Fixing Tax Loopholes, 51% of Americans Pay NO Incomes Taxes

How is it class warfare AGAINST the poor, if your busy taking what belongs to the rich and giving it to the poor? Why are you content supporting a cycle of poverty, lack of education and dependence on a set of rules you set up for them? It is your system that oppresses them, not free enterprise.

What an absolute crock of shit. Do you actually think before you write something?

inequality-p25_averagehouseholdincom.png



These numbers are from the CBO which I'm sure that someone on the right will say is biased.

The rich have been getting more and more rich while the income for the rest of us has been going down. This is no secret you know.

So what? The government helped us "invest" in our homes and the stock market. Then they got both totally screwed up and we lost our money, while the rich held on to theirs because they had different investments. Your little chart does nothing to disprove a single word I wrote.

You want to get rid of the home mortgage interest deduction? That's a specific example of targeted government 'help' for Americans to 'invest' in a home.
 
Government is the problem, greed is good, the poor are lazy criminals (code...)- Raygun's legacy is a disaster...From the Greatest Generation to the greatest A-holes....make it stop...lol
 
What an absolute crock of shit. Do you actually think before you write something?

inequality-p25_averagehouseholdincom.png



These numbers are from the CBO which I'm sure that someone on the right will say is biased.

The rich have been getting more and more rich while the income for the rest of us has been going down. This is no secret you know.

So what? The government helped us "invest" in our homes and the stock market. Then they got both totally screwed up and we lost our money, while the rich held on to theirs because they had different investments. Your little chart does nothing to disprove a single word I wrote.

You want to get rid of the home mortgage interest deduction? That's a specific example of targeted government 'help' for Americans to 'invest' in a home.

Dang! I thought your post was directed at me! Phew...sure glad it wasn't.
 
I really think that this is the argument the Republicans need to use to counter the class envy rhetoric Obama is employing.

I think the majority of Americans agree with your sentiment, hell I know I do. I didn't believe it was right when I got money back after I hadn't paid any taxes, but I took it.

The whole shared sacrifice thing is something Americans do believe, and a lot of Americans know deep down that they aren't giving their fair share.
There is no such thing as "shared sacrifice"...First off, to "share" is voluntary.
And as a matter of fact, "giving" ( the term you used later in your post) is also voluntary.
What part of taxation is voluntary? When politicians decide they need more money, do they ASK for it in the hopes that Americans "share" or want to "give" more of their earnings?
No. The government simply makes a decision which ends up in the signing of a piece of paper that says government has a right to TAKE from us that which belongs to us.
There is no sharing or giving.
This term"shared sacrifice is just progressive new speak which is designed to make people feel guilty about their achievements. Screw that shit.

I guess it's just congress living up to their constitutional mandate, that they are responsible for taxation. The constitution doesn't mention the public having to ask.
No. The Congress does not ask.
However the current rhetoric from the political Left implies that we should all feel as though additional and open ended taxation is justified. Hence the use of the words "sacrifice" and "giving".
To date NO ONE on the political Left wants to touch the issue of fiscal responsibility and the fact that the federal government has just gotten far too large and has far too many fingers in way too many pies.
The all or nothing straw man argument that no one wants or sees the need for taxation is pure unadulterated bull snot.
 
Some have implied or suggested that people who do not owe federal income tax are “freeloaders” who don’t have a “stake in the system” and that making them pay federal income taxes would improve the tax code.

Income Tax Historical background

"To raise revenue to fund the Civil War, the income tax was introduced in the United States with the Revenue Act of 1861.[1] It was a flat tax of 3% on annual income above $800. The following year, this was replaced with a graduated tax of 3-5% on income above $600 in the Revenue Act of 1862, which specified a termination of income taxation in 1866. The Socialist Labor Party advocated a graduated income tax in 1887.[2] The Populist Party "demanded a graduated income tax" in its 1892 platform.[3] The Populist Party, led by William Jennings Bryan, advocated the income tax law passed in 1894,[4] and proposed an income tax in its 1908 platform.[5]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pollock_v._Farmers'_Loan_&_Trust_Co.

