CDZ Democrat Party and Taxation

[2aguy]

Democrats seem excited about their opportunities to make things better. I hope they are right, but I do not understand how taking a sizable portion of workers money and offering less choices does that?

A false dichotomy. Right wingers have no better solutions at lower cost. This is all the right wing knows how to do while alleging they are for free market Capitalism:

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

How is it a false dichotomy when some states pay tremendous taxes for the same schools and roads? The status quo without increased pain to wage earners would be better wouldn't it? I'm still not seeing the services provided for the extra burden on working people. I'm not saying national programs are impossible in the US, though I would caution that a program that works in one country might not automatically be applicable to the US. Our attempt at heath care raised the price of healthcare. Trying to make college free would make people who don't attend college pay the burden of those who do. It doesn't have to be difficult. You don't have to speculate about 'pure' capitalism, or whatever form we have. I simply want to know if the service provided by increased taxes will help Americans or make their lives more difficult.

Keep in mind too......foriegn countries with national healthcare systems are going bust.....the healthcare system are unsustainable, and have only been able to keep going so far because the U.S. is covering the national security expenses of those countries with National health systems...when that ends, those systems will crash much faster than they are now...and they are crashing now....

 

[Donald H]

The concept of 'FREE' money fits right in with this topic. In Canada we receive a lot more free money than Americans do and that's directly related to democracy and taxation. In America's case, more taxation by the Democratic party.

Taxation is good! That's a general principle that can't be argued. And when taxes are applied correctly and fairly to both the richest and the poorest, the later result is FREE money. Canadians can talk from experience, as we have the highest 'quality of life' in the entire world. This is due to equitable taxation of the people in good times so that the FREE money can flow back to the people in hard times.

And so why would any American talk in a derogatory way about taxation?

Isn't the real problem the lack of equitable taxation of the wealthiest? Can it be equitable when two of the top billionaires have the equivalent of half the country's poorest people?

The FREE money in that instance is the money the billionaires were permitted to earn without having to pay their bills to the people who earned it for them, and they also didn't pay the bill to the country that provided them the opportunity to earn their huge hordes of money.

Ask me how it works Americans. It's been kept a secret from the American people for far too long!

 

[Donald H]

Keep in mind too......foriegn countries with national healthcare systems are going bust.....the healthcare system are unsustainable, and have only been able to keep going so far because the U.S. is covering the national security expenses of those countries with National health systems...when that ends, those systems will crash much faster than they are now...and they are crashing now....

Countries with government run universal health care are the most prosperous countries in the world if prosperity is measured by the quality of life of the people. Canada has the highest quality of life in the entire world and the next 9 or the top ten all have universal health care that is administered by government.
Oh, and their health care is rated better quality than America's in all 10 instances.

 

[sartre play]

ACA may be able to be improved until we get just the right fix, just take the political propaganda out of the mix. all sides working for a solution,. Not just a political win for their party.

 

[task0778]

ACA may be able to be improved until we get just the right fix, just take the political propaganda out of the mix. all sides working for a solution,. Not just a political win for their party.

I think there are a lot of people (not just repubs) who believe that the ACA has to be discarded and until that happens the political propaganda will not go away. Throw it out and start fresh or forget about a bipartisan solution. If it's still the ACA the Left will claim a win and the Right is not going to accept that. I don't think it'll work anyway without the insurance mandate or one hell of a big new tax hike. Maybe a consumption tax.

 

[Donald H]

ACA may be able to be improved until we get just the right fix, just take the political propaganda out of the mix. all sides working for a solution,. Not just a political win for their party.

I think there are a lot of people (not just repubs) who believe that the ACA has to be discarded and until that happens the political propaganda will not go away. Throw it out and start fresh or forget about a bipartisan solution. If it's still the ACA the Left will claim a win and the Right is not going to accept that. I don't think it'll work anyway without the insurance mandate or one hell of a big new tax hike. Maybe a consumption tax.

There's very little chance that the people of America will ever get a good and affordable universal health care system. There's just far too much hate and racism to ever allow it to happen.

Only government can do it and that lesson should have been learned and clearly understood by now.
Obama had it right but unfortunately his skin was the wrong colour for south going Americans.
best wishes from Canada.

 

[task0778]

ACA may be able to be improved until we get just the right fix, just take the political propaganda out of the mix. all sides working for a solution,. Not just a political win for their party.

