Intelligent, Respectful Political Discourse, RIP

[Mac1958]

Certainly is kind of so many to jump in to illustrate my point for me.

Again.

 

[Shelzin]

The media -- both ends, of course -- is certainly a part of it. And the same thing holds true for them: Unless they are held accountable by their own viewers, readers and listeners, they're going to keep shoveling the shit. The public is clearly mal-informed.

Both ends... Absolutely. I have noticed that they take turns based on who is in office. There was a time when FOX was what I see as CNN is now.

But still, bottom line, our behaviors are our responsibility.

Behaviors yes... And I certainly believe that forum goers such as this is much more informed than your average joe. My problem is that many don't know they SHOULD hold their news accountable because it's the only news they get. That's the truth, don't watch what that other channel says because they are white supremacists or snowflakes. I think THAT'S THE BIGGEST PROBLEM HERE.

 

[eagle1462010]

Certainly is kind of so many to jump in to illustrate my point for me.

Again.

How many times over the years have I told you to duck if you want to stand in no mans land.

My points still stand.

 

[WelfareQueen]

The violence in America right now in many major cities is overwhelmingly coming from the far left. That is not even a debatable point. But idiot Dims in the media and Congress say don't believe your eyes, believe us.

Nobody is buying that shit. 76% of Americans are saying the violent protest are out of hand. The 24% not admitting it are liars or anarchists.

So why have you guys changed the subject from a decay in our political discourse, which has been a decades-long process, to the violence we have been seeing over the last few weeks?

Okay, I'm just kidding, I know why. It's because you guys have no idea how to have a rational, honest, intelligent conversation about complicated issues.

Mac & Cheese saying people aren't nice enough in their political discourse. Pot meet kettle. Read your last sentence. Is that what you're talking about?

The massive hypocrisy is duly noted.

Indeed. That sentence is as vile, hateful, ugly and vulgar as anything you'll see here.

I'm pleased that you feel you have to stretch that far to make a "point".

Be what you are. I'm certainly not trying to change people like you.

I am intellectually honest. I have no problem conceding a valid point. You were the same imho. I enjoyed having discussions with you.

That is gone in my opinion. Many in this thread have told you the same. They were not being unkind to you. I am not being unkind to you. It is an honest opinion given to you by people who held you in some regard.

When you are told this your general response is condescending or very snarky or flatly dismissive. You don't have to agree with anyone, but your discourse has changed. If you want more civil discourse maybe you can start with that like you use to do. You might be surprised how people responded back.

 

[CowboyTed]

Hillary Clinton had an approval rating of 65% when she left office in 2013. That was the most popular national politician in the country.

She wasn't in office.

Yet by 2016 she was the most hated woman in America. Thins was woman who did next to nothing wrong. The email issue was bullshit and was regularly done in different formats before she arrived.

You ask why politics has got so polarising you have to look at one side. Look at the attempts at Biden, Biden talks like an adult. He tries to explain things like an adult. They are complex topics which involve complex exlainations.

Trump isn't the cause of the problems but actual symptom. The one thing lucky and unlucky, he is incompetent, the bad part is 150k+ Americans dead, good thing is he isn't smart enough to destroy the democracy...

Trump Administration has just been accused from a credible source of having a national plan for COVID put together by the CDC under Kushner and have it selved because they thought only democratic states were affected. COVID could have been severely curtailed if a national plan like Europe was put in place. How is that going to play out...

Trump Scrapped Jared Kushner’s COVID Plan Because It Wouldn’t Help Trump

For months since the coronavirus pandemic reached the United States, the Trump administration’s ignorance and obvious lack of preparedness have been called into question. But a new investigation shows something even more sinister going on behind the scenes. According to new reporting by Vanity...

news.yahoo.com

Congress should have hearings immediately...

 

[Shelzin]

Hillary Clinton had an approval rating of 65% when she left office in 2013. That was the most popular national politician in the country.

She wasn't in office.

Yet by 2016 she was the most hated woman in America. Thins was woman who did next to nothing wrong. The email issue was bullshit and was regularly done in different formats before she arrived.

You ask why politics has got so polarising you have to look at one side. Look at the attempts at Biden, Biden talks like an adult. He tries to explain things like an adult. They are complex topics which involve complex exlainations.

