"Conventional Wisdom" on Our Elite Campuses

[Adam's Apple]

Not-so-smart College Boys
By Suzanne Fields, Washington Times
November 6, 2006

John Kerry's insult of the troops in Iraq actually offered a little insight. His "advice" to students at Pasadena City Community College in California would have been conventional wisdom on almost any "elite" campus, particularly in the Ivy League, where almost anyone is eager to tell you that only chumps go to Iraq -- or anywhere within the sound of the guns.

For full article:
http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20061105-095545-2634r.htm

 

[Mr.Conley]

John Kerry's insult of the troops in Iraq actually offered a little insight. His "advice" to students at Pasadena City Community College in California would have been conventional wisdom on almost any "elite" campus, particularly in the Ivy League, where almost anyone is eager to tell you that only chumps go to Iraq -- or anywhere within the sound of the guns.

I get what your saying, but honestly, given the choice, why would anyone want to pass on an Ivy League education? I mean, I guess you could join the army afterwards, but going to a top college like Harvard or Princeton is a once in a lifetime opportunity.

 

[dmp]

Intellect will be our downfall, as it will be worshipped over wisdom.........

What HE said...

 

[Mr.Conley]

Wisdom and intellect are not mutually exclusive. Education is an integral part of any person's life. It's important to know the world around you.

 

[dmp]

Wisdom and intellect are not mutually exclusive. Education is an integral part of any person's life. It's important to know the world around you.

They are not - but I've met so few who ballance both. Most unwise/foolish people seek to remedy their lot in life by 'schoolin'. It's near impossible to educate somebody into 'wisdom'.

 

[Adam's Apple]

The extreme contempt in which the military is held by faculty and a majority of students at these universities is not “conventional” in any way. War is a part of life--has been since the beginning of life on earth if we are to believe recorded history--so to denigrate the military as being something heinous, evil--not worthy of “elitist” thinking--is utter nonsense to say the least.

These “intellectual”, condescending elitists don’t seem to realize that, because of a strong, dedicated military, they continue to live in a democracy and are guaranteed the right to pontificate their idealistic, unreal views that have very little to do with the real world, as testified to in the last paragraph of the article. Too bad that our impressionable young people are their audience.

 

[Adam's Apple]

I get what your saying, but honestly, given the choice, why would anyone want to pass on an Ivy League education? I mean, I guess you could join the army afterwards, but going to a top college like Harvard or Princeton is a once in a lifetime opportunity.

Just curious. What is your goal in life? I take it you have very high aspirations. What could a degree from an Ivy League school get you that, in everyday life, a degree from one of our fine state-supported/private schools in the Midwest could not get you?

 

[Mr.Conley]

Just curious. What is your goal in life? I take it you have very high aspirations. What could a degree from an Ivy League school get you that, in everyday life, a degree from one of our fine state-supported/private schools in the Midwest could not get you?

My goal in life is to do well enough that I can choose to live my life as I see fit. I don't want anyone to have any control over me or my family. I want to decide what it is I do, when I do it, where, why, and for who. Plus I want to make a lot of money. My plan is to spend a couple of years in IB, and then move back to my family's business, and expand it many times over. A Harvard education helps me accomplish this because it grants me the ability to decide all of these things. A Harvard degree is in demand. Companies want people with Ivy degrees, and they'll pay more to get it, a lot more. Plus there's job security. Most importantly, I don't have to worry being out of work. If I ever have to leave on job there will always be a dozen more open.

Now, why is the Ivy League held in such high regard? Here are a few reasons:
1. It's a hell of a lot easier to get a job or internship with a Harvard degree.

2. People respect a Harvard degree more than a state school degree

3. Harvard has deeper pockets and more resources than a state school

4. Most investment banking firms (who pay as much as $200,000 from day one) recruit exclusively at Ivy-caliber schools.

5. Most professors are at the top of their fields.

6. The students are intellectually active and involved.

7. The course work is interesting and challenging, something I never found at my public school from 5th-7th grades (then again, my state college curriculum isn't dumbed down).

8. The dorms are nicer.

9. Connections

 

[Mr.Conley]

They are not - but I've met so few who ballance both. Most unwise/foolish people seek to remedy their lot in life by 'schoolin'. It's near impossible to educate somebody into 'wisdom'.

Yes, but knowledge is still necessary if we are to understand the world. We cannot pursue wisdom while forgetting knowledge.

 

[The ClayTaurus]

Wisdom and intellect are not mutually exclusive.

Indeed.

However, each are worthless without the other.

 

[Mr.Conley]

The extreme contempt in which the military is held by faculty and a majority of students at these universities is not “conventional” in any way. War is a part of life--has been since the beginning of life on earth if we are to believe recorded history--so to denigrate the military as being something heinous, evil--not worthy of “elitist” thinking--is utter nonsense to say the least.

These “intellectual”, condescending elitists don’t seem to realize that, because of a strong, dedicated military, they continue to live in a democracy and are guaranteed the right to pontificate their idealistic, unreal views that have very little to do with the real world, as testified to in the last paragraph of the article. Too bad that our impressionable young people are their audience.

I think the author mischaracterizes the situation a bit. It's not that every student at all the Ivy League schools hates the military (there certainly wouldn't be a need for an ROTC in that case), but most wouldn't want to join. Unlike the previous inhabitants of many top universities, a lot of the current students at such schools didn't assume they'd go to Yale simply because daddy went and donated money. Going to a top university is a rare and tremendous opportunity, and I doubt anyone at an institution such as Yale, Harvard, or Princeton would want to toss aside the chance they've been given, especially since their contribution as an soldier is likely to be minimal.

 

[Adam's Apple]

I think the author mischaracterizes the situation a bit. It's not that every student at all the Ivy League schools hates the military...

I don’t think the author mischaracterized the situation. Of course, not every student on these campuses hates the military; that was not even implied in the article. But a majority of faculty members on these campuses are strongly and fervently anti-military; and thanks to their brainwashing over a four- or five-year period, a majority of their students become anti-military. As Fields pointed out, the preaching of diversity and multiculturalism is all important on these campuses; but the snag is that--to them--not all diverse cultures (i.e., the military) are equal.

…I doubt anyone at an institution such as Yale, Harvard, or Princeton would want to toss aside the chance they've been given, especially since their contribution as an soldier is likely to be minimal.

I don’t see how that can be used as an argument to defend the all-too-real anti-military sentiment on “elite” campuses. No one is asking young people to toss aside their golden opportunity. That was not even alluded to by Fields in her article. But the problems young people electing to attend these campuses will have are two-fold: (1) the strong political environment and the strong influence that will be exerted on them to conform, and (2) the education that can be obtained from serving in the military that will not be gained on campuses prohibiting military programs as part of the education curriculum.