How can we Help James Renner 77, Confessed MI. Fake Elector, Climb Out of the QAnon/Trump Rabbit Hole?

[Lesh]

The law disagrees. Forgery is a felony.

And for the record this is nothing like what happened in Hawaii.

In that case two slates of electors were

Read this slowly

CERTIFIED

These were FAKE…FRAUDULENT electors

 

[NotfooledbyW]

schmidlap in #1 23.12.07 said:

Trump can't handle losing, and can never get beyond having lost. •¥• He broods, pisses and moans, and lashes out hysterically at Americans, Republicans included,who respect democracy and acknowledge reality. •¥¥• His January 6, 2021 goons' attack upon outnumbered police failed, and over a thousand of his goons have been prosecuted. Law enforcement will be far better prepared in 2024. •¥¥¥• Of his various schemes to overcome the will of the People in 2020, might he repeat his attempt to have his fake electors replace legitimate ones, or has he exhausted that caper? •¥¥¥¥• Schmvdlvp.23.22.07 #1

10 Wisconsin fake electors acknowledge actions were used to overturn 2020 election

Michigan fake elector described planning with Trump campaign

Arizona fake elector explains why he no longer supports Trump

Email reveals Trump campaign told fake electors in Georgia to use ‘complete secrecy’

Fake Pro-Trump Electors in Wisconsin Admit Effort to 'Improperly Overturn' 2020 Vote

New Mexico's fake electors in Trump's 2020 election indictment

Nevada grand jury indicts six Republicans who falsely certified that Trump won the state in 2020

Pennsylvania's fake electors in the third Trump indictment

Schmvdlvp.23.22.07 #1


Reality must be settling in MAGA skulls:

The weakest MAGA minds that are in full blown denial that fake electors were part of DJT’s criminal conspiracy to overturn the 2020 election that he fucking knew he lost.

There is time for these MAGA to rejoin reality with respect to the criminality of Son of Jesus Trump.

3/Dangerously deranged witch hunt.

the left claims there is no election fraud

They weren't 'fake electors' a

maybe not! The Jonestown solution may follow a guilty verdict and prison time for the con man prior to next November.

nf.23.12.28 #22

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Lastamender in #156 23.08.31 said: Alternative electors are a Constitutional reality. They have to be chosen by Dec.14th. They were, and there is nothing illegal about it. lstmndr.23.08.31 #156

All fifty states certified their chosen electors on or before December 14th. There were no active legal challenges or appeals left standing - the election was over / Biden won.

How do you defend what Trump did to one of his loyal voters? Mr. Renner according to The NY Times is a former state trooper and a retired businessman who typically supported Republican campaigns. He said he was contacted by the head of the county Republican Party a day or so before the electors had planned to meet on Dec. 14, 2020, was asked to fill in for someone who was dropping out and agreed to do so.

On the 14th Mr. Renner should have been aware that Michigan had already been certified for Biden. who won the state by more than 150,000 votes. Mr. Rennet was with the other 15 Trump electors who were barred from convening in the Capitol building so they ended up meeting in the basement of the state Republican headquarters where Mr Renner signed a document prepared by Trump’s lawyers that he officially declared himself to be a state certified elector and that Trump had officially won the state. Mr. Renner committed fraud for Trump when he signed that document as an official state elector.

You should reject Trump, Saint Lastamender for what he did to Mr Renner. But the cult holds you. Why?

nf.23.12.28 #23
to lstmndr.23.08.31 #156

 

[Chillicothe]

From poster Noftfooled's list of links:​

​

"Email reveals Trump campaign told fake electors in Georgia to use ‘complete secrecy’"​

Why "secret"?
That alone must raise suspicion.
And it destroys the credibility of their 'it was legal' excuses.

And couple that with the actions to 'keep secret' the intention to announce from the Ellipse podium a march to the Capitol....with no notice to the Capitol police, the DC police, the Park police, as is required.....which led to the J6 Goons overwhelming any police presence.

Why keep such things secret here in America?
What's up with that?
It speaks clearly and loudly of mendacity in Don Trump's attempt to retain power....and avoid 'being-a-loser'.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Why does the US need electors ?
It seems to be a device that can only add confusion and give bad actors an opportunity to cause mischief.
Like trump is doing.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Lisa558 in #976 23.12.29 said: People are responsible for their own actions.” •¥• lvsvnnn.23.12.29 #976 to nf.23.12.28 #973


Do you Saint Lisa558 argue that DJT has zero responsibility for his campaign lawyers pressuring Mr. Renner to sign an official election affidavit as an official duty swearing that DJT “WON” the state of Michigan while knowing that DJT officially lost that state by 150,000 votes?