I think there are a lot of people (not just repubs) who believe that the ACA has to be discarded and until that happens the political propaganda will not go away. Throw it out and start fresh or forget about a bipartisan solution. If it's still the ACA the Left will claim a win and the Right is not going to accept that. I don't think it'll work anyway without the insurance mandate or one hell of a big new tax hike. Maybe a consumption tax.

There's very little chance that the people of America will ever get a good and affordable universal health care system. There's just far too much hate and racism to ever allow it to happen.

Only government can do it and that lesson should have been learned and clearly understood by now.
Obama had it right but unfortunately his skin was the wrong colour for south going Americans.
best wishes from Canada.

Might be a few other reasons, dude. Like too expensive, too many people and too few providers.

If you believe the ACA failed because of Obama's skin color then you are sadly mistaken.

South going Americans? What does that mean?

Best wishes for you guys up there in the frigid north. So, do you think you guys have good and affordable health care system? Not sure many of your compatriots up there agree with you if you do. Far as I can tell, UHC systems suck everywhere they've been tried. A few of our states have tried it or looked at trying it but it didn't work out. We don't have enough providers for it to be good, and it's too expensive here for it to be affordable here. Gov't run health care? Like the VA? LOL, no thanks.

 

[flacaltenn]

Democrats seem excited about their opportunities to make things better. I hope they are right, but I do not understand how taking a sizable portion of workers money and offering less choices does that?

A false dichotomy. Right wingers have no better solutions at lower cost. This is all the right wing knows how to do while alleging they are for free market Capitalism:

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

Repubs generally aim to solve problems. Democrats aim to solve needs.. A good example was the Soc Sec plan that Bush 2 put out.. When Soc Sec was not dead ass broke as it is today and running Surpluses..

Repubs tried to reason with folks that the Surpluses were being SPENT AND SQUANDERED. And instead of CONTINUING that fraud on the working people -- they proposed funneling the surplus into subsidizing some tiny fraction of volunteers who would accept SMALLER payments in retirement in exchange for a small reduction in their CURRENT FICA liabilities.. It would have bought SAVINGS for TODAY when Soc Sec is running about a $50Bill per year cash deficit funded by debt sold to China.,

Of course the Dems demagogued this to death.. Said the volunteers shouldn't have the ability to direct maybe 10% of their FICA into their OWN retirement, IRA/SEP accounts. Talked as tho the Repubs were trying to roll Granny off the cliff again in her wheel chair..

But all that THEFT of Soc Sec surplus went unabated until the income stream for the Baby Boomer bust went negative about 2010 and the crisis was upon us..,.

 

[Andylusion]

There is no "Democrat Party". Where'd you pick that up? As if I don't know....

How does the left's taxation benefit working people? I'll use California as an example. Their taxes are amongst the highest in the nation, and their schools are bad as well as the roads. Do any of the high tax states have a demonstrable example of how those taxes make life better for the people in those states? I'm don't see why people are so excited about the prospect of giving more income to the layers of bureaucracy. I don't see the benefit the people who live in California and New York get for living that way.

wwwwwhhhhoooooosssshhhhh

If I ask what you are talking about, would you then care to answer why people should be grateful the government is taking more of their money with no results? If it is some uniparty thing, people are still being sold that more taxation is a great thing. Why?

The problem is that in the short term there are results. Short term socialism is generally always fantastic.

Truly it is. In the short term, you get free this, free that, free everything else. It really is utopia.

The problem is, what happens when you run out of other people's money?

Left-wing ideology is completely based on mythology. The myth that "someone else will pay for it".

Typically, this is done by saying "Look at Jeff Bezo! He has $182 Billion dollars! Surely if we tax the rich, we can fund universal health care!"

And if you are a public school failure, you likely have no idea that that is net worth, not net cash, and you can't pay for health care with stock in a company, and even if you could, most can't do basic math to figure out $182 Billion, wouldn't pay for health care for more than a day.

People are amazingly ignorant of the history of the Roman empire. One of the primary reasons the Roman Republic devolved into a cruel dictatorship, was because they spent all their wealth, the nation was in debt, and in order to survive they had to confiscate the wealth of their own citizens, and they needed a strong man dictator to do that, and the people cheered him for slaughtering their own people and taking their stuff.

And we see that today. As much as the left screams about Trump being a dictator, Obama directly said he did not have constitutional authority to change immigration laws, and then did it anyway with DACA by executive order, and people cheered him for it.

