I will not Bow!

[RoccoR]

Victory67, et al,

I stand corrected. It appears that I was wrong.

Israel may occupy the Golan Heights, but they made no attempt to annex the territory. The present situation is covered by the Disengagement Agreement with the United Nations Disengagement Observer Force (UNDOF) to maintain the cease-fire along the lines annotated on UN Map H213/10/1974; attached via addendum S/11302/Add.3 9 July 1974; as implementation by the Security Council S/RES/338 22 October 1973.

I fail to see that either allegation is with foundation. The territory is neither annexed as alleged; or, illegally controlled as alleged. Every aspect has been approved under the express agreement with the Government of Syria.

Most Respectfully,
R

Israel annexed the Golan Heights in 1981.

(COMMENT)

It appears that neither the UN Security Council Resolution 497 or the 1999 verbal agreements were placed into effect.

My apologies. I was wrong.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[toastman]

Wow, that's a lie I never heard before.

The Arabs expelled the Jews from the ME because of the State of Israel coming into existence.
What is it with anti - Zionists and distorting history?

And many of the Jews in the Muslim world were Zionists and supported Israel's birth.

aka a hostile population deserving of expulsion.

Just as [MENTION=20204]Kondor3[/MENTION] stated.

Logic knows no borders, right?

That doesn't make them hostile lol !!

The comparison you made is extremely off !

 

[Victory67]

Victory67, et al,

I stand corrected. It appears that I was wrong. My apologies. I was wrong.

Most Respectfully,
R

You have nothing to apologize for.

 

[Victory67]

Wow, that's a lie I never heard before.

The Arabs expelled the Jews from the ME because of the State of Israel coming into existence.
What is it with anti - Zionists and distorting history?

And many of the Jews in the Muslim world were Zionists and supported Israel's birth.

aka a hostile population deserving of expulsion.

Just as [MENTION=20204]Kondor3[/MENTION] stated.

Logic knows no borders, right?

That doesn't make them hostile lol !!

The comparison you made is extremely off !

Supporting an enemy makes them hostile.

 

[toastman]

And many of the Jews in the Muslim world were Zionists and supported Israel's birth.

aka a hostile population deserving of expulsion.

Just as [MENTION=20204]Kondor3[/MENTION] stated.

Logic knows no borders, right?

That doesn't make them hostile lol !!

The comparison you made is extremely off !

Supporting an enemy makes them hostile.

So you're saying its ok to expel the hostile population?

 

[Victory67]

So you're saying its ok to expel the hostile population?

[MENTION=20204]Kondor3[/MENTION] says its ok. No one here chooses to condemn him. So I guess I should just agree with him.

I could bring up another example of a "hostile population" being expelled but I don't think we are ready for that just yet.

 

[aris2chat]

Did they ever get around to annexing the West Bank, or are they just occupying it?

Israel has annexed 27 square miles of the West Bank.

Given that the West Bank is 2270 square miles in size - at a minimum - this represents something akin to 1.2% or less of the total land area.

1.2% ???!!!

Friggin' REALLY ???!!!!

Puh-leeze.

"...If it wasn't for the First Intifada they would have annexed all the rest."

It's gonna happen anyway... in the post-Intifada II period, or post Intifada IV, V, VI, VII or whatever... it's gonna happen... and probably before their Arab neighbors (Egypt, Iraq, Syria, etc.) get their shit back together and are once again capable of posing a threat. Might as well avoid the Holiday Rush and get it over with sooner rather than later.

and the PA has already agreed in principle to an equal land trade for the settlements, but even expansion within the settlements is turned into a land theft when there is no additional land involved. Settlements are in no way an issue to hindering a peace agreement except that the palestinians don't want to agree to any peace and will use any and every excuse to walk, or rather run, away from the negotiation table.

 

[Victory67]

and the PA has already agreed in principle to an equal land trade for the settlements, but even expansion within the settlements is turned into a land theft when there is no additional land involved. Settlements are in no way an issue to hindering a peace agreement except that the palestinians don't want to agree to any peace and will use any and every excuse to walk, or rather run, away from the negotiation table.

That's only because you don't understand that many of the settlements are illegal.

Why should the PA accept Israel being able to keep illegal settlements?

The Israelis still refuse to offer a 1 to 1 exchange of land in order to keep settlements.

They think for every square mile of land Israel keeps, Palestine should get 1/3 of the land area in Israel. With such an unfair mindset how can there be peace?

