Conservatism Has Always Been Wrong for Blacks

[theHawk]

Here we see a debate with James Baldwin vs. William Buckley on the issue of race. Buckley was soundly defeated. Buckley's message is still the basic philosophy of conservatism.

James Baldwin Debates William F. Buckley (1965)

How is this a debate about conservatism working or not for blacks? Many of the arguments put forth in this debate were nonsensical, such as Baldwin complaining about how American society is geared towards whites, and yet doesn’t explain why white colonists should had built a nation for Africans as opposed to building one for themselves. He also fails to explain why he remains in a “racist” white dominated America, when he has the freedom to move to Africa. Buckley also pointed out that the real problem for negroes at the time were the idiot whites in the south voting to keep discrimination against blacks (Democrats). Buckley also pointed out the rising illegitimacy rates in the black community, and as that rate has skyrocketed since then we have seen the effects on the black community. Single parent upbringing is by far the most detrimental thing for a child. That is something conservatives have stood by and have been correct about, while liberals do everything they can to destroy the family unit. How has that liberal ideology worked out for blacks?

How did Selma turn out? It’s one of the poorest run down shit holes in America. Voting Dem has left every black neighborhood and city a complete shit hole, yet you still want to blame conservatives. Well, keep voting the same way for another 100 years, I’m sure it will all magically turn around for you at some point.

Baldwin was 100 percent right. We have the first amendment right to air our grievance with the government just like your white ass. So the next time your punk ass whines about the media, taxes, or government, ask yourself why don't you move back to Europe. We were republicans for 100 years and all we got was jim crow. I live in a republican state, conservative policies fucked up our state. Conservative policy on the federal level fucked up every state. The poorest states are run by republicans so hang up that dumb dried up right wing lie. If we return to the republican party that's full of human scabs like you, we will return to the same jim crow that made us leave the republican party in the first place.

I see your reply doesn’t address what I said, as usual. All you can do is make silly generic accusations that the GOP has “fucked up” your state. How are Republicans going to return us to Jim Crow? Those were Democrat laws. Conservatives would like to see less illegitimate, single parent homes in the black community. Are you saying that is bad? You think rampant illegitimacy rates are good for blacks? Conservatives would like to see blacks become prosperous and paying taxes, instead of being on generational welfare.

You keep complaining you want to be treated equally, yet you keep rejecting polices that would make you equal. You’d rather promote thug culture, let your women raise multiple children from different fathers by herself, and you don’t want businesses to thrive or good middle class jobs to be made available to the black community. You vote for morons like Beijing Biden that would rather ship manufacturing jobs to China, instead of keeping them in America and available to blacks. You want to defund the police, because your Dem masters have told you so, which will lead to skyrocketing violence and crime in black neighborhoods, which in turn will lead to more blacks either dead or in prison. Real racists and white supremacists applaud you for voting Democrat. It’s going to keep you in the same place you’ve been for the last 60 years.

 

[LeftofLeft]

LOL

The OP hates working soooo much that he goes full NAZI to avoid working.........thinks people owe him a living......that others should give up their private possessions to him.........Nothing but a Communist Prick pretending to be righteous............

BLM............BURN LOOT MURDER.

I worked for 43 years. Shut the fuck up.

Being a paid protester doesn't count........Shad up you Racists.........Now RAISE THE FIST like a good little Nazi.

If I was a nazi, I'd be you. Now go on back into your trailer and make that tuna fish sandwich.

Nazi's destroyed anything or anyone who disagrees with them..........Hand salute..type shit...now brain dead left doing the FIST THING..........

You are the Nazi...........own it.

First off, my work ethic shall not be called into question by a member of the race that has been given everything they have by the government. Second it has been shown that white supremacists have been the main ones doing the burning and destroying. So just go on back in your trailer and have a bowl of corn flakes.

You keep perpetuating the myth and the lie that the majority of the burning, looting, murdering, and violence in our cities is being done by white supremacists. Show the empirical data to back it up. You have a sense of entitlement to present what lies between your ears as fact.

I've shown it. Multiple times. I don't think that a person/people who have run off at the mouth claiming that we blame whites for racism to have an excuse for failing with no proof ever are in a position to make demands.

You haven’t shown anything but shit. Specious at best.

I have shown articles showing that DHS found that white supremacists were planning and infiltrating BLM protests inciting violence because they know BLM will be blamed. Fact.

You have NOT shown statements from DHS or other law enforcement confirming the OUTCOME and verification that white supremacists instigated the violence. FACT.

