Is There A God?

[ding]

How so?

Because you believe in a creator, but you have no cause for it.

There is no cause needed for a Creator as the only solution to the first cause is something which is eternal... like our Creator. Time does not exist outside of our universe. In fact, some would argue that time does not exist at all.

This is made-up bullshit. Received wisdom, repeated by the brainwashed. It has all the evidentiary backing of Zeus, Thor, or Flying Spaghetti Monster.

Above all, it's not "rational" and therefore proves my statement correct.

No, Gary, it is not made up bullshit. It is logic and reason. You do realize that you can test received wisdom, right? Cause and effect are useful tools for testing received wisdom. We live in a universe where there has never been an uncaused event. We can observe outcomes to determine the difference between successful and failed behaviors, thus confirming or denying received wisdom.

Which, again, totally undercuts your unsubstantiated wild guess that some immensely complicated force formed out of nothing to create the universe.

How does it do that, Gary?

 

[PK1]

Most people think of "god" as a being who resembles them, hangs out in a place called "heaven" and passes harsh judgements on us.
...
Nearly all religions have three things in common: 1. They believe in a god. 2. Only their religions is right. 3. Fear.
...
I do not subscribe to any religious dogma any more than I subscribe to any political dogma. I believe there is a force of energy that is so great it can create things from nothing, including the human life form.

I'm intellectually sympathetic to your non-belief about god fantasies as worshipped in today's religions.
Your position is relatively reasonable, but you must admit, "force of energy" is a very general concept that also has a problem with origins.
Therefore, without ANY knowledge about original energy sources and their transformation to various masses, we can only be agnostic about whether a "god" exists.

 

[ScienceRocks]

Lets just say that it is a myth until proven otherwise.

Lets keep it out of government and out of our schools.

 

[ding]

Most people think of "god" as a being who resembles them, hangs out in a place called "heaven" and passes harsh judgements on us.
...
Nearly all religions have three things in common: 1. They believe in a god. 2. Only their religions is right. 3. Fear.
...
I do not subscribe to any religious dogma any more than I subscribe to any political dogma. I believe there is a force of energy that is so great it can create things from nothing, including the human life form.

I'm intellectually sympathetic to your non-belief about god fantasies as worshipped in today's religions.
Your position is relatively reasonable, but you must admit, "force of energy" is a very general concept that also has a problem with origins.
Therefore, without ANY knowledge about original energy sources and their transformation to various masses, we can only be agnostic about whether a "god" exists.

You don't sound agnostic.

 

[ding]

Lets just say that it is a myth until proven otherwise.

Lets keep it out of government and out of our schools.

Fair enough. Can you please keep your religion out of our schools and government?

Their religion is socialism which worships big government and social policy. It is based on atheism and deification of man. It proceeds in almost all its manifestations from the assumption that the basic principles guiding the life of an individual and of mankind in general do not go beyond the satisfaction of material needs or primitive instincts. They have no distinction between good and evil, no morality or any other kind of value, save pleasure. Their doctrine is abolition of private property, abolition of family, abolition of religion and communality or equality. The religious nature of socialism explains the extraordinary attraction to socialist doctrines and its capacity to inflame individuals and inspire popular movements and condemn respect for any who believe in Christianity. They practice moral relativity, indiscriminate indiscriminateness, multiculturalism, cultural marxism and normalization of deviance. Their hostility towards traditional religions is that of an animosity between a rival religion. They can be identified by an external locus of control. They worship science but are the first to argue against it. They are modern American liberals.

 

[Mudda]

Lets just say that it is a myth until proven otherwise.

Lets keep it out of government and out of our schools.

Fair enough. Can you please keep your religion out of our schools and government?

Their religion is socialism which worships big government and social policy. It is based on atheism and deification of man. It proceeds in almost all its manifestations from the assumption that the basic principles guiding the life of an individual and of mankind in general do not go beyond the satisfaction of material needs or primitive instincts. They have no distinction between good and evil, no morality or any other kind of value, save pleasure. Their doctrine is abolition of private property, abolition of family, abolition of religion and communality or equality. The religious nature of socialism explains the extraordinary attraction to socialist doctrines and its capacity to inflame individuals and inspire popular movements and condemn respect for any who believe in Christianity. They practice moral relativity, indiscriminate indiscriminateness, multiculturalism, cultural marxism and normalization of deviance. Their hostility towards traditional religions is that of an animosity between a rival religion. They can be identified by an external locus of control. They worship science but are the first to argue against it. They are modern American liberals.

Must be a slow day at work. Did they close the drive-thru?

