i can see this turning ugly

[eagleseven]

So there are no Muslim counselors? I had no idea.

Not graduating from that program, no.

 

[chanel]

I agree. But how would they know that prior to employment? If their religion states that homosexuality is a sin and they don't deny that in grad. school, would they be expelled? Methinks not.

 

[Immanuel]

you need to stop with the victim card, no one is excluding christians

Can you prove that? Can you prove that the school graduates Christians and does not "re-educate" them into their "world view"?

I think based on the articles about this instance you are going to be hard pressed to do so.

Immie

I am going it solely based on the article. The girl in question beliefs do not align with all christians, especially the part about gay being a choice. many christians could go to that school and easily go along with what the school believes. nothing they believe is that controversial really

I don't see where it states that Christians have been allowed to graduate from this school without completely adopting the views of the school.

I do, however, see this from her:

Keeton told faculty members, "I can’t alter my biblical beliefs, and I will not affirm the morality of those behaviors in a counseling situation."

But she stressed, "I understand the need to reflect clients’ goals and to allow them to work toward their own solutions, and I know I can do that."

She believes that she can do the job regardless of her point of view. Without evidence to the contrary, I do not think the school should interfere with her career goals nor do I believe they have the right to indoctrinate her.

Immie

 

[chanel]

So there are no Muslim counselors? I had no idea.

Not graduating from that program, no.

It's a state school. You mean to tell me there isn't one Muslim counselor in the entire state of GA? I had no idea.

 

[eagleseven]

I agree. But how would they know that prior to employment? If their religion states that homosexuality is a sin and they don't deny that in grad. school, would they be expelled? Methinks not.

If they publicly argued against the teachings of the professors, they would be.

No Muslims graduated from my Microbiology program, simply because they refused to accept the teachings in half of the classes. The only Baptist (whom I am friends with) simply wrote what the professors were expecting to see, only disagreeing with evolution privately (with friends, such as myself).

Granted, we all teased him about it, but since he didn't make a scene about his beliefs, the professors did not care.

 

[Immanuel]

And blu's a liar.

Prove that her degree can only be awarded if she foreswears her beliefs and embraces homosexuality as something that is hardwired.

Being wrong does not make one a liar.

Immie

 

[eagleseven]

It's a state school. You mean to tell me there isn't one Muslim counselor in the entire state of GA?

No.

I mean to tell you that no Muslims graduated from this specific program, at this specific school.

 

[blu]

And blu's a liar.

Prove that her degree can only be awarded if she foreswears her beliefs and embraces homosexuality as something that is hardwired.

Being wrong does not make one a liar.

Immie

I guess there is a confusion of terms here. the link I gave spcially showed the aca saying those that teach that being gay is reversible are not practicing under their guidelines or as a professional

 

[eagleseven]

She believes that she can do the job regardless of her point of view. Without evidence to the contrary, I do not think the school should interfere with her career goals nor do I believe they have the right to indoctrinate her.

She is not the one who confers degrees, nor is she the one who confers licenses.

If simply stating something made it so, I would be a MD/PhD/MBA/MFA.

 

[Immanuel]

yes thats why all of this odd and seems to me like she eventually wanted to cause problems. she knew she was going to a secular school where her religious beliefes who be at odds with the guidelines there and she spent years there anyway.

Exactly. I know plenty of people who got degrees, despite their contrarian beliefs, by simply keeping their mouths shut. They get their degrees, go on with their lives, and everyone is happy.

This woman was being a real-life troll, repeatedly making big scenes, and so the admins banned her. Now she's suing them, rather like PI.

Don't you find it kind of sad that you are espousing people not being true to themselves or their beliefs in an institution of higher learning?

I commend her for being willing to speak her mind in an obviously hostile environment.

Immie

 

[theDoctorisIn]

I agree. But how would they know that prior to employment? If their religion states that homosexuality is a sin and they don't deny that in grad. school, would they be expelled? Methinks not.

This woman isn't being kicked out because she believes that homosexuality is a crime. She can believe that as much as she likes. But she can't put that ahead of the Code of Ethics of the ACA if she wants to be a counselor.

I wouldn't be surprised if this is a publicity stunt.

 

[eagleseven]

Don't you find it kind of sad that you are espousing people not being true to themselves or their beliefs in an institution of higher learning?

I never pretended that University is something that it is not. Just like in the working world, angering your academic bosses will bite you in the butt, and faculty politics can be vicious. In fact, intra-departmental politics can make or break you in graduate school (as this woman found out).

I commend her for being willing to speak her mind in an obviously hostile environment.

How many courageous men died fighting for Communism?

She is no doubt courageous, but this is not the question at hand.

 

[Immanuel]

Because she had no idea that a liberal secular school could be so intolerant.

Then she should ask for a refund from her undergraduate institution, because they failed to teach her critical thinking skills.

Why do you say that? Are you insinuating that secular schools persecute Christians and she should have known this was going to happen?

Immie

 

[Immanuel]

The school does not set the code of ethics. The state does. It is not up to the school to decide if she is ethical or not.

It is...they would expel her if they caught her plagiarizing, for example.

That is a completely different code of ethics.

Immie

 

[Immanuel]

You will have to prove that. I do not agree.

Legally, you are required to sign a contract to enroll. If she signed without reading it, she is still legally bound by it.

I didn't "know" what beliefs I was expected to have when I graduated at the time I enrolled at my school. I highly doubt she did either.

Then your school did not have a code of ethics? Mine did, and they were quite clear about the consequences of violations.

I've seen professors fired for violations, with no press coverage whatsoever.

Again, the code of ethics at my school was in regards to conduct as a student. It had nothing to do with the ethics of my chosen field.

Immie

 

[chanel]

Ethical Standards for School Counselors

E.2. Diversity

The professional school counselor:
a. Affirms the diversity of students, staff and families.

b. Expands and develops awareness of his/her own attitudes and beliefs affecting cultural values and biases and strives to attain cultural competence.

c. Possesses knowledge and understanding about how oppression, racism, discrimination and stereotyping affects her/him personally and professionally.

d. Acquires educational, consultation and training experiences to improve awareness, knowledge, skills and effectiveness in working with diverse populations: ethnic/racial status, age, economic status, special needs, ESL or ELL, immigration status, sexual orientation, gender, gender identity/expression, family type, religious/spiritual identity and appearance.

Ethical Standards for School Counselors - American School Counselor Association

I'm sure there are plenty of graduates who have prejudices, but they probably keep their mouth shut. Don't ask; don't tell works in many situations.

FYI - Gay kids want to be treated like any other kid. Handicapped kids want the same. The hyper sensitive crowd likes to treat them like pets. Let kids be kids.

 

[AllieBaba]

Yeah, well, that's nice but I don't see anything there that makes a case for denying someone a degree based upon their belief that homosexuality is a choice.

 

[AllieBaba]

Was she getting a degree in high school counseling, btw?

 

[Immanuel]

According to the articles (granted that is from her side of the story) she has not denigrated anyone in the classroom.

Fortunately, the Christian Post is not the agency which determines the standards to which professional counselors are held...and I would very much like to see the school's side of the story from a non-religious source.

Actually, I am getting my information from two different stories.

1) the article from the OP and 2) this one:

Change views on Christianity or get out - Augusta State Univ. tells student

I too would like to see the school's side of the story, but have not had time in between posting trying to keep up to look for it. I highly doubt they can convince me they are not trying to brainwash Jennifer.

Immie

 

[AllieBaba]

I would like to see the story from a non-school source.