You can see how dictatorship will arise in the US, and it will be the left-wing cheering it on.

As it relates to the topic at hand, everyone believes that someone else will foot the bill. Everyone believes that some other person will pay for free education, free health care, free housing, free food, free universal basic income.

When you ask, how will people be better off when government takes their stuff, to pay for it.... well they simply don't believe that, because they don't want to believe that. They don't believe that the lower class in denmark is paying 40% of their income in taxes, and another 20% national sales tax, so they can get free college, and so on.

They simply don't want to believe it. It's that simple. It's not a matter of facts or evidence, it's simply they want to believe the magic government fairy will grant their wishes, and they'll cheer on Caesar if he promises to give it to them.

If you doubt that, just look at Greece. Greece had a deal with the EU, to bail them out. Of course that required cuts to their spending. No one bails someone out, without requiring they make changes to how they live. Otherwise they'll just come back tomorrow asking for more bailouts.

A socialist party stepped up telling the Greek people that they would 'force' the EU to renegotiate their bailouts to not have the cuts. Now even the dumbest of fools outside Greece, could see that obviously you can't "force" someone to lend you money and demand that they have no requirements on the loan. That is ridiculous, but the Greek people overwhelmingly voted that idiot in.

They failed of course, and when the EU realized the Greek people were trying to demand they give them a loan, they cut the loan, Greek defaulted, and the new round of bailouts were even more restrictive than before. They were worse off.

That entire situation of mental disconnection from reality that happened in Greece.... is the entire Democrap party today. An entire party of pathetic children screaming "I WANT IT" at the top of their lungs, thinking that voting will change math and reality on a whim.

As a Christian, this whole thing reminds me of Pilot talking to Jesus. Jesus said "I came to witness to the truth"...and Pilot being a politician in the Roman government under a dictator, sarcastically responded back "What is 'truth'?"

That's the American public of today.

I don't think it is simply about 'free stuff.' I believe they want a society where everybody has tremendous opportunities and options. The problem is that it makes everything more expensive and actually reduces the choices people have. I'd argue that it creates poverty and hardship. Again, I'm not saying huge national plans are impossible, but it grows layers of government, and makes people pay for things that have nothing to do with them. The right is criticized for not having solutions, and rightly so, but I do think they are correct in low government burden and personal choices. The government program would have to be impressive to make up for its costs. I don't think people are being critical enough of how our taxes are spent and the effect of such social engineering.

I would disagree with that. The right-wing does have solutions. Many solutions. They simply don't like the solutions, because that doesn't fit with their equality ideology.

There is nothing complex about the basic concepts that simply put.......

If people have freedom..... then people who use their freedom wisely, will end up better off.
And if people have freedom...... then people who use their freedom poorly, will end up worse off.

This not only normal and good.... but it morally correct.

The left-wing simply doesn't like that. They want those that work hard, start their own company, live out of their car at the plant parking lot for the first 2 years, until they become a success.... to still live on $50,000 a year, like they were a lazy butt who put in barely 40 a week at McDonald's until they were promoted to store manager by simply being the senior employee who stuck around the longest without putting in the effort to move up in life.

Whether the left-wing openly admits this or not, that's the truth. That is exactly why they keep talking about how much more the CEO earns than the employees. Because they think the employees who didn't make the wise, if difficult choices, that the CEO made, should have similar, or at least.... "more equal" outcomes.

Well why? Morally speaking, why should someone who didn't make any of the same choices, be even remotely 'more equal' to those that did?

Have you ever run a business? It's hard work. You ever met people who own businesses? They work 50 to 60 hours a week, every single week, year around.

That's why they make the big bucks.

The right-wing answer, and solution to society is, people should be wiser, and work more, and work smarter, and take responsibility for what they do in life. It's right. It's good. It is morally correct.

