrow. She and Mitt Romney can wonder what the hell happened.
 

OKTexas

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OKTexas

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Mac1958

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Opposing Authoritarian Ideological Fundamentalism.
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Jets

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Rep Cheney failed the Grand Trump Party litmus test...
 

Smokin' OP

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The Trump Cult is beholden to their leader, and while I think a majority of the elected GOP is not wanting to be in the cult, the truth is, it's the rubes on this forum, and where I live, and in the hills and hollers and trailer parks of America who insist that their leaders remain subservient to their favorite authoritarian. We saw how this shit turns out, be it Germany, Japan, Italy, and a host of other countries, slavish devotion to an authoritarian never ends well.
We will not ignore the stolen election.
Either will the Fulton county DA.

"So look. All I want to do is this. I just want to find 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have. Because we won the state,” Trump says on the call.

"The people of Georgia are angry, the people of the country are angry,” Trump tells the state’s election chief at another point. “And there’s nothing wrong with saying, you know, that you’ve recalculated.”

“So what are we going to do here, folks? I only need 11,000 votes. Fellas, I need 11,000 votes. Give me a break,” Trump asks.
 

Polishprince

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Rep Cheney failed the Grand Trump Party litmus test...


Rep. Cheney wasn't kicked out of the GOP, she just demonstrated that she isn't a leader and shouldn't be in a position of leadership.

Had Liz led the caucus to repudiate Trump and embrace Sleepy Joe like she has, then she would be a demonstrated leader.

But she didn't, she failed completely.
 

midcan5

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Liz Cheney is 'the man in the crowd'. And while I probably disagree with her on much, I give her credit for her honesty in the face of the Trump cult. Hopefully the final act is not like that of 'the man in....

When you cannot even criticize an insurrection against our Republic you cannot be an American conservative.

"The president [Trump] is a nationalist, which is not at all the same thing as a patriot. A nationalist encourages us to be our worst, and then tells us that we are the best. A nationalist, 'although endlessly brooding on power, victory, defeat, revenge,' wrote Orwell, tends to be 'uninterested in what happens in the real world.' Nationalism is relativist, since the only truth is the resentment we feel when we contemplate others. As the novelist Danilo Kiš put it, nationalism 'has no universal values, aesthetic or ethical.' A patriot, by contrast, wants the nation to live up to its ideals, which means asking us to be our best selves. A patriot must be concerned with the real world, which is the only place where his country can be loved and sustained. A patriot has universal values, standards by which he judges his nation, always wishing it well—and wishing that it would do better." Timothy Snyder 'On Tyranny'


'Hiding in Plain Sight: The Invention of Donald Trump and the Erosion of America'

 

Polishprince

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And the GOPQ is willing to help him initiate Putin plan....all to gain power.
I watched the speech and not one word was false. The republicans should make her the leader. She's the only one with guts.


The problem with that theorem is that if they did, it would eliminate the reason for the Republican Party.

If the rest of the GOP were to allow Rep. Cheney to lead them to capitulate to Sleepy Joe, they might as well just rip down the shingle over their door and just close up shop.

Why have an opposing party, if you aren't going to oppose? Seems pointless.
 

Jets

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Rep Cheney failed the Grand Trump Party litmus test...


Rep. Cheney wasn't kicked out of the GOP, she just demonstrated that she isn't a leader and shouldn't be in a position of leadership.

Had Liz led the caucus to repudiate Trump and embrace Sleepy Joe like she has, then she would be a demonstrated leader.

But she didn't, she failed completely.

Just to be clear, Rep Cheney would have been a leader if she rallied the caucus behind her to repudiate Trump?
 

Polishprince

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Rep Cheney failed the Grand Trump Party litmus test...


Rep. Cheney wasn't kicked out of the GOP, she just demonstrated that she isn't a leader and shouldn't be in a position of leadership.

Had Liz led the caucus to repudiate Trump and embrace Sleepy Joe like she has, then she would be a demonstrated leader.

But she didn't, she failed completely.

Just to be clear, Rep Cheney would have been a leader if she rallied the caucus behind her to repudiate Trump?


Absolutely. Leaders are called to lead, and that would have been an indication that she is a leader.

But that's not the way it turned out- Cheney backs Sleepy Joe, the vast majority of the caucus is still in opposition.
 

colfax_m

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Had Liz led the caucus to repudiate Trump and embrace Sleepy Joe like she has, then she would be a demonstrated leader.
That’s true. But it also shows she’s trying to lead a caucus of cowards.
 

Polishprince

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Had Liz led the caucus to repudiate Trump and embrace Sleepy Joe like she has, then she would be a demonstrated leader.
That’s true. But it also shows she’s trying to lead a caucus of cowards.


Why do you think that opposing Sleepy Joe is "cowardly"? I know you are a Biden devotee, and you would consider the loyal opposition to be "infidels", but I don't see the "coward" part.
 

Jets

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Rep Cheney failed the Grand Trump Party litmus test...


Rep. Cheney wasn't kicked out of the GOP, she just demonstrated that she isn't a leader and shouldn't be in a position of leadership.

