It does sound like Goebbels.
Israel violates international law
- Thread starter Victory67
- Start date
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It does sound like Goebbels.
No it just means that they don't have the protection of the Geneva conventions. They still violate laws when they use terrorist tactics and can be tried in other countries for their crimes. Israel having signed up to the Geneva conventions is covered and understands that they must abide by them when dealing with another nation bound by the conventions.
RoccoR
Gold Member
Quadravius, et al,
This is a very chld-like assessment you have made.
Yes, the act of "Genocide" is defined by the International Criminal Code (Rome Statute).
(EXAMPLE WITH RESPECT TO INTENT)
In most wars you have the stand alone elements of:
These are common element found in nearly every conflict. They do not imply "genocide." The elements of:
After more than six decades of conflict, it becomes pretty clear that if any of these element were true and applicable to the actions of the Israel, then a reasonable person would expect to see a significant decline in the population of the Arab-Palestinian both inside the sovereign territory of Israel and in the Occupied Territories. Clearly, we see the opposite.
We could argue all day about how the clause "to destroy, in whole or in part" applies, just as well as we could argue how we apply "a national, ethnical, racial or religious group." But, a key element of many crimes, as it is with genocide, is the "intent!" What we do see, in the claim, is the exact opposite. We see an express "intent" on the part of the Arab-Palestinian to kill every "man, woman and child" --- a very clear "intent" and articulated in no uncertain terms. AND, you have a very clear pattern of behaviors records that demonstrate the actual attempt to carry such a threat to its conclusion.
Most Respectfully,
R
This is a very chld-like assessment you have made.
(OBSERVATION)
Yes, the act of "Genocide" is defined by the International Criminal Code (Rome Statute).
Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court said:
(EXAMPLE WITH RESPECT TO INTENT)
(COMMENT)Statement of 6 February 1948 Communicated to the Secretary-General by Mr. Isa Nakhleh said:
In most wars you have the stand alone elements of:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
These are common element found in nearly every conflict. They do not imply "genocide." The elements of:
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
After more than six decades of conflict, it becomes pretty clear that if any of these element were true and applicable to the actions of the Israel, then a reasonable person would expect to see a significant decline in the population of the Arab-Palestinian both inside the sovereign territory of Israel and in the Occupied Territories. Clearly, we see the opposite.
We could argue all day about how the clause "to destroy, in whole or in part" applies, just as well as we could argue how we apply "a national, ethnical, racial or religious group." But, a key element of many crimes, as it is with genocide, is the "intent!" What we do see, in the claim, is the exact opposite. We see an express "intent" on the part of the Arab-Palestinian to kill every "man, woman and child" --- a very clear "intent" and articulated in no uncertain terms. AND, you have a very clear pattern of behaviors records that demonstrate the actual attempt to carry such a threat to its conclusion.
Most Respectfully,
R
No you were just trying to score points and ended up giving them away.
They still violate International law, it just means they cant use it for their own benefit.
P F Tinmore
Diamond Member
- Dec 6, 2009
- 86,385
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So the GC applies...er no it doesn't...Uhh..yes it does...ahhh...
You are so confused. Does it apply or not?
I remember the West Bank before the settlements ... before the checkpoints ... before the six day war.
Israel does a decent job of complying with International Law insofar as may be practicable.
Where it is not practicable, we are dealing in matters of safety-security and survival, and, still, they generally violate to as minimal an extent as may be practicable, while ensuring safety-security and survival.
Survival and safety-security - both short- and long-term - always trump International Law in the minds of the so-called violating party.
Always.
Sometimes, it's a valid perception; sometimes not.
In the case of Israel, it's usually a valid perception, and they have the balls to do what is needed, to ensure their safety-security and survival, despite what anyone else thinks.
As would any head of a family - taking care of his own first, with as little damage to others as may be practicable, but regardless of what others think - his family coming first in his calculations and actions. Human. Understandable. Laudable.
There is not a sane country on the face of the planet that would trade its survival for strict adherence to International Law.
The Israelis are no different in that regard.
They are a nation of refugees from a horrific slaughter 70 years ago, with that slaughter still within living memory, and they aren't about to take your shit - or mine - or that of some of the weasels at the UN General Assembly - to block their 2000 year-old goal of reclaiming Eretz Yisrael as a final redoubt and homeland for Jews around the world, now that the world has demonstrated a penchant for slaughtering them in their millions.
Eretz Yisrael is the price the world must pay for the Holocaust. The Muslim-Arab Palestinians of the region are merely in-the-way, and need to be moved elsewhere.
