Do You Understand The Concept Of Tithing?

[CMike]

But what I want for you is to prosper, not persevere. To put the O back in GOD. To live in peace with your neighbors, and to fully enjoy the Lord.
Do you think God doesn't know who you are talking about if you leave the o out? You have nothing to fear from a loving God.

Once again you understand little about judaism.

The reason jews don't spell it out is because it's almost like using his name in vain.

If it's deleted or erased it's considered disrespectful to G-D.

However, it's considered okay to spell it out on internet, because it's not the same as paper, but I still do it anyway as a sign of respect.

 

[MaryL]

So a guy with Muslim ideologue like Malcolm X (Ya know the same ISALM that slaughtered thousands of innocent Americans ON 9/11) for icon NOW wants answers. Isn't precious or what?

 

[CMike]

Except Mohammad isn't Jewish. The Christian Bible concentrates on the Jew and the Gentile. To dis Jesus is to pervert the New Testament, yet you doing so doesn't insult me in the least. The earth may pass away, but Christ's words will endure forever.

A few prophecies:
1 Messiah would be born of a woman. Genesis 3:15 Matthew 1:20
Galatians 4:4
2 Messiah would be born in Bethlehem. Micah 5:2 Matthew 2:1
Luke 2:4-6
3 Messiah would be born of a virgin. Isaiah 7:14 Matthew 1:22-23
Luke 1:26-31
4 Messiah would come from the line of Abraham. Genesis 12:3
Genesis 22:18 Matthew 1:1
Romans 9:5
5 Messiah would be a descendant of Isaac. Genesis 17:19
Genesis 21:12 Luke 3:34
6 Messiah would be a descendant of Jacob. Numbers 24:17 Matthew 1:2
7 Messiah would come from the tribe of Judah. Genesis 49:10 Luke 3:33
Hebrews 7:14
8 Messiah would be heir to King David's throne. 2 Samuel 7:12-13
Isaiah 9:7 Luke 1:32-33
Romans 1:3
9 Messiah's throne will be anointed and eternal. Psalm 45:6-7
Daniel 2:44 Luke 1:33
Hebrews 1:8-12
10 Messiah would be called Immanuel. Isaiah 7:14 Matthew 1:23
11 Messiah would spend a season in Egypt. Hosea 11:1 Matthew 2:14-15
12 A massacre of children would happen at Messiah's birthplace. Jeremiah 31:15 Matthew 2:16-18
13 A messenger would prepare the way for Messiah Isaiah 40:3-5 Luke 3:3-6
14 Messiah would be rejected by his own people. Psalm 69:8
Isaiah 53:3 John 1:11
John 7:5
15 Messiah would be a prophet. Deuteronomy 18:15 Acts 3:20-22
16 Messiah would be preceded by Elijah. Malachi 4:5-6 Matthew 11:13-14
17 Messiah would be declared the Son of God. Psalm 2:7 Matthew 3:16-17
18 Messiah would be called a Nazarene. Isaiah 11:1 Matthew 2:23
19 Messiah would bring light to Galilee. Isaiah 9:1-2 Matthew 4:13-16
20 Messiah would speak in parables. Psalm 78:2-4
Isaiah 6:9-10 Matthew 13:10-15, 34-35
21 Messiah would be sent to heal the brokenhearted. Isaiah 61:1-2 Luke 4:18-19
22 Messiah would be a priest after the order of Melchizedek. Psalm 110:4 Hebrews 5:5-6
23 Messiah would be called King. Psalm 2:6
Zechariah 9:9 Matthew 27:37
Mark 11:7-11
24 Messiah would be praised by little children. Psalm 8:2 Matthew 21:16
25 Messiah would be betrayed. Psalm 41:9
Zechariah 11:12-13 Luke 22:47-48
Matthew 26:14-16
26 Messiah's price money would be used to buy a potter's field. Zechariah 11:12-13 Matthew 27:9-10
27 Messiah would be falsely accused. Psalm 35:11 Mark 14:57-58
28 Messiah would be silent before his accusers. Isaiah 53:7 Mark 15:4-5
29 Messiah would be spat upon and struck. Isaiah 50:6 Matthew 26:67
30 Messiah would be hated without cause. Psalm 35:19
Psalm 69:4 John 15:24-25
31 Messiah would be crucified with criminals. Isaiah 53:12 Matthew 27:38
Mark 15:27-28
32 Messiah would be given vinegar to drink. Psalm 69:21 Matthew 27:34
John 19:28-30
33 Messiah's hands and feet would be pierced. Psalm 22:16
Zechariah 12:10 John 20:25-27
34 Messiah would be mocked and ridiculed. Psalm 22:7-8 Luke 23:35
35 Soldiers would gamble for Messiah's garments. Psalm 22:18 Luke 23:34
Matthew 27:35-36
36 Messiah's bones would not be broken. Exodus 12:46
Psalm 34:20 John 19:33-36
37 Messiah would be forsaken by God. Psalm 22:1 Matthew 27:46
38 Messiah would pray for his enemies. Psalm 109:4 Luke 23:34
39 Soldiers would pierce Messiah's side. Zechariah 12:10 John 19:34
40 Messiah would be buried with the rich. Isaiah 53:9 Matthew 27:57-60
41 Messiah would resurrect from the dead. Psalm 16:10
Psalm 49:15 Matthew 28:2-7
Acts 2:22-32
42 Messiah would ascend to heaven. Psalm 24:7-10 Mark 16:19
Luke 24:51
43 Messiah would be seated at God's right hand. Psalm 68:18
44 Messiah would be a sacrifice for sin. Isaiah 53:5-12 Romans 5:6-8
.

