"Democrats at a Crossroads" -- But WHY is that?

[citygator]

Two things to start:

1. You still think demographics are destiny? You've seen the Hispanic numbers right? hahahah

2. Please, please, please please please please please bring your Blue State Soy Boys to Flyover Country to start that war. Oh. DO IT

1. Yes. Less bad numbers for republicans are stil bad numbers
2. Stop being dramatic. US has too many creature comforts to implode. Plus there is no money in flyover land and that’s what wins.

 

[bendog]

Thread sort of went off topic. I'm more than selective in what political books I read. Hillbilly Eulogy may have been the last. And that guy sold his won integrity to suck up to the Trumpbots. Back to the OT:

I think the dems disconnected with their base when they chose to favor one race over another, and give money to those who don't want to work. imo that sums up the Biden disaster and BBB. And it explains how and why Nixon and then Reagan succeeded electorally.

Working class people do not appreciate hand outs. Student loans? Community colleges here attract basically two types. One you go for free with a working class family and HS GPA above 3 and live at home. Two max out loans with no intention of ever getting a degree. Guess what group One thinks of Two?

It's not that poor people vote against their interests. It's that they literally have more in common with the 1% if they aren't welfare deadbeats.

And in the South it IS exacerbated by race.

 

[odanny]

, which I found funny because the Democrats have done nothing but tear us apart for decades.

This basically renders your argument null and void.

Talk about an amazing lack of self awareness...

 

[22lcidw]

Oh, I don't know... maybe I'm an old man, but I've been hearing this kind of stuff since the 1970's...

Trump was an anamoly, the combination of celebrity obsession, a flawed, anachronistic form of selecting presidents, and that the Democrats nominated someone even THEY really didn't like.

You are globalist. And we are becoming impoverished because of many who think like you.

 

[odanny]

Tell the Great White Unwashed what they want to hear, generate a decent-sized sucker-base, and presto-chango, you've got a Presidency on your hands...

And, once in power, considerable numbers of better-educated Whites started drifting into the Rumpian Camp, seeing it as being in their own best interests...

The only reason why that White Vote re-crystalization failed the Republicans in 2020 was that their Orange -tinted candidate proved unfit for high office...

But that was a temporary pause in White Vote re-crystalization necessitated by Rump's existential threat to American representative democracy...

And now, with the Democrats back in power, and with Whites hostile over gas prices, inflation, the southern border, Afghanistan, Russia, etc., well...

The Democrats... hopelessly mired in minority vote-whoring and unable to openly advance an agenda for White Folk, are rapidly losing that demographic...

 

[citygator]

• Buy time for demographics to take over and fight gerrymandering

I'm not so sure about the demographics. Hispanics are more conservative than Democrats assume, and are breaking away as we speak. Gerrymandering is an absolute catastrophe and must be addressed for any progress to be made..

• Move away from culture discussions to policy where democrats win

Absolutely. Personally, I put the Democrats' reliance on, and weaponization of, PC & Identity Politics at the top of the list of reasons this has happened. And I've formed that opinion simply by paying attention to what white people say.

• Move aggressively to shore up elderly support by shoring up their financial security and healthcare

You really would think they would own this already. I don't get it.

• Recapture the patriotism discussion by branding republicans as radically UnAmerican theocrats

This one drives me nuts. The Democrats do the exact OPPOSITE of what they should be doing when they criticize the flag or (most recently) the Fourth of July. They are just HANDING those things to the GOP. Instead of going against those very American institutions, they should be saying "That is MY flag, TOO. NOT YOURS. You can't have it."

• When all else fails start a war we can win and gain land - kidding. Kinda.

Yikes

I think the Hispanic shift is overblown. A Hispanic woman won a special election in Texas and Florida Cubans liked Trump. That’s the movement. There is some Hispanic leakage on democrat support as a result of having no clear border strategy though but if Biden doesn’t fix that it’s not just Hispanics.

 

[22lcidw]

Work in inner cities and visit the projects. Endless poverty that the social welfare programs promote.

 

[Mac-7]

No, we really weren't. Our military was considered a joke, not only before the war, but well into it.

During the North African Campaign, the US Army performed so poorly at first that the British remarked, "We found our Italians!"

Americans had no desire for old world style politics

Before and after WWI we were WWI isolationist

But since 1900 we had the biggest economy and broadest standard of living

 

[citygator]

Do you look at that as the primary early driving factor of the tribalism we see today?

