Does the Israeli government represent world Jewery?

[abi]

This is the most unbiased look at this question I have yet seen. It's only around 10 minutes. Please attack the rabbis points if you disagree with any. Also, please use facts to substantiate your position.

This is such an important issue to understand when discussing Israel, the Jewish people and all that has happened in Palestine.

In this interview, Rabbi Yaakov Shapiro, rabbi of Beis Medrash of Bayswater, explains the motives behind the claims of Netanyahu and other Israeli leaders to represent all Jews. He explains how Zionism, starting from Theodor Herzl, unilaterally arrogated to itself the right to speak in the name of world Jewry. Rabbi Shapiro explains the motives behind this and the danger it poses to the Jewish people.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

So you lost on your self determination thread and instead start this to attack Jews.

 

[abi]

I am not attacking. There is no way you watched it. Please stop trolling.

 

[skye]

Why are you so obsessed with Israel, OP?

Is this constant hatred for Israel part of your work? part of your life..somehow? just curious.

 

[abi]

How do you people twist this into my hatred? I have a book being published and I want both sides of the story. These false charges only serve to derail threads.

Listen to the rabbi. Did he say something incorrect? Please say what, exactly, and why. Use facts from a legitimate source to back your claim if possible.

 

[abi]

In depth analysis! Rabbi Yaakov Shapiro reacts to #Jerusalem being declared the capital of Israel, and explains that the Jewish people relate to Jerusalem as a holy city, not as a political capital city. Jerusalem as the capital of the "Jews" is a #Zionist fiction, and conflicts directly with the teachings of #Judaism.

To all those countries considering moving their embassies, please know that this would only benefit Israel and the Zionists, and has no benefit to the Jewish people at large. Israel does NOT represent world Jewry.



Could we find a more unbiased source?

 

[Ringel05]

This is the most unbiased look at this question I have yet seen. It's only around 10 minutes. Please attack the rabbis points if you disagree with any. Also, please use facts to substantiate your position.

This is such an important issue to understand when discussing Israel, the Jewish people and all that has happened in Palestine.

In this interview, Rabbi Yaakov Shapiro, rabbi of Beis Medrash of Bayswater, explains the motives behind the claims of Netanyahu and other Israeli leaders to represent all Jews. He explains how Zionism, starting from Theodor Herzl, unilaterally arrogated to itself the right to speak in the name of world Jewry. Rabbi Shapiro explains the motives behind this and the danger it poses to the Jewish people

So, do you agree with the Rabbi? If so then why?

 

[abi]

So, do you agree with the Rabbi? If so then why?

After reading this board for so long, I must say that what he says seems far more reasonable than the zionist claims. I would call it indisputable, but I know this board to well now.

 

[Ringel05]

So, do you agree with the Rabbi? If so then why?

After reading this board for so long, I must say that what he says seems far more reasonable than the zionist claims. I would call it indisputable, but I know this board to well now.

Then you should look into 'Confirmation Bias' unless, of course, you can find empirical evidence to back up your belief. Note that I stipulated 'empirical evidence', not disjointed snippets taken out of context or opinions that support your bias.
Good luck, I don't expect to hear back from you for a looooooong, looooooong time if ever.

 

[beagle9]

Why would the Jewish people not want their capital in Jerusalem ?? Are they afraid to want that ??

 

[abi]

Why would the Jewish people not want their capital in Jerusalem ?? Are they afraid to want that ??

Because we see it as the greatest danger to the Jewish people.

 

[beagle9]

Why would the Jewish people not want their capital in Jerusalem ?? Are they afraid to want that ??

Because we see it as the greatest danger to the Jewish people.

. Why on Earth would that be ? Doesn't the word Jerusalem mean where the Jewish people live and are originally from ?

 

[abi]

. Why on Earth would that be ? Doesn't the word Jerusalem mean where the Jewish people live and are originally from ?

Watch both videos. Listen to the rabbi. And Abraham was from what is now Iraq and spent most of his time in today's Syria. That is based on the bible. There is no actual historical evidence for Abraham, so it depends on what you accept as historical evidence.

Anyways, definitely not the point of the thread. This is about a political entity speaking for a religious one that exists on other continents.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Jerusalem as capitol of Israel only threatens Jews world wide if your buddies the Arabs chose to murder Jews over it.

