Exploring a Parallel Universe

[The ClayTaurus]

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2005/011/19.128.html

...How can people who inhabit the same society have such different perceptions? More ominously, what have we evangelicals done to make Good News—the very meaning of the word evangelical—sound like such a threat?...

Reflecting on our conversation, I remembered a remark by Lewis, who drew a distinction between communicating with a society that hears the gospel for the first time and one that has embraced and then largely rejected it. A person must court a virgin differently than a divorcée, said Lewis. One welcomes the charming words; the other needs a demonstration of love to overcome inbuilt skepticism.

I thought, too, how tempting it can be—and how distracting from our primary mission—to devote so many efforts to rehabilitating society at large, especially when these efforts demonize the opposition. (After all, neither Jesus nor Paul showed much concern about cleaning up the degenerate Roman Empire.) As history has proven, especially in times when church and state closely mingle, it is possible for the church to gain a nation and in the process lose the kingdom.

 

[dmp]

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2005/011/19.128.html

Insightful.

 

[Hagbard Celine]

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2005/011/19.128.html

That's a good, reasoned article. I like it when people explore the differences in the ways other types of people interpret things. But there is still an underlying message that conversion to the Christian faith is the ultimate goal. "You must court a virgin differently than you would a divorcee." He's speaking in terms of converting others to Christianity. That's not tolerance, that's trying to change people to suit your own interests.

 

[The ClayTaurus]

That's a good, reasoned article. I like it when people explore the differences in the ways other types of people interpret things. But there is still an underlying message that conversion to the Christian faith is the ultimate goal. "You must court a virgin differently than you would a divorcee." He's speaking in terms of converting others to Christianity. That's not tolerance, that's trying to change people to suit your own interests.

But to him, it's being a good neighbor. It's inherent of his religion.

 

[dmp]

That's a good, reasoned article. I like it when people explore the differences in the ways other types of people interpret things. But there is still an underlying message that conversion to the Christian faith is the ultimate goal. "You must court a virgin differently than you would a divorcee." He's speaking in terms of converting others to Christianity. That's not tolerance, that's trying to change people to suit your own interests.

Tolerance isn't part of Christianity so it makes sense, eh? Having people accept Christianity is a GOOD thing, because christianity is GOOD for people, mostly because it's Absolutely True. Religion is 'not' true. Christianity is the answer to the question "Who is God, and why am I here?"



Nope - You're reading that correctly. A true Christian makes NO allowances that any OTHER belief could be 'the path to heaven/God, etc.'. Christ said "I am the way. No man comes to the father but through me." or something.

 

[The ClayTaurus]

Tolerance isn't part of Christianity so it makes sense, eh? Having people accept Christianity is a GOOD thing, because christianity is GOOD for people, mostly because it's Absolutely True. Religion is 'not' true. Christianity is the answer to the question "Who is God, and why am I here?"



Nope - You're reading that correctly. A true Christian makes NO allowances that any OTHER belief could be 'the path to heaven/God, etc.'. Christ said "I am the way. No man comes to the father but through me." or something.

So you would agree that allowing a non-believer to continue on his way would go against Christian teachings, no? It's your obligation to interfere in his spiritual life, as a service to him. I always thought that's where Christians were coming from. It's just that most people who aren't Christians don't understand that. Or am I off base?

 

[Hobbit]

So you would agree that allowing a non-believer to continue on his way would go against Christian teachings, no? It's your obligation to interfere in his spiritual life, as a service to him. I always thought that's where Christians were coming from. It's just that most people who aren't Christians don't understand that. Or am I off base?

You make it sound like we convert people at gunpoint. It's pointless to "convert" someone if they don't do so willingly with full acceptance. If someone converts, they'll thank us for the favor.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

So you would agree that allowing a non-believer to continue on his way would go against Christian teachings, no? It's your obligation to interfere in his spiritual life, as a service to him. ?

Actually, thats not even possible. ITS IMPOSSIBLE to convert someone at gunpoint. You can only convert their heart, and it is done only by true, effective persuasion. NOTHING FORCED, nothing phoney. Presenting them with truth and allowing them to decide for themselves, thats the Christian way, Gods way.

