Zone1 Did Jesus come to save the Jews?

[The Irish Ram]

Jesus went off-message to become a revolutionary. Like most of that ilk, he wanted to overthrow the High Priests to become some infallible and omnipotent Jewish pope

If Jesus came here to overthrow the Pharisees and become a Pope, He would have. Pope is a concept not mentioned in the Bible. He came to fulfill Jewish Law, and did so. He was then and is now and forever will be a Jewish Rabbi.

Hebrews 13:8 says, “Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.

When He returns, it will be, once again, to the Jews. Christ is not Catholic. He will not be showing up at the Vatican, but on the Mount of Olives. This time He stays and will reside in the City of David, not Rome. And the 7 candle sticks He plans on bringing to Him to the Temple are all Paul's churches. The Catholic Church isn't even mentioned in Christ's prophecy of the future. Replacement theology is man's conception, not the Lord's.

 

[jwoodie]

Jesus went off-message to become a revolutionary.

What message did he go off?

 

[The Irish Ram]

He gave the Jews first crack at it knowing most would reject him. His real commission was to the other tribes.

Can you site that for me? I don't recall the scripture that distinguishes Christ's real commission to save certain groups of Jews over another. When in the Bible did Jesus leave one Jewish tribe to go save a different tribe? And did the other tribes welcome Him? I can't substantiate that with scripture. Did He come specifically to save the tribe of Levites? Did they accept Him, or was Christ a failure? I need the scripture that confirms that. Of the hordes of Jews that followed Him around, I don't recall Jesus ever asking them what tribe they belonged to, or that His real mission was only meant for certain Jews and not others.

There were 12 tribes, because of one man, that God renamed Israel. The 12 tribes were Jacob's children and grand children. They all started from the exact same line/tribe.

Zac: 12:8-9 On that day the LORD will shield those who live in Jerusalem, so that the feeblest among them will be like David, and the house of David will be like God, like the angel of the LORD going before them. On that day, I will set out to destroy all the nations that attack Jerusalem. < WW3.

Jews from every tribe live in Jerusalem, then and now. And He is going to salvage what is left of every one of them during WW3.

Romans 11 "And in this way all Israel will be saved, as it is written, 'The Deliverer will come from Zion, he will banish ungodliness from Jacob." < including the tribe of Judah, David's line, and the Levites (His mother's line).

Christ is actually a mix of 2 tribes. Judah and the Levites.

 

[The Irish Ram]

Those weren't Jews. They were Gentiles (Israelites) from the region of Galilee and Samaria.

While some Gentiles lived among them, Jesus never made the distinction between Jews in Galilee and Jews in Judea. All under the control of Herod. John was Jewish. Peter was very Jewish. Both from the Sea of Galilee, which was predominantly Jewish. I have no scripture that says, Jesus divided Jews by their tribes, forsook some and ministered to others. Regardless of where they lived, if they practiced the Law, then Christ showed up to fulfill it for them. Christ had no ill will with the Jews living in Jerusalem, (who you think He abandoned?) but preached to them, in the Temple and in the streets until He died there. It is where Peter started his church, and where thousands were converted. And our God is the God of Israel, not just a few from a tribe He likes better. And He gathered the Jews from all over the world back to Israel, and will protect them all, regardless of tribal affiliation

 

[BreezeWood]

What part of "Render Unto Caesar" don't you understand?

nothing to understand - forgeries and fallacies of the christian bible.

never claimed by jesus - that is a forgery made in the 4th century attributed to jesus by the crucifiers that never occurred.

 

[BreezeWood]

He attracted thousands and thousands of Jews. In one case alone, he fed 5,000 men with a few fish and loaves of bread. They didn't count women or children back then. That # could easily have been doubled. The crowds that followed Him at one point tried to get so close to Him that they were pushing Him into the sea. He got in a boat to minister to them.

really, without a single contemporary account being recorded much less someone just crucified walking the streets without being rearrested.

the Jews replied, “His blood is on us and on our children!” 27:24-25

- the 4th century christian bible says otherwise than the cheering crowds.