 

[beagle9]

. Why on Earth would that be ? Doesn't the word Jerusalem mean where the Jewish people live and are originally from ?

Watch both videos. Listen to the rabbi. And Abraham was from what is now Iraq and spent most of his time in today's Syria. That is based on the bible. There is no actual historical evidence for Abraham, so it depends on what you accept as historical evidence.

Anyways, definitely not the point of the thread. This is about a political entity speaking for a religious one that exists on other continents.

. How are Jews and Jerusalem related ??

 

[flacaltenn]

This is the most unbiased look at this question I have yet seen. It's only around 10 minutes. Please attack the rabbis points if you disagree with any. Also, please use facts to substantiate your position.

This is such an important issue to understand when discussing Israel, the Jewish people and all that has happened in Palestine.

In this interview, Rabbi Yaakov Shapiro, rabbi of Beis Medrash of Bayswater, explains the motives behind the claims of Netanyahu and other Israeli leaders to represent all Jews. He explains how Zionism, starting from Theodor Herzl, unilaterally arrogated to itself the right to speak in the name of world Jewry. Rabbi Shapiro explains the motives behind this and the danger it poses to the Jewish people.

Yet another NK endorsing, Holocaust denying, Hitler conspiracy endorsing Rabbi? Only so many of them around. You seem to know them all. Pretty marginal fixation you got there bubbalah.. No NK rabbis outside of NYC -- maybe LA.. It's a figment of your self-hating imagination that their views are ANYWHERE near important. Even IN Israel.. But especially in America.

Louie888 was also totally enamored with the NK movement. Religious zealots that are SHUNNED by most of Jewry for their pansy ass attitude about Diaspora being BEST for "their people". Folks so fixated on their OPINION that God wants Jews scattered throughout the world UNTIL he gives the signal to "return to Zion". So -- did YOUR Rabbi ever tell you Abi that Jews should wait for the Word of God to return to the nation of Israel?

 

[abi]

Yet another NK endorsing, Holocaust denying, Hitler conspiracy endorsing Rabbi?

You need to back up such an antisemitic attack on a rabbi. Please post your source for this. I would be amazed if true.
And he is not NK. Here is his site:
Bais Medrash Of Bayswater

For once I would love to see you argue a man's facts that you disagree with instead of going on an immediate attack.

 

[flacaltenn]

. Why on Earth would that be ? Doesn't the word Jerusalem mean where the Jewish people live and are originally from ?

Watch both videos. Listen to the rabbi. And Abraham was from what is now Iraq and spent most of his time in today's Syria. That is based on the bible. There is no actual historical evidence for Abraham, so it depends on what you accept as historical evidence.

Anyways, definitely not the point of the thread. This is about a political entity speaking for a religious one that exists on other continents.

. How are Jews and Jerusalem related ??

Bunches of stuff our resident "jewish anti-Zionist Abi never learned in Sunday Schule.

The first mention of Zion in the Bible is 2 Samuel 5:7: “David captured the fortress of Zion—which is the City of David.” Zion was originally an ancient Jebusite fortress in the city of Jerusalem. After David’s conquest of the fortress, Jerusalem became a possession of Israel. The royal palace was built there, and Zion/Jerusalem became the seat of power in Israel’s kingdom..

Jerusalem in Judaism - Wikipedia

For example, the book of Psalms, which has been frequently recited and memorized by Jews for centuries, says:

• "By the rivers of Babylon we sat down and wept when we remembered Zion." (Psalms 137:1)
• "For there they that carried us away captive required of us a song; and they that wasted us required of us mirth, saying, Sing us one of the songs of Zion. How shall we sing the LORD's song in a strange land? If I forget thee, O Jerusalem, let my right hand forget her cunning . If I do not remember thee, let my tongue cleave to the roof of my mouth; if I prefer not Jerusalem above my chief joy. Remember, O LORD, the children of Edom in the day of Jerusalem; who said, Raze it, raze it, even to the foundation thereof; O daughter of Babylon, that art to be destroyed; happy shall he be, that repay eth thee as thou hast served us. Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones." (Psalms 137:3–9) (King James Version, with italics for words not in the original Hebrew)
• "O God, the nations have entered into your inheritance, they have defiled the sanctuary of your holiness, they have turned Jerusalem into heaps of rubble...they have shed their blood like water round Jerusalem..." (Psalms 79:1–3);
• "...O Jerusalem, the built up Jerusalem is like a city that is united together...Pray for the peace of Jerusalem..." (Psalms 122:2–6);
• "Jerusalem is surrounded by mountains as God surrounds his people forever" (Psalms 125:3);
• "The builder of Jerusalem is God, the outcast of Israel he will gather in...Praise God O Jerusalem, laud your God O Zion." (Psalms 147:2–12)

