Zone1 have you ever heard Jesus....

[ninja007]

say literally anything the rcc believes? no.mary worship, graven image worship, purgatory, indulgences, the 7 sacraments etc.? no.

 

[luiza]

Just ring me for Cash Prayers and Absolution Certificates .
Hear an instant Sermon catereng to your very own needs and let's enter a Tithing Contract together .

The RCC today is all about your fun in your future

 

[Harry Dresden]

say literally anything the rcc believes? no.mary worship, graven image worship, purgatory, indulgences, the 7 sacraments etc.? no.

wasnt alive back then.....so never heard him talk....

 

[Meriweather]

say literally anything the rcc believes? no.mary worship, graven image worship, purgatory, indulgences, the 7 sacraments etc.? no.

It's curious when a religion leaves one with so little, people fill their time making things up about another religion. Truly, ninja, what you miss about the Catholic faith is that it lives the story of salvation, beginning with Genesis. The Old Testament/Covenants are a treasure trove of intelligence, knowledge, and instruction of God's works of salvation in our midst throughout time. Catholics are not only taught and reminded of this story, but are encouraged to take part in it--to live it.

Jesus was baptized, often compared to the Great Flood cleansing creation; he announced the forgiveness of sins, and this forgiveness had been introduced in the Old Testament; next is the Eucharist, Bread come down from heaven, again following Old Testament salvation of manna coming down from heaven and the Bread of the Presence; Old Testament Prophets were given a special priesthood, just as Jesus gave the Twelve Apostles a special priesthood; the presence of the Holy Spirit, from Genesis on, with a special appearance on Pentecost; Jesus pointed to the way God intended marriage as a covenant not broken by divorce; he healed the sick, even saving some from death, just as Old Testament prophets had. These are the seven Sacraments, the way and history of Salvation from the beginning of time that Catholics are happy to be a part of and to live.

To reduce all this history, all these memories, all this life to, Claim Jesus as Lord and Savior, wake up in heaven, nothing more needed, nothing more to be done, it's finished, works for many.

Those wishing to live the story of salvation, the way of salvation, take a different tact. Earth and our life on earth still exists, where God's will being done on earth as it is in heaven is still to be achieved. Isn't God calling and inviting us all to take part in this chapter of his story, this part of the Lord's prayer?

 

[The Irish Ram]

To reduce all this history, all these memories, all this life to, Claim Jesus as Lord and Savior, wake up in heaven, nothing more needed, nothing more to be done, it's finished, works for many.

It works for us because it worked for Jesus. Christ claimed it was finished. The word He used on the cross, after He had been punished for ALL of our sin is Tetelestai:

The most common use of “tetelestai” in Jesus' day was in debt collecting. When a person finally paid off a loan they were issued a receipt that was stamped with the word “tetelestai” which meant that their debt was now paid in full.

 

[Meriweather]

The most common use of “tetelestai” in Jesus' day was in debt collecting. When a person finally paid off a loan they were issued a receipt that was stamped with the word “tetelestai” which meant that their debt was now paid in full.

It was used that way in the Greek language. There is a difference between the Greek language and Hebrew/Aramaic. In the other two languages, it refers to accomplished, consummated, finished. It has been noted that not only had Salvation been accomplished, God's will consummated, but also the fourth cup of wine for Passover had been finished.

 

[The Irish Ram]

שָׁלֵם ~ To pay out. Debt paid.

Colossians 2:13-14 to describe the reality of having our sins forever forgiven: "And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses, by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross."

 

[Meriweather]

He used on the cross, after He had been punished for ALL of our sin

having forgiven us all our trespasses, by canceling the record of debt

In the first quote, Jesus is being punished. In the second quote debt is being cancelled. Isn't it rather odd that Jesus' mission was to proclaim the forgiveness of sins, which he did, and yet this results in some holding the belief that upon having announced the forgiveness of sin, God is seen as forgiving the sins of the unjust, but also turning and punishing the one just man for the sins of the all the unjust that he said are forgiven.