The Jews of Israel are a people under siege and they fully intend to survive this time, and ultimately to thrive; not willing to take shit from either you or I, on the road to reclaiming the full extent of their old ancestral and spiritual homeland.
Their former monstrous and cosmic suffering as a people, and the courage that they have demonstrated in holding themselves together for 2000 years and reclaiming what was once theirs, has excited the admiration and support of much of the world, even amongst those who publicly cluck their tongues and wag their fingers at Israel, in order to keep the Arab oil flowing their way.
Not to mention the 'Guilt Factor' over the Holocaust, and the extra slack that the Israelis get from The West as a sort of unspoken (but very real) penance for allowing so many of them to be killed in the 1930s and 1940s.
So, insofar as International Law is concerned, if the Israelis aren't actually slaughtering the Palestinians - sweeping through Gaza and the West Bank and killing everything that moves - then The World is willing to give them a lot more latitude than most others get, due to their special circumstances and needs.
The UN is a toothless old ladies' debating society.
It is a place where the Lilliputians of the world band together to try to keep the Gullivers in check.
Set up by the Gullivers to keep the Lilliputians quiet.
And controlled - ultimately - through the Five Permanent Gullivers on the Security Council.
In the long run, International Law is what the Five Gullivers say it is, or what they'll tolerate.
If you're a mid-sized type - a Regional Gulliver - bigger or stronger than your neighbors but not big enough to have a seat amongst the Big Five Gullivers - and if you're good friends with one of the Big Five Gullivers - you can pretty much do what you want, within reason, so long as you don't go around massacring whole populations and whatnot.
Annex their old lands when they abandon them or as spoils of war? No problem.
Seize and annex additional parcels of land when they won't reach a compromise and continue to shoot at you? No problem.
Wall-off the Lilliputians so they can't hurt your own people with guns and suicide vests? No problem.
Smack the shit out of the Lilliputians when they fire rockets at your people or dig tunnels for guerrilla sorties? No problem.
Evict and expel them to other Lilliputian lands when you've had enough? No problem.
It's called 'Friends with Benefits' - being Best Buds with one of the Big Five Gullivers.
Of course, it helps to have a track record as a much-savaged Lilliputian clan yourselves.
The UN General Assembly - the global town hall for the Lilliputians - will ***** and piss and moan and 'resolve' - dominated as it is by Arab sympathizers and Lilliputians who need Arab oil much worse than we do, or who do not face such in-your-face hostile populations themselves, or wussies who couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper bag.
The UN Security Council - dominated by the Big Five Gullivers - ultimately decides whether to take seriously the proceedings and 'resolve' of the Lilliputians in the General Assembly.
The UN?
Don't make me laugh.
Some of its agencies do good and necessary work around the world - bless 'em.
As a world-governance body, however... you attribute far too much effectiveness to them and far too little skepticism and powerlessness.
In the Real World, it doesn't work that way.
Israel can certainly leave the UN if it likes, but I think that would be a mistake; always better to have a seat in the Global Town Hall than not.
As to being 'expelled', well... to expel Israel, you would have to expel a sizable number of other members using the same grounds or basis - Lilliputians and Gullivers alike.
Besides, Israel has a very good friend amongst the Big Five Gullivers, and you need the 'recommendation' and 'approval' of the Security Council, before the Lilliputians in the General Assembly are allowed to vote on expelling, under the UN Charter, Section II, Articles 5 and 6.
See how that works? Isn't that cool?
Israel is the price the Palestinians pay for the Holocaust in Europe.
Israel tried to forcibly relocate the rest of the Arabs in 1949 or 1950... Chaim Weizmann approached Ibn Saud to take them in to Arabia to build TAPLINE.. instead of giving those jobs to Saudis. He also approached ARAMCO.. and the US.. He wanted the US to pay for the relocation.
This is not well known but it is referenced in the Mulligan Papers.
Here we go again the islamonazi version of history. The setting up of Israel as a homeland for the Jews was put in place way back in the 1920's. So it had absolutely nothing to do with the holocaust. That is just an islamonazi BLOOD LIBEL. Read the history and you see that the muslims got 3 nations and Israel 1. It was the threats of islamonazi violence that has resulted in the situation we see now in the M.E. The only answer is to force the Palestinians into accepting a UN brokered peace and borders or they will get nothing.
Not really.
Goebbels advocated slaughtering the Jews.
What is outlined above is a relocation of the Palestinians to some other place where they can build new and happy lives.