 

[Sally]

and the PA has already agreed in principle to an equal land trade for the settlements, but even expansion within the settlements is turned into a land theft when there is no additional land involved. Settlements are in no way an issue to hindering a peace agreement except that the palestinians don't want to agree to any peace and will use any and every excuse to walk, or rather run, away from the negotiation table.

That's only because you don't understand that many of the settlements are illegal.

Why should the PA accept Israel being able to keep illegal settlements?

The Israelis still refuse to offer a 1 to 1 exchange of land in order to keep settlements.

They think for every square mile of land Israel keeps, Palestine should get 1/3 of the land area in Israel. With such an unfair mindset how can there be peace?

I wonder how you can tell us how there can ever be peace when in the Hamas and Fatah Charters, they still state their purpose is to destroy Israel.

 

[Victory67]

I wonder how you can tell us how there can ever be peace when in the Hamas and Fatah Charters, they still state their purpose is to destroy Israel.

The PLO amended their charter more than a decade ago.

 

[Sally]

I wonder how you can tell us how there can ever be peace when in the Hamas and Fatah Charters, they still state their purpose is to destroy Israel.

The PLO amended their charter more than a decade ago.

Why don't you prove it to us.

 

[Victory67]

I wonder how you can tell us how there can ever be peace when in the Hamas and Fatah Charters, they still state their purpose is to destroy Israel.

The PLO amended their charter more than a decade ago.

Why don't you prove it to us.

Like President Clinton, Israel and the Likud party now formally agreed that the objectionable clauses of the charter had been abrogated, in official statements and statements by Prime Minister Netanyahu, Foreign Minister Sharon, Defense Minister Mordechai and Trade and Industry Minister Sharansky.[13][14][15][16] With official Israeli objections to the Charter disappearing henceforward from lists of Palestinian violations of agreements,[17] the international legal controversy ended.

Palestinian National Covenant - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


The draft of the Constitution of the State of Palestine makes no mention of destroying Israel.

http://www.pcpsr.org/domestic/2001/conste1.html

 

[Sally]

The PLO amended their charter more than a decade ago.

Why don't you prove it to us.

Like President Clinton, Israel and the Likud party now formally agreed that the objectionable clauses of the charter had been abrogated, in official statements and statements by Prime Minister Netanyahu, Foreign Minister Sharon, Defense Minister Mordechai and Trade and Industry Minister Sharansky.[13][14][15][16] With official Israeli objections to the Charter disappearing henceforward from lists of Palestinian violations of agreements,[17] the international legal controversy ended.

Palestinian National Covenant - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


The draft of the Constitution of the State of Palestine makes no mention of destroying Israel.

Palestinian Constitutition - First Part

I can imagine that even if the charter were changed, those Palestinians doing the changing would be killed by other Palestinians, the same way if some Palestinians signed a peace agreement with Israel, they would be killed. Say, since you appear to have mucho time on your hands, why don't you go over there and convince your good friends to change it? You can also tell them to stop making those cartoons teaching the children to hate the Jews and how glorious it is to be a Shaheed if you take out some Jews with you.

The PLO Charter Amendment That Never Was - Op-Eds - Israel National News

 

[Victory67]

I can imagine that even if the charter were changed, those Palestinians doing the changing would be killed by other Palestinians, the same way if some Palestinians signed a peace agreement with Israel, they would be killed. Say, since you appear to have mucho time on your hands, why don't you go over there and convince your good friends to change it? You can also tell them to stop making those cartoons teaching the children to hate the Jews and how glorious it is to be a Shaheed if you take out some Jews with you.

The PLO Charter Amendment That Never Was - Op-Eds - Israel National News

You asked me for evidence that the Charter was amended only to then say that the Charter was never amended after I give you evidence? What a waste of time you are.

 

[Sally]

I very rarely read Wikipedia because I know things can be put in there that people want to put in. I would rather rely on a regular encyclopedia. However, you certainly must be a waste of time since you informed the readers that the charter was changed. Meanwhile, with all your postings with the same old stuff that readers have seen for years, you seem like an over zealous madrassa student who couldn't care about your brothers are doing in many spots in the world against innocent people but are just focused on israel because of the Jews. Carry on, but please be aware that most readers here are intelligent and can see right through you.

 

[aris2chat]

and the PA has already agreed in principle to an equal land trade for the settlements, but even expansion within the settlements is turned into a land theft when there is no additional land involved. Settlements are in no way an issue to hindering a peace agreement except that the palestinians don't want to agree to any peace and will use any and every excuse to walk, or rather run, away from the negotiation table.