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So? what's your point?

"Nothing can be clearer than that what the constitution intended to guard against was the exercise by the general government of the power of directly taxing persons and property within any state through a majority made up from the other states. It is true that the effect of requiring direct taxes to be apportioned among the states in proportion to their population is necessarily that the amount of taxes on the individual [157 U.S. 429, 583] taxpayer in a state having the taxable subject-matter to a larger extent in proportion to its population than another state has, would be less than in such other state; but this inequality must be held to have been contemplated, and was manifestly designed to operate to restrain the exercise of the power of direct taxation to extraordinary emergencies, and to prevent an attack upon accumulated property by mere force of numbers. "

U.S. Supreme Court
POLLOCK v. FARMERS' LOAN & TRUST CO., 157 U.S. 429 (1895)



FindLaw | Cases and Codes

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What an absolute crock of shit. Do you actually think before you write something?

inequality-p25_averagehouseholdincom.png



These numbers are from the CBO which I'm sure that someone on the right will say is biased.

The rich have been getting more and more rich while the income for the rest of us has been going down. This is no secret you know.

So what? The government helped us "invest" in our homes and the stock market. Then they got both totally screwed up and we lost our money, while the rich held on to theirs because they had different investments. Your little chart does nothing to disprove a single word I wrote.

You want to get rid of the home mortgage interest deduction? That's a specific example of targeted government 'help' for Americans to 'invest' in a home.
Yes. why should the taxpayers have to fund the interest payments on a purchasing choice?
The federal government has no business involving itself in the real estate market.
 
The exact number is not relevant to my excellent point. :lol:

:razz: You're right, your point was excellent. Thanks. I just hate to see that number thrown around since it's another RW myth.
Really? No one has been able to disprove that number.

The “half of Americans pay no income tax” fraud

One of the right-wing’s favorite talking points is the claim that 50 percent of American households don’t pay income taxes. From that claim flow a couple of other points: First, it’s impossible to “cut” taxes for those households because they don’t pay any tax in the first place; second, those households are somehow less deserving of respect or even a voice in politics because they aren’t paying their own way.

That claim is bogus both in its details and its general charge.
Atlanta Opinion *| ajc.com

5-26-11tax-f4.jpg
 
:razz: You're right, your point was excellent. Thanks. I just hate to see that number thrown around since it's another RW myth.
Really? No one has been able to disprove that number.

The “half of Americans pay no income tax” fraud

One of the right-wing’s favorite talking points is the claim that 50 percent of American households don’t pay income taxes. From that claim flow a couple of other points: First, it’s impossible to “cut” taxes for those households because they don’t pay any tax in the first place; second, those households are somehow less deserving of respect or even a voice in politics because they aren’t paying their own way.

That claim is bogus both in its details and its general charge.
Atlanta Opinion *| ajc.com

5-26-11tax-f4.jpg

Excellent, too bad the willfully ignorant ignore anything which challeges conservative dogma
 
Income Tax Historical background

"To raise revenue to fund the Civil War, the income tax was introduced in the United States with the Revenue Act of 1861.[1] It was a flat tax of 3% on annual income above $800. The following year, this was replaced with a graduated tax of 3-5% on income above $600 in the Revenue Act of 1862, which specified a termination of income taxation in 1866. The Socialist Labor Party advocated a graduated income tax in 1887.[2] The Populist Party "demanded a graduated income tax" in its 1892 platform.[3] The Populist Party, led by William Jennings Bryan, advocated the income tax law passed in 1894,[4] and proposed an income tax in its 1908 platform.[5]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pollock_v._Farmers'_Loan_&_Trust_Co.

.

So? what's your point?