 

[John T. Ford]

You have NOT shown statements from DHS or other law enforcement confirming the OUTCOME and verification that white supremacists instigated the violence. FACT.

Leftist don't use Facts.

It's Emotions only for these psychos.

In this case it's the emotions of Hatred and Intolerance.

 

[kaz]

Here we see a debate with James Baldwin vs. William Buckley on the issue of race. Buckley was soundly defeated. Buckley's message is still the basic philosophy of conservatism.

James Baldwin Debates William F. Buckley (1965)

So slavery, segregation, the KKK, Jim Crow, lynching and cross burning was good for blacks, huh? Yeah, Democrats have been great for them

Same old bird brained fucked up lies.

Today's lesson.

Blacks were Republican for 100 Years

Out of the 155 years since the Emancipation Proclamation, blacks were Republican for 100 of them. Seems that our black trump supporters do not know the true reality of what happened to us while we were republican.

At this time, meaning right now, there are Americans who have chosen to ignore the last 150 years of history. When trying to discuss race with a “conservative” you are almost guaranteed to hear the lecture on why blacks should be republicans today because the Abraham Lincoln was a republican and he freed the slaves. Forgotten in this revised history was the fact Lincoln did not believe in racial equality. Also forgotten as I have already mentioned, was the 100 years of apartheid and the more than 50 years after the civil rights act into today. This distorted reality has the far right talking crazy. It is Teflon history in high definition.

Furthermore, there are some black republicans today who have forgotten the great tradition established by great black republicans of the past. Many black republicans today would be denounced by great black republicans of the past because they disrespect the memory and honor of those same great black republicans. Republicans like Frederick Douglass who stood in front of whites in 1852, more than a decade before the Emancipation Proclamation asking whites “What to the slave is the fourth of July? Or Isabella Baumfree, better known as Sojourner Truth who stood in front of whites at the Seneca Convention and informed them that she was just as much a woman as any of the women at that meeting. I think these two great black republicans would have some choice words for people like Larry Elders and Candice Owens.

Let’s end the lie right here. The party of Lincoln wanted to free blacks and in return we were to be moved back to Africa or somewhere in South America. So let’s drop the lie about the republican party and face the fact that republicans were just as racist and now today the republicans party is the racist party while democrats have become more diverse.

While the far right and some black and non white stooges try pushing the slavery ended then Martin Luther King showed up and finally ended racism fairy tale, the fact is that republicans lost blacks because of their actions after slavery. During reconstruction initially it looked like blacks and whites would be able to get beyond slavery as a nation and perhaps unite. But it did not happen because of a republican backlash to black progress called the lily-white movement.

“The lily-white movement was an all-white faction of the Republican Party in the Southern United States in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. It battled and usually defeated the biracial element called the Black-and-tan faction.

During Reconstruction, following the U.S. Civil War, black leaders in Texas and around the country gained increasing influence in the Republican Party by organizing blacks as an important voting bloc. Conservative whites attempted to eliminate this influence and recover white voters who had defected to the Democratic Party. The effort was largely successful in eliminating African-American influence in the Republican Party leading to black voters predominantly migrating to the Democratic Party for much of the 20th century.

The term lily-white movement was coined by Texas Republican leader Norris Wright Cuney, who used the term in an 1888 Republican convention to describe efforts by white conservatives to oust blacks from positions of Texas party leadership and incite riots to divide the party.[1] The term came to be used nationally to describe this ongoing movement as it further developed in the early 20th century,[2] including through the administration of Herbert Hoover. Localized movements began immediately after the war but by the beginning of the 20th century the effort had become national.” “This movement is largely credited with driving blacks out of the Republican party during the early 20th century, setting the stage for their eventual support of the Democrats.”

Michael K. Fauntroy - Republicans and the Black vote

The racism inherent in much of the current republican base allows a failure to understand that blacks are able to think critically and make decisions without white input. We know what republicans have done. Lincoln signed the Emancipation Proclamation. Rutherford Hayes, a republican, ended reconstruction. We had the republican lily white movement to purge blacks from the party. Republicans endorsed separate but equal, every republican administration in the early to mid 1900's broke promises made to blacks, most notably during the Great Mississippi flood, which resulted in massive black casualties, displacement and basically returning southern blacks back to slave status.