 

[BreezeWood]

However you embellish or alter the story doesn't change the text. Jesus came for his people, Jews, and recruited Jews to join his company.

nothing more than locality - the exemplars had no religious persuasion whatsoever they are secular - liberation theology, self determination is applicable to everyone. they are not egomaniacs, religion of apartheid.

 

[MarcATL]

Jesus was a Jew and a Rabbi. His interpretation of some aspects of the Torah were clearly inaccurate but I've never viewed him in a negative light. In fact, he has been a most important figure for all the Abrahamic religions.

During his time he upset too many people. He clearly didn't deserve to die and if he were living in a free country today he would not have been. The Romans certainly didn't allow much dissention did they?

Was it the Jews or the Romans that ultimately caused Jesus' death?

 

[shockedcanadian]

Was it the Jews or the Romans that ultimately caused Jesus' death?

The Romans. The Jewish higher authority.at the time were angry with him and considered him blasphemous, perhaps even a threat to their power. Their complaints wouldn't have been even a seriois consideration for Pontius Pilate beyond a minor nuisance, the Romans ruled with an iron fist and they put to death countless people,.often for relatively frivolous reasons, especially non-Romans. Jesus was just another unfortunate victim of Roman rule.

 

[SweetSue92]

Jews are generally blithely unaware of how they attract negative feelings of others upon themselves. Part of God's curse I think.

Get into a church.

You need it

 

[luiza]

Did Jesus come to save the Jews?


No . He came to save the bacon .
Essenes loved roasted Pharisee .

 

[Woodznutz]

Can you site that for me? I don't recall the scripture that distinguishes Christ's real commission to save certain groups of Jews over another. When in the Bible did Jesus leave one Jewish tribe to go save a different tribe? And did the other tribes welcome Him? I can't substantiate that with scripture. Did He come specifically to save the tribe of Levites? Did they accept Him, or was Christ a failure? I need the scripture that confirms that. Of the hordes of Jews that followed Him around, I don't recall Jesus ever asking them what tribe they belonged to, or that His real mission was only meant for certain Jews and not others.

There were 12 tribes, because of one man, that God renamed Israel. The 12 tribes were Jacob's children and grand children. They all started from the exact same line/tribe.

Zac: 12:8-9 On that day the LORD will shield those who live in Jerusalem, so that the feeblest among them will be like David, and the house of David will be like God, like the angel of the LORD going before them. On that day, I will set out to destroy all the nations that attack Jerusalem. < WW3.

Jews from every tribe live in Jerusalem, then and now. And He is going to salvage what is left of every one of them during WW3.

Romans 11 "And in this way all Israel will be saved, as it is written, 'The Deliverer will come from Zion, he will banish ungodliness from Jacob." < including the tribe of Judah, David's line, and the Levites (His mother's line).

Christ is actually a mix of 2 tribes. Judah and the Levites.

All Jews are Israelites, but not all Israelites are Jews. Since the God ordained split in the days of Rehoboam and Jeroboam Israel was divided into two kingdoms; the southern kingdom, the 'house of Judah' comprised of the Jews, Levites, and the Benjamite's.

The ten-tribe northern kingdom was thereafter called 'the house of Israel'. This distinction was made in scripture from that time forward, even to the time of Jesus.

Jesus stated that he was "sent only to the lost sheep of the "house of Israel", the scattered remains of the northern kingdom still living in the region of Galilee and Samaria. The throngs of people that came to him from that region were the poor that had been left after the Assyrian conquest of the northern kingdom.

 

[Woodznutz]

While some Gentiles lived among them, Jesus never made the distinction between Jews in Galilee and Jews in Judea. All under the control of Herod. John was Jewish. Peter was very Jewish. Both from the Sea of Galilee, which was predominantly Jewish. I have no scripture that says, Jesus divided Jews by their tribes, forsook some and ministered to others. Regardless of where they lived, if they practiced the Law, then Christ showed up to fulfill it for them. Christ had no ill will with the Jews living in Jerusalem, (who you think He abandoned?) but preached to them, in the Temple and in the streets until He died there. It is where Peter started his church, and where thousands were converted. And our God is the God of Israel, not just a few from a tribe He likes better. And He gathered the Jews from all over the world back to Israel, and will protect them all, regardless of tribal affiliation

Most Jews in Judea rejected Jesus and wanted him dead. Jewish influence and participation in the NT church was dead by the fourth century.