 

[PK1]

Most people think of "god" as a being who resembles them, hangs out in a place called "heaven" and passes harsh judgements on us.
...
Nearly all religions have three things in common: 1. They believe in a god. 2. Only their religions is right. 3. Fear.
...
I do not subscribe to any religious dogma any more than I subscribe to any political dogma. I believe there is a force of energy that is so great it can create things from nothing, including the human life form.

I'm intellectually sympathetic to your non-belief about god fantasies as worshipped in today's religions.
Your position is relatively reasonable, but you must admit, "force of energy" is a very general concept that also has a problem with origins.
Therefore, without ANY knowledge about original energy sources and their transformation to various masses, we can only be agnostic about whether a "god" exists.

You don't sound agnostic.

Apparently, you don't understand what agnosticism is.
Here is a simplified explanation that even you should understand:
No knowledge = no belief.

 

[ding]

Lets just say that it is a myth until proven otherwise.

Lets keep it out of government and out of our schools.

Fair enough. Can you please keep your religion out of our schools and government?

Their religion is socialism which worships big government and social policy. It is based on atheism and deification of man. It proceeds in almost all its manifestations from the assumption that the basic principles guiding the life of an individual and of mankind in general do not go beyond the satisfaction of material needs or primitive instincts. They have no distinction between good and evil, no morality or any other kind of value, save pleasure. Their doctrine is abolition of private property, abolition of family, abolition of religion and communality or equality. The religious nature of socialism explains the extraordinary attraction to socialist doctrines and its capacity to inflame individuals and inspire popular movements and condemn respect for any who believe in Christianity. They practice moral relativity, indiscriminate indiscriminateness, multiculturalism, cultural marxism and normalization of deviance. Their hostility towards traditional religions is that of an animosity between a rival religion. They can be identified by an external locus of control. They worship science but are the first to argue against it. They are modern American liberals.

Must be a slow day at work. Did they close the drive-thru?

Is that why you are posting today?

 

[ding]

Most people think of "god" as a being who resembles them, hangs out in a place called "heaven" and passes harsh judgements on us.
...
Nearly all religions have three things in common: 1. They believe in a god. 2. Only their religions is right. 3. Fear.
...
I do not subscribe to any religious dogma any more than I subscribe to any political dogma. I believe there is a force of energy that is so great it can create things from nothing, including the human life form.

I'm intellectually sympathetic to your non-belief about god fantasies as worshipped in today's religions.
Your position is relatively reasonable, but you must admit, "force of energy" is a very general concept that also has a problem with origins.
Therefore, without ANY knowledge about original energy sources and their transformation to various masses, we can only be agnostic about whether a "god" exists.

You don't sound agnostic.

Apparently, you don't understand what agnosticism is.
Here is a simplified explanation that even you should understand:
No knowledge = no belief.

Apparently you are unable to make the leap in logic that if you have no knowledge and no belief that it is illogical for you to be arguing with those that do. Therefore, your actions prove you are not agnostic.

 

[Mudda]

Lets just say that it is a myth until proven otherwise.

Lets keep it out of government and out of our schools.

Fair enough. Can you please keep your religion out of our schools and government?

Their religion is socialism which worships big government and social policy. It is based on atheism and deification of man. It proceeds in almost all its manifestations from the assumption that the basic principles guiding the life of an individual and of mankind in general do not go beyond the satisfaction of material needs or primitive instincts. They have no distinction between good and evil, no morality or any other kind of value, save pleasure. Their doctrine is abolition of private property, abolition of family, abolition of religion and communality or equality. The religious nature of socialism explains the extraordinary attraction to socialist doctrines and its capacity to inflame individuals and inspire popular movements and condemn respect for any who believe in Christianity. They practice moral relativity, indiscriminate indiscriminateness, multiculturalism, cultural marxism and normalization of deviance. Their hostility towards traditional religions is that of an animosity between a rival religion. They can be identified by an external locus of control. They worship science but are the first to argue against it. They are modern American liberals.

Must be a slow day at work. Did they close the drive-thru?

Is that why you are posting today?

I never said I had a job. You claimed to be a fry cook.

 

[ding]

Lets just say that it is a myth until proven otherwise.

Lets keep it out of government and out of our schools.

Fair enough. Can you please keep your religion out of our schools and government?

Their religion is socialism which worships big government and social policy. It is based on atheism and deification of man. It proceeds in almost all its manifestations from the assumption that the basic principles guiding the life of an individual and of mankind in general do not go beyond the satisfaction of material needs or primitive instincts. They have no distinction between good and evil, no morality or any other kind of value, save pleasure. Their doctrine is abolition of private property, abolition of family, abolition of religion and communality or equality. The religious nature of socialism explains the extraordinary attraction to socialist doctrines and its capacity to inflame individuals and inspire popular movements and condemn respect for any who believe in Christianity. They practice moral relativity, indiscriminate indiscriminateness, multiculturalism, cultural marxism and normalization of deviance. Their hostility towards traditional religions is that of an animosity between a rival religion. They can be identified by an external locus of control. They worship science but are the first to argue against it. They are modern American liberals.