Just about all of these are based on mistranslations of the text

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Except Mohammad isn't Jewish. The Christian Bible concentrates on the Jew and the Gentile. To dis Jesus is to pervert the New Testament, yet you doing so doesn't insult me in the least. The earth may pass away, but Christ's words will endure forever.

Once jesus proclaimed himself a god and former jews followed him they weren't considered jews anymore. According to Judaism you have to pick your god.

A few prophecies:
1 Messiah would be born of a woman. Genesis 3:15 Matthew 1:20
Galatians 4:4

Yeah, no kidding. Most people are born from a woman.

3 Messiah would be born of a virgin. Isaiah 7:14 Matthew 1:22-23
Luke 1:26-31
4 Messiah would come from the line of Abraham. Genesis 12:3
Genesis 22:18 Matthew 1:1
Romans 9:5

Wrong. Christians once again perverted the Torah. The passage in Isaiah says the messiah will be born from a young maiden. Batulah is a virgen.

8 Messiah would be heir to King David's throne. 2 Samuel 7:12-13
Isaiah 9:7 Luke 1:32-33
Romans 1:3

That's true. Jesus wasn't


If you want to deal with each passage one at a time I'll be happy to. However, I'm not going to respond to such a list with no passages.

Here are the actual messianic prophesies. My commentary in blue.

Ezekiel 37


21. And say to them, So says the Lord God: Behold I will take the children of Israel from among the nations where they have gone, and I will gather them from every side, and I will bring them to their land.All the jew will go to Israel





22. And I will make them into one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel, and one king shall be to them all as a king; and they shall no longer be two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms anymore.There will be one unified king



23. And they shall no longer defile themselves with their idols, with their detestable things, or with all their transgressions, and I will save them from all their habitations in which they have sinned, and I will purify them, and they shall be to Me as a people, and I will be to them as a God.All nations will worship one G-D





24. And My servant David shall be king over them, and one shepherd shall be for them all, and they shall walk in My ordinances and observe My statutes and perform them.The messiah will be a descendent of David



25. And they shall dwell on the land that I have given to My servant, to Jacob, wherein your forefathers lived; and they shall dwell upon it, they and their children and their children's children, forever; and My servant David shall be their prince forever.All the jews will not only god to Israel but stay there




26. And I will form a covenant of peace for them, an everlasting covenant shall be with them; and I will establish them and I will multiply them, and I will place My Sanctuary in their midst forever.The the temple in jerusalem will be rebuilt and stand forever



27. And My dwelling place shall be over them, and I will be to them for a God, and they shall be to Me as a people.



28. And the nations shall know that I am the Lord, Who sanctifies Israel, when My Sanctuary is in their midst forever."
All nations will worship one G-D, and the temple in jerusalem will stand forever.