I don't recall Goebbels advocating to help the Jews do that, although his gang used that as a smokescreen to cart 'em away and dispose of 'em.
A bona fide population relocation effort is the only way out of this mess.
Everything else has been tried... and everything else has failed.
The only way to cut the Gordian knot now is to move one or the other population away from the other.
Given the history of the past 66 years (and more, if one ranges back to the 1880-1947 timeframe), it is the only solution that will now work, so that peace may reign once again.
Your assessment notwithstanding.
Last edited:
Why will they be refugees when they will just be returning to their nation of birth ?
It would help if the muslims tore out the "kill the Jews" passages from the Koran and stopped being so violent
Israel does a decent job of complying with International Law insofar as may be practicable.
Where it is not practicable, we are dealing in matters of safety-security and survival, and, still, they generally violate to as minimal an extent as may be practicable, while ensuring safety-security and survival.
Survival and safety-security - both short- and long-term - always trump International Law in the minds of the so-called violating party.
Always.
Sometimes, it's a valid perception; sometimes not.
In the case of Israel, it's usually a valid perception, and they have the balls to do what is needed, to ensure their safety-security and survival, despite what anyone else thinks.
As would any head of a family - taking care of his own first, with as little damage to others as may be practicable, but regardless of what others think - his family coming first in his calculations and actions. Human. Understandable. Laudable.
There is not a sane country on the face of the planet that would trade its survival for strict adherence to International Law.
The Israelis are no different in that regard.
They are a nation of refugees from a horrific slaughter 70 years ago, with that slaughter still within living memory, and they aren't about to take your shit - or mine - or that of some of the weasels at the UN General Assembly - to block their 2000 year-old goal of reclaiming Eretz Yisrael as a final redoubt and homeland for Jews around the world, now that the world has demonstrated a penchant for slaughtering them in their millions.
Eretz Yisrael is the price the world must pay for the Holocaust. The Muslim-Arab Palestinians of the region are merely in-the-way, and need to be moved elsewhere.
The Jews of Israel are a people under siege and they fully intend to survive this time, and ultimately to thrive; not willing to take shit from either you or I, on the road to reclaiming the full extent of their old ancestral and spiritual homeland.
Their former monstrous and cosmic suffering as a people, and the courage that they have demonstrated in holding themselves together for 2000 years and reclaiming what was once theirs, has excited the admiration and support of much of the world, even amongst those who publicly cluck their tongues and wag their fingers at Israel, in order to keep the Arab oil flowing their way.
Not to mention the 'Guilt Factor' over the Holocaust, and the extra slack that the Israelis get from The West as a sort of unspoken (but very real) penance for allowing so many of them to be killed in the 1930s and 1940s.
So, insofar as International Law is concerned, if the Israelis aren't actually slaughtering the Palestinians - sweeping through Gaza and the West Bank and killing everything that moves - then The World is willing to give them a lot more latitude than most others get, due to their special circumstances and needs.
The UN is a toothless old ladies' debating society.
It is a place where the Lilliputians of the world band together to try to keep the Gullivers in check.
Set up by the Gullivers to keep the Lilliputians quiet.
And controlled - ultimately - through the Five Permanent Gullivers on the Security Council.
In the long run, International Law is what the Five Gullivers say it is, or what they'll tolerate.
If you're a mid-sized type - a Regional Gulliver - bigger or stronger than your neighbors but not big enough to have a seat amongst the Big Five Gullivers - and if you're good friends with one of the Big Five Gullivers - you can pretty much do what you want, within reason, so long as you don't go around massacring whole populations and whatnot.
Annex their old lands when they abandon them or as spoils of war? No problem.
Seize and annex additional parcels of land when they won't reach a compromise and continue to shoot at you? No problem.
Wall-off the Lilliputians so they can't hurt your own people with guns and suicide vests? No problem.
Smack the shit out of the Lilliputians when they fire rockets at your people or dig tunnels for guerrilla sorties? No problem.
Evict and expel them to other Lilliputian lands when you've had enough? No problem.
It's called 'Friends with Benefits' - being Best Buds with one of the Big Five Gullivers.
Of course, it helps to have a track record as a much-savaged Lilliputian clan yourselves.
The UN General Assembly - the global town hall for the Lilliputians - will ***** and piss and moan and 'resolve' - dominated as it is by Arab sympathizers and Lilliputians who need Arab oil much worse than we do, or who do not face such in-your-face hostile populations themselves, or wussies who couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper bag.
