Franklin Roosevelts views of Nazi Germany 1933 through 1938

[AZrailwhale]

Okay, you realize when France and the Netherlands got overrun, they stopped buying defense stuff from us. (Not that they were buying a lot to start with.)

The Great depression ended in 1933. That's when the economy returned to positive growth.

Are you kidding? France ordered more than the UK and more from the USA was delivered than from France's own factories before the surrender. The Dutch were mostly ordering things for the DEI (Dutch East Indies) since the Netherlands had few if any munitions and war equipment factories of its own. The DEI ordered and received Brewster Buffalos, Curtis Wright CW-21 Demons, Marmon-Harrington light and medium tanks, (crappy tanks by western standards), but good enough to defeat the Type 95 lights and type 97 mediums the IJA was equipped with. I believe the DEI had either ordered or was considering ordering warships from the USA as well.

 

[AZrailwhale]

Please stop pretending the US Submarines were not as guilty of sinking merchant ships.

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View attachment 1070090
American submarines sank many merchant ships during World War II, including Japanese ships, British ships, and others.

Japanese ships

• Agano: Japanese cruiser sunk by an American submarine
• Akigumo: Japanese destroyer sunk by an American submarine
• Akikaze: Japanese destroyer sunk by an American submarine
• Akitsu Maru: Japanese aircraft carrier sunk by an American submarine
• Aotaka: Japanese minelayer sunk by an American submarine
• Arare: Japanese destroyer sunk by an American submarine
• Asahi: Japanese battleship sunk by an American submarine
• Asakaze: Japanese destroyer sunk by an American submarine
• Asanagi: Japanese destroyer sunk by an American submarine
• Atago: Japanese cruiser sunk by an American submarine

British ships

• HMS Pathfinder: Sunk by U-21 in 1914, becoming the first ship sunk by a submarine's torpedo
• HMS Aboukir, HMS Hogue, and HMS Cressy: Sunk by U-9 in 1914
• RMS Lusitania: Sunk by U-20 in 1915, killing 1,198 people

Other ships

• Toyama Maru: Sunk in 1944, with a death toll of 5,400
• Ryusei Maru: Sunk in 1944, with a death toll of 4,998
• Tamatsu Maru: Sunk in 1944, with a death toll of 4,406–4,755

• List of ships sunk by submarines by death toll - Wikipedia
  View attachment 1070092
  Wikipedia
  
  
  
• List of submarine actions - Wikipedia
  World War I Illustration by Hans Bohrdt depicting the sinking of HMS Cressy, HMS Hogue and HMS Aboukir by U-9 on 22 September 1914...
  View attachment 1070091
  Wikipedia
  
  
  
• Category:Ships sunk by American submarines - Wikipedia
  Pages in category "Ships sunk by American submarines" * HNLMS A. * Japanese cruiser Agano. * Japanese destroyer Akigumo (1941) *
  View attachment 1070093
  Wikipedia
  
  
  
• Show all

Generative AI is experimental.

Yep, the USN adopted the Axis practice of ignoring cruiser rules and practiced unrestricted submarine warfare as well. What is good for the goose is good for the gander as the saying goes. Before Nuremburg, that's how the international laws of war were enforced. If the enemy was ignoring the law, you didn't have to conform to it either. Unlike the Geneva Conventions which our enemies totally ignore; reciprocity actually works in the real world.

 

[Robert W]

You know damned well from previous experience, congress wouldn't;'t apply most of the money to the debt, they would just go on a spending spree with most of it

Democrats are the robber class. To them the citizens who graduated from a university, managed to build the economy Democrats try to take credit for, do indeed expand the economy and pay far and away the highest taxes. So much so our public earning under 40 percent live virtually tax free.

 

[Robert W]

Are you kidding? France ordered more than the UK and more from the USA was delivered than from France's own factories before the surrender. The Dutch were mostly ordering things for the DEI (Dutch East Indies) since the Netherlands had few if any munitions and war equipment factories of its own. The DEI ordered and received Brewster Buffalos, Curtis Wright CW-21 Demons, Marmon-Harrington light and medium tanks, (crappy tanks by western standards), but good enough to defeat the Type 95 lights and type 97 mediums the IJA was equipped with. I believe the DEI had either ordered or was considering ordering warships from the USA as well.

JoeB131 is proof of the hold on this nation Teachers who love FDR and hate Reagan have on our teaching and careers. To them the democrat is what amounts to their GOD. They worship at the altar of massive federal spending and control over not just our lives, but their lives as well. They operate pretty much as the Germans did under Hitler.

 

[Robert W]

Yep, the USN adopted the Axis practice of ignoring cruiser rules and practiced unrestricted submarine warfare as well. What is good for the goose is good for the gander as the saying goes. Before Nuremburg, that's how the international laws of war were enforced. If the enemy was ignoring the law, you didn't have to conform to it either. Unlike the Geneva Conventions which our enemies totally ignore; reciprocity actually works in the real world.