Must be a slow day at work. Did they close the drive-thru?

Is that why you are posting today?

I never said I had a job. You claimed to be a fry cook.

lol, in your head.

 

[PK1]

Most people think of "god" as a being who resembles them, hangs out in a place called "heaven" and passes harsh judgements on us.
...
Nearly all religions have three things in common: 1. They believe in a god. 2. Only their religions is right. 3. Fear.
...
I do not subscribe to any religious dogma any more than I subscribe to any political dogma. I believe there is a force of energy that is so great it can create things from nothing, including the human life form.

I'm intellectually sympathetic to your non-belief about god fantasies as worshipped in today's religions.
Your position is relatively reasonable, but you must admit, "force of energy" is a very general concept that also has a problem with origins.
Therefore, without ANY knowledge about original energy sources and their transformation to various masses, we can only be agnostic about whether a "god" exists.

You don't sound agnostic.

Apparently, you don't understand what agnosticism is.
Here is a simplified explanation that even you should understand:
No knowledge = no belief.

Apparently you are unable to make the leap in logic that if you have no knowledge and no belief that it is illogical for you to be arguing with those that do. Therefore, your actions prove you are not agnostic.

It is logical for me to ask you what knowledge you have to support your belief.
So tell us your knowledge.
Fantasy does not count.

 

[ding]

Most people think of "god" as a being who resembles them, hangs out in a place called "heaven" and passes harsh judgements on us.
...
Nearly all religions have three things in common: 1. They believe in a god. 2. Only their religions is right. 3. Fear.
...
I do not subscribe to any religious dogma any more than I subscribe to any political dogma. I believe there is a force of energy that is so great it can create things from nothing, including the human life form.

I'm intellectually sympathetic to your non-belief about god fantasies as worshipped in today's religions.
Your position is relatively reasonable, but you must admit, "force of energy" is a very general concept that also has a problem with origins.
Therefore, without ANY knowledge about original energy sources and their transformation to various masses, we can only be agnostic about whether a "god" exists.

You don't sound agnostic.

Apparently, you don't understand what agnosticism is.
Here is a simplified explanation that even you should understand:
No knowledge = no belief.

Apparently you are unable to make the leap in logic that if you have no knowledge and no belief that it is illogical for you to be arguing with those that do. Therefore, your actions prove you are not agnostic.

It is logical for me to ask you what knowledge you have to support your belief.
So tell us your knowledge.
Fantasy does not count.

Our own experiences and reasoning abilities.

 

[GaryDog]

I'm intellectually sympathetic to your non-belief about god fantasies as worshipped in today's religions.
Your position is relatively reasonable, but you must admit, "force of energy" is a very general concept that also has a problem with origins.
Therefore, without ANY knowledge about original energy sources and their transformation to various masses, we can only be agnostic about whether a "god" exists.

You don't sound agnostic.

Apparently, you don't understand what agnosticism is.
Here is a simplified explanation that even you should understand:
No knowledge = no belief.

Apparently you are unable to make the leap in logic that if you have no knowledge and no belief that it is illogical for you to be arguing with those that do. Therefore, your actions prove you are not agnostic.

It is logical for me to ask you what knowledge you have to support your belief.
So tell us your knowledge.
Fantasy does not count.

Our own experiences and reasoning abilities.

You mean the ones you don't use?

 

[PK1]

I'm intellectually sympathetic to your non-belief about god fantasies as worshipped in today's religions.
Your position is relatively reasonable, but you must admit, "force of energy" is a very general concept that also has a problem with origins.
Therefore, without ANY knowledge about original energy sources and their transformation to various masses, we can only be agnostic about whether a "god" exists.

You don't sound agnostic.

Apparently, you don't understand what agnosticism is.
Here is a simplified explanation that even you should understand:
No knowledge = no belief.

Apparently you are unable to make the leap in logic that if you have no knowledge and no belief that it is illogical for you to be arguing with those that do. Therefore, your actions prove you are not agnostic.

It is logical for me to ask you what knowledge you have to support your belief.
So tell us your knowledge.
Fantasy does not count.

Our own experiences and reasoning abilities.

As you know, and we have discussed this before, experiences are subjective and can relate to objective reality if other brains perceive the same experiences (in scientific methodology, this can be an example of "convergent operations").
Then, you can try interpreting your data to explain or predict something called "knowledge".

So, please describe your "knowledge" about a "god".

