Latest Ukrainian Peace Plan From the US...Ukraine Surrenders, NATO Cannot Expand; Russia Gives Up Nothing.

[Zavulon]

So now suddenly, according to your previous post, they are “our property”.

No. America is more or less free country. Iranians are free to speak language they want, watch movies they want, leave America if they want. They have all human rights.

 

[there4eyeM]

At least it is clear where the vodka is flowing.

 

[candycorn]

No. America is more or less free country. Iranians are free to speak language they want, watch movies they want, leave America if they want. They have all human rights.

wow..ok.

Where do these people come from?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Why should NATO expand? WHere?

Ukraine puts them right on Russia's border!

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Until Russia wants more....

Then what?

More what?

Please explain

 

[candycorn]

More what?

Please explain

They just roll in the tanks and take whatever they want. Please tell me you really aren’t this vapid.

 

[Zavulon]

wow..ok.

Where do these people come from?

Persians came from Iran. Ukrainians were invented by Austrians in XIX century and in its original form only Galicians were "Ukrainians".

Post in thread 'Yet Some Claim Ukraine isn’t Held Enthrall By Nazis' Yet Some Claim Ukraine isn’t Held Enthrall By Nazis


Nazification makes people think that they are not Russians and they should kill Russians.
Oversimplificated, there were three main ideological waves of Ukro-Nazification (all three were based on factual bullshit and propaganda)
1. In the middle of XIX century, Austria after recognisition of Czech threat, and understanding how powerful weapon could be "national-building" decided to make non-Russians from controlled by them part of Russian people (Galicians). So, they said - "You are not Russians, you are "Ukrainians" because you speak different language (not dialect of Russian). They sponsored making "Ukrainian language" from local dialect of Galician villagers. Really poor thing, practically useless for any purpose short of singing folk songs. What is even more important - for a poor and narrow-mind Galician villager everyone (including Moscowites, Jews, Poles and even "Ukrainians from Poltava") are aliens and Germans are "natural masters". One can use them for the violence and destruction, may be for some farming, but they can't make a tank or a gun. Really poor guys. Banderlogs or Raguls in the narrow meaning of the word. We can call it Ukronazism type I.

2. Second stage of Ukrainisation was Soviet. Extra-left communists government in 1920s saw "Great Russian Chauvinism" as the greatest threat for their national policy. You know, something like "positive discrimination" on steroids. Ukrainisation was a form of "rootinisation" and "nation-building" in Soviet Republics. So, they made "Derjavna Mova" (State's language) based not only Galician, but some other dialects, too. In fact, it, like Esperanto, is no one's first language. It is the language of bureaucratic features. State-loyal nazism is a form of loyalty to the state. "We are Ukrainians because our government said us that. We speak (sometimes), Ukrainian at job or because we demonstrate our loyalty to the current regime. It is so called "political Ukrainism" (or Ukronazism type II) and, say, Zelenskiy (Russian-speaking Jew) or Syrsky (ethnic Russian) are examples of that. After fall of the Soviet Union, political Ukrainism became just loyalty to pro-Western course.

3. Post-Soviet Ukrainian Neonazism, is a way to "Ukronazificate" mostly eastern, Russian-speaking population of the industrial, educated cosmopolitic Eastern Ukraine (Russians and "Russian-speaking Ukrainians"). Like, you know, Azov battalion/brigade/corps. It is classical western Neo-Nazism. You can't say to a man, speaking proper Russian language (usually even without any significant accent) that his language is not Russian. So, you tell him, that he is the only true Russian, while Moscowites are Mongols, Finno-Hungarians, Tatars and other sub-humans, they are not Russians and should be genocided to purge true European blood. Of course it is a lie and nazism in the modern Western understanding. We can call it Ukronazism type III.

 

[kyzr]

Until the Soviets want more. Then…they just take it. Why wouldn’t they? There is no price to pay for aggression. Right?