Now, if you wish to talk about forcing converts at gunpoint, lets talk about that religion you and some others seem to think we should be more tolerant of, ISLAM. :chains:

 

[Gunny]

So you would agree that allowing a non-believer to continue on his way would go against Christian teachings, no? It's your obligation to interfere in his spiritual life, as a service to him. I always thought that's where Christians were coming from. It's just that most people who aren't Christians don't understand that. Or am I off base?

No. Christ teaches to not waste one's time on those who are unwilling to listen. Spreading His word IS part of Christianity; however, attempting to forcefeed it to people is NOT a Christian principle, and those who do so are misinterpreting His word to suit their own agendas.

 

[The ClayTaurus]

You make it sound like we convert people at gunpoint. It's pointless to "convert" someone if they don't do so willingly with full acceptance. If someone converts, they'll thank us for the favor.

The point I was making wasn't that I think Christians convert people at gunpoint, but rather many non-Christians don't understand the evangelization idea. They see a Christian talking to them about their faith as threatening, when it shouldn't be. While you may or may not want to be a Christian, you should at least be able to appreciate the fact that someone thinks enough of you to try and "save" you.

I know Christians of many kinds - those who will tell you all about their religion if you ask them, and those that will tell you all about it if you don't ask them.

All I was saying is, some people don't understand the second group of people and their motivations, and I think if they did, there would be a lot less tension.

 

[The ClayTaurus]

Actually, thats not even possible. ITS IMPOSSIBLE to convert someone at gunpoint. You can only convert their heart, and it is done only by true, effective persuasion. NOTHING FORCED, nothing phoney. Presenting them with truth and allowing them to decide for themselves, thats the Christian way, Gods way.

Now, if you wish to talk about forcing converts at gunpoint, lets talk about that religion you and some others seem to think we should be more tolerant of, ISLAM. :chains:

But how long do you present them with truth? As long as it takes?

 

[dmp]

The point I was making wasn't that I think Christians convert people at gunpoint, but rather many non-Christians don't understand the evangelization idea. They see a Christian talking to them about their faith as threatening, when it shouldn't be. While you may or may not want to be a Christian, you should at least be able to appreciate the fact that someone thinks enough of you to try and "save" you.

I know Christians of many kinds - those who will tell you all about their religion if you ask them, and those that will tell you all about it if you don't ask them.

All I was saying is, some people don't understand the second group of people and their motivations, and I think if they did, there would be a lot less tension.

I think every non-christian who hears the truth feels uncomfortable at some point. Most people don't like to be confronted with truth which shows our faults.

 

[dmp]

But how long do you present them with truth? As long as it takes?

I believe Christians have done more harm than good at times, when it comes to sharing their faith with non-believers. I believe most people, say, in a friendship relationship, will be drawn to a Christians reason, kindness, hope and junk and stuff, more than 'hearing it' from the Christian's mouth.

 

[The ClayTaurus]

I believe Christians have done more harm than good at times, when it comes to sharing their faith with non-believers. I believe most people, say, in a friendship relationship, will be drawn to a Christians reason, kindness, hope and junk and stuff, more than 'hearing it' from the Christian's mouth.

Very true. I've known a handful of people who begin to look very desperate at their attempt to convert you, almost as if their ticket to heaven depended on it. Most Christians I know are more of the show through example type.

 

[dmp]

Very true. I've known a handful of people who begin to look very desperate at their attempt to convert you, almost as if their ticket to heaven depended on it. Most Christians I know are more of the show through example type.

Right - The days of standing on street corners shouting at people are over. Today people are just as hungry for answers, but almost seemed conditioned against God. They turn to drugs, sexual addictions, worse? in an attempt to find peace. To find Meaning in life. No, a Christian's ticket to heaven - ANYONE's ticket to heaven is as simple as this:

Believe what Christ said as 'true'. All or nothing, really.

 

[Powerman]

So I guess I'm the only one that wants to watch Donnie Darko after reading the thread title eh?