 

[ding]

You don't sound agnostic.

Apparently, you don't understand what agnosticism is.
Here is a simplified explanation that even you should understand:
No knowledge = no belief.

Apparently you are unable to make the leap in logic that if you have no knowledge and no belief that it is illogical for you to be arguing with those that do. Therefore, your actions prove you are not agnostic.

It is logical for me to ask you what knowledge you have to support your belief.
So tell us your knowledge.
Fantasy does not count.

Our own experiences and reasoning abilities.

You mean the ones you don't use?

No. The ones that are beyond your capability to understand.

 

[ding]

You don't sound agnostic.

Apparently, you don't understand what agnosticism is.
Here is a simplified explanation that even you should understand:
No knowledge = no belief.

Apparently you are unable to make the leap in logic that if you have no knowledge and no belief that it is illogical for you to be arguing with those that do. Therefore, your actions prove you are not agnostic.

It is logical for me to ask you what knowledge you have to support your belief.
So tell us your knowledge.
Fantasy does not count.

Our own experiences and reasoning abilities.

As you know, and we have discussed this before, experiences are subjective and can relate to objective reality if other brains perceive the same experiences (in scientific methodology, this can be an example of "convergent operations").
Then, you can try interpreting your data to explain or predict something called "knowledge".

So, please describe your "knowledge" about a "god".

You are trying to skip steps. First we must establish that the universe itself and everything in it can be used as evidence to prove this point.

 

[PK1]

Apparently, you don't understand what agnosticism is.
Here is a simplified explanation that even you should understand:
No knowledge = no belief.

Apparently you are unable to make the leap in logic that if you have no knowledge and no belief that it is illogical for you to be arguing with those that do. Therefore, your actions prove you are not agnostic.

It is logical for me to ask you what knowledge you have to support your belief.
So tell us your knowledge.
Fantasy does not count.

Our own experiences and reasoning abilities.

As you know, and we have discussed this before, experiences are subjective and can relate to objective reality if other brains perceive the same experiences (in scientific methodology, this can be an example of "convergent operations").
Then, you can try interpreting your data to explain or predict something called "knowledge".

So, please describe your "knowledge" about a "god".

You are trying to skip steps. First we must establish that the universe itself and everything in it can be used as evidence to prove this point.

So, you also have no knowledge of any god, but you want to assume that ... because it makes you feel better?

The observable universe has patterns, but no god is needed to explain many patterns we see & understand.
The patterns occur naturally based on our limited scientific knowledge.
A god-of-the-gaps explanation is reflective of a childish "easy button" for those who prefer to believe their fantasy.

 

[ding]

Apparently you are unable to make the leap in logic that if you have no knowledge and no belief that it is illogical for you to be arguing with those that do. Therefore, your actions prove you are not agnostic.

It is logical for me to ask you what knowledge you have to support your belief.
So tell us your knowledge.
Fantasy does not count.

Our own experiences and reasoning abilities.

As you know, and we have discussed this before, experiences are subjective and can relate to objective reality if other brains perceive the same experiences (in scientific methodology, this can be an example of "convergent operations").
Then, you can try interpreting your data to explain or predict something called "knowledge".

So, please describe your "knowledge" about a "god".

You are trying to skip steps. First we must establish that the universe itself and everything in it can be used as evidence to prove this point.

So, you also have no knowledge of any god, but you want to assume that ... because it makes you feel better?

The observable universe has patterns, but no god is needed to explain many patterns we see & understand.
The patterns occur naturally based on our limited scientific knowledge.
A god-of-the-gaps explanation is reflective of a childish "easy button" for those who prefer to believe their fantasy.

Don't be silly. I can know God by what He has created. I can learn a great many things about Him.

 

[PK1]

It is logical for me to ask you what knowledge you have to support your belief.
So tell us your knowledge.
Fantasy does not count.

Our own experiences and reasoning abilities.

As you know, and we have discussed this before, experiences are subjective and can relate to objective reality if other brains perceive the same experiences (in scientific methodology, this can be an example of "convergent operations").
Then, you can try interpreting your data to explain or predict something called "knowledge".

So, please describe your "knowledge" about a "god".

You are trying to skip steps. First we must establish that the universe itself and everything in it can be used as evidence to prove this point.

So, you also have no knowledge of any god, but you want to assume that ... because it makes you feel better?

The observable universe has patterns, but no god is needed to explain many patterns we see & understand.
The patterns occur naturally based on our limited scientific knowledge.
A god-of-the-gaps explanation is reflective of a childish "easy button" for those who prefer to believe their fantasy.

Don't be silly. I can know God by what He has created. I can learn a great many things about Him.

You think you "know" a god, but you have not proven that you are not deluded.