Zone1 How should non-Jews fix antisemitism?

[The Sage of Main Street]

Sorry you can’t comprehend that this is just YOUR religion’s teachings, and is no more or less valid than other religions.

That said, and since it’s the topic of the thread, how would YOU suggest that antisemitism be reduced? (And don’t say for Jews to abandon their religion.)

Islam Must Be Destroyed

Duped antisemite fanatics should blame some other group for what they blame the Jews for doing. They refuse to man up to clear and present tyranny and have to run away to some fantasy about Jews manipulating it all behind the scenes. That would give the Jews some supernatural power, such as would take to fake the Holocaust, but that fits in with the fantasy that Satan also has supernatural powers.

The Jews are clever in dealing with oppression from the top but may not know how to deal with it coming from the dispossessed. The Jewish Defense League is the only American group that realizes Islam must be banned from the United States. Protestants actually call the Crusades unChristian and a crime of Catholicism. Something violent also has to be done about Stormfront.

 

[flacaltenn]

Actually they are. They are labeled “self hating Jews”.

If you're talking about just getting cancelled by "your people" for political views -- that's just silly stuff. To earn the title of "self-hating Jew" you merely have to support TOLERANCE of speech and association in a free society. Even if you;re not defending "enemies of race" and ABHOR the views and actions of "jew haters" -- support for ABSOLUTE liberties and freedoms to say and mix with whom they chose can get you canceled by "extremists" of your OWN kind.

 

[flacaltenn]

Several posters have dismissed the Palestinians. That mindset is an ongoing source of antisemitism.. Funny since Arabs are semites descended from Abraham.

Topics are limited in scope, because USMB LOVES topics. So it's fine to point that out as a contributing factor to antisemitism today -- but not fine to go DEEPLY into the history or politics of how the West Bank ended up in Israel. That's a NEVER ENDING thread diversion. There's a whole SEPARATE FORUM to debate that over in Israel/Palestine forum.

 

[flacaltenn]

And conservative Jews are being driven out of synagogues via hostility is inexcusable. I even had a liberal Jew tell me you can’t be Republican and Jewish, both. (The flip side of “if you don’t vote for me, you ain’t black.) Another nasty liberal Jew sent me a joke mocking Republican Jews. And I never once said anything negative to any of them - I avoid politics like the plague when I’m around liberal Jews.

Hard to avoid when they are in your family huh? Haven't talked to my brother in about 4 years now. He quipped about "all the people Trump killed under Covid" and all got to squeak out on the phone was "Trump was already putting travel bans into effect, while all YOUR tribe was impeaching him"

CLICK -- he hung up on me. I dont reward behaviors like that. I wouldn't call him a "leftist". Just hated Trump. So THAT KIND OF HATE just buries us deeper than the ACTUAL threat value of antisemitism -- or at least EQUAL to.

We NEED TO MAKE CERTAIN that the PHRASE antisemitism is NOT OVER-used. Several social media big storms about Whoopie and others saying things that WEREN'T REALLY antisemitic, but the WOKE leftists and the ADL and other Jewish orgs JUMPED her mercilessly. I dont count those senseless Twitter feuds as the REAL antisemitic problem. EVERYONE is a tad too "touchy" these days.

We dont want accusations of antisemitism to be DEVALUED TO ZERO -- like the accusation of someone or something is racist has been,

 

[Lisa558]

Hard to avoid when they are in your family huh? Haven't talked to my brother in about 4 years now. He quipped about "all the people Trump killed under Covid" and all got to squeak out on the phone was "Trump was already putting travel bans into effect, while all YOUR tribe was impeaching him"

CLICK -- he hung up on me. I dont reward behaviors like that. I wouldn't call him a "leftist". Just hated Trump. So THAT KIND OF HATE just buries us deeper than the ACTUAL threat value of antisemitism -- or at least EQUAL to.

We NEED TO MAKE CERTAIN that the PHRASE antisemitism is NOT OVER-used. Several social media big storms about Whoopie and others saying things that WEREN'T REALLY antisemitic, but the WOKE leftists and the ADL and other Jewish orgs JUMPED her mercilessly. I dont count those senseless Twitter feuds as the REAL antisemitic problem. EVERYONE is a tad too "touchy" these days.

