Is it ethical to exploit others?

[Man of Ethics]

Prior to mid 19th Century, resources were very limited. Production per capita was about 50 times lower then in USA 2021. Child mortality was 30% to 50%. Life was miserable. Between the time of Hammurabi and late XVIIIth Century, agrarian life and technology did not change much. The only way to acquire reasonable or large resources was by exploiting others. Almost every Civilization was built on exploitation of many people. Some systems of exploitation were relatively humane, while others were brutal.


French Society had great income inequality. Here. Nobles, clergy, and Bourgeois consumed 50% of resources which were mostly produced by peasants. Nevertheless, the level of direct coercion was minimal. The nobles owned the land. The peasants paid rent, but they were free to move to another estate. Peasants were not slaves, and they were not subject to physical abuse.


Of course, French Peasants were not happy with the fact that the fruits of their hard work were expropriated. That was the cause of French Revolution. Nevertheless, the system of exploitation produced a noble class which advanced sciences and arts. That system used resources extracted from peasants to produce masterpieces of Art and Architecture.


Russian and East European Serfdom was much more coercive. The peasants were bound to their owners. In Russia, about 60% of peasant population paid taxes -- they were either state peasants or obrok (tax) peasants. About 30% of peasants were in worse situation -- they had work (barshina) obligations. They had to work about three days per week for their owners. About 10% of peasants were de facto slaves -- household servants or factory serfs. In Russia and East Europe, serfs did suffer physical abuse from their owners.


American Slavery was extremely coercive and exploitative. Slaves had work obligations at least 2.5 times higher then serfs in Russia and East Europe. Brutal abuse of slaves was common. American Slavery was based not only on exploitation but also on unnecessary brutality. That was excessive by XVIIth and XIXth Century standards. { American Slavery and Russian Serfdom.}

 

[Man of Ethics]

Even the mildest system of exploitation was not exactly mild. Effective expropriation of about 30% of commoners' income through rents was a heavy burden. Relative well-being of top 10% and luxury of the top 1% of population was achieved by placing a heavy burden on the bottom 70%. The life of poorest 35% of population -- agricultural day laborers and servants was miserable. Hunger was common, and sometimes fatal. French Peasants were not happy. That was the cause of French Revolution.


Nevertheless, the system of exploitation produced a noble class which advanced sciences and arts. Feudal system produced masterpieces of Art and Architecture. Feudal system produced the Palace of Versailles with it's magnificent 22,000 great works of art. Possibly, the system of exploitation which existed in Europe was one of the major contributors of resources which were needed to launch the Industrial Revolution.

 

[Turtlesoup]

Even the mildest system of exploitation was not exactly mild. Effective expropriation of about 30% of commoners' income through rents was a heavy burden. Relative well-being of top 10% and luxury of the top 1% of population was achieved by placing a heavy burden on the bottom 70%. The life of poorest 35% of population -- agricultural day laborers and servants was miserable. Hunger was common, and sometimes fatal. French Peasants were not happy. That was the cause of French Revolution.


Nevertheless, the system of exploitation produced a noble class which advanced sciences and arts. Feudal system produced masterpieces of Art and Architecture. Feudal system produced the Palace of Versailles with it's magnificent 22,000 great works of art. Possibly, the system of exploitation which existed in Europe was one of the major contributors of resources which were needed to launch the Industrial Revolution.

Oh stop it....communist trolls trying to spread shit. The slaves here in america did not starve like the european serfs-------they were also given better medical care than most american free person received.

 

[Man of Ethics]

Oh stop it....communist trolls trying to spread shit. The slaves here in america did not starve like the european serfs-------they were also given better medical care than most american free person received.

American Slavery was extreme even by XVIIIth and XIXth Century standards. That is an example of unnecessary cruelty. European serfdom was somewhat necessary in order for Civilization to have resources for development.

 

[Turtlesoup]

American Slavery was extreme even by XVIIIth and XIXth Century standards. That is an example of unnecessary cruelty. European serfdom was somewhat necessary in order for Civilization to have resources for development.