Trump isn't the cause of the problems but actual symptom. The one thing lucky and unlucky, he is incompetent, the bad part is 150k+ Americans dead, good thing is he isn't smart enough to destroy the democracy...

Trump Administration has just been accused from a credible source of having a national plan for COVID put together by the CDC under Kushner and have it selved because they thought only democratic states were affected. COVID could have been severely curtailed if a national plan like Europe was put in place. How is that going to play out...

Trump Scrapped Jared Kushner’s COVID Plan Because It Wouldn’t Help Trump

For months since the coronavirus pandemic reached the United States, the Trump administration’s ignorance and obvious lack of preparedness have been called into question. But a new investigation shows something even more sinister going on behind the scenes. According to new reporting by Vanity...

news.yahoo.com

Congress should have hearings immediately...

Not sure where you think you are... But this was the wrong thread.

 

[Mac1958]

Certainly is kind of so many to jump in to illustrate my point for me.

Again.

How many times over the years have I told you to duck if you want to stand in no mans land.

My points still stand.

My side of the fence is clear: I'm against ideological fundamentalism. Nutters.

I can't help the fact that this is too complicated for you.

 

[Mac1958]

The violence in America right now in many major cities is overwhelmingly coming from the far left. That is not even a debatable point. But idiot Dims in the media and Congress say don't believe your eyes, believe us.

Nobody is buying that shit. 76% of Americans are saying the violent protest are out of hand. The 24% not admitting it are liars or anarchists.

So why have you guys changed the subject from a decay in our political discourse, which has been a decades-long process, to the violence we have been seeing over the last few weeks?

Okay, I'm just kidding, I know why. It's because you guys have no idea how to have a rational, honest, intelligent conversation about complicated issues.

Mac & Cheese saying people aren't nice enough in their political discourse. Pot meet kettle. Read your last sentence. Is that what you're talking about?

The massive hypocrisy is duly noted.

Indeed. That sentence is as vile, hateful, ugly and vulgar as anything you'll see here.

I'm pleased that you feel you have to stretch that far to make a "point".

Be what you are. I'm certainly not trying to change people like you.

I am intellectually honest. I have no problem conceding a valid point. You were the same imho. I enjoyed having discussions with you.

That is gone in my opinion. Many in this thread have told you the same. They were not being unkind to you. I am not being unkind to you. It is an honest opinion given to you by people who held you in some regard.

When you are told this your general response is condescending or very snarky or flatly dismissive. You don't have to agree with anyone, but your discourse has changed. If you want more civil discourse maybe you can start with that like you use to do. You might be surprised how people responded back.

Sure, back when Obama was in office and you agreed with my criticisms, all was well and Mac was reasonable. The Regressive Lefties concluded I was a fraud and actually a hardcore right winger. Now Trump is in office and I have different criticisms, so suddenly everything about me changes. I'm a big ol' commie Hitler Nazi Marxist now.

Meanwhile, none of my positions on the issues have changed.

You guys somehow don't see how obvious, and comical, this is.

 

[j-mac]

Yikes, stumbled on to this discussion between two guys from opposite ends of the political spectrum, William F. Buckley and Noam Chomsky.

Intelligent, respectful, stimulating, thoughtful disagreement.

So what happened to us? Aside from, "it's all the other tribe's fault"?

Need a mirror?

 

[JoeB131]

The Left is going what each wing does when its side is doing stupid things: It's refusing to address it honestly or effectively. It's placing its base over what's best for the city or state or country. And as I've said a zillion times, when we refuse to hold our side accountable for its actions, all we're REALLY doing is enabling MORE of them.

Oh, Stormy, we know what you want in life is two sell-out corporate parties that don't upset Wall Street. The problem is, the rank and file of both parties have decided they really don't care what the markets want.

To drag this back to the point of the thread, it's essentially impossible to effectively address the problems we face when neither end is willing to honestly look in the mirror. The mayors in the cities with violence have clearly taken sides, and it's up to the Left to hold them accountable. I'm not seeing much of that, if anything.

Quite the contrary, the Mayors of the big cities were the ones who refused to do anything about their thug cops for years. Now that the shit has truly hit the fan, it's not just the Mayors who are appeasing the mob, it's the big corporations you love so much. It's the NFL and other Sports leagues that are just fine with kneeling now, just don't break my stuff. It's fucking Amazon telling people to donate to BLM and other groups.