If your youngest child owes a debt. What sense does it make to say to the youngest, "I am forgiving you the entire debt," and then turning to the oldest who owes no debt and saying, "I am going to punish you for the debt I forgave the younger." When a debt is forgiven/canceled, no punishment is called for.

 

[The Irish Ram]

In the first quote, Jesus is being punished. In the second quote debt is being cancelled. Isn't it rather odd that Jesus' mission was to proclaim the forgiveness of sins, which he did, and yet this results in some holding the belief that upon having announced the forgiveness of sin, God is seen as forgiving the sins of the unjust, but also turning and punishing the one just man for the sins of the all the unjust that he said are forgiven.

And yet that was exactly their plan. At the moment the Jews were sacrificing a lamb to temporary cover their sins, Jesus became the unblemished sacrificial lamb for us all, permanently covering our sin. It wasn't Jesus forgiving us and then God punishing Him anyway. The cross was the process in which the forgiving took place. There was an exchange. Christ took our sin and died for us, so we could take His perfect record and live with God in Heaven. There isn't anywhere in the Bible that calls what Christ did for us as incomplete, or pending our participation.
2 Corinthians 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
^The righteousness of God. God doesn't have sin, not even a little bit.
And note that there will be living beings that are going to be raptured, and will be with Jesus forever. There is no sin on them that needs to be worked on. Their bodies are glorified/rendered incorruptable for eternity. That takes place in the twinkling of an eye.

 

[chesswarsnow]

Sorry bout that,

1. I spoke to him.

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

 

[BreezeWood]

what you miss about the Catholic faith is that it lives the story of salvation, beginning with Genesis. The Old Testament/Covenants are a treasure trove of intelligence, knowledge, and instruction of God's works of salvation in our midst throughout time. Catholics are not only taught and reminded of this story, but are encouraged to take part in it--to live it.

copied writings from the liar moses and written in the 4th century by the crucifiers - not one word written by jesus included in their book ...

- nor a word of liberation theology, self determination jesus and those in the 1st century gave their lives for. the repudiation of judaism

 

[fncceo]

have you ever heard Jesus....​

.

They guy who mows my lawn?

 

[BreezeWood]

They guy who mows my lawn?

you must be referring to the liar moses and his phony commandments ... jesus is who ran him off.

 

[Meriweather]

And yet that was exactly their plan. At the moment the Jews were sacrificing a lamb to temporary cover their sins, Jesus became the unblemished sacrificial lamb for us all, permanently covering our sin. It wasn't Jesus forgiving us and then God punishing Him anyway. The cross was the process in which the forgiving took place. There was an exchange. Christ took our sin and died for us, so we could take His perfect record and live with God in Heaven. There isn't anywhere in the Bible that calls what Christ did for us as incomplete, or pending our participation.

In Judaism there was nothing temporary about a sin offering, it was an atonement (often for wicked thoughts) being sent up to God.

Obedience is the perfect sacrifice, and Jesus being perfectly obedient, became not only the perfect sacrifice but the final sacrifice. So, no punishment involved. Jesus gave his life for insisting it is repentance (turning back to obedience to God) for the forgiveness of sins. Obedience is what cancels (or cancelled if that is the preferred word) our debt.

I get that some believe their own obedience to God is not important as their belief God only sees Christ's obedience not anything they, themselves, do. Catholics are more of the mind that we are to follow Christ's Way of Salvation, which is discerning the will of God and being obedient to God's will. We believe Christ's life, death, and resurrection redeemed the entire world and opened the Way of Salvation to everyone.

One belief is that salvation was over and done with two thousand years ago. The other belief is that salvation can be one of the most active ways or things in our life today. We are a participant in the salvation (the way of obedience to God) in the world.

 

[MisterBeale]

They guy who mows my lawn?

Different fellow. . ..

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

It's curious when a religion leaves one with so little, people fill their time making things up about another religion. Truly, ninja, what you miss about the Catholic faith is that it lives the story of salvation, beginning with Genesis. The Old Testament/Covenants are a treasure trove of intelligence, knowledge, and instruction of God's works of salvation in our midst throughout time. Catholics are not only taught and reminded of this story, but are encouraged to take part in it--to live it.