Michah 4

3. And he shall judge between many peoples and reprove mighty nations afar off; and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks; nations shall not lift the sword against nation; neither shall they learn war anymore. World peace

So may have not noticed but:

• We don't have world peace
• All the jews are not in Israel
• All the jews aren't staying in Israel
• There hasn't been one unified king of the jews
• The temple in jerusalem has not been rebuilt. In fact, it was shortly after jesus that it was destroyed
• Jesus was not a descendent of David
• The messiah will be a mortal man

And most importantly G-D said to worship no one but him in any manner. He also said he is one. There are no separate parts.

G-D said one of the three sins you are supposed to sacrifice your life for is to worship anyone other than the one true G-D.

So for a jew to worship Jesus is the gravest of sins. It's an affront to G-D.

In fact, G-D specifically told jews not to worship gods that they do not know, and if someone tries to get them to do so to treat them harshly.

So worship whatever you want; a person, a chair,a golden calf, jesus, buddah, baal, whatever. However, you should know that the Torah in no way validates these beliefs.

Jesus was a descendant of King David. Scripture verifies this.

 

[CMike]

Whose scripture?

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Whose scripture?

Yours and mine, Mike. ( Torah & NT )
Numerous times.

-Jeremiah

 

[CMike]

Tribal lineage goes by the father, and we don't know who was jesus' actual father.

 

[The Irish Ram]

Mike, I'm puzzled about your, ''God wants us to persevere through one calamity after another, to bring us close to Him" mindset.
David relied on God in battle all the time. And was victorious. The apple of God's eye should have never asked His father for help. How disappointing for God, for David to rely on Him instead of himself.
and:
As much as God loved Abraham, while the two of them laughed and ate stew around the campfire, why didn't He give Abraham the Law, so Abraham could have had the same relationship with God that you are "blessed" with? Or at least start Jacob/Israel out on the right foot by giving Him the Law?

Or Adam. All Adam had to do to be close to God, was to ask Him questions as they walked together in the cool of the evening. Looks to me like God had every thing done for Adam before Adam made the scene. Was it an oversight not to let Adam produce His own Eden? Even in disobedience, God provided/clothed Adam. Why didn't G-d let them clothe themselves, so they could be more pleasing to Him?
Why did G-d make your ancestors follow Him to the promised land, instead of giving Moses the Law at the beginning of their journey? Why wait until they asked for an alternative to God's mercy?
In fact, why help at all? 400 years of slavery/perseverance should have made G-d giddy with joy.
Blood on the door for the angel of death to passover? Can't you kill your enemies on your own? Why defer your job to an angel?
If God wants YOU to rely on yourself, Why are you waiting for your Messiah? Isn't that looking forward to the day you can stop persevering and rely on someone else?

 

[MarcATL]

Tithing of tithe, is the concept of giving God 10 percent of your increase.

That is, ten percent (10%) of everything you earn, monetarily of course.

So if you make 3,000 a month, your tithe should be 300 a month.

Do you find yourself wondering why would God need your money?

Do you understand what's this all about?

What's your understanding of this?

My understanding is the what the Holy Spirit has shown me about tithing. God loves a cheerful giver. That is good enough for me. I'm not under the law.

I must tell you though that what I see taking place in the churches is very disturbing. You see, Satan has led the ministers to believe that a big church with a big bank account is evidence of Gods favor, evidence of their spirituality, their position in the evangelical community. This is NOT the measure of a successful church. This is evidence of the Laeodeican church.