Had Liz led the caucus to repudiate Trump and embrace Sleepy Joe like she has, then she would be a demonstrated leader.

But she didn't, she failed completely.

Just to be clear, Rep Cheney would have been a leader if she rallied the caucus behind her to repudiate Trump?


Absolutely. Leaders are called to lead, and that would have been an indication that she is a leader.

But that's not the way it turned out- Cheney backs Sleepy Joe, the vast majority of the caucus is still in opposition.

Ok, but Rep Cheney cannot strong arm the caucus to support her perspective.
 

Polishprince

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Rep Cheney failed the Grand Trump Party litmus test...


Rep. Cheney wasn't kicked out of the GOP, she just demonstrated that she isn't a leader and shouldn't be in a position of leadership.

Had Liz led the caucus to repudiate Trump and embrace Sleepy Joe like she has, then she would be a demonstrated leader.

But she didn't, she failed completely.

Just to be clear, Rep Cheney would have been a leader if she rallied the caucus behind her to repudiate Trump?


Absolutely. Leaders are called to lead, and that would have been an indication that she is a leader.

But that's not the way it turned out- Cheney backs Sleepy Joe, the vast majority of the caucus is still in opposition.

Ok, but Rep Cheney cannot strong arm the caucus to support her perspective.


True, but she can use her powers of persuasion to convince them to join her in bending a knee and pledging fealty to Sleepy Joe. And she didn't, failing completely.
 

Jets

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Rep Cheney failed the Grand Trump Party litmus test...


Rep. Cheney wasn't kicked out of the GOP, she just demonstrated that she isn't a leader and shouldn't be in a position of leadership.

Had Liz led the caucus to repudiate Trump and embrace Sleepy Joe like she has, then she would be a demonstrated leader.

But she didn't, she failed completely.

Just to be clear, Rep Cheney would have been a leader if she rallied the caucus behind her to repudiate Trump?


Absolutely. Leaders are called to lead, and that would have been an indication that she is a leader.

But that's not the way it turned out- Cheney backs Sleepy Joe, the vast majority of the caucus is still in opposition.

Ok, but Rep Cheney cannot strong arm the caucus to support her perspective.


True, but she can use her powers of persuasion to convince them to join her in bending a knee and pledging fealty to Sleepy Joe. And she didn't, failing completely.

I appreciate the point being made, but is acknowledging Biden won the election the equivalent of “pledging fealty“?
 

Chillicothe

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Stepping up to the Tee-Box is-----:

"....the long game looks good for her."
The optimistic skeptic within me believes you are right, poster Lakhota. Sooner or later America of this generation, like the America of Joe McCarthy's generation, will note Cheney's long vision as the right vision. IMHO
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So why are you pressing the cause of a loser like Liz Cheney on the Republican Party?
Ummm, I can't respond for the poster you are addressing with your rhetorical question; however, I can respond for my poor avatar. To wit ---- it ain't so much pressing for Cheney herself, it's pressing for her late-to-arrive perception and judgement. And her view of what America should be.
She's only the messenger. The message is the thing.
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She is marginalizing a lot of Americans.
Whaaaaat? I really dunno what that poster is wishing to express. ??
But, if he means expressing her opinion that Don Trump was instrumental in creating and spurring the events of January 6th.....and that is 'marginalizing' a lot of Americans....well, I demur.

That would be utter and complete nonsense. She is marginalizing one person......Don Trump.
Now, if "a lot" of Americans are so subsumed into believing Don Trump is them, and they are Don Trump......well, that's on them.
Not on Liz Cheney.
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They don't need her conducting a separate battle with him that will be both polarizing and damaging. She should shut her pie-hole, but she won't.
WHAT Republicans need is ----- is for Don Trump to shut HIS pie-hole.
Cheney has merely been reacting to the outrageousness and the danger to our democracy and free elections that Trump's Big Lie poses.
If HE would quit using every microphone within shouting distance to whine about his loss (in a landslide, by the way).....well then, there'd be no need for Cheney to add a corrective. IMHO
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“And there’s nothing wrong with saying, you know, that you’ve recalculated.” "Fellas, I need 11,000 votes. Give me a break,” Trump asks.
My biggest complaint about the above quote of a quote by poster 'Smokin Op' is........well, is that it is too long to fit on a bumper-sticker.
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"Cheney backs Sleepy Joe"
Ah, what a sad mis-read of this whole brouhaha.
A bigly mis-read.
Lemme offer a hint to you poster Polish: It AIN'T that Cheney is backing Joe Biden.
Rather, it is that she AIN'T backing Trump's Big Lie.
Duh!

(that was from my notes at the Captain Obvious 'Politics for Dummies' TED Talk.)
 

colfax_m

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Why do you think that opposing Sleepy Joe is "cowardly"? I know you are a Biden devotee, and you would consider the loyal opposition to be "infidels", but I don't see the "coward" part.
Cowardly is refusing to stand up to Trump’s big lie.
 

lennypartiv

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Cowardly is hiding in your basement while an election is stolen.
 

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