"Nothing can be clearer than that what the constitution intended to guard against was the exercise by the general government of the power of directly taxing persons and property within any state through a majority made up from the other states. It is true that the effect of requiring direct taxes to be apportioned among the states in proportion to their population is necessarily that the amount of taxes on the individual [157 U.S. 429, 583] taxpayer in a state having the taxable subject-matter to a larger extent in proportion to its population than another state has, would be less than in such other state; but this inequality must be held to have been contemplated, and was manifestly designed to operate to restrain the exercise of the power of direct taxation to extraordinary emergencies, and to prevent an attack upon accumulated property by mere force of numbers. "

U.S. Supreme Court
POLLOCK v. FARMERS' LOAN & TRUST CO., 157 U.S. 429 (1895)



FindLaw | Cases and Codes

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US Constitution

Article 1

Section 7 - Revenue Bills, Legislative Process, Presidential Veto

All bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives; but the Senate may propose or concur with Amendments as on other Bills.

Section 8 - Powers of Congress

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

To borrow money on the credit of the United States;


To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes;

To establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization, and uniform Laws on the subject of Bankruptcies throughout the United States;

To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

To provide for the Punishment of counterfeiting the Securities and current Coin of the United States;

To establish Post Offices and Post Roads;

To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries;

To constitute Tribunals inferior to the supreme Court;

To define and punish Piracies and Felonies committed on the high Seas, and Offenses against the Law of Nations;

To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water;

To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years;

To provide and maintain a Navy;

To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land and naval Forces;

To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

To exercise exclusive Legislation in all Cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten Miles square) as may, by Cession of particular States, and the acceptance of Congress, become the Seat of the Government of the United States, and to exercise like Authority over all Places purchased by the Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall be, for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards, and other needful Buildings; And

To make all Laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into Execution the foregoing Powers, and all other Powers vested by this Constitution in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof.

The United States Constitution - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net

I went ahead and posted all the powers of congress since I'm not sure many people know what is in it. But taxation is right in the Constitution, straight from our forefathers.

What could not be clearer is that the power to tax is straight from the US Constitution and I don't care how many legal bills you put up or by whom. You don't have to be a constitutional scholar to understand their plain language.

And it sure sounds to me like our forefathers, intending that the government should have the power to tax put it directly into the constitution.
 
Section 8 - Powers of Congress

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

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OK Section 8 authorizes UNIFORM taxes - which Article section clause authorizes GRADUATED TAXES -

Which Article section clause authorizes congress to EXEMPT certain Americans from excise taxation?!?!?!?!?!?


In Liberty,

Contumacious H. Freeman

.
 
Really? No one has been able to disprove that number.

The “half of Americans pay no income tax” fraud

One of the right-wing’s favorite talking points is the claim that 50 percent of American households don’t pay income taxes. From that claim flow a couple of other points: First, it’s impossible to “cut” taxes for those households because they don’t pay any tax in the first place; second, those households are somehow less deserving of respect or even a voice in politics because they aren’t paying their own way.

That claim is bogus both in its details and its general charge.
Atlanta Opinion *| ajc.com

5-26-11tax-f4.jpg

Excellent, too bad the willfully ignorant ignore anything which challeges conservative dogma

I read about 8-9 pages of the vitriol on this thread before I decided to post. These willfully ignorant have the bollocks to accuse liberals of class warfare when the posts here were just dripping with venom against the poor.

Yes, there are people who are too poor to pay income taxes, most of SS if my friends are taken into consideration. LOL But the right seems to feel the poor folks want to be poor and are doing it willfully.

But this is a RW myth and I've made it my goal to strike it down every time I see it. It's bullshit and should be treated that way.
 
The “half of Americans pay no income tax” fraud

One of the right-wing’s favorite talking points is the claim that 50 percent of American households don’t pay income taxes. From that claim flow a couple of other points: First, it’s impossible to “cut” taxes for those households because they don’t pay any tax in the first place; second, those households are somehow less deserving of respect or even a voice in politics because they aren’t paying their own way.