Oh stop with the stupid....You babbling nonsense.

Slavery started in the US because there was an extreme shortage of workers for one---so they felt it was necessary to enslave even though they did not normally support enslaving others. In order to rectify this conflict "their need" for workers with the immorality of slavery, they argued that enslaving non-christians was the christian thing to do in order to convert the heathens to christianity. They did not set out to be cruel--------they wanted workers to make money and they wanted their new forced workers to convert so they often tried the carrot method of conversion with the slaves.

SLAVES were quite valuable----so african slaves were often treated far better than indentured white servants as evidence by GRAVES from that time. Slaves were well fed and far less abused than the european serf indentured servants. This is historic FACT, not manipulative bs that you are posting.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

Oh stop with the stupid....You babbling nonsense.

Slavery started in the US because there was an extreme shortage of workers for one---so they felt it was necessary to enslave even though they did not normally support enslaving others. In order to rectify this conflict "their need" for workers with the immorality of slavery, they argued that enslaving non-christians was the christian thing to do in order to convert the heathens to christianity. They did not set out to be cruel--------they wanted workers to make money and they wanted their new forced workers to convert so they often tried the carrot method of conversion with the slaves.

SLAVES were quite valuable----so african slaves were often treated far better than indentured white servants as evidence by GRAVES from that time. Slaves were well fed and far less abused than the european serf indentured servants. This is historic FACT, not manipulative bs that you are posting.

You think it's ethical to "breed" human beings in order to increase one's wealth?

 

[EvilCat Breath]

Oh stop it....communist trolls trying to spread shit. The slaves here in america did not starve like the european serfs-------they were also given better medical care than most american free person received.

That's quite true. Marxists today won't admit it but American slives for the most part weren't badly treated. Unlike free peasants, the master was obligated to feed his slaves, and give them medical care because a slave represented a significant investment. Slaves were treated as valuable livestock.

 

[BackAgain]

Exploitation is an interesting word. In one sense it denotes an abuse. In another sense it denotes a mere use.

Societies that utilized any system of slavery, for example, fall into the former category.

But an “exploitation” of available resources falls into the latter category.

Certain people try to take advantage of that verbal ambiguity. They seek to conflate the concept of slavery as “exploitation” of human workers (which it is) with the notion of the “exploitation” of human workers in a capitalist system (which is more akin to the exploitation of resources).

You all know the drill from there. “Greedy” capitalists “exploit” the working “class.” And this construct is still used by Marxist types to claim that the “workers” are “exploited” even today in any capitalist system. Regardless of wage. Regardless of Union rights. Regardless of material quality of life.

So, I’m just wondering if this lame ass thread has any merit to it at all.

 

[Turtlesoup]

You think it's ethical to "breed" human beings in order to increase one's wealth?

NOoooooooo....but I try to understand cause and effect in all things. Atleast in most instances, something can be learned to avoid creating the same mistakes or Evil in this case.

Two, I fucking hate manipulative people spinning BS about history trying to push an agenda---these assholes must be stopped and corrected immediately.

Slavery has been mistaught for generations now---------It is now being used to beat whites into submission as the druggies and globalist try to seize power and enslave this one race as a means to enslave the entire world.

 

[elektra]

People know so much more today, about yesterday, then those who lived yesterday.

So much bullshit one must simply call it all bullshit.

As far as bad people go we are seeing the return of people like those who were the elite or slave owners. We call them Democrats or American Marxists.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

NOoooooooo....but I try to understand cause and effect in all things. Atleast in most instances, something can be learned to avoid creating the same mistakes or Evil in this case.

Two, I fucking hate manipulative people spinning BS about history trying to push an agenda---these assholes must be stopped and corrected immediately.

Slavery has been mistaught for generations now---------It is now being used to beat whites into submission as the druggies and globalist try to seize power and enslave this one race as a means to enslave the entire world.

Cause and effect has nothing to do with it, you're just referring to unethical justification and making exceptions to what is right and ethical in order for them to achieve the goals they desired. Ethics don't really change, they involve doing the right thing all of the time, not conditionally as in "well it depends on ..." .