The UN Security Council - dominated by the Big Five Gullivers - ultimately decides whether to take seriously the proceedings and 'resolve' of the Lilliputians in the General Assembly.
The UN?
Don't make me laugh.
Some of its agencies do good and necessary work around the world - bless 'em.
As a world-governance body, however... you attribute far too much effectiveness to them and far too little skepticism and powerlessness.
In the Real World, it doesn't work that way.
Israel can certainly leave the UN if it likes, but I think that would be a mistake; always better to have a seat in the Global Town Hall than not.
As to being 'expelled', well... to expel Israel, you would have to expel a sizable number of other members using the same grounds or basis - Lilliputians and Gullivers alike.
Besides, Israel has a very good friend amongst the Big Five Gullivers, and you need the 'recommendation' and 'approval' of the Security Council, before the Lilliputians in the General Assembly are allowed to vote on expelling, under the UN Charter, Section II, Articles 5 and 6.
See how that works? Isn't that cool?
Israel is the price the Palestinians pay for the Holocaust in Europe.
Israel tried to forcibly relocate the rest of the Arabs in 1949 or 1950... Chaim Weizmann approached Ibn Saud to take them in to Arabia to build TAPLINE.. instead of giving those jobs to Saudis. He also approached ARAMCO.. and the US.. He wanted the US to pay for the relocation.
This is not well known but it is referenced in the Mulligan Papers.
Here we go again the islamonazi version of history. The setting up of Israel as a homeland for the Jews was put in place way back in the 1920's. So it had absolutely nothing to do with the holocaust. That is just an islamonazi BLOOD LIBEL. Read the history and you see that the muslims got 3 nations and Israel 1. It was the threats of islamonazi violence that has resulted in the situation we see now in the M.E. The only answer is to force the Palestinians into accepting a UN brokered peace and borders or they will get nothing.
The Muslims didn't get 3 countries... They already lived there.
The only problem is those millions of non Jews have already admitted that they came from other nations, and once the problems are over will move back home.
Indeependent
Diamond Member
- Nov 19, 2013
- 73,633
- 28,515
- 2,250
The difference between the Arab Scum and the Jews?
The Jews were the most loyal Germans.
The Jews were the most loyal Austrians.
The Jews were the most loyal citizens of every nation.
The Jews were also great scapegoats.
The Arab Scum have spent a millennia murdering people over hear gear.
The Jews were the most loyal Germans.
The Jews were the most loyal Austrians.
The Jews were the most loyal citizens of every nation.
The Jews were also great scapegoats.
The Arab Scum have spent a millennia murdering people over hear gear.
Sweet_Caroline
Gold Member
- Jun 15, 2013
- 4,174
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Arabs run around like headless chickens not knowing their arse from their elbow.
montelatici
Gold Member
- Feb 5, 2014
- 18,686
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Total bullshit.
Israel does a decent job of complying with International Law insofar as may be practicable.
Where it is not practicable, we are dealing in matters of safety-security and survival, and, still, they generally violate to as minimal an extent as may be practicable, while ensuring safety-security and survival.
Survival and safety-security - both short- and long-term - always trump International Law in the minds of the so-called violating party.
Always.
Sometimes, it's a valid perception; sometimes not.
In the case of Israel, it's usually a valid perception, and they have the balls to do what is needed, to ensure their safety-security and survival, despite what anyone else thinks.
As would any head of a family - taking care of his own first, with as little damage to others as may be practicable, but regardless of what others think - his family coming first in his calculations and actions. Human. Understandable. Laudable.
There is not a sane country on the face of the planet that would trade its survival for strict adherence to International Law.
The Israelis are no different in that regard.
They are a nation of refugees from a horrific slaughter 70 years ago, with that slaughter still within living memory, and they aren't about to take your shit - or mine - or that of some of the weasels at the UN General Assembly - to block their 2000 year-old goal of reclaiming Eretz Yisrael as a final redoubt and homeland for Jews around the world, now that the world has demonstrated a penchant for slaughtering them in their millions.
Eretz Yisrael is the price the world must pay for the Holocaust. The Muslim-Arab Palestinians of the region are merely in-the-way, and need to be moved elsewhere.
The Jews of Israel are a people under siege and they fully intend to survive this time, and ultimately to thrive; not willing to take shit from either you or I, on the road to reclaiming the full extent of their old ancestral and spiritual homeland.
Their former monstrous and cosmic suffering as a people, and the courage that they have demonstrated in holding themselves together for 2000 years and reclaiming what was once theirs, has excited the admiration and support of much of the world, even amongst those who publicly cluck their tongues and wag their fingers at Israel, in order to keep the Arab oil flowing their way.