 

[alpine]

the fantasy is; democrats are taxing everyone dry and republicans trying to cut taxes all around...
the reality is; the amount of tax collected yoy is in a linear trajectory with the gdp...
so they all tax more or less the same...

there are 2 key differences between democrats and republicans in the case of taxes;

1. who is paying the tax...
2. where the tax is being spent...

and these are pure political and ideological decisions based on priorities...

republicans tend to tax less on the wealthy, assuming they will somehow spend that money more wisely unlike the poor folks who just like to blow it on cheap walmart stuff...
and they double down on the wealthy by spending the taxes on projects that benefit wealthy corporations like in oil and military industries...

while republicans prioritize above a threshold, democrats do prioritize below a threshold...
and for the upcoming biden admin that threshold seems to be sitting somewhere around $400K...
so they will try to collect more of the tax from the folks above that threshold and spend it more in the interest of those folks below the threshold... in terms of healthcare and education...

from my perspective, one could argue both povs...

one could argue rich is rich because they know what to do with money, so we should leave more money in their hands, assuming they will make best out of it for all... meaning a trickle down...

and another could argue rich is rich mostly because they are lucky, so money mostly will trickle into a locked safe if it was allowed to trickle and rather good smart policies will make the most out it...

it would take some highly knowledgeable people debating these points for me or anyone else to come to any conclusions really...

 

[Blues Man]

Democrats seem excited about their opportunities to make things better. I hope they are right, but I do not understand how taking a sizable portion of workers money and offering less choices does that?

A false dichotomy. Right wingers have no better solutions at lower cost. This is all the right wing knows how to do while alleging they are for free market Capitalism:

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

Democrats only care about the debt when republicans are in office

Republicans only care about the debt when democrats are in office.

Democrats are for healthcare reform and increasing the minimum wage.

yeah and all the debt that goes with it

This is all we got from the right wing, and without healthcare reform or raising the minimum wage.

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

you do understand that every single president in our lifetimes including democrats have increased the debt don't you?

 

[danielpalos]

Democrats seem excited about their opportunities to make things better. I hope they are right, but I do not understand how taking a sizable portion of workers money and offering less choices does that?

A false dichotomy. Right wingers have no better solutions at lower cost. This is all the right wing knows how to do while alleging they are for free market Capitalism:

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

Democrats only care about the debt when republicans are in office

Republicans only care about the debt when democrats are in office.

Democrats are for healthcare reform and increasing the minimum wage.

yeah and all the debt that goes with it

This is all we got from the right wing, and without healthcare reform or raising the minimum wage.

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

you do understand that every single president in our lifetimes including democrats have increased the debt don't you?

Clinton the democrat balanced the budget and could have started paying down the debt.

 

[Oldestyle]

Raising taxes to pay for a bloated inefficient Federal Government is akin to pouring water into a bucket that has huge gashes in it's sides! You can keep pouring more and more water into that bucket but until you fix the holes...it's never going to be full!
We desperately need to improve our Government's efficiency before we kill our economy by raising taxes over and over again but the people who work in Government like the status quo and will not willingly change.

 

[Oldestyle]

Democrats seem excited about their opportunities to make things better. I hope they are right, but I do not understand how taking a sizable portion of workers money and offering less choices does that?

A false dichotomy. Right wingers have no better solutions at lower cost. This is all the right wing knows how to do while alleging they are for free market Capitalism:

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

Democrats only care about the debt when republicans are in office

Republicans only care about the debt when democrats are in office.

Democrats are for healthcare reform and increasing the minimum wage.

yeah and all the debt that goes with it

This is all we got from the right wing, and without healthcare reform or raising the minimum wage.

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

you do understand that every single president in our lifetimes including democrats have increased the debt don't you?

Clinton the democrat balanced the budget and could have started paying down the debt.

Clinton never balanced the budget, Daniel! That's a liberal myth that people who never took Economics buy into! The debt increased every year of the Clinton Presidency.

 

[danielpalos]

Democrats seem excited about their opportunities to make things better. I hope they are right, but I do not understand how taking a sizable portion of workers money and offering less choices does that?

A false dichotomy. Right wingers have no better solutions at lower cost. This is all the right wing knows how to do while alleging they are for free market Capitalism:

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

Democrats only care about the debt when republicans are in office

Republicans only care about the debt when democrats are in office.

Democrats are for healthcare reform and increasing the minimum wage.

yeah and all the debt that goes with it

This is all we got from the right wing, and without healthcare reform or raising the minimum wage.

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

you do understand that every single president in our lifetimes including democrats have increased the debt don't you?

Clinton the democrat balanced the budget and could have started paying down the debt.

Clinton never balanced the budget, Daniel! That's a liberal myth that people who never took Economics buy into! The debt increased every year of the Clinton Presidency.

No myth at all. Anyone who actually understands economics will tell you the same thing. The debt and the budget are distinct and not the same thing at all. And, Clinton increased the debt less than the republicans before and after.

 

[Blues Man]

Democrats seem excited about their opportunities to make things better. I hope they are right, but I do not understand how taking a sizable portion of workers money and offering less choices does that?