People had more time to build collaboration in the passed. If a politician even thinks about a compromise hardliners (on both sides) are on twitter before you get the thought out of your head. Almost derailed the infrastructure deal on the democrat side.

 

[22lcidw]

People had more time to build collaboration in the passed. If a politician even thinks about a compromise hardliners (on both sides) are on twitter before you get the thought out of your head. Almost derailed the infrastructure deal on the democrat side.

Losing ten percent of wealth each year now is fun. These people need to be exterminated. And that is giving them mercy.

 

[citygator]

I took the trouble of going to the DNC official page and looking at the platform. Lots and lots and tons of mentions of "President Trump" there, IN THE PLATFORM. Here is a whole category of "Healing the Soul of America", which I found funny because the Democrats have done nothing but tear us apart for decades. Here is the first sentence:

Democrats believe in bringing the American people together, not stoking division and distrust. President Trump has denigrated virtually every segment of American society—and in so doing, he has insulted the very idea of America itself.

HEALING THE SOUL OF AMERICA - Democrats

democrats.org

That...is some amazing lack of self-awareness right there. The party of Race Supremacy, all the -phobias, all the -isms, just now wants to say, 'Nope, wasn't us'. That is nuclear bomb level trust-destroying stuff. What that first sentence needs to be is an APOLOGY or at the very least, an explanation. But I know they're not up to that. Just an abject denial.

Anyway, you are losing politically and you are losing the culture. You'll be lucky to come out of this with an intact party to be honest.

Now do the Republican one.

 

[Burgermeister]

Dems have aligned with various Marxist strategies to bring down the US, and most of them don't know it - classic useful idiots. It's propagated from the labor unions, community organizers, and universities to mainstream Democrat-speak. Would be difficult to walk it back at this point even if they wanted to.

 

[citygator]

Losing ten percent of wealth each year now is fun. These people need to be exterminated. And that is giving them mercy.

Not sure what you mean.

 

[citygator]

Dems have aligned with various Marxist strategies to bring down the US, and most of them don't know it - classic useful idiots. It's propagated from the labor unions, community organizers, and universities to mainstream Democrat-speak. Would be difficult to walk it back at this point even if they wanted to.

Link? Evidence? Rational thoughts?

 

[odanny]

Dems have aligned with various Marxist strategies to bring down the US,

Of course they have.

Speaking of useful idiots...

 

[struth]

"Why?" is a question that is no longer asked in American political discussion, perhaps because it risks honesty and self-reflection. We can't have THAT. Honest curiosity -- one of the most valuable of human traits, one that leads to great innovation and progress -- appears to be a characteristic that is dripping away from us by the day, causing our thought process to calcify. The results of that are clear.

Interesting piece here about where the Democrats are today. My question at the bottom.

The Democrats at a Crossroads

Michael Kazin’s new book examines the contradictory past and uncertain future of the Democratic Party.

www.thenation.com

"Gradually for decades, and then rapidly since the 2008 financial crisis, the Democrats have lost the loyalty of white Americans who are below the median income level and who live in rural America—that is, they have lost a large part of their original constituency. They have remained competitive partly by persuading many affluent and educated metropolitan voters, who tend to be liberal on social issues and conservative on economic ones—a category that used to dominate the liberal wing of the Republican Party, when it had a liberal wing—to switch parties.

"The congressional districts with the highest median incomes now overwhelmingly send Democrats to Congress. Michael Podhorzer, an analyst at the AFL-CIO, calls this set of changes in who votes for which party “the Great Reversal.” This isn’t just an American phenomenon; roughly the same dynamic is playing out all over the world."

So here is my "why" question: If the above is true and fair, WHY have the Democrats lost white voters like they have?

I'd love to see how those here who are Left of center would answer that.

I think it's the same reason we see them losing hispanic voters, and why a record number of African-Americans voted for Trump.....

The Dems, have gone full demafascist with their policies, and working Americans are realizing their true nature and how their policies are oppressive

 

[miketx]

First the democrats have a hugely popular agenda.

 

[bendog]

I thought the thread was about decade(s) trends. But the dems ran train on Trump in 18 by focusing on middle class economic issues, like getting your kids in good public schools and healthcare and retirement. The Gop is going to run train on Biden in 22 on the same issues.

 

[Mac1958]

I thought the thread was about decade(s) trends. But the dems ran train on Trump in 18 by focusing on middle class economic issues, like getting your kids in good public schools and healthcare and retirement. The Gop is going to run train on Biden in 22 on the same issues.

How did that switch happen?

 

[miketx]

How did that switch happen?

Y'all stole the election.