 

[Mac1958]

Yikes, stumbled on to this discussion between two guys from opposite ends of the political spectrum, William F. Buckley and Noam Chomsky.

Intelligent, respectful, stimulating, thoughtful disagreement.

So what happened to us? Aside from, "it's all the other tribe's fault"?

Need a mirror?

You're certainly free to point out my offending posts.

Please quote me, though. You guys aren't very good at that.

 

[JoeB131]

Sure, back when Obama was in office and you agreed with my criticisms, all was well and Mac was reasonable. The Regressive Lefties concluded I was a fraud and actually a hardcore right winger. Now Trump is in office and I have different criticisms, so suddenly everything about me changes. I'm a big ol' commie Hitler Nazi Marxist now.

Meanwhile, none of my positions on the issues have changed.

You guys somehow don't see how obvious, and comical, this is.

We've already got you pegged. What you want are two nice Political Parties that suck up to Wall Street and put the interests of the Investor Class over the interests of the Working Class. The problem is, the rank and file of BOTH parties have kind of decided that they really don't care about that. So what your criticism is of the "Great Unwashed".

Trump and Biden are both kind of tools of Wall Street, but they have to get people to come out and vote for them, and nobody goes out and votes on "Where is the Dow at today?"

 

[JoeB131]

The media -- both ends, of course -- is certainly a part of it. And the same thing holds true for them: Unless they are held accountable by their own viewers, readers and listeners, they're going to keep shoveling the shit. The public is clearly mal-informed.

But still, bottom line, our behaviors are our responsibility.

Mitlaufer Mac, never ceases to be wrong. I see why he hides from me like a coward.

The problem with "the Media" is with you beloved Wall Street Types.

It used to be, the big networks ran their News Divisions as a public service. They weren't supposed to make a profit. It was the job of the Beverly Hillbillies to sell Corn Flakes, the News was there to keep people informed.

Then it was decided that news should be entertainment. News divisions fired correspondents around the world actually getting the stories, which is why we tend to be so misinformed about what is going on outside our borders, and invested that money into on-air newsreaders who appealed to a certain audience.

 

[22lcidw]

The media -- both ends, of course -- is certainly a part of it. And the same thing holds true for them: Unless they are held accountable by their own viewers, readers and listeners, they're going to keep shoveling the shit. The public is clearly mal-informed.

Both ends... Absolutely. I have noticed that they take turns based on who is in office. There was a time when FOX was what I see as CNN is now.

But still, bottom line, our behaviors are our responsibility.

Behaviors yes... And I certainly believe that forum goers such as this is much more informed than your average joe. My problem is that many don't know they SHOULD hold their news accountable because it's the only news they get. That's the truth, don't watch what that other channel says because they are white supremacists or snowflakes. I think THAT'S THE BIGGEST PROBLEM HERE.

FOX is allowed to be the pressure release for Non Progs by the globalists. Most other modern TV production is Prog agenda motivated.

 

[dannyboys]

Yikes, stumbled on to this discussion between two guys from opposite ends of the political spectrum, William F. Buckley and Noam Chomsky.

Intelligent, respectful, stimulating, thoughtful disagreement.

So what happened to us? Aside from, "it's all the other tribe's fault"?

How many righties have been shouting down, charging stages with intent of assault, rioting, and/or cancelling a single leftist speaking anywhere?

Name one...I fucking defy you.

Oh c'mon professor!....Surely you can find one single example of the right acting like this, when people they disagree with are speaking!

Can't think of any offhand (although admittedly I'm not really trying).

The illiberal, authoritarian Regressive Left is much worse in this particular area.

I'm really not interested in another asymmetrical conversation. I'm bored to tears with them.

Yet YOU constantly attempt to start said 'convervations'.
You're my former wife after she had consumed a bottle of cooking sherry when she was 'riding the cotton pony'' With you everyday is like that.

 

[JoeB131]

Yet YOU constantly attempt to start said 'convervations'.
You're my former wife after she had consumed a bottle of cooking sherry when she was 'riding the cotton pony'' With you everyday is like that.

You are my new hero!!!

Too funny, describes Mac perfectly. Mac is a Karen, and he'd like to speak with the Manager.

 

[dannyboys]

Hillary Clinton had an approval rating of 65% when she left office in 2013. That was the most popular national politician in the country.

She wasn't in office.