A false dichotomy. Right wingers have no better solutions at lower cost. This is all the right wing knows how to do while alleging they are for free market Capitalism:

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

Democrats only care about the debt when republicans are in office

Republicans only care about the debt when democrats are in office.

Democrats are for healthcare reform and increasing the minimum wage.

yeah and all the debt that goes with it

This is all we got from the right wing, and without healthcare reform or raising the minimum wage.

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

you do understand that every single president in our lifetimes including democrats have increased the debt don't you?

Clinton the democrat balanced the budget and could have started paying down the debt.

no he didn't pay down any debt.

The debt was higher after Clinton's 2 terms not lower

Presidents That Have Reduced The Federal Debt – Joseph Scott

 

[danielpalos]

Raising taxes to pay for a bloated inefficient Federal Government is akin to pouring water into a bucket that has huge gashes in it's sides! You can keep pouring more and more water into that bucket but until you fix the holes...it's never going to be full!
We desperately need to improve our Government's efficiency before we kill our economy by raising taxes over and over again but the people who work in Government like the status quo and will not willingly change.

Abolish your alleged wars on crime, drugs, and terror. It is only and merely, Big Government nanny-Statism not any form of free market Capitalism. You all don't want to pay for that either unlike good Patriots or you would be for real times of War tax rates to be really really Patriotic.

 

[danielpalos]

Democrats seem excited about their opportunities to make things better. I hope they are right, but I do not understand how taking a sizable portion of workers money and offering less choices does that?

A false dichotomy. Right wingers have no better solutions at lower cost. This is all the right wing knows how to do while alleging they are for free market Capitalism:

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

Democrats only care about the debt when republicans are in office

Republicans only care about the debt when democrats are in office.

Democrats are for healthcare reform and increasing the minimum wage.

yeah and all the debt that goes with it

This is all we got from the right wing, and without healthcare reform or raising the minimum wage.

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

you do understand that every single president in our lifetimes including democrats have increased the debt don't you?

Clinton the democrat balanced the budget and could have started paying down the debt.

no he didn't pay down any debt.

The debt was higher after Clinton's 2 terms not lower

Presidents That Have Reduced The Federal Debt – Joseph Scott

I said he could have Started paying down the debt with massive federal budget surpluses instead of the reverse.

 

[Blues Man]

Democrats seem excited about their opportunities to make things better. I hope they are right, but I do not understand how taking a sizable portion of workers money and offering less choices does that?

A false dichotomy. Right wingers have no better solutions at lower cost. This is all the right wing knows how to do while alleging they are for free market Capitalism:

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

Democrats only care about the debt when republicans are in office

Republicans only care about the debt when democrats are in office.

Democrats are for healthcare reform and increasing the minimum wage.

yeah and all the debt that goes with it

This is all we got from the right wing, and without healthcare reform or raising the minimum wage.

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

you do understand that every single president in our lifetimes including democrats have increased the debt don't you?

Clinton the democrat balanced the budget and could have started paying down the debt.

no he didn't pay down any debt.

The debt was higher after Clinton's 2 terms not lower

Presidents That Have Reduced The Federal Debt – Joseph Scott

I said he could have Started paying down the debt with massive federal budget surpluses instead of the reverse.

Could have would have should have don't mean shit never did never will

 

[danielpalos]

Democrats seem excited about their opportunities to make things better. I hope they are right, but I do not understand how taking a sizable portion of workers money and offering less choices does that?

A false dichotomy. Right wingers have no better solutions at lower cost. This is all the right wing knows how to do while alleging they are for free market Capitalism:

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

Democrats only care about the debt when republicans are in office

Republicans only care about the debt when democrats are in office.

Democrats are for healthcare reform and increasing the minimum wage.

yeah and all the debt that goes with it

This is all we got from the right wing, and without healthcare reform or raising the minimum wage.

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

you do understand that every single president in our lifetimes including democrats have increased the debt don't you?

Clinton the democrat balanced the budget and could have started paying down the debt.

no he didn't pay down any debt.

The debt was higher after Clinton's 2 terms not lower

Presidents That Have Reduced The Federal Debt – Joseph Scott

I said he could have Started paying down the debt with massive federal budget surpluses instead of the reverse.

Could have would have should have don't mean shit never did never will

It was a Rational Choice under our form of Capitalism. Your guy does not have that luxury for the right wing.