We dont want accusations of antisemitism to be DEVALUED TO ZERO -- like the accusation of someone or something is racist has been,

On the other hand, it’s critical that we don’t UNDERSTATE antisemitism while OVERSTATING racism. In doing so, we are sending the message that prejudice against Jews is more tolerable than racism against blacks, and I fear that is the message that is being sent by many on the left. That message, in turn, advances the idea that antisemitism is “less awful” than racism.

Take, for example, how overstated racism has been in recent years. The key example is George Floyd, when there was nothing to indicate that race was a factor at all (it wasn’t even mentioned at trial), but we also have Aunt Jemima syrup called racist, math called racist, AP classes called racist, the idea that deciding whom to admit based on merit called racist, and so forth. Our former Governor (D) even wanted to pay black teachers more than whites, and he said that anyone objecting to the race-based pay scale was racist.

Then, on the other side, you have out-and-out antisemitism that is downplayed. We had a member of the DC Council, a Democrat who is a big fan of Farrakhan, blame Jews for making it snow. He said, specifically, that the greedy Jews wanted to make money with their snow plow companies. Although some Jewish groups were appalled and wanted him to resign, we immediately had liberals jump to the antisemite‘s defense by saying he was just poorly informed, or needed to be educated. And he thus paid no real political price for advancing a blatantly antisemitic conspiracy theory, ala the Rothschilds.

But, wait….it gets better. This guy qualified and is now in the running for DC mayor. Of course, he’s an idiot and won’t win, but would this happen if a Republican council member made a horrible racist comment - not only retaining his seat but actually running for mayor?

There was another case in Philly where the president of the NAACP chapter put a disgusting anti-Jew meme on a flyer, and some Jews were calling for his resignation. (The irony of someone tasked to combat bigotry against one minority perpetrating it against Jews is pretty blatant.) Yet the liberals on the NAACP national board defended him, said in som many words that Jews were over-reacting, and he retained his seat.

The point is that there are two standards: a very low tolerance for racism, to the point that things like math is called racist, and a much higher tolerance for antisemitism, in which obvious antisemitic comments or memes are chalked up to “not the nicest thing, but let’s move past it and punish nobody.”

Those two different standards are enabling antisemitism to grow.

 

[Curried Goats]

On the other hand, it’s critical that we don’t UNDERSTATE antisemitism while OVERSTATING racism. In doing so, we are sending the message that prejudice against Jews is more tolerable than racism against blacks, and I fear that is the message that is being sent by many on the left. That message, in turn, advances the idea that antisemitism is “less awful” than racism.

Take, for example, how overstated racism has been in recent years. The key example is George Floyd, when there was nothing to indicate that race was a factor at all (it wasn’t even mentioned at trial), but we also have Aunt Jemima syrup called racist, math called racist, AP classes called racist, the idea that deciding whom to admit based on merit called racist, and so forth. Our former Governor (D) even wanted to pay black teachers more than whites, and he said that anyone objecting to the race-based pay scale was racist.

Then, on the other side, you have out-and-out antisemitism that is downplayed. We had a member of the DC Council, a Democrat who is a big fan of Farrakhan, blame Jews for making it snow. He said, specifically, that the greedy Jews wanted to make money with their snow plow companies. Although some Jewish groups were appalled and wanted him to resign, we immediately had liberals jump to the antisemite‘s defense by saying he was just poorly informed, or needed to be educated. And he thus paid no real political price for advancing a blatantly antisemitic conspiracy theory, ala the Rothschilds.

But, wait….it gets better. This guy qualified and is now in the running for DC mayor. Of course, he’s an idiot and won’t win, but would this happen if a Republican council member made a horrible racist comment - not only retaining his seat but actually running for mayor?

There was another case in Philly where the president of the NAACP chapter put a disgusting anti-Jew meme on a flyer, and some Jews were calling for his resignation. (The irony of someone tasked to combat bigotry against one minority perpetrating it against Jews is pretty blatant.) Yet the liberals on the NAACP national board defended him, said in som many words that Jews were over-reacting, and he retained his seat.