Why is it ok with you Saint Lisa558 for DJT to abuse and use Mr. Renner in furtherance committing fraud against the United States
of America. Mr, Renner is a former state trooper and a retired businessman who supported him?

Mr Renner said he was contacted by the head of the county Republican Party a day or so before the electors had planned to meet on Dec. 14, 2020. He was asked to fill in for someone who was dropping out and agreed to do so.

On the 14th Mr. Renner should have been aware that Michigan had already been certified for Biden. Biden won the state by more than 150,000 votes. Mr. Renner was with the other 15 Trump electors who were barred from convening in the Lansing Capitol building so they ended up meeting in the basement of the state Republican headquarters where Mr Renner signed a document prepared by Trump’s lawyers that he officially declared himself to be a state certified elector and that Trump had officially won the state. Mr. Renner, perhaps unwittingly, committed fraud for Trump when he signed that document as an official state elector.

Why do you not hold DJT responsible both morally and legally Saint Lisa558

nf.23.12.28 #26
to lvsvnnn.23.12.29 #976

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Edgetho in #10 24.01,01 wrote: “Eat a sack of dicks, commie scumbag. I love Jews.” •¥• vdgvthv.24.01.01 #10

Saint Edgetho only hates American Jews who vote Democrat. Or just about all Jewish prople who vote overwhelmingly for Democrats.

Edgetho in #24 said: “I didn't watch the war in Viet Nam on TV because -- I was in it. As an Infantryman. vdgvthv.24.01.01 #24

Sometimes blanket hatred against a broad category of “others” due to the perceived cause of traumatic experiences early in life can be considered tolerable if consistently limited to non-violent verbal lashing over an entire lifespan. vdgvthv.24.01.01 #24

nf.24.01.02 #27
to vdgvthv.24.01.01 #24

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Why does the US need electors ?
It seems to be a device that can only add confusion and give bad actors an opportunity to cause mischief.
Like trump is doing.

Not your problem. No matter how well anyone might try to explain it to you, I very much doubt that you have anywhere near the capability to understand the divinely-inspired brilliance of the way the great men who founded this country set up our government, including our bicameral legislative branch, and the Electoral College.

 

[Rigby5]

How can we Help James Renner 77, Confessed MI. Fake Elector Climb Out of the QAnon/Trump Rabbit Hole?

We can start by getting MAGA faithful to admit that fake electors were a real creation by Trump and his campaign team and were illegal in seven states that Biden won.

Who is James Renner?

'Betrayed is an understatement': Michigan fake elector says he was duped by GOP officials
PBLSHD 23.12.27 fake.electors

​

'Betrayed is an understatement': Michigan fake elector says he was duped by GOP officials Adam Nichols December 27, 2023​

​

A Republican fake elector in Michigan told investigators of his regret for trying to swing the 2020 vote for Donald Trump — and said officials “betrayed” him by exploiting his ignorance.​

​

In a recording of an interview obtained by the New York Times, James Renner said it was only after he heard testimony from the House’s January 6 investigation that he realized he’d acted illegally.​

​

“I was accepting the individuals that were in authority” knew “what they were talking about,” Renner said in the interview.​

​

But, after he and another 15 fake electors were sued in civil court in January this year, he started reading House transcripts involving the scheme he was accused of being a part of.​

​

“It was only then that I realized that, hold it, there is an official state-authorized process for this,” he said. “I had never been an elector, I had never discussed it with anybody. I was used to a much more informal process at the county level. And so that’s when I became suspicious of what had gone on... what happened was not legitimate.”“I am very upset,” he went on. “I don’t show it, but I am. … Betrayed is an understatement. That’s all I can say.”​

​

Criminal charges against Renner, including forgery and conspiracy, were dropped after he agreed to cooperate with Michigan Attorney General Dana Nessel. He is the only one of 16 people hit with the charges in July to have them dropped.was added to the roster of electors in December 2020 after two others dropped out. He said he had never been an elector before, but was asked to do so by the head of the county Republican Party after somebody else dropped out.​

​

“I felt that I had been walked into a situation that I shouldn’t have ever been involved in,” he said in the interview.​