They can try to take more any time they want. Nothing you want to do would stop them.

And you’re arguing that anything goes.

The choice is peace or keep fighting. I like the peace option.

You embody the battered wife syndrome.

Its called war, duh. Take Putin's deal or keep fighting.

 

[kyzr]

Until Russia wants more....Then what?

Then the war starts up again.

Zavulon is a Russian, see what he thinks of your ideas.

 

[candycorn]

They can try to take more any time they want. Nothing you want to do would stop them.

The choice is peace or keep fighting. I like the peace option.

Its called war, duh. Take Putin's deal or keep fighting.

So would you have done the same thing in the 30’s and 40’s with Hitler? If not, why not?

 

[candycorn]

Then the war starts up again.

Yep...you’re right. More death and destruction becuase you didn’t stop it the first time.

Where do they stop?

 

[JanetTheGreat]

The sooner Ukraine surrenders the better. Funding them was one of the most stupid things the US has done in the modern era. I detest this "playing hero" nonsense while doing exactly that causes more death.

 

[kyzr]

So would you have done the same thing in the 30’s and 40’s with Hitler? If not, why not?

This is a "no red herring" zone. Real politick in Ukraine is that Putin wants to keep it in Russia's sphere of influence, and keep NATO out, much like we told Russia no nukes in Cuba. Hitler wanted German speaking Sudetenland, like Putin wants Russian speaking Donbas, the difference is Putin occupies Donbas. I don't think Ukraine is giving up any territory Russians don't occupy.

 

[gipper]

That is a lie. Ukraine would keep its independence and its democracy.

Russia says take this deal or keep fighting. So you vote to keep fighting? In case you forgot, Russia had Donbas since 2014, so I can argue Ukraine is not giving up much territory.

Agreed no US troops.

You are arguing for an outcome that can't happen. Putin would never leave any of the territory he occupies and paid for with a million Russian casualties, so your options are take the deal or keep fighting and lose more of Ukraine.

Peace, prosperity, and independence from Russia. Also, no more being bombed by Russian drones.

What proof do you have Russia incurred a million casualties?

Experts have said they’ve incurred less than 100,000.

 

[kyzr]

Yep...you’re right. More death and destruction becuase you didn’t stop it the first time.
Where do they stop?

What part of "nothing you do could stop Putin if he wants to take territory" don't you understand?
You don't have any magic option that precludes Putin from invading someone.
Simple choice, peace or more war.

 

[gipper]

They just roll in the tanks and take whatever they want. Please tell me you really aren’t this vapid.

That’s ridiculous. You must watch MSNBC all day.

 

[gipper]

They just roll in the tanks and take whatever they want. Please tell me you really aren’t this vapid.

Do you believe Russia was unprovoked?

 

[candycorn]

This is a "no red herring" zone. Real politick in Ukraine is that Putin wants to keep it in Russia's sphere of influence, and keep NATO out, much like we told Russia no nukes in Cuba. Hitler wanted German speaking Sudetenland, like Putin wants Russian speaking Donbas, the difference is Putin occupies Donbas. I don't think Ukraine is giving up any territory Russians don't occupy.

And what happened after they tried to appease Hitler?

C’mon Neville..let us know what Vlad...err I mean Adolph did shortly after he got “everything he wanted”.

 

[kyzr]

What proof do you have Russia incurred a million casualties?
Experts have said they’ve incurred less than 100,000.

AI says the following, there are several links in google or bing to choose from.

 

[candycorn]

What part of "nothing you do could stop Putin if he wants to take territory" don't you understand?
You don't have any magic option that precludes Putin from invading someone.
Simple choice, peace or more war.

That is always the option...someone puts a gun in your face and demands your wallet on Tuesday, you give it to him right?

The same guy does it again on Wednesday and takes both your money clip (you’ve already lost your wallet) and your wristwatch....

You didn’t get shot but at least you got what you wanted...peace!