Not to mention the 'Guilt Factor' over the Holocaust, and the extra slack that the Israelis get from The West as a sort of unspoken (but very real) penance for allowing so many of them to be killed in the 1930s and 1940s.
So, insofar as International Law is concerned, if the Israelis aren't actually slaughtering the Palestinians - sweeping through Gaza and the West Bank and killing everything that moves - then The World is willing to give them a lot more latitude than most others get, due to their special circumstances and needs.
The UN is a toothless old ladies' debating society.
It is a place where the Lilliputians of the world band together to try to keep the Gullivers in check.
Set up by the Gullivers to keep the Lilliputians quiet.
And controlled - ultimately - through the Five Permanent Gullivers on the Security Council.
In the long run, International Law is what the Five Gullivers say it is, or what they'll tolerate.
If you're a mid-sized type - a Regional Gulliver - bigger or stronger than your neighbors but not big enough to have a seat amongst the Big Five Gullivers - and if you're good friends with one of the Big Five Gullivers - you can pretty much do what you want, within reason, so long as you don't go around massacring whole populations and whatnot.
Annex their old lands when they abandon them or as spoils of war? No problem.
Seize and annex additional parcels of land when they won't reach a compromise and continue to shoot at you? No problem.
Wall-off the Lilliputians so they can't hurt your own people with guns and suicide vests? No problem.
Smack the shit out of the Lilliputians when they fire rockets at your people or dig tunnels for guerrilla sorties? No problem.
Evict and expel them to other Lilliputian lands when you've had enough? No problem.
It's called 'Friends with Benefits' - being Best Buds with one of the Big Five Gullivers.
Of course, it helps to have a track record as a much-savaged Lilliputian clan yourselves.
The UN General Assembly - the global town hall for the Lilliputians - will ***** and piss and moan and 'resolve' - dominated as it is by Arab sympathizers and Lilliputians who need Arab oil much worse than we do, or who do not face such in-your-face hostile populations themselves, or wussies who couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper bag.
The UN Security Council - dominated by the Big Five Gullivers - ultimately decides whether to take seriously the proceedings and 'resolve' of the Lilliputians in the General Assembly.
The UN?
Don't make me laugh.
Some of its agencies do good and necessary work around the world - bless 'em.
As a world-governance body, however... you attribute far too much effectiveness to them and far too little skepticism and powerlessness.
In the Real World, it doesn't work that way.
Israel can certainly leave the UN if it likes, but I think that would be a mistake; always better to have a seat in the Global Town Hall than not.
As to being 'expelled', well... to expel Israel, you would have to expel a sizable number of other members using the same grounds or basis - Lilliputians and Gullivers alike.
Besides, Israel has a very good friend amongst the Big Five Gullivers, and you need the 'recommendation' and 'approval' of the Security Council, before the Lilliputians in the General Assembly are allowed to vote on expelling, under the UN Charter, Section II, Articles 5 and 6.
See how that works? Isn't that cool?
Israel has committed to abide by the 4th Geneva Conventions, and openly flaunting that they have the right to abide by them when they see fit and ignore them when they see fit is one of the many reasons why Israel gets so much criticism and has many enemies throughout the world.
Perhaps if they commited to remaining true to the 4th Geneva Conventions and acted in such a manner they would have more friends.
They fully abide by the Geneva conventions in as much as they apply. In the case of the west bank they don't apply because Palestine has not signed them and as such are not bound by them. It is the neo Nazi stooges that have been force fed islamonazi lies that believe the Israelis should be forced to commit suicide. Once the Palestinians have signed all parts of the Geneva conventions then they will be covered, and this means they cant breach them
P F Tinmore
Diamond Member
- Dec 6, 2009
- 86,385
- 4,876
- 1,815
Indeed, the vast majority of Palestinians have ancestors who predate Ottoman rule.
After spending centuries taking them from others...
Cool.
And they'll have plenty of time to update their family genealogy tree-records, once they're happily resettled someplace else, and out of harms' way, and where they, in turn, can do no harm.
montelatici
Gold Member
- Feb 5, 2014
- 18,686
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- 280
Ethnic cleansing is a crime against humanity, want to end up in court (and usually die of old age) in the Hague like those Serbs who tried the ethnically cleanse the Muslims from Bosnia?
Yep.
Under-performers have been getting pushed off their lands since the dawn of human history.
Ask the Native Americans (Indians).
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