Zone1 How Did God Come Into Existence?

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Your science will never catch up to God.

Of course not. The game is rigged. The goalposts can be moved at will.

 

[Cougarbear]

Of course not. The game is rigged. The goalposts can be moved at will.

The goalposts are fixed and firm. Our science is learning all the time more and more. But, they are so far behind that I’m sure the Godhead is chuckling at our infant steps.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

The goalposts are fixed and firm.

Nah. They get moved every time we discover that part of the Bible is wrong or impossible. Let's get real.

 

[Cougarbear]

Nah. They get moved every time we discover that part of the Bible is wrong or impossible. Let's get real.

There’s nothing wrong with the Bible other than translation or interpretation. That’s why another witness or testament is needed. Jesus said by 2 or more his gospel truth will be confirmed to believers. Ezekiel gave this other testament in chapter 37. The book of Joseph. Isaiah wrote about his book in chapter 29. A marvelous work and wonder to come forth in the last days. Those who have asked God with real intent and perfect faith know it’s the Book of Mormon. Together is the fulness of the Gospel. So, it’s your lack of faith, belief, hope and charity that makes you think there are errors. Your reading with only one testament. Like one hand clapping.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

There’s nothing wrong with the Bible other than translation or interpretation

Well that's obviously incorrect. No, seas did not part. No, nobody came back from the dead. Genesis is of course a steaming pile of falsehood, as written.

And you changing the words to mean sometimes else is precisely the goalposts moving i described .

 

[ding]

There’s nothing flawed with our perfect God who will decide all of our eternal fates. Your science will never catch up to God. It’s his Universe he organized the science.

I didn't say there was anything flawed with God. I said Joseph Smith's theology that God created the universe from existing matter is flawed. We now know that was not the case. Apparently Joseph did not believe God could create something out of nothing.

 

[Cougarbear]

Well that's obviously incorrect. No, seas did not part. No, nobody came back from the dead. Genesis is of course a steaming pile of falsehood, as written.

And you changing the words to mean sometimes else is precisely the goalposts moving i described .

The Book of Mormon testifies you are wrong and supports the Bible. You were not there with Moses. So, for you to say otherwise is narcissistic.

Then you make a statement which we agree with. Interpretation means changing translation. The Bible has been translated many times. It’s correct as far as it is translated correctly. Therefore, a 2nd testament and witness is necessary that hasn’t been translated a bunch. Even with that, there will be other interpretations which is okay. The scrip are not for private interpretation. What this means is a prophet of God leading and guiding with communication with God is necessary. We have this too. Joseph Smith was the first and today is Russell M. Nelson. We also follow the current prophet. For us today, God speaks to us through the current prophet so we will never be without the truth as God wants us to know.

 

[onefour1]

I counted 14 questions, so I get the feeling your mind is just rambling and you are really not interested in answers.

I only count 12.

That goes without saying, as for an event to exist, they must PASS in TIME. And since something can only "exist" in time, your statement becomes self-fulfilling.

If God did not create the passage of events and you agree with that, then you seem to agree that God did not create time. My point is that if God existed before he created time, then did not God himself participate in events prior to when he created time? If so, then time would have existed before God created time.

God is God, God is the creator or all, God is the original cause of everything to be God, which leaves your feeling as a non-sequitur.

So it must be your opinion that God's first creation was time itself otherwise all his other acts of creation would have been events in the passage of time. So again, you must believe that God did not participate in any event before he created time. What a boring existence. God existed for an eternity past before creating time and participated in no event which had a beginning or end. Don't you find that to be strange? To me God is the creator of "All" things that were created. I believe there were things that are self-existent that were not created or made. Thus they are not included in "All" that God created. Matter, intelligence and time already existed and from these God created "All" that He created. Nowhere in the Bible does it say that God created time.

Sweet. This statement contradicts your previous one so both CANNOT be true. Nice.

No it doesn't. What I am saying is that God did not create time itself which is the passage of events. What I am saying is God sectioned off a portion of eternity for this mortal existence and called it time. Thus God is God for time and all eternity.

 

[toobfreak]

If God did not create the passage of events and you agree with that

Wrong. I said the exact opposite, so all your other assertions seem equally discombobulated thus I will ignore them. Obviously, God created time as time is the essential element necessary to the physical universe where events happen as no event can occur without time for it to occur in.