The point is that there are two standards: a very low tolerance for racism, to the point that things like math is called racist, and a much higher tolerance for antisemitism, in which obvious antisemitic comments or memes are chalked up to “not the nicest thing, but let’s move past it and punish nobody.”

Those two different standards are enabling antisemitism to grow.

The investigation in the Minneapolis police department absolutely proved race was a factor in police brutality and harassment from that department.

 

[Indeependent]

The investigation in the Minneapolis police department absolutely proved race was a factor in police brutality and harassment from that department.

The fact that a Black man was beating his wife up every night?

 

[Lisa558]

The investigation in the Minneapolis police department absolutely proved race was a factor in police brutality and harassment from that department.

You ignored my examples of some horrific antisemitism, and went right back to racism. Thanks for proving my point.

 

[Lisa558]

lisa, all you've done this thread is ignore my points, like when you tried to claim some special values Jewish people have that other minorities don't. Don't complain and cry now.

I’ve ignored your points because I’ve had you on ignore, due to your previous racist attitude toward whites and lies about what people say. I took you off because curiosity got the better of me. I’ve learned better, and back on ignore you go. Buh-bye.

P.S. Jews have succeeded despite bigotry largely because of their value of education. Sorry if stating the obvious hurts your feelings,

 

[Indeependent]

Nope. Wrong again.

I don't believe for a second that you were watching that story develop every day.
You have a habit of remembering what you want to remember and to be frank, I don't care what you think.

 

[Coyote]

If you're talking about just getting cancelled by "your people" for political views -- that's just silly stuff. To earn the title of "self-hating Jew" you merely have to support TOLERANCE of speech and association in a free society. Even if you;re not defending "enemies of race" and ABHOR the views and actions of "jew haters" -- support for ABSOLUTE liberties and freedoms to say and mix with whom they chose can get you canceled by "extremists" of your OWN kind.

Indeed. I think I would consider it a badge of honor.

 

[IM2]

How about people who claim to be Jewish end their racism against people of color? That would go a long way to fixing anti semitism racist Jews create by their behavior.

 

[Curried Goats]

Ahhhh, so you're in favor of a man beating up his wife every night.
That was the sentiment I was looking to get you to post...you're a scumbag.

So you admit you were just dishonestly trying to trap me in a gotcha moment? What does being against a police officer murdering a subdued suspect have to do with being okay with spousal abuse?

 

[Curried Goats]

You will excuse anything a Black person does. including murder and wife beating.
It's not like we haven't seen your White Man Bad theme already in a few hundred posts .
Anyway...you are boring.

This of course is nothing but projection. I have a black family, we come from a predominantly black country. When family members and myself have been victims of crime it was typically at the hands of black criminals. Of course I want to see justice. What happened to George Floyd was not justice. The Minneapolis police department didn't care about black victims, they didn't kill George Floyd because he beat his wife, they killed him because he pissed them off. As you applaud George Flloyds death you ignore all the innocent victims and suspects that the report showed the Minneapolis police department harassed and abused routinely.

 

[flacaltenn]

On the other hand, it’s critical that we don’t UNDERSTATE antisemitism while OVERSTATING racism. In doing so, we are sending the message that prejudice against Jews is more tolerable than racism against blacks, and I fear that is the message that is being sent by many on the left. That message, in turn, advances the idea that antisemitism is “less awful” than racism.

bias and discrimination is not a zero sum game amongst the villified. Doesn't subtract importance from one to the other. BOTH claims of hate speech and hate crimes are equally appalling to me. Just that ONE has it's own "college curriculum" on the persecution/discrimination and the other does not have as much public attention.

Generally, amongst the "hate groups" that COULD do damage to either -- most all of them hate BOTH jews and POC.

Take, for example, how overstated racism has been in recent years. The key example is George Floyd, when there was nothing to indicate that race was a factor at all (it wasn’t even mentioned at trial), but we also have Aunt Jemima syrup called racist, math called racist, AP classes called racist, the idea that deciding whom to admit based on merit called racist, and so forth. Our former Governor (D) even wanted to pay black teachers more than whites, and he said that anyone objecting to the race-based pay scale was racist.