Things like ethics and wrong versus right as opposed to legal versus illegal, don't get a pass as times go by and people learn just how fucked up they and their ancestors were.

It is one thing to not appreciate people attempting to hold a person responsible for things you have not done, and I can speak of this from first hand experience when every time I come on this message board, the white racists on this site attribute to me and other black posters here as well, a litany of false characteristics and attributes simply due to our race, while denying and lamenting the things that members of your race have done to us, then and are continuing to do now.

So every time you make a false statement about black people and imply it's all black people or most black people when in actuality, it's a small percentage of blacks and there are far more whites still doing damage to black people because of resentment of the progress we're finally making and because of the loss of entitlement that's finally occuring that doesn't give you all pass a pass when it comes to crimes, and unethical behavior perpetutated present day ("I'm blonde and have a good job, I'm not going to jail") or just plain old garden variety white racism against blacks.

If all of the black people suddenly disappeared from the U.S. you all would be dumbfounded by all of the problems remaining for whites of a certain social-economical status as well as those above them that are just racists. Who are you going to blame all your problem on then?

 

[DudleySmith]

Oh stop it....communist trolls trying to spread shit. The slaves here in america did not starve like the european serfs-------they were also given better medical care than most american free person received.

Oh stop with the stupid....You babbling nonsense.

Slavery started in the US because there was an extreme shortage of workers for one---so they felt it was necessary to enslave even though they did not normally support enslaving others. In order to rectify this conflict "their need" for workers with the immorality of slavery, they argued that enslaving non-christians was the christian thing to do in order to convert the heathens to christianity. They did not set out to be cruel--------they wanted workers to make money and they wanted their new forced workers to convert so they often tried the carrot method of conversion with the slaves.

SLAVES were quite valuable----so african slaves were often treated far better than indentured white servants as evidence by GRAVES from that time. Slaves were well fed and far less abused than the european serf indentured servants. This is historic FACT, not manipulative bs that you are posting.

Yes. One thing 1960's radical Democrat historians like Kolchin never do is compare slave conditions to so-called 'free white labor' in the South, particularly Irish and German laborers . For that one has to read contemporary eyewitness reports from such peopleas the noted architect and abolitionist Fredrick Law Omstead, who kept a diary of his trip to Texas through the South and made note of who was doing the shitty dangerous work, and who were just buried where they dropped dead and covered over while working on the levees along the Mississippi and the surrounding swamps, and also on the cotton boats, handling and tossing 320 pound bales of cotton under dangerous conditions. They avoid real context like the plague, for obvious reasons.

 

[DudleySmith]

If all of the black people suddenly disappeared from the U.S.

Crime rates, especially violent crime would plunge to the lowest levels in the world, education levels would skyrocket, teenage pregnancies would drop significantly, as would abortions, entire sections of major cities would become habitable again. Thanks for asking.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

Crime rates, especially violent crime would plunge to the lowest levels in the world, education levels would skyrocket, teenage pregnancies would drop significantly, as would abortions, entire sections of major cities would become habitable again. Thanks for asking.

Well it's obvious that the literacy rates wouldn't go up with your help since that portion of my paragraph wasn't a question dumbass

 

[DudleySmith]

Well it's obvious that the literacy rates wouldn't go up with your help since that portion of my paragraph wasn't a question dumbass

Sure it was; it was about who should get reparations first, like all your posts are about hoping to get tards behind giving you lots of cash. It's all you can dream about.

Sucks it turns out to be the Irish and Germans are first in line according to your rationalizations , doesn't it? lol

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

Sure it was; it was about who should get reparations first. like all your other posts hoping to get tards behind giving you lots of cash.

Sucks it turns out to be the Irish and Germans are first in line according to your rationalizations , doesn't it? lol

You know I don't usually call people stupid because everyone is special in their own way <rolling eyes> but you certainly are one that takes the cake.

I'm not doing anything at the moment but counting down time so I'll play.