That's only because you don't understand that many of the settlements are illegal.

Why should the PA accept Israel being able to keep illegal settlements?

The Israelis still refuse to offer a 1 to 1 exchange of land in order to keep settlements.

They think for every square mile of land Israel keeps, Palestine should get 1/3 of the land area in Israel. With such an unfair mindset how can there be peace?

Problem is arabs don't want to be part of any land swap. They want to remain Israelis, they don't want to be palestinians. Jews are willing to be palestinians in the WB but Abbas says "no jews" even through jews lived in all areas of the palestine and the middle east long before the arabs. Even according to Islam, jews did not steal the land but told by god to go live there as a nation. Arabs did not show up till the 7th Century AD with the Islamic invasion after the death of Mohammed.

 

[Victory67]

Problem is arabs don't want to be part of any land swap. They want to remain Israelis, they don't want to be palestinians. Jews are willing to be palestinians in the WB but Abbas says "no jews" even through jews lived in all areas of the palestine and the middle east long before the arabs. Even according to Islam, jews did not steal the land but told by god to go live there as a nation. Arabs did not show up till the 7th Century AD with the Islamic invasion after the death of Mohammed.

Which Jewish settlers are willing to become Palestinian citizens?

Israel should give Palestine uninhabited land to swap for settlement land.

Using Israeli land with hundreds of thousands of Arabs on it to swap without their consent, is a crime against humanity.

 

[Sally]

Problem is arabs don't want to be part of any land swap. They want to remain Israelis, they don't want to be palestinians. Jews are willing to be palestinians in the WB but Abbas says "no jews" even through jews lived in all areas of the palestine and the middle east long before the arabs. Even according to Islam, jews did not steal the land but told by god to go live there as a nation. Arabs did not show up till the 7th Century AD with the Islamic invasion after the death of Mohammed.

Which Jewish settlers are willing to become Palestinian citizens?

Israel should give Palestine uninhabited land to swap for settlement land.

Using Israeli land with hundreds of thousands of Arabs on it to swap without their consent, is a crime against humanity.

I wonder if a big stink was made when lines of counries were changed in Europe. Were the people living there asked if they didn't mind being part of another country from one they thought they were citizens of. Maybe Victory, that astute scholar of history, can tell us this. By the way, whether or not all of the settlers are willing to become Palestinian citizens, Abbas has claimed that the area will be Jew free.

 

[aris2chat]

Problem is arabs don't want to be part of any land swap. They want to remain Israelis, they don't want to be palestinians. Jews are willing to be palestinians in the WB but Abbas says "no jews" even through jews lived in all areas of the palestine and the middle east long before the arabs. Even according to Islam, jews did not steal the land but told by god to go live there as a nation. Arabs did not show up till the 7th Century AD with the Islamic invasion after the death of Mohammed.

Which Jewish settlers are willing to become Palestinian citizens?

Israel should give Palestine uninhabited land to swap for settlement land.

Using Israeli land with hundreds of thousands of Arabs on it to swap without their consent, is a crime against humanity.

So Israel gives the palestinians desert. Now jews might have made the desert bloom but do you think palestinians can do the same? Or are willing to try? They can't even make their own economy bloom with all the money given to them by the world.

Jews develope the land, vacated it and turn it over to palestinians.... that worked so well in gaza the palestinians destroyed everything that was had been touched by jewish hands, and still wage constant war on Israel because they won't accept Israel has a right to exist.

If even Jordan does not want palestinians in control of the jordan valley, it does not show much faith in the palestinians/former jordanians.

 

[Victory67]

So Israel gives the palestinians desert. Now jews might have made the desert bloom but do you think palestinians can do the same? Or are willing to try? They can't even make their own economy bloom with all the money given to them by the world.

Jews develope the land, vacated it and turn it over to palestinians.... that worked so well in gaza the palestinians destroyed everything that was had been touched by jewish hands, and still wage constant war on Israel because they won't accept Israel has a right to exist.

If even Jordan does not want palestinians in control of the jordan valley, it does not show much faith in the palestinians/former jordanians.

So the only options are parts of northern Israel with hundreds of thousands of Arabs, or parts of the Negev desert?

Sounds like you want to make an offer the Palestinians must refuse.



How about instead Israel offers Palestine a 1 to 1 swap, settlement land for uninhabited Israeli land that's borders the West Bank.

Israel could just give Palestine a 5 mile wide extension of the West Bank border in the northern half.