Then, on the other side, you have out-and-out antisemitism that is downplayed. We had a member of the DC Council, a Democrat who is a big fan of Farrakhan, blame Jews for making it snow. He said, specifically, that the greedy Jews wanted to make money with their snow plow companies. Although some Jewish groups were appalled and wanted him to resign, we immediately had liberals jump to the antisemite‘s defense by saying he was just poorly informed, or needed to be educated. And he thus paid no real political price for advancing a blatantly antisemitic conspiracy theory, ala the Rothschilds.

First paragraph there is WHY calling someone/something racist is NOW MEANINGLESS. Even HAND DRYERS have been called racist. That's what happens if YOU LOOK for sympathy/support based on declaring EVERYTHING against you. And what I said before is -- we SHOULD NOT follow that tactic. We should PRESERVE/reserve antisemitism for stuff MUCH MORE IMPORTANT than some random radicalized City Council member "blaming Jews for making it snow"..

THAT is not a crisis of existence. It's the perfect opportunity to parody/satire this "funny guy" to death. I kinda doubt that there are A LOT of Jewish owned snowplow companies anyways. Wait (or goad him into) going FULL Farrahkan and THEN start demanding a political price.

Incompetent politicians are gonna blame everyone BUT themselves for failing. Whether it's snow plowing or gas prices today. I think Russia and Putin has taken A LOT MORE visible tangible abuse from the Left than Jews have.

 

[flacaltenn]

How about people who claim to be Jewish end their racism against people of color? That would go a long way to fixing anti semitism racist Jews create by their behavior.

Jews dont generally blend in well in skin-head and neo-nazi groups that are certified black haters. So it's hard to imagine Jews ORGANIZING ALONE against any kind of POC. And black discrimination is generally less prevalent in Jews than other whites. ANYBODY of ANY color can be taught to hate a group,

If you're talking "behavior" -- I'm assuming you're referring to Jewish business owners and shop keepers. THEY are there to SERVE customers, not hate them or cheat/punish them. BUT as in ALL places and circumstances - THERE ARE INDIVIDUALS or groups of customers that MIGHT PROVOKE a little bias and maybe hate.

 

[IM2]

Jews dont generally blend in well in skin-head and neo-nazi groups that are certified black haters. So it's hard to imagine Jews ORGANIZING ALONE against any kind of POC. And black discrimination is generally less prevalent in Jews than other whites. ANYBODY of ANY color can be taught to hate a group,

If you're talking "behavior" -- I'm assuming you're referring to Jewish business owners and shop keepers. THEY are there to SERVE customers, not hate them or cheat/punish them. BUT as in ALL places and circumstances - THERE ARE INDIVIDUALS or groups of customers that MIGHT PROVOKE a little bias and maybe hate.

Quit trying to explain shit to me. I'm 61 and the fact is the OP is a racist who has posted loads of garbage and wants to whine about anti semitism while expressing her extreme anti black opinions. There is a problem of racism among white and black Jews. Jews can be of any race.

American Jews are taking a hard look at racism in their midst

(RNS) — The challenge for white American Jews is to understand that they can be both targets of white supremacy and also accomplices.

religionnews.com

I know that racism is more than just individual acts. You have the right to believe what you want, but you can stop trying to explain something to me I've faced all my life that you haven't. Furthermore, you're a member of the group primarily practicing the behavior so why do you think I need to listen or read your attempts to minimize or dismiss it? Stop thinking all blacks are dumb flacaltenn.

 

[Quasar44]

There was a thread a couple of days ago in which a black poster asked whites how they should fix racism, so I’m asked a similar question: what should non-Jews do to fix antisemitism?

Given that it can be argued that there is more pronounced prejudice against Jews than there is against blacks (link below), and that Jew-hate is on the rise worldwide, it’s an important question.

As a start, we need to ramp down on these hate crimes, since Jews are experiencing them at twice the rate of blacks or Muslims, and thus more attention should be paid there. Suggestions?