JoeB131 actually reminds me of the Nazis. He worships a ruler. He defends his ruler. He sees bad only of the group that is victimized.

 

[Robert W]

Yep, the USN adopted the Axis practice of ignoring cruiser rules and practiced unrestricted submarine warfare as well. What is good for the goose is good for the gander as the saying goes. Before Nuremburg, that's how the international laws of war were enforced. If the enemy was ignoring the law, you didn't have to conform to it either. Unlike the Geneva Conventions which our enemies totally ignore; reciprocity actually works in the real world.

Some whine over sunken ships. But they ignore totally that during WW2, the USA under FDR annihilated millions in Europe and Asia.

 

[AZrailwhale]

Some whine over sunken ships. But they ignore totally that during WW2, the USA under FDR annihilated millions in Europe and As

Again RECIPROCITY. The Germans, Italians and Japanese were the ones started bombing civilian cities, even undefended ones that had been declared "open" cities. At least the USA was trying to hit legitimate war targets like factories. The Germans, Japanese and RAF were deliberately attacking civilian areas that had no industry to speak of.

 

[Robert W]

Again RECIPROCITY. The Germans, Italians and Japanese were the ones started bombing civilian cities, even undefended ones that had been declared "open" cities. At least the USA was trying to hit legitimate war targets like factories. The Germans, Japanese and RAF were deliberately attacking civilian areas that had no industry to speak of.

Tell me of any state in the USA among states that was heavily bombed by the Nazis or the Japanese or the Italians.

Some moan about Hiroshima and Nagasaki but to be honest using just bombs of various types America had ruined both Germany and Japan. Frankly had Germany and Japan won, they would have hung thousands of Americans. But we bombed the shit out of all those named by me.

 

[AZrailwhale]

Tell me of any state in the USA among states that was heavily bombed by the Nazis or the Japanese or the Italians.

Some moan about Hiroshima and Nagasaki but to be honest using just bombs of various types America had ruined both Germany and Japan. Frankly had Germany and Japan won, they would have hung thousands of Americans. But we bombed the shit out of all those named by me.

Not states but territories, Guam, the Philippines and the Hawaiian Islands. But the violations of international law were cities in China for the Japanese, Guernica, Warsaw and other Polish and French cities as well as London and numerous other British cities for the Germans. They were allies of the USA.

The casualties in Hiroshima and Nagasaki were lower than in the other Japanese cities that were firebombed to rubble. Both were military targets, not civilian ones. Hiroshima was a major naval base and shipyard that was busily turning out suicide subs and boats, Nagasaki was a regional army headquarters and production facility.

 

[Robert W]

Not states but territories, Guam, the Philippines and the Hawaiian Islands. But the violations of international law were cities in China for the Japanese, Guernica, Warsaw and other Polish and French cities as well as London and numerous other British cities for the Germans. They were allies of the USA.

The casualties in Hiroshima and Nagasaki were lower than in the other Japanese cities that were firebombed to rubble. Both were military targets, not civilian ones. Hiroshima was a major naval base and shipyard that was busily turning out suicide subs and boats, Nagasaki was a regional army headquarters and production facility.

I hope we are on the same page. We both know that in the 48 states, we were not bombed seriously as we did to Germany and Japan. So we for a fact went full out war against Germany and Japan and also Italy. FDR locked up Citizens as well. FDR took his sweet time bombing Germany, Japan and Italy. Citizens may not know that Japan did use fire bombs that hit some of our forests.

 

[AZrailwhale]

I hope we are on the same page. We both know that in the 48 states, we were not bombed seriously as we did to Germany and Japan. So we for a fact went full out war against Germany and Japan and also Italy. FDR locked up Citizens as well. FDR took his sweet time bombing Germany, Japan and Italy. Citizens may not know that Japan did use fire bombs that hit some of our forests.

What is even less known is that the ballon bombs were intended to carry biological warfare agents. The firebombs were just launched to get target analysis from American newspapers if and where they were landing. Japan was big on biowarfare in WWII.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

You could take every cent from everyone making more than a hundred grand a year and it would disappear into the black hole of federal debt and out of control spending. If you want to eliminate the income tax, shrink government by eliminating every department and job that doesn’t clearly conform to the limits set by the Tenth Amendment. That would shrink both federal and state governments by probably eighty percent, the Feds by direct action, the states by eliminating the people administering unfounded federal mandates and paperwork. Then fund the remaining by import tariffs, fees on direct users of federal services and excise taxes.

Sperm Bingo

As usual, Preppylovers completely ignore what I posted. The nation-destroying cancer of inheritance is so dominant that plebeian Americans are afraid to even mention it. It ensures incompetent leadership in all sectors just as much as letting lottery winners rule over us.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

Have you read Road to serfdom? By the esteemed economist
Book by Friedrich Hayek

Serfdom Is the Result of Hereditary Power

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

Your love of FDR frankly was not expected. Most will say it was the stock market that crashed. Trouble is most Americans did not buy stocks. So just those with stocks got hurt.