John 1:

10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.

11 He came unto his own, and his own (the Jews) received him not.

 

[Woodznutz]

Get into a church.

You need it

I learned this in Bible study. Can't unlearn it.

 

[Woodznutz]

Get into a church.

You need it

I'm in a church that doesn't treat the Bible as a bunch of children's stories. Some serious stuff in there.

 

[BreezeWood]

Get into a church.

I'm in a church that doesn't treat the Bible as a bunch of children's stories. Some serious stuff in there.

Did Jesus come to save the Jews?​

the Jews replied, “His blood is on us and on our children!” Matthew 27:24-25

the simple answer is no and certainly not to save judaism something the jews found less than pleasing - nor are the false commandments by the 4th century christian bible remitted as the 1st century events would require for a religion represented by jesus - nor did jesus ever claim to be a messiah - that will never be from the heavens.

 

[norwegen]

Was it the Jews or the Romans that ultimately caused Jesus' death?

The Jews.

 

[The Irish Ram]

All Jews are Israelites, but not all Israelites are Jews. Since the God ordained split in the days of Rehoboam and Jeroboam Israel was divided into two kingdoms; the southern kingdom, the 'house of Judah' comprised of the Jews, Levites, and the Benjamite's.

The ten-tribe northern kingdom was thereafter called 'the house of Israel'. This distinction was made in scripture from that time forward, even to the time of Jesus.

Jesus stated that he was "sent only to the lost sheep of the "house of Israel", the scattered remains of the northern kingdom still living in the region of Galilee and Samaria. The throngs of people that came to him from that region were the poor that had been left after the Assyrian conquest of the northern kingdom.

I understand history, but the tribes united a thousand years before Jesus showed up. Jesus sent disciples all over the place to the scattered Jews, and told them to avoid the gentiles and Samaritans.
The "lost sheep" were lost spiritually, not physically. If a Jew or Israelite, if you prefer, was under the law, Jesus fulfilled it for them, regardless of locality. It wasn't until His resurrection that He told the disciples to preach His salvation to all the world.
Here it is clarified that Jesus made no distinction between the Jew and Israelite:

Romans 15:8 For I tell you that Christ has become a servant of the circumcised on behalf of God's truth, to confirm the promises made to the patriarchs.

 

[norwegen]

Did Jesus come to save the Jews?


No . He came to save the bacon .
Essenes loved roasted Pharisee .

Jesus didn’t appear to have had any political affiliations. Nor did his disciples, except for Simon the Zealot, of course. Why Jesus chose him, I don’t know.

At any rate, your being facetious is not entirely unfounded, I don’t think, as many think the gospels were penned as fiction. And honestly, after all was said and done, perhaps they were. Perhaps the purpose they served for the surviving Jews of the Jewish rebellions was to explain away the destruction of their temple and culture.

But then, of course, Paul presents a problem, as his undisputed letters casually mention on occasion that looming calamity. This is one bit of evidence that convinces me of the veracity of the Scriptures, or at least of the New Testament, as before Christ, the Israelites were idolatrous, insolent, warmongering drunkards. I have trouble imagining that their portrayal of their God as genocidal and vindictive is accurate. The way their later writers wrote of Him – after Christ – is much more believable.

And you know what? The story of the later writers is entirely Jewish. Paul claimed he was of Benjamin. To what measure, I don’t know; he was also a Pharisee. Essentially, the story is Jewish. Ephraim had already had her day in divorce court, and lost. And her migration back to Judea centuries later probably amounted to next to nothing, if anything, her lineage being bred out of her in the meantime.

 

[MarcATL]

The Romans. The Jewish higher authority.at the time were angry with him and considered him blasphemous, perhaps even a threat to their power. Their complaints wouldn't have been even a seriois consideration for Pontius Pilate beyond a minor nuisance, the Romans ruled with an iron fist and they put to death countless people,.often for relatively frivolous reasons, especially non-Romans. Jesus was just another unfortunate victim of Roman rule.

What you're stating here isn't Biblical, therefore blasphemous.

Check yourself.