Latest Ukrainian Peace Plan From the US...Ukraine Surrenders, NATO Cannot Expand; Russia Gives Up Nothing.

[Toddsterpatriot]

So, since the US has invaded far more countries than Russia and none of them on it’s borders as Russia has done, do you condemn it and believe it wants world domination?

Think!

Poor Russia never did anything to anybody.
Always getting blamed.

DURR

 

[kyzr]

"Enemies are dead, we are not" in the case of large-scale war. In the case of a local war, "victor is one, who wrote the text of peace treaty."

OK

No. If he authorized (as in the movie) counter-force strike against Russian silos, command centers and military bases with already compromised C3I system, he'll kill thousands of Russians, may be (but unlikely) few million, but the USA will be totally destroyed by the third Russian strike.

Both sides have thousands of nukes.

Only Chicago? Man, however incompetent STRATCOM is, in this movie, even he realised that it is just an initial phase of a sophisticated, coordinated attack. In the best (for the USA) scenario American people are going to ask POTUS about what the f#ck just happened and Russian and Chinese agents do everything to start a civil war in the USA, or at least, prevent US involvement in European business.
In more realistic scenario Russia and China see American preparations to retaliation as preparation for preempive strike and attack US forces first.

Keep dreaming.

F#ck the borders.

That's how wars start. Russia lost 250,000 dead in Ukraine for what? Some war torn land? Bad outcome.

You make preparations to attack first. But some times enemy preempt you.

So the US never struck first. We won't attack first.

No. What happens with Russian people or in the Eurasia is a lot of our business. And it is definitely not your business.

What happens inside Ukraine is none of Russia's business.

We can win it.

No one wins a nuclear war.

Really? Ok. We'll see it in Venezuela.

Deal. Place your bets on whose drones are better.

Ok. We'll see, how neutral you can be after Russian nuclear attacks against French nuclear bases.

It's called MAD for a reason. Article 5 will be used to support NATO. Putin is not that stupid.

 

[gipper]

Poor Russia never did anything to anybody.
Always getting blamed.

DURR

Binary thinking. Always dumb.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Binary thinking. Always dumb.

Da, comrade!

 

[AntonToo]

Biden didn't say "It depends on if it's a major incursion"?

What does that have to do with inviting something?

Stop beating around the bush and put togather a coherent thought.

What was Trump doing when Putin invading? Calling it "smart".

Trump didn't call the invasion "smart".

Yes he did, stop posting bs.

Trump calls Putin 'genius' and 'savvy' for Ukraine invasion

The former president's praise for Putin comes at a perilous geopolitical moment in Europe.

www.politico.com

 

[AntonToo]

And there is no difference between Nazies and Democrats at all.

Ignoramus, the difference is Nazis were imperialist land grabbers and genocidal racists ruled by a charismatic dictator while Democrats are...wait for it...democrats.

Today who is most closely resembling them? Who are imperialist invaders ruled by a charismatic dictator in the modern world? Rushists and their Dear Leader Putin thats who.

 

[Kondor3]

You pay for it. We are tired of it.

You pay for it now, or you pay twenty times the price later... which is the more intelligent and cost-effective approach?

The ghost of Soviet Russia has materialized again under a different name and set of faces... the Evil Empire is back.

And they want you and your allies weak and divided and isolated so that they can continue their forward advance.

Only short-sighted tunnel vision -crippled isolationist fools and fifth-columnists hold otherwise.

 

[22lcidw]

You pay for it now, or you pay twenty times the price later... which is the more intelligent and cost-effective approach?

The ghost of Soviet Russia has materialized again under a different name and set of faces... the Evil Empire is back.

And they want you and your allies weak and divided and isolated so that they can continue their forward advance.

Only short-sighted tunnel vision -crippled isolationist fools and fifth-columnists hold otherwise.

Russia is limited due to its economy size. The Republican voters got tired of the wars that George Senior and George W. got us into. And you went directly from antiwar to pro war. You have changed views to opposite of what the Republicans have changed to. Remember, Republican voters changed their views first. And you guys changed to the side you did not like.

 

[Kondor3]

Russia is limited due to its economy size...

Agreed. But they routinely overspend to create and sustain what they need. And they have powerful friends.

...The Republican voters got tired of the wars that George Senior and George W. got us into...

True. But that does not negate the extreme danger that Isolationism poses to ourselves and our children and grandkids.

...And you went directly from antiwar to pro war...

You? I have no idea to whom you're referring.

Personally, I was in favor of a short, intense, victorious war against the Taliban and al-Qaeda in Afghanistan.

One lasting no more than six months and without us wasting our time on Nation Building... leave 'em choking on smoke.

I was entirely against Iraq War II... it did nothing more than topple an impotent dictator and leave chaos behind and take our eye off the ball in Afghanistan - and delay getting us the-hell-out of the region for two decades.

But I was also against showing Division and Weakness in the face of The Enemy once our people had been committed.

But all that's just me, personally.

...You have changed views to opposite of what the Republicans have changed to...

Again... who is this "you" being referenced? If, by that, you mean Democrats, well... that is possible.

Fortunately for me, personally, I consider myself a "Recovering Democrat" who has morphed into a genuine Independent.

...Remember, Republican voters changed their views first...

No. Not Republicans as a whole. More like the Populist-MAGA subset that presently is steering the leaky ship.

My own perception is that the Populist-MAGA crowd are, like their standard-bearer, transactional, and not strategic in their thinking and in their policies, and that such knee-jerk thinking and behaviors pose a grave longer-term danger.

While I entirely agree that war-making should be a serious undertaking of last-resort rather than a knee-jerk reaction at the whim of a President... falling back into a pseudo-19th-century Isolationism is not the answer and carries a grave risk.