Based on 2019 FBI Data, Jews Were 2.6X More Likely Than Blacks and 2.2X More Likely Than Muslims to Be Victims of Hate Crimes

Members of which of these groups were most likely to be a victim of a hate crime in 2019: Muslims, Blacks, or Jews? Based on media coverage, you would probably say Muslims or Blacks. According to a Google news search for the term “hate crimes” along with the name of each of those three groups, […]

www.aei.org

Ahh
What about Jews stop being too Jewish

 

[Lisa558]

Quit trying to explain shit to me. I'm 61 and the fact is the OP is a racist who has posted loads of garbage and wants to whine about anti semitism while expressing her extreme anti black opinions. There is a problem of racism among white and black Jews. Jews can be of any race.

American Jews are taking a hard look at racism in their midst

(RNS) — The challenge for white American Jews is to understand that they can be both targets of white supremacy and also accomplices.

religionnews.com

I know that racism is more than just individual acts. You have the right to believe what you want, but you can stop trying to explain something to me I've faced all my life that you haven't. Furthermore, you're a member of the group primarily practicing the behavior so why do you think I need to listen or read your attempts to minimize or dismiss it? Stop thinking all blacks are dumb flacaltenn.

I’ve said NOTHING racist. There is nothing racist about wanting to abolish admissions policies that admit blacks with scores and grades that would have them rejected if they were white. Neither is pointing out that the main reason blacks who are poor are so due to the high out-of-wedlock birthrate.

But noooooo…..anyone who points out these obvious issues is deemed a racist in your mind.

At the SAME TIME you talk about a Jew “whining” about antisemitism when she brings up OBVIOUS cases of it. Sorry, but the chapter president of the NAACP spreading a disgusting antisemitic meme should have been forced to resign.

You are an example of what I’m talking about. You screech ”raaaacist” if someone says blacks are responsible for their own outcomes, yet downplay obvious instances of Jew-hate and call a Jew who points it out as whining.

 

[Lisa558]

bias and discrimination is not a zero sum game amongst the villified. Doesn't subtract importance from one to the other. BOTH claims of hate speech and hate crimes are equally appalling to me. Just that ONE has it's own "college curriculum" on the persecution/discrimination and the other does not have as much public attention.

Generally, amongst the "hate groups" that COULD do damage to either -- most all of them hate BOTH jews and POC.


First paragraph there is WHY calling someone/something racist is NOW MEANINGLESS. Even HAND DRYERS have been called racist. That's what happens if YOU LOOK for sympathy/support based on declaring EVERYTHING against you. And what I said before is -- we SHOULD NOT follow that tactic. We should PRESERVE/reserve antisemitism for stuff MUCH MORE IMPORTANT than some random radicalized City Council member "blaming Jews for making it snow"..

THAT is not a crisis of existence. It's the perfect opportunity to parody/satire this "funny guy" to death. I kinda doubt that there are A LOT of Jewish owned snowplow companies anyways. Wait (or goad him into) going FULL Farrahkan and THEN start demanding a political price.

Incompetent politicians are gonna blame everyone BUT themselves for failing. Whether it's snow plowing or gas prices today. I think Russia and Putin has taken A LOT MORE visible tangible abuse from the Left than Jews have.

Sorry, but we REALLY disagree on this. You are downplaying the DC council mayor who is spreading Farrakhan lies about Jews, and saying that we shouldn’t overreact. How is what he said not “full Farrakhan”? He got that message about the Jews controlling the weather direct,y FROM Farrakhan, who made that point at a rally two weeks prior, and which the antisemitic councilman attended. The point is that if a DC councilman spread disgusting lies about blacks he got from a KKK wizard, it would be national news, and liberals would be calling for his head.

Same thing for the black antisemite who is the Philly NAACP president. If the chapter president of the ADL, or another group focused on stopping bigotry, sent a flyer around demonizing blacks, liberals would have his head on a platter, it would be the lead story on CNN, and he’d be history.

Jews need to stand up against antisemites such as these. In both cases they were black, and in the new liberal world of “blacks can do no wrong,” they were protected and excused from their show of Jew-hate. That makes it extra bad - black people fighting prejudice against their own minority spreading it against another minority! The Jews, of course.

My point is that elected officials, black or white, who spread antisemitism should be held to task rather than excused because the target of their bigotry was Jews, and that is tolerable.