Do we want the Ukraine in NATO? POLL

[Decus]

All the tough talk by Trump and his little sucklings on this forum was just so much pig shit.

Just as we knew it was.

Nothing regarding the Ukraine/Russia happened yet except for ship restricted travel, so your critique' is premature. By giving/selling the Ukes advanced weaponry Trump already did more than Obama to contain Putin. If/when the shooting starts, with Russia already out of money due to the low price of oil, Putin doesn't want to waste what little money he has on a war in Ukraine.

Do you really think those few things we sold to the Ukraine makes them a match for the Russian military?

If you do I have a nice bridge for sell

The same thing was said about the Afghans. If the Ukrainians decide to fight, the Russians will have to commit a significant number of troops to the effort with little certainty of victory.

.

The Ukraine is not Afghanistan. The people are different and more importantly the terrain is different.

We are finding out the same thing about Afghanistan as Russia did, but we are too stupid to cut our losses and leave

The will to prevail is an important factor in David vs. Goliath type conflicts. The Vietnamese beat back three significantly larger and better equipped armies in modern history - first the French, then the US and subsequently the Chinese. Having the will and fighting for one's homeland are a powerful combo.

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[Pete7469]

Something asinine as usual

..., says a white person fascist hater.

Think about this...

Lets say we minded our own business. Lets say we sold guns and oil to anyone with money, ignored the japs killing millions of chinks, because Mao was going to have killed them anyway. Lets say Hitler forced the limies to end the war and he was free to take out the bolsheviks. How many Russians might still be alive if Stalin had not been around to purge them for 30 more years? How many more chinks would the japs have killed than Mao did? 50 Million took him quite a while. Would hitler have killed all the jews if he had some place in Siberia or elsewhere to put them? They had been considering relocating them to the middle east if what I I was informed correctly.

Imagine if we stayed out of WW1 and Germany didn't find itself having to surrender it's dignity in the first place?

No hitler.... No WW2... No Nuclear weapons being built....

As far as I'm concerned the entire Eastern Hemisphere can be divided between the ruskies and chinks and it's the euroweenie's own fault for turning into pussies.

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[georgephillip]

It would seem challenging Russia over Ukraine would be another losing proposition. Putin's supply lines are just too much shorter than ours, at least according to Larry Wilkerson, former chief-of-staff to Colin Powell.

Yeah, wow....how would the United States ever come up with a solution to a problem / challenge that looks so impossible to overcome? Never been done before....Oh, wait....


View attachment 231311
www.historynet.com

The Berlin Airlift: The End of the Blockade. By spring 1949, it was clear that the Soviet blockade of West Berlin had failed. It had not persuaded West Berliners to reject their allies in the West, nor had it prevented the creation of a unified West German state.


Berlin Airlift - HISTORY

https://www.history.com/topics/cold-war/berlin-airlift

Your link:

"As far as the western Allies were concerned, withdrawal from the city was not an option. 'If we withdraw,' said the American military commander, 'our position in Europe is threatened, and Communism will run rampant.'

"President Harry Truman echoed this sentiment: “We shall stay,” he declared, “period.” Using military force to strike back against the Soviet blockade seemed equally unwise: The risk of turning the Cold War into an actual war—even worse, a nuclear war—was just too great. Finding another way to re-provision the city seemed to the Allies to be the only reasonable response."

Do you see any realistic way of supporting Ukraine today without risking an actual war?

If Americans were really asked to fulfill Article 5 of the NATO treaty who do you think should be expected to die for Donetsk?

Nobody in his CS family.

 

[SobieskiSavedEurope]

Something asinine as usual

..., says a white person fascist hater.

Think about this...

Lets say we minded our own business. Lets say we sold guns and oil to anyone with money, ignored the japs killing millions of chinks, because Mao was going to have killed them anyway. Lets say Hitler forced the limies to end the war and he was free to take out the bolsheviks. How many Russians might still be alive if Stalin had not been around to purge them for 30 more years? How many more chinks would the japs have killed than Mao did? 50 Million took him quite a while. Would hitler have killed all the jews if he had some place in Siberia or elsewhere to put them? They had been considering relocating them to the middle east if what I I was informed correctly.

Imagine if we stayed out of WW1 and Germany didn't find itself having to surrender it's dignity in the first place?

No hitler.... No WW2... No Nuclear weapons being built....

As far as I'm concerned the entire Eastern Hemisphere can be divided between the ruskies and chinks and it's the euroweenie's own fault for turning into pussies.

.

LOL, Germany would've been more impotent, if it was wiped off the map in WW1.

As for Ukraine, what's wrong with Ukraine in NATO?

 

[georgephillip]

It would seem challenging Russia over Ukraine would be another losing proposition. Putin's supply lines are just too much shorter than ours, at least according to Larry Wilkerson, former chief-of-staff to Colin Powell.

Yeah, wow....how would the United States ever come up with a solution to a problem / challenge that looks so impossible to overcome? Never been done before....Oh, wait....


View attachment 231311
www.historynet.com

The Berlin Airlift: The End of the Blockade. By spring 1949, it was clear that the Soviet blockade of West Berlin had failed. It had not persuaded West Berliners to reject their allies in the West, nor had it prevented the creation of a unified West German state.


Berlin Airlift - HISTORY

https://www.history.com/topics/cold-war/berlin-airlift

You want our troops dying in Afghanistan and now you want them dying in the Ukraine but lack the balls to put on the combat boots and do it yourself.




Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

Russia won't accept NATO expanding into Ukraine in spite of the opinions of US neocons like Trump:

Moscow & NATO Playing a 'Dangerous Tit-For-Tat Game' in the Ukraine

"So their (Russian) military exercises since about 2013 have been postulated on a NATO invasion of the near abroad, and even a NATO invasion of Russia proper. So this is the way they do their military exercises.

"Clearly they’re not doing that because they think spending all that money on that preposterous possible situation is just that: preposterous.

"They think it’s a probability, or at least a possibility.

"So we’re giving them the incentive to do this.

"And to fight over Ukraine–you remember the old expression 'Who would die for Danzig?'

"I keep asking myself, if Americans really were asked to fulfill Article 5 of the NATO treaty for a place like Tbilisi, or even a place like Riga, or any of those countries we’ve now expanded NATO into or proposed expanding NATO into, like Ukraine, what would Americans say when they were told that full conscription was in process, full mobilization was in process, war taxes are going to be levied, and we’re going to war for a city you can’t even pronounce and couldn’t find on a map?

"That’s what we’re talking about. And oh, by the way, Russia is generally speaking cheek and jowl with that city, whereas we’re ten thousand miles away."

 

[there4eyeM]

What will be done the day Putin says, "I'll nuke New York and Los Angeles unless I get my way and I don't care if the world burns don't if I don't get my way!"?

 

[georgephillip]

What will be done the day Putin says, "I'll nuke New York and Los Angeles unless I get my way and I don't care if the world burns don't if I don't get my way!"?

Putin sees NATO (and US) expansion into Ukraine as a direct threat to Russia just as any POTUS would view Russian forces in Mexico as a threat to his/her homeland. If Putin resorts to nuclear weapons they will likely be tactical devices deployed to stall a NATO invasion of his "near abroad" or even his own homeland.

UKRAINE --- People are deceived by the U.S. / EU - Nazis and fascists in control of government