...And you guys changed to the side you did not like.

If you're referring to Democrats, it's entirely possible that you're correct... Opposition for the sake of Opposition... they, like a fair number of Populist types, are not the Brightest Crayons in the Box... the Dems, too, are oftentimes full-of-$hit.

 

[berg80]

Russia lost 250,000 dead in Ukraine for what? Some war torn land? Bad outcome.

For Putin's delusional vision of a reunited USSR.

 

[berg80]

Sen. Mark Warner calls 28-point plan for Russia-Ukraine truce 'a historically bad deal'​

Sen. Mark Warner (D-Va.) said Sunday morning that the Trump administration’s 28-point plan for peace between Russia and Ukraine “would go down, frankly, as a historically bad deal, rivaling Neville Chamberlain giving in to Hitler before World War II.”

Warner, the highest-ranking Democrat on the Intelligence Committee, told “Fox News Sunday” host Shannon Bream that he fears the plan could embolden Chinese leader Xi Jinping to pursue an invasion of Taiwan if accepted, blasting the proposal as “a total capitulation by Ukraine.”

“Clearly this plan was at least initially laid out as simply Russian input and no Ukrainian input,” Warner said. “Now they’re saying there has been Ukrainian input. Now the president is changing his mind again about whether this is a final offer or not. At the end of the day, we all want to see peace, but we don’t want to see a peace that rewards Vladimir Putin.”

https://www.politico.com/news/2025/11/23/mark-warner-neville-calls-russia-ukraine-truce-00666433

Putin's benefactor is selling out Ukraine to no one's surprise.

 

[kyzr]

Sen. Mark Warner calls 28-point plan for Russia-Ukraine truce 'a historically bad deal'​

Sen. Mark Warner (D-Va.) said Sunday morning that the Trump administration’s 28-point plan for peace between Russia and Ukraine “would go down, frankly, as a historically bad deal, rivaling Neville Chamberlain giving in to Hitler before World War II.”

Warner, the highest-ranking Democrat on the Intelligence Committee, told “Fox News Sunday” host Shannon Bream that he fears the plan could embolden Chinese leader Xi Jinping to pursue an invasion of Taiwan if accepted, blasting the proposal as “a total capitulation by Ukraine.”

“Clearly this plan was at least initially laid out as simply Russian input and no Ukrainian input,” Warner said. “Now they’re saying there has been Ukrainian input. Now the president is changing his mind again about whether this is a final offer or not. At the end of the day, we all want to see peace, but we don’t want to see a peace that rewards Vladimir Putin.”
Putin's benefactor is selling out Ukraine to no one's surprise.

There is apparently a new deal that Marco Rubio is bragging about after meeting with the Ukrainians.

I haven't seen it yet.

 

[Ringo]

The ghost of Soviet Russia has materialized again under a different name and set of faces... the Evil Empire is back.

What a bombastic drooling moron!

 

[GavanPeacefan]

You pay for it now, or you pay twenty times the price later... which is the more intelligent and cost-effective approach?

The ghost of Soviet Russia has materialized again under a different name and set of faces... the Evil Empire is back.

And they want you and your allies weak and divided and isolated so that they can continue their forward advance.

Only short-sighted tunnel vision -crippled isolationist fools and fifth-columnists hold otherwise.

Or you could say Russia has a right to a stable western flank around Moscow, stable enough to see Kaliningrad permanently secured, as well as Crimea and the Ukranian lands Russia has recently conquered (in what I believe to be a pre-emptive strike to derail NATO and EU aggressive territorial expansion into eastern europe).

let's see what happens AFTER Moscow gets a good bufferzone (part of Lithuania in addition to Crimea etc).
see if they become reasonable in their foreign policy.
we can always take those lands back and place 'm under article 5 protection if Moscow does really play the USSR card again with it's 'Russian Federation'.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

What does that have to do with inviting something?

Stop beating around the bush and put togather a coherent thought.



Yes he did, stop posting bs.

Trump calls Putin 'genius' and 'savvy' for Ukraine invasion

The former president's praise for Putin comes at a perilous geopolitical moment in Europe.

www.politico.com

If Biden had said, "A single Russian soldier in Ukraine is unacceptable and we'll respond forcefully",
that would have signaled strength, instead of saying we'll wait and see how serious their invasion really is.

“I went in yesterday and there was a television screen, and I said, ‘This is genius.’ Putin declares a big portion of the Ukraine — of Ukraine — Putin declares it as independent. Oh, that’s wonderful,”

His declaring a portion is independent was "genius", not his invasion.

 

[AntonToo]

If Biden had said, "A single Russian soldier in Ukraine is unacceptable and we'll respond forcefully"

Russian soldiers have been in Ukraine since 2014 and throughout Trump presidency.

Same Trump straight up rejected any sort of boots on the ground in Ukraine.

What the **** are you talking about?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

What a bombastic drooling moron!

Don't be so hard on yourself.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Russian soldiers have been in Ukraine since 2014 and throughout Trump presidency.

What the **** are you talking about?

Obama's flexibility after his re-election didn't keep the peace?
Hillary's "reset button" didn't work?

 

[AntonToo]

Obama's flexibility after his re-election didn't keep the peace?

No it didn't silly. No American president did ENOUGH on Russia and certainly Obama didn't either.

Though in that pack there is one degenerate Putin lapdog that really stands out.

Today, after cutting off all American defense funding to Ukraine, "deal artist" is saying they need to reduce their army and hand over their cities to Russia.

 

[Kondor3]

What a bombastic drooling moron!

Sit down, child... and show some respect to your betters...