​

Charges have now been brought against fake electors in Georgia, Michigan and Nevada, with investigations ongoing in Arizona and New Mexico.​

​

In the interview, Renner was asked about several people involved in the scheme including Trump lawyer Shawn Flynn, who worked on Trump’s campaign in the state, and the then-president’s former personal lawyer Rudy Giuliani.​

​

Trump has not been charged with any crime in the state, though The Detroit News last week released a recording that showed him pressuring two canvassers not to certify the result, which could be evidence of his role in trying to overturn it.​

Pro-Biden Fox News segment stuns critics 'since they're allergic to facts'

Why Trump's 'divine right of kings' claim will be smashed by Supreme Court: legal experts

Trump’s escalating racist rhetoric and the far right’s plan for a slow civil war

JOIN THE DISCUSSION

bigrebnc1775 in #24 23.12.06 said: Why don't you provide the law that shows fake electors are illegal #24

whitehall in #27 23.12.06 said: “ What are "fake electors"? #27


BackAgain in #435 22.05.17 said: “The alternative slate of electors were an effort to undo what was seen as a theft. I don’t care where they are. I still don’t know how many votes were falsely cast by Democrat criminality. And I don’t know if there were sufficient numbers to alter the outcome of any state’s or states’ electoral college outcome.” bckvgn.22.05.17 #435

toobfreak in #3 23.12.06 said: No such thing as a fake elector. They are alternate electors. But then, the Bidenistas don't care about the law. tvvbfrvvk #3

nf.23.12.27 #1

Total nonsense.
All parties select alternate electors BEFORE the election.
Then after the election, when every one know who won and who are the authorized electors, the authorized electors then cast their votes in an open session of the state legislature.
There is zero opportunity for elector fraud.
Anyone claiming there was or even could have been ANY elector fraud, is a liar.

 

[Rigby5]

You have to understand that MAGA is a giant grift, and Trump doesn't give a flying f*** about his supporters other than as a source of wealth and power.

He couldn't care less if any of them went to jail, including everyone whoring for him on this forum.

That is silly.
This claim is obviously totally a fraud.
There is absolutely no possible way to ever have any elector fraud.

 

[Rigby5]

Not really true, we agree everything MAGA and Trump have done since the election is interference.

Like what specifically?

People have been trying to think of ways to commit election interference for centuries.
And the only one that ever worked was to charge the candidate with a grand jury.
So the Founders said that was not legal.
And yet, here with are, with 91 fake charges in violation of the way the Founders said it was to be.

 

[Rigby5]

The law knocking on his door cured the ol boy.

Notice that nothing is ever said that was illegal?
Whether or not he was selected as an alternate elector does not at all matter, since neither is a crime.
There is no way to commit elector fraud.
No one has described any possible crime.

 

[Rigby5]

The pattern of Trump and his cronies is to so muddle the election process with lies and lawsuits that they might be able to find a plasuible enough lie to gain an advantage, and perhaps a sympathetic, conservative judge or jury.

They will use any and every means available to them to usurp the legal result of any election they lose.

But there is always some election fraud, in 2000 there was tons of election fraud, and the 2020 election was only 3.5% margin, so election fraud is a huge issue that should have been investigated instead of being ignored.

 

[Rigby5]

Alternate electors are required to follow a formula as set out by state law. The “electors” In this case were totally ad hoc.

Wrong.
Alternate electors are simply selected by the party that put up their candidate.
There is no "formula".
Then after the election, the state legislature invites the electors known to them, as having been the ones the people voted for.
Again, not any opportunity for any fraud.
Then those electors vote in an open session of the state legislature, where everyone knows who they are and how they are supposed to vote.
So there is no possible opportunity for ANY elector fraud, in any way.