What did Jesus say about the Laeodician church? Revelation Chapter 3. Jesus told them you say you are rich, have been increased with many possessions are in need of nothing! But you are miserable, blind, naked, wretched and poor......... That describes your mega churches to a "T". Doesn't it? Sure it does!!

When I see a preacher driving a bentley with a rolex on his wrist while his congregation has children without shoes, decent clothing? Single parents struggling to pay their electric bill and this man is going to say God bless you on the way out the door and not give them any assistance when he knows they are hurting? How is that possibly showing forth the love of God? Yet this is what we see with the churches today and no where more pronounced than the evangelical churches. I mean seriously folks. Jesus had no place to lay his head and these guys are living the high life and teaching others its about naming and claiming it, blabbing and grabbing, coveting everything they see a church member owns and you expect people to see Jesus in that? lol.. Come on now! Doesn't James warn against heaping up silver in the end days? Yes he did. I believe its the 5th chapter. The Just shall live by Faith. What do you suppose that means? Let me just cut to the chase here.......

These guys are the modern day money changers. Books sold from the pulpit, tapes too, merchandising the gospel, using the scriptures on tithes and offerings to excess because they are greedy for filthy lucre. Manipulating, coercing, intimidating, flattering, throwing in a "thus sayeth the Lord" whoever gives a 1000 dollars tonight...... Luddley is right. What is going on in many churches these days is indeed "a racket".. I like that one, Luddley! Racket! I think the LORD is definitely thinking the same thing!! ha! ha! ha! Is God fun or what? I love him! Okay so lets get down to what a successful church really is...........

A successful church could be 10 members on fire for God who reach out to their communities, shut ins, doing intercessory prayer meetings and living holy. The church I attend right now has about 15 people. All 15 totally sold out to God.

I've never heard my preacher give a sermon on money. EVER. In fact, Jesus never did have anything good to say about money did he? It was all warnings and to tell you the truth the people I see in the greatest danger these days are the ministers who are pushing the money gospel. I don't believe they realise they can lose their salvation over it. But they can. To whom much is given much is required was fair enough warning for you guys.

There was a preacher whom Reinhard Bonke raised from the dead back a few years ago who actually died after hitting a tree with his car, saw hell, came back to life and tells the story of seeing preachers in hell who were robbing the church treasury. You didn't think Judas was the last one to do that and end up in hell, did you?

Why do we bring tithes and offerings into the storehouse. So there will be meat in the storehouse. So where is the meat for the storehouse going? Some are building multi million dollar buildings rather than using it for what it was meant for. Do you realise that the Christians in America spend more money on dog food than on missions? It's true.

The last non denominational church * (before the Lord led me to the church where I am now..) I was at I had to confront the preacher about his vision for the church. Like you he asssumed a successful church was a huge one paid for, a large bank account and membership busting at the seams. That is a lukewarm church in disaster mode. Its the Laeodicean church Jesus warns about at the end of the age and its rampant, friend! Are you with me? Hope so because when Jesus said that road was "narrow"?? He meant it. Have a nice evening, Pastor. - Jeremiah

One word - POWERFUL!!!!

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Tribal lineage goes by the father, and we don't know who was jesus' actual father.

Then we cannot discount that Jesus may have been from the lineage of King David. Correct?

 

[Caroljo]

Tithing is usually prevalent in smaller independent churches that do not have the infrastructure for more unorganized giving.

God is just fine without money, however churches are buildings with maintenance and mortgages, reverends need to eat, and that organ doesnt play itself.

Really? And what specifically did Jesus endorse as far as mortgages, houses of worship and commercial ventures?

He didn't. YOU are the church. YOU are the house of worship ( you are the temple of the Holy Ghost!!! ) The Church isn't a building. The early Church met at various homes and they worshiped daily. There was no Church Building per se. They gave all they had and they had all things in common. The people were united as one in Christ.