Here is the facts about the new deal.

Childishly Blowing Bubbles

During the 1920s boom, the workers were underpaid and eventually could not afford the merchandise they produced. Owners foolishly did not prepare for a shortage of buyers and got stuck with a loss they had no retained earnings to make up for. So they had to shut down their businesses, making the problem even worse. They had wasted their profits on Wall Street gambling.

 

[Robert W]

Childishly Blowing Bubbles

During the 1920s boom, the workers were underpaid and eventually could not afford the merchandise they produced. Owners foolishly did not prepare for a shortage of buyers and got stuck with a loss they had no retained earnings to make up for. So they had to shut down their businesses, making the problem even worse. They had wasted their profits on Wall Street gambling.

You are a good candidate to read truth done by outstanding author Amity Shlaes.

 

[JoeB131]

Please stop pretending the US Submarines were not as guilty of sinking merchant ships.

Japanese ships

• Agano: Japanese cruiser sunk by an American submarine
• Akigumo: Japanese destroyer sunk by an American submarine
• Akikaze: Japanese destroyer sunk by an American submarine
• Akitsu Maru: Japanese aircraft carrier sunk by an American submarine
• Aotaka: Japanese minelayer sunk by an American submarine
• Arare: Japanese destroyer sunk by an American submarine
• Asahi: Japanese battleship sunk by an American submarine
• Asakaze: Japanese destroyer sunk by an American submarine
• Asanagi: Japanese destroyer sunk by an American submarine
• Atago: Japanese cruiser sunk by an American submarine

Um, those are all WARSHIPS. Warships are fair game in a war.

Point was, Germany had signed a treaty where they swore they'd never do submarine warfare against civilian ships again. But that's exactly what they did.

our love of FDR frankly was not expected. Most will say it was the stock market that crashed. Trouble is most Americans did not buy stocks. So just those with stocks got hurt.

The Stock Market was a trigger on an economy that was already floundering. But what really sunk us was the Smoot-Hawley Tariffs that destroyed international trade and plunged the whole world into a Depression.

 

[JoeB131]

Oh, dear. Okay, you realize that France and the Netherlands didn't fall until mid-1940, right? So AZrailwhale's point is valid.

No, it really isn't. Holland was in the war for less than a few weeks (before that it was neutral.)

As for the French... Their entire time in the war was less than a year.

Have you read Road to serfdom? By the esteemed economist
Book by Friedrich Hayek

So you put all your trust in Wikipedia buster!!! I have contributed to Wikipedia over things I was involved with. But being in Wikipedia does not mean all there is accurate.

No, I just find Wiki to be a quicker source than breaking out all the textbooks I have in my library.

 

[JoeB131]

Are you kidding? France ordered more than the UK and more from the USA was delivered than from France's own factories before the surrender. The Dutch were mostly ordering things for the DEI (Dutch East Indies) since the Netherlands had few if any munitions and war equipment factories of its own. The DEI ordered and received Brewster Buffalos, Curtis Wright CW-21 Demons, Marmon-Harrington light and medium tanks, (crappy tanks by western standards), but good enough to defeat the Type 95 lights and type 97 mediums the IJA was equipped with. I believe the DEI had either ordered or was considering ordering warships from the USA as well.

Well, you'd be wrong, guy. The fact was, the DEI were horrifically underdefended, which is why the Japanese overran it in weeks.

Did they buy a few things? Sure? Enough to pull the US out of an economic slump? NOt even close.

FDR's policies and the creation of a real middle class did that.

 

[AZrailwhale]

Well, you'd be wrong, guy. The fact was, the DEI were horrifically underdefended, which is why the Japanese overran it in weeks.

Did they buy a few things? Sure? Enough to pull the US out of an economic slump? NOt even close.

FDR's policies and the creation of a real middle class did that.

Most of the spending came from France and the UK. The UK expended its entire gold reserve buying equipment from the USA.
After the fall of Holland, the DEI was spending money like water trying to prepare a defense force against the Japanese who it knew was coming. It bought over a hundred Buffalos, twenty four CW-21 Demons, six hundred twenty eight miscellaneous Martin Harrington tanks few of which arrived in time. Twenty four P-36s, one hundred fifty Martin 139s (export model B-10s), along with several hundred trainers, liaison aircraft and multi-engine transports. The DEI army bought small arms from the USA including a thousand Thompson and over a thousand M-1941 Johnson rifles.

 

[AZrailwhale]

Well, you'd be wrong, guy. The fact was, the DEI were horrifically underdefended, which is why the Japanese overran it in weeks.

Did they buy a few things? Sure? Enough to pull the US out of an economic slump? NOt even close.

FDR's policies and the creation of a real middle class did that.

The DEI defense force expanded from about twenty thousand to eighty thousand between 1940 and 1941 with plans to triple that, but ran out of time before the invasion. It only had about fifteen thousand trained troops by December 7th, 1941. Given what it had to use, the DEI fought hard.