 

[Rigby5]

OhPleaseJustQuit in #123 22.01.16 said: “It all boils down to you're terrified.” #123

OhPleaseJustQuit in #123 22.01.26 said: “I'm not scared of President Trump.” #123

BWK in #139 22.01.16 said: Also, are you for or against fake electors forging signatures and stealing the votes from millions? Yes or no? Still asking? #139

CrusaderFrank in #140 22.01.16 said: “Russian Collusion, right?” #140

OhPleaseJustQuit in #6 22.06.08 said: “Yahoo.” #6

OhPleaseJustQuit in #10 22.06.08 said: “The Hill” #10

OhPleaseJustQuit in #52 22.10.22 said: “I disagree.” •¥• “You must hate yourself, considering how much time you spend here, getting laughed at and downvoted.” #52


OhPleaseJustQuit in #14 22.11.04 said: “4 days” #14

OhPleaseJustQuit in #3 22.12.06 said: “You just can't quit the man! THAT is a love story!” #3

excalibur in #06 22.12.06 said:
Perfectly legal prior to the count. #6

excalibur in #08 22.12.06 said:
There is no law against it. Asking states to do it is a states right as the State Legislatures choose the Electors.

mudwhistle in #13 22.12.06 said: The left specializes in making their actions illegal after they do it themselves. #13


OhPleaseJustQuit #15 23.08.02 said:

View attachment 879440
#15
OhPleaseJustQuit in #3 23.12.06 said: Oh, yeah. thehill.com Right. #3




You are a liar Saint Edgetho. After December 14, 2020 all fifty states had certified their elections. And that includes Michigan.

OTHER Than BWK, you need to be absolutely non~factual in your responses like all the above Saint Edgetho because being ignorant of facts is no excuse for making up facts.

Certified Presidential Elections are officially dated and observed by all parties involved. You are fool when you argue against historically important and recorded reality like you just did in POST vdgvthv.23.12.27 #14 . It proves you are not connected to reality in any meaningful way except to nourish the MAGA cult.

nf.23.12.27 #16
to vdgvthv.23.12.27 #14 .

Wrong.
We all saw tons of election fraud in 2000 for example, the hanging chads, 40k being denied the vote due to names similarities to felons, ballots being tossed, etc.
Election fraud is not only common, but made much easier with computers being used as voting machines, unmanned drop boxes, etc.

 

[Rigby5]

Yes, that.
The problem with these fraudulent electors is that they fraudulently claimed they were the real duly selected legitimate electors.

Therein lies the problem for them.
Therein lies their fraud.
They weren't.

If these rubes would have .... if their mentor from the Trump campaign would have advised them to....simply write in..."In the event of".... or....."If confirmed vote counts show Joe Biden didn't win Michigan then we are the electors".

But alas, the Michigan Republican rubes were the too willing cannon-fodder. They outright signed documents claiming they were the real deal. They weren't.

And the Trump advisor skipped town and hid.....and let the rubes take the hit.

MAGA

WRONG!
Alternate electors are always selected by the parties that put up the candidates, before the election.
So elector fraud is impossible.
Trump's alternate electors are supposed to be selected by the local republican party.
That is exactly what happened.

And there is no way they could illegally cast their vote for Trump after Trump lost, because they would not have been invited to the state legislature session where the actual elector vote would have been counted.

So anyone claiming there was any possible "elector fraud", has to be lying.
It is not possible, while voter fraud we do know is common.

 

[Rigby5]

The only fraud was perpetrated by Trump’s minions… Roody, this guy, Eastman, etc

How do you know, since the only people who could actually investigate voter fraud would be the officials with access to official documents, and they never conducted any investigation?

 

[Rigby5]

-------------------------------------------------------
Well, on a positive note we can agree on the "inarticulate game-show host."
So there is that.

However, the rest of the screed is sorta proof of the pudding that MAGA's/QAnon'rs are ineffective, grievance-ridden, angry, and vulgar.

Or so it seems.

IMHO

I have to admit you have my interest with the "inarticulate game-show host."
Who is that referring to, or what game show at least?

 

[Rigby5]

The law disagrees. Forgery is a felony.

What "forgery"?
Alternate electors are selected by the parties, so there can be no possible forgery there.
Then when the election is over, the state legislature invites the appropriate electors to a state legislature session to hear their vote.
So again there is no possible opportunity for forgery there.
So explain what "forgery" you are referring to.
The electors never claim to know what vote was.
The state legislators are the ones who invite the electors to come to their session, so the alternate elections cannot possibly ever initiate anything.

 

[konradv]

Wrong.
Alternate electors are simply selected by the party that put up their candidate.
There is no "formula".
Then after the election, the state legislature invites the electors known to them, as having been the ones the people voted for.
Again, not any opportunity for any fraud.
Then those electors vote in an open session of the state legislature, where everyone knows who they are and how they are supposed to vote.
So there is no possible opportunity for ANY elector fraud, in any way.

Every state has its own formula. Simply showing up with a slate isn’t enough.