I believe we are going to see persecution such as we have never seen, the money changers will be long gone, the backslidden and lukewarm will be no where in sight, the people will be meeting in their homes or will meet in some underground type church meeting situation such as China has been doing for years now. I believe there are 100 million christians in the underground Chinese church meetings right now. ( the three self church is communist ) China 's church is so beautiful! Oh that the west could see the purity and holiness of the chinese church and how passionate those people are. It is so beautiful!

Exactly.....God said where 2 or more gather in His name, he will be there also. I don't believe you have to go to a "building" to worship God! I don't go to church, i meet with other Christians weekly for Bible Study. Everyone brings a dish to pass, we eat together, then pray together.

Also, i do believe in the end days we will be doing just this, because we'll all be outcasts and condemned for our beliefs. The only church "buildings" will be for the people that are only Christian because they say they are....the ones that go to those "feel good" mega church's that really don't teach the whole Bible, only the parts they like.

There's a huge church in Lansing Michigan....an old building that takes up an entire block. You can't go there if you don't tithe, and i believe it's way more than 10%. It's for the rich....if you're poor and can't give, they won't let you in the doors! I will never again belong to any certain denomination again (with their man made rules).

 

[Caroljo]

Don't forget tithing of food saved them from famine. The Word is far cooler than any Priest or Minister can give you a synopsis of.

If you throw yourself at it and read it cover to cover for starters to get a true grip on it's greatness, then you can go back and study different passages. And trust me, the" begats" will kill you.

But it's truly awesome. I feel sorry for those who only go to their Churches and no matter how sweet the Pastor or the Priest throwing out one small passage to you it won't cut it.

But that's usually all they get. That's one man's opinion on the Word of Jehovah instead of reading the Bible for themselves and letting the Holy Spirit guide them.

IMHO

Many believe, and i'm one, that tithing doesn't mean just MONEY. I believe it also includes giving, sharing, helping others. If you have no money, try to give 10% or more of your TIME to help others. It's giving up something of value to you to help others that are struggling. God never said we had to meet in a building called a Church....he did suggest that Christians mingle with other like minded Christians for support, but he didn't say where this needed to happen.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

In the city I live in the mega churches won't provide marriage counseling, any financial assistance, emergency help unless you tithe off your gross & you have to provide your tax returns. I feel that is just too much pressure on the people, Caroljo, it grieves me that there is such an emphasis on this when the focus should be Jesus.

Yes, I agree with you. You and I are having church right now. Where the Spirit of the Lord is there is liberty. Wherever we gather, there He is! - Jeremiah

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Thanks, MarcATL.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Don't forget tithing of food saved them from famine. The Word is far cooler than any Priest or Minister can give you a synopsis of.

If you throw yourself at it and read it cover to cover for starters to get a true grip on it's greatness, then you can go back and study different passages. And trust me, the" begats" will kill you.

But it's truly awesome. I feel sorry for those who only go to their Churches and no matter how sweet the Pastor or the Priest throwing out one small passage to you it won't cut it.

But that's usually all they get. That's one man's opinion on the Word of Jehovah instead of reading the Bible for themselves and letting the Holy Spirit guide them.

IMHO

Yes, you are speaking of being led by the Spirit. The bible says those that are the Sons of God are led by the Spirit of God. Being Led by the Spirit is Key to giving because He can let you know of a need someone has without that person ever opening their mouth.

I like seeing the look on a strangers face when you give to them in Jesus name. I'm pretty bold about and will just say Jesus told me to give you this, hand it to them and walk away. I have to believe those type encounters are what God uses to eventually save those people or bring them back if they were wandering.

-Jeremiah

Many believe, and i'm one, that tithing doesn't mean just MONEY. I believe it also includes giving, sharing, helping others. If you have no money, try to give 10% or more of your TIME to help others. It's giving up something of value to you to help others that are struggling. God never said we had to meet in a building called a Church....he did suggest that Christians mingle with other like minded Christians for support, but he didn't say where this needed to happen.

Amen.

 

[Caroljo]

Tithing of tithe, is the concept of giving God 10 percent of your increase.