 

[Cougarbear]

I only count 12.

If God did not create the passage of events and you agree with that, then you seem to agree that God did not create time. My point is that if God existed before he created time, then did not God himself participate in events prior to when he created time? If so, then time would have existed before God created time.

So it must be your opinion that God's first creation was time itself otherwise all his other acts of creation would have been events in the passage of time. So again, you must believe that God did not participate in any event before he created time. What a boring existence. God existed for an eternity past before creating time and participated in no event which had a beginning or end. Don't you find that to be strange? To me God is the creator of "All" things that were created. I believe there were things that are self-existent that were not created or made. Thus they are not included in "All" that God created. Matter, intelligence and time already existed and from these God created "All" that He created. Nowhere in the Bible does it say that God created time.

No it doesn't. What I am saying is that God did not create time itself which is the passage of events. What I am saying is God sectioned off a portion of eternity for this mortal existence and called it time. Thus God is God for time and all eternity.

Well, I wonder how long we existed as intelligences floating around wondering if there is more than this? It always causes mental anxiety to imagine there is no beginning. Not of the universe but of energy itself. Yet, I remember when I was teaching geometry, I found a proof of proving that there is no smallest number. It's an indirect proof but it worked mathematically. So, if there is no smallest number, there is no smallest amount of time nor existence either. No beginning. Christians tend to take things so literally. Back in the 1800's the State of Indiana brought up a bill to make Pi equal exactly 3. That's because of the dimension of the Sea of Cast Metal in the Temple stated in the Old Testament as 30 cubits around and 10 cubits across. Legislature members actually voted for it and nearly passed.

 

[Cougarbear]

Wrong. I said the exact opposite, so all your other assertions seem equally discombobulated thus I will ignore them. Obviously, God created time as time is the essential element necessary to the physical universe where events happen as no event can occur without time for it to occur in.

So, answer his other truths then. How did God exist before without time? What was he doing? Was he alone? For how long? Was he in a physical world too? Where are you now? Why are you here? And, where did you come from? And, where are you going?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Maybe your god is the creation of another god?

 

[onefour1]

Well, I wonder how long we existed as intelligences floating around wondering if there is more than this? It always causes mental anxiety to imagine there is no beginning. Not of the universe but of energy itself. Yet, I remember when I was teaching geometry, I found a proof of proving that there is no smallest number. It's an indirect proof but it worked mathematically. So, if there is no smallest number, there is no smallest amount of time nor existence either. No beginning. Christians tend to take things so literally. Back in the 1800's the State of Indiana brought up a bill to make Pi equal exactly 3. That's because of the dimension of the Sea of Cast Metal in the Temple stated in the Old Testament as 30 cubits around and 10 cubits across. Legislature members actually voted for it and nearly passed.

I think from the passage of D&C 93:29 that intelligence was not created or made and neither indeed can be, that we have always existed and that there never was a time in which we did not exist. I'm also under the belief that there is intelligence in all things. Not only in what we consider living things like animals and plants but also in the earth and inanimate objects. So when God commands a mountain to move, He simply has to command it and it obeys Him. I first learned of this concept from a talk by Cleon Skousen entitled, "The Atonement". So I believe that when Moses commanded the Red Sea to part and when Jesus commanded water to become wine, that it was nothing more than obedient intelligence. I believe there are a huge variation of intelligences and that mankind are of the highest degree of most intelligences. Of course God himself is of the very highest degree. Not sure if you have read the talk, "The Atonement" but if not here is a link for you to read it, "The Atonement by Cleon Skousen".

Upon learning this, it made me wonder myself what our intelligences have been doing for an eternity past and if we didn't start out as a very low intelligence and gradually progress to higher and higher intelligence. What are your thoughts regarding this topic?

 

[ding]

Maybe your god is the creation of another god?

That is the theology of the LDS in a nutshell.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

That is the theology of the LDS in a nutshell.

Weird!

 

[ding]

Weird!

More like unnecessarily complicated.

 

[kyzr]

Maybe your god is the creation of another god?

Actually God always existed, so he couldn't be created.
"Time" doesn't exist in God's dimension. He sees the entirety of the universe from the Big Bang 4-billion years ago until the last atom leaves the universe in 100 trillion years, at the same time, as well as other universes, aka the "multiverse".
I'd just worry about keeping your soul in a state of grace, instead of wondering if God grades on a curve.