Jewish religious writings contain thousands of references to Jerusalem, some of which are included in the following:

• If one is praying in the Land of Israel, he should direct his heart towards Jerusalem; If he is standing in Jerusalem, he should face towards the Holy Temple — Brachot 27a
• Why are the fruits of Ginosar not found in Jerusalem? So that the pilgrims should not say "were it only incumbent on us to eat the fruits of Ginosar in Jerusalem, it would be enough" — Pesachim 8b
• In the future the Holy One will expand Jerusalem to the extent that a horse will flee and its owner will be able to recover it [while still being within the city’s limits] — Pesachim 50a
• Jerusalem was not divided among the tribes — Yoma 12a
• A snake or scorpion never injured anyone in Jerusalem — Yoma 21a
• Whoever did not see Jerusalem in her glory has never seen a beautiful city — Sukkah 51b
• Ten measures of beauty descended to the world, Jerusalem took nine — Kidushin 49b
• Jerusalem is the light of the world — Bereshit Rabbah 59
• Jerusalem will not be rebuilt until the ingathering of the exiles has occurred — Tanchuma Noach 11
• The Land of Israel sits at the centre of the world and Jerusalem sits at the centre of the Land of Israel — Tanchuma Kedoshim 10
• Why did the omnipresent not create warm springs in Jerusalem, like those of Tiberias? So a person should not say “Let us ascend to Jerusalem in order to bathe” — Sifre Behaalotecha 89
• There is no beauty like that of Jerusalem — Avot of Rabbi Natan 28
• Ten miracles occurred for our forefathers in Jerusalem — Avot of Rabbi Natan 35
• ”From all your tribes” – This refers to Jerusalem because all Israel are partners in her — Avot of Rabbi Natan 35
• In the future all the nations and kingdoms will be gathered unto Jerusalem — Avot of Rabbi Natan 35
• All who pray in Jerusalem - it is as if he prayed before the throne of glory, because the gate of heaven is situated there — Pirkei de-Rabbi Eliezer 35
• In the merit of Jerusalem I split the sea for them — Yalkut Shimoni Isaiah 473
• In the future the suburbs of Jerusalem will be filled with precious stones and jewels and all of Israel will come and take them — Yalkut Shimoni Isaiah 478
• From the day Jerusalem was destroyed, God has no joy, until He rebuilds Jerusalem and returns Israel to it — Yalkut Shimoni Lamentations 1009

All these Neturei Karta weirdos that Abi is fascinated by -- REJECT all this overwhelming attachment to Jerusalem and even Israel. THEY believe God WANTS the Jews dispersed and homeless and vulnerable. Until a REVELATION is disclosed to some future future prophet to reconstitute the Nation of Israel. Because Jews were naughty or some other damn theory..

Abi uses this marginalized sect as an EXCUSE to taunt mainstream Jews into opposing Zionism. But I THINK -- it stems from the fact -- that Abi was never exposed to the TOTALITY of Judaism --- if at all...

 

[flacaltenn]

Yet another NK endorsing, Holocaust denying, Hitler conspiracy endorsing Rabbi?

You need to back up such an antisemitic attack on a rabbi. Please post your source for this. I would be amazed if true.
And he is not NK. Here is his site:
Bais Medrash Of Bayswater

For once I would love to see you argue a man's facts that you disagree with instead of going on an immediate attack.

He has a site. It's at truetorah.com. All the marginalized NK crap is on display there. INCLUDING the snide and cynical comments about Zionists being responsible for the Holocaust. Because they didn't suck up to Hitler.

 

[abi]

Neither I nor the rabbi disagreed with any of that. Watch the videos again and if you find anything at all incorrect, please let me know with supporting evidence.
That mile long copy/paste means nothing we don't already understand.