That is, ten percent (10%) of everything you earn, monetarily of course.

So if you make 3,000 a month, your tithe should be 300 a month.

Do you find yourself wondering why would God need your money?

Do you understand what's this all about?

What's your understanding of this?

money puts food on the table and a roof over your head

lots of money = power = more money = more power

The chatholic church runs things not b/c they can send you off to hell, but b/c of investments

Temple owns miles upon miles of Philly and the surrounding area

The lutheran church I got married in spent $6 million on a gym that's never been used for a single game in ~10 years, the preacher makes $80K where the median is $30


Tithing HAD a great intention, and I'm certain some places still use it as it was meant for, but honestly the only real exceptions are the Salvation Army and Red Cross, the rest are in it for the power.

Exactly why i will donate what i can to both Salvation Army & Red Cross. I'll give to different charities....because this way i KNOW where my money is going.

 

[MarcATL]

The norm of most all of the churches I used to go to was build, build, build.
The last big church I went to spent 30K a piece for 6 stained glass windows.
I now go to a church where we rent out retail store space for $2500 a month. It seats 350 and we bought used chairs for $12 a piece.
We have no building fund to erect a 5 million dollar church.
We follow Christ instead and help others instead of building mansions.
We pass no plate and we do not pick political candidates.

Thanks for sharing this Brother. Sounds like you've found a good church.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

The norm of most all of the churches I used to go to was build, build, build.
The last big church I went to spent 30K a piece for 6 stained glass windows.
I now go to a church where we rent out retail store space for $2500 a month. It seats 350 and we bought used chairs for $12 a piece.
We have no building fund to erect a 5 million dollar church.
We follow Christ instead and help others instead of building mansions.
We pass no plate and we do not pick political candidates.

Thanks for sharing this Brother. Sounds like you've found a good church.

I agree, this is definitely a great example his church is showing forth. There are lots of good churches out there like this and the Lord will bless the heart of these Pastors. They have got it right. In our church we give generously but we also offer to do things for our Pastor, like fixing his roof at his house, whatever he needs. He is a real blessing to us and we want to be a blessing to him in every way we can be.

- Jeremiah

 

[CMike]

Tribal lineage goes by the father, and we don't know who was jesus' actual father.

Then we cannot discount that Jesus may have been from the lineage of King David. Correct?

Incorrect. If tribal lineage is not known they are classifed as an Israelite- the general jewish population.

 

[CMike]

That is not at all what I stated.

G-D set the law and the moral code.

You can do the right thing or the wrong thing. There is the temptation to do the wrong thing.

Using your willpower to not give in to the temptation and to do the right thing brings us closer to G-D.

Mike, I'm puzzled about your, ''God wants us to persevere through one calamity after another, to bring us close to Him" mindset.
David relied on God in battle all the time. And was victorious. The apple of God's eye should have never asked His father for help. How disappointing for God, for David to rely on Him instead of himself.
and:
As much as God loved Abraham, while the two of them laughed and ate stew around the campfire, why didn't He give Abraham the Law, so Abraham could have had the same relationship with God that you are "blessed" with? Or at least start Jacob/Israel out on the right foot by giving Him the Law?

Or Adam. All Adam had to do to be close to God, was to ask Him questions as they walked together in the cool of the evening. Looks to me like God had every thing done for Adam before Adam made the scene. Was it an oversight not to let Adam produce His own Eden? Even in disobedience, God provided/clothed Adam. Why didn't G-d let them clothe themselves, so they could be more pleasing to Him?
Why did G-d make your ancestors follow Him to the promised land, instead of giving Moses the Law at the beginning of their journey? Why wait until they asked for an alternative to God's mercy?
In fact, why help at all? 400 years of slavery/perseverance should have made G-d giddy with joy.
Blood on the door for the angel of death to passover? Can't you kill your enemies on your own? Why defer your job to an angel?
If God wants YOU to rely on yourself, Why are you waiting for your Messiah? Isn't that looking forward to the day you can stop persevering and rely on someone else?