1. Reparations are not mentioned in this thread or my response so you must be hallucinating if you're seeing things that simply aren't there
2. I think you're confused on who is on who's side but that tends to be the case with people who are as woefully ignorant as those such as yourself.
3. Words have meanings and not everything are synonyms. The Germans and Irish people are white and as you very well know the black people who are the subject of this OP are of African descent. The white people who served as indentured servants whom you are attempting to compare to the black people who were subjected to a brutal form of slavery known as chattel slavery which placed them on about the same level as the livestock of the plantations could eventually buy their freedom, while the status of slavery for blacks was inherited from the parents of the newborns. Even those that were fathered by the plantation owners or other white men.

Reparations for people of African descent has nothing to do with people who were able to eventually buy their way out of captivity. They are not ahead of us in terms of reparations for the chattel slavery and it's aftermath of Jim Crow and black codes, separate but equal, because once again they are not the same thing because they were unaffected by those laws simply because they are WHITE and NOT BLACK. Damn you're stupid.

But as long as we're up against people like you who haven't a clue what they're talking about, it just makes our job easier because as I said, getting rid of us, doesn't solve any of your problems even if there were no repercussions for you all having made that happen.

 

[Man of Ethics]

Crime rates, especially violent crime would plunge to the lowest levels in the world, education levels would skyrocket, teenage pregnancies would drop significantly, as would abortions, entire sections of major cities would become habitable again. Thanks for asking.

Overt Racism is Evil.

Fortunately, most Conservatives would also find your views repugnant.

Covert Racism is also very bad.

 

[Man of Ethics]

The legal right of Reparations comes from the right of inheritance. Slaves had a right to Reparations, so the money should go to their legal hairs.

Similarly, only Rockefeller's hairs can inherit his wealth.

 

[DudleySmith]

Overt Racism is Evil.

Fortunately, most Conservatives would also find your views repugnant.

Covert Racism is also very bad.

Anybody who knows the facts will have to agree with what I said, and would try and correct the real problems instead of sniveling and making up excuses for failed cultures and mindless behaviors, like you obviously hate to admit and want to keep encouraging. Even your hero Obama admitted as much, even as he failed to admit what would be the most effective change would be, since that wouldn't get him votes from the assorted vermin who make a living off of violence and misery, including a large swathe of the black middle class, who like to use their hood rats as hostages to extort bennies for themselves from the rest of society.

 

[DudleySmith]

You know I don't usually call people stupid because everyone is special in their own way <rolling eyes> but you certainly are one that takes the cake.

I'm not doing anything at the moment but counting down time so I'll play.

1. Reparations are not mentioned in this thread or my response so you must be hallucinating if you're seeing things that simply aren't there
2. I think you're confused on who is on who's side but that tends to be the case with people who are as woefully ignorant as those such as yourself.
3. Words have meanings and not everything are synonyms. The Germans and Irish people are white and as you very well know the black people who are the subject of this OP are of African descent. The white people who served as indentured servants whom you are attempting to compare to the black people who were subjected to a brutal form of slavery known as chattel slavery which placed them on about the same level as the livestock of the plantations could eventually buy their freedom, while the status of slavery for blacks was inherited from the parents of the newborns. Even those that were fathered by the plantation owners or other white men.

Reparations for people of African descent has nothing to do with people who were able to eventually buy their way out of captivity. They are not ahead of us in terms of reparations for the chattel slavery and it's aftermath of Jim Crow and black codes, separate but equal, because once again they are not the same thing because they were unaffected by those laws simply because they are WHITE and NOT BLACK. Damn you're stupid.

But as long as we're up against people like you who haven't a clue what they're talking about, it just makes our job easier because as I said, getting rid of us, doesn't solve any of your problems even if there were no repercussions for you all having made that happen.

Ah, your typical bullshit screeds and attempts at deflection, and the usual half-truths and outright fantasy. Sorry, but Jackson and Sharpton aren't going to share any of their loot with you. You'll have to refine your own con games and swindles.