Yet by 2016 she was the most hated woman in America. Thins was woman who did next to nothing wrong. The email issue was bullshit and was regularly done in different formats before she arrived.

You ask why politics has got so polarising you have to look at one side. Look at the attempts at Biden, Biden talks like an adult. He tries to explain things like an adult. They are complex topics which involve complex exlainations.

Trump isn't the cause of the problems but actual symptom. The one thing lucky and unlucky, he is incompetent, the bad part is 150k+ Americans dead, good thing is he isn't smart enough to destroy the democracy...

Trump Administration has just been accused from a credible source of having a national plan for COVID put together by the CDC under Kushner and have it selved because they thought only democratic states were affected. COVID could have been severely curtailed if a national plan like Europe was put in place. How is that going to play out...

Trump Scrapped Jared Kushner’s COVID Plan Because It Wouldn’t Help Trump

For months since the coronavirus pandemic reached the United States, the Trump administration’s ignorance and obvious lack of preparedness have been called into question. But a new investigation shows something even more sinister going on behind the scenes. According to new reporting by Vanity...

news.yahoo.com

Congress should have hearings immediately...

Who do you want as chairman? Schiff/Nadler/Waters/Johnson/? I know. Let's give Fart-head Swalwell a chance. LOL!

 

[Mac1958]

Yikes, stumbled on to this discussion between two guys from opposite ends of the political spectrum, William F. Buckley and Noam Chomsky.

Intelligent, respectful, stimulating, thoughtful disagreement.

So what happened to us? Aside from, "it's all the other tribe's fault"?

How many righties have been shouting down, charging stages with intent of assault, rioting, and/or cancelling a single leftist speaking anywhere?

Name one...I fucking defy you.

Oh c'mon professor!....Surely you can find one single example of the right acting like this, when people they disagree with are speaking!

Can't think of any offhand (although admittedly I'm not really trying).

The illiberal, authoritarian Regressive Left is much worse in this particular area.

I'm really not interested in another asymmetrical conversation. I'm bored to tears with them.

Yet YOU constantly attempt to start said 'convervations'.
You're my former wife after she had consumed a bottle of cooking sherry when she was 'riding the cotton pony'' With you everyday is like that.

Gosh, that's terrible!

 

[L.K.Eder]

i watched the video. if that was the base line for respectful political discourse, then it is no wonder you are in trouble.

was chomsky allowed to finish one sentence or thought?

 

[WelfareQueen]

The violence in America right now in many major cities is overwhelmingly coming from the far left. That is not even a debatable point. But idiot Dims in the media and Congress say don't believe your eyes, believe us.

Nobody is buying that shit. 76% of Americans are saying the violent protest are out of hand. The 24% not admitting it are liars or anarchists.

So why have you guys changed the subject from a decay in our political discourse, which has been a decades-long process, to the violence we have been seeing over the last few weeks?

Okay, I'm just kidding, I know why. It's because you guys have no idea how to have a rational, honest, intelligent conversation about complicated issues.

Mac & Cheese saying people aren't nice enough in their political discourse. Pot meet kettle. Read your last sentence. Is that what you're talking about?

The massive hypocrisy is duly noted.

Indeed. That sentence is as vile, hateful, ugly and vulgar as anything you'll see here.

I'm pleased that you feel you have to stretch that far to make a "point".

Be what you are. I'm certainly not trying to change people like you.

I am intellectually honest. I have no problem conceding a valid point. You were the same imho. I enjoyed having discussions with you.

That is gone in my opinion. Many in this thread have told you the same. They were not being unkind to you. I am not being unkind to you. It is an honest opinion given to you by people who held you in some regard.

When you are told this your general response is condescending or very snarky or flatly dismissive. You don't have to agree with anyone, but your discourse has changed. If you want more civil discourse maybe you can start with that like you use to do. You might be surprised how people responded back.

Sure, back when Obama was in office and you agreed with my criticisms, all was well and Mac was reasonable. The Regressive Lefties concluded I was a fraud and actually a hardcore right winger. Now Trump is in office and I have different criticisms, so suddenly everything about me changes. I'm a big ol' commie Hitler Nazi Marxist now.

Meanwhile, none of my positions on the issues have changed.

You guys somehow don't see how obvious, and comical, this is.

You're right. It's everyone else's fault. Glad I helped.