That claim is bogus both in its details and its general charge.
Atlanta Opinion *| ajc.com

5-26-11tax-f4.jpg

Excellent, too bad the willfully ignorant ignore anything which challeges conservative dogma

I read about 8-9 pages of the vitriol on this thread before I decided to post. These willfully ignorant have the bollocks to accuse liberals of class warfare when the posts here were just dripping with venom against the poor.

Yes, there are people who are too poor to pay income taxes, most of SS if my friends are taken into consideration. LOL But the right seems to feel the poor folks want to be poor and are doing it willfully.

But this is a RW myth and I've made it my goal to strike it down every time I see it. It's bullshit and should be treated that way.

Understood, "income taxes' are unconstitutional anyway. So abolish them.

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How is it class warfare AGAINST the poor, if your busy taking what belongs to the rich and giving it to the poor? Why are you content supporting a cycle of poverty, lack of education and dependence on a set of rules you set up for them? It is your system that oppresses them, not free enterprise.

What an absolute crock of shit. Do you actually think before you write something?

inequality-p25_averagehouseholdincom.png



These numbers are from the CBO which I'm sure that someone on the right will say is biased.

The rich have been getting more and more rich while the income for the rest of us has been going down. This is no secret you know.




this statement is absolutely meaningless..

The rich have been getting more and more rich while the income for the rest of us has been going down.

so what?

if you are dissatisfied with your station in life, income etc. then, have at it- education, ambition and motivation.

the world is your oyster.
 
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15th post
Section 8 - Powers of Congress

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

.


OK Section 8 authorizes UNIFORM taxes - which Article section clause authorizes GRADUATED TAXES -

Which Article section clause authorizes congress to EXEMPT certain Americans from excise taxation?!?!?!?!?!?


In Liberty,

Contumacious H. Freeman

.


My understanding is that by uniform they meant that all states would be taxed the same. But of course I could be wrong. Please feel free to research it and let us know.

It actually was nice to see someone from the right that did some research even if I wasn't sure where you were going with it. For that I commend you.

BTW I'm probably the wrong person to ask about taxes, I'm probably more confused that most of the people here.
 
Section 8 - Powers of Congress

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

.


OK Section 8 authorizes UNIFORM taxes - which Article section clause authorizes GRADUATED TAXES -

Which Article section clause authorizes congress to EXEMPT certain Americans from excise taxation?!?!?!?!?!?


In Liberty,

Contumacious H. Freeman

.


My understanding is that by uniform they meant that all states would be taxed the same. But of course I could be wrong. Please feel free to research it and let us know.

It actually was nice to see someone from the right that did some research even if I wasn't sure where you were going with it. For that I commend you.

BTW I'm probably the wrong person to ask about taxes, I'm probably more confused that most of the people here.


:lol::lol::lol: says the one posting all the graphs and swearing they be true. :lol:
 
so what?

if you are dissatisfied with your station in life, income etc. then, have at it- education, ambition and motivation.

the world is your oyster.

So what?

I'm tired of socialism for the rich.
I'm tired of paying for corporations to build war machines to persecute wars against people that did nothing to us.
I'm tired of the rich deciding the outcomes of US elections via court appointments and unlimited funding.

That was never the way the founding fathers intended it. In fact they fought tooth and nail against that very outcome.
 
so what?

if you are dissatisfied with your station in life, income etc. then, have at it- education, ambition and motivation.

the world is your oyster.

So what?

I'm tired of socialism for the rich.
I'm tired of paying for corporations to build war machines to persecute wars against people that did nothing to us.
I'm tired of the rich deciding the outcomes of US elections via court appointments and unlimited funding.

That was never the way the founding fathers intended it. In fact they fought tooth and nail against that very outcome.

I'm tired of paying for corporations to build war machines to persecute wars against people that did nothing to us.

sing it brother!!





joelleconvention322x250.jpg
 
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