Jesus was baptized, often compared to the Great Flood cleansing creation; he announced the forgiveness of sins, and this forgiveness had been introduced in the Old Testament; next is the Eucharist, Bread come down from heaven, again following Old Testament salvation of manna coming down from heaven and the Bread of the Presence; Old Testament Prophets were given a special priesthood, just as Jesus gave the Twelve Apostles a special priesthood; the presence of the Holy Spirit, from Genesis on, with a special appearance on Pentecost; Jesus pointed to the way God intended marriage as a covenant not broken by divorce; he healed the sick, even saving some from death, just as Old Testament prophets had. These are the seven Sacraments, the way and history of Salvation from the beginning of time that Catholics are happy to be a part of and to live.

To reduce all this history, all these memories, all this life to, Claim Jesus as Lord and Savior, wake up in heaven, nothing more needed, nothing more to be done, it's finished, works for many.

Those wishing to live the story of salvation, the way of salvation, take a different tact. Earth and our life on earth still exists, where God's will being done on earth as it is in heaven is still to be achieved. Isn't God calling and inviting us all to take part in this chapter of his story, this part of the Lord's prayer?

God's People are required to speak out against pagan deception

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

Different fellow. . ..

Thank God for the "Crusades". The Muslim hordes were beaten back OUT OF EUROPE as they should have been

 

[Foxfyre]

say literally anything the rcc believes? no.mary worship, graven image worship, purgatory, indulgences, the 7 sacraments etc.? no.

Does it matter? I honestly don't think Jesus cares how the faithful worship him so long as they do so with reverence and respect and do not harm themselves or others.

How can anyone possibly know all that Jesus said and did back then? We have a tiny fraction of it recorded in the New Testament manuscripts. The Apostle John wrote at the end of his gospel: "This is the disciple who testifies to these things and who wrote them down. We know that his testimony is true. Jesus did many other things as well. if every one of them were written down, I suppose that even the whole world would not have room for the books that would be written."--John 21:24,25 NIV.

I figure if the devout Catholic worships the same God that I do with piety and love, who am I to see he/she is wrong and I am right? There is nothing in the scriptures to say that we can't pray to Mary or the saints or whomever. We simply are to understand they are not God and put no gods before the one true God. I don't feel led to do that myself but when I have worshipped with Catholic friends or family, I felt the presence of God there.

I take a live and let live approach to these things.

 

[The Irish Ram]

In Judaism there was nothing temporary about a sin offering

There are many different offerings that the Jews practiced. For the removal of sins, the Jewish priest would enter the Holy of Holies once a year, and God would forgive the sins of the Jews until next year when the process was repeated.

Obedience is important, but God showed us by giving the Jews over 600 rules to obey, that we can't be obedient. The Law was death because of the Jews inability to be obedient. Christ was obedient for their sake and fulfilled the Law for them.

2 Corinthians 3:7-18 The Law of Moses brought only the promise of death, even though it was carved on stones and given in a wonderful way​

John 7:19 Has not Moses given you the law? Yet not one of you keeps it.

If obedience worked there would not have been a need for Jesus and the cross.
Hebrews 8:6-9 But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, inasmuch as He is also Mediator of a better covenant, which was established on better promises.For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second.

I think the obedience we need isn't obedience to the Law, but obedience to faith in Christ.
Romans 1:5 Through Him we have received grace and apostleship for obedience to the faith among all nations for His name.
Romans 16:26 but now made manifest, and by the prophetic Scriptures made known to all nations, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, for obedience of faith.

Some Bibles say to the faith, some say obedience of faith.

Obedience is a noble undertaking, but doesn't save us lest any man boast. Christ saved us and is the only way to Heaven.

 

[The Irish Ram]

There is nothing in the scriptures to say that we can't pray to Mary or the saints or whomever.

Some here say they have asked Mary for favors. That would fall under this category:

Deuteronomy 18:11 ...or a charmer or a medium or a necromancer or one who inquires of the dead.​