The Great Mississippi Flood of 1927 was the most destructive river flood in the history of the United States. Twenty-seven thousand square miles of the United States was under water up to 30 feet deep. Because of this flood, the federal government built the system of levees and floodways we see along the Mississippi River today. More than 200,000 African Americans were displaced from their homes along the Mississippi and had to live for lengthy periods in “relief camps.” Calling them relief camps is overly kind as supplies and means of evacuation after flooding were given to primarily to whites. Blacks got whatever was left. African Americans could not receive supplies without providing the name of a white employer or a voucher from somebody white. Blacks were made to work against their will and were not allowed to leave. In some discussions it has been said that blacks were put in concentration camps. Whether or not that is true, blacks were subject to dangerous and inhumane conditions.

Walter White, then the president of the NAACP visited the Mississippi delta. When he returned to New York he had some very choice words for the conditions he saw that blacks had to endure. “Negroes in hundreds of cases were forced to work at the point of guns on the levees long after it was certain that the levees would break. Conscripted Negro labor did practically all of the hard and dangerous work in fighting the flood. Harrowing as many of these stories are, they are the almost inevitable products of a gigantic catastrophe and are part of the normal picture of the industrial and race situation in certain parts of the South. The greatest and most significant injustice is in the denial to Negroes of the right of free movement and of the privilege of selling their services to the highest bidder. That, if persisted in, would recreate and crystallize a new slavery almost as miserable as the old.” White called the facilities the federal troops used to hold until their employers could claim them concentration camps.

Whites report as well as others caught the attention of Herbert Hoover who was serving as Secretary of Commerce. Hoover was charged with the responsibility of flood relief. In classic racist fashion without white oversight, the report from a black person on the condition they saw other blacks enduring would not be good enough for the whites in charge. So Hoover decided he needed to create a Colored Advisory Committee. This committee was appointed to investigate the NAACP’s complaints. The Colored Advisory Committee was chaired by Tuskegee Institute president Robert Moton, with eleven other people from Tuskegee serving as as committee members. Hoover was using black conservatives in hopes that what the came from the Booker T Washington side would be less critical and could be used to discredit the drilling the federal government took from the NAACP. Once again, the Washington philosophy failed black Americans in spectacular fashion.

Before we go further, I think it’s important to know who Robert Moton is. Moton is a very consequential figure in black political history. His political story is a cautionary tale for current blacks who call themselves conservative but whose beliefs align with right wing white racial extremists. His life story shows a fact of slavery that some whites purposefully leave out of the tale of how blacks sold each other into slavery.

Moton was born in 1867. His father had been a wealthy African Cheiftain that got rich by selling slaves. That is until he was sold into slavery. Moton graduated from Hampton Institute in 1890. When Booker T. Washington died in 1915, Moton succeeded Washington as President of Tuskegee. During his time at Tuskegee, Moton expanded the curriculum at Tuskegee to include liberal arts. However, during his time Moton allowed the Tuskegee Experiment to be conducted. Moton by all standards was an impressive man, but he had one flaw, his belief in accommodation.

Like Washington, Moton believed that the best way to advance the cause of African Americans was to convince white people of black people's worth through their exemplary behavior. He didn't fight segregation or challenge white authority. Moton sat on the boards of major philanthropies with the likes of Andrew Carnegie and John D. Rockefeller Jr. It is not overstating that Moton held great influence in the America of that period.

After the NAACP roasted the government, Hoover, who was thinking about a presidential run, was told by advisors to get influential blacks involved in order address the criticism from the NAACP. Such is why Hoover used him to Chair the Colored Advisory Committee. I describe this as using because that’s exactly what Hoover did. The Committee goes to investigate the situation in Mississippi. On December 12, 1927, The Colored Advisory Commission sent Hoover a letter with the findings from their investigation. They reported on the conditions they found on arrival and made 13 recommendations to Hoover.

Moton presented the findings of the commission to Hoover and advocated for immediate assistance to those most in need. Hoover asked Moton to not let information contained in the commission report be leaked to the public. So Moton kept the findings from the public In return for doing that, Hoover hinted to Moton that if he get elected president, Moton and his people would be part of the Hoover administration. Hoover also implied that as president he would to divide the land of planters bankrupted from the flood into African American-owned farms.

Because of these promises, Moton made sure the Commission did not leak the full story of what they saw and were told by blacks who were suffering mightily in the Mississippi delta. Moton then pumped up the Hoover's candidacy in the African American community. Once he was elected President in 1928, Hoover caught a case of amnesia and forgot about the promises he made to Moton and the black community. To quote Ice Cube, Moton got, “fucked out of his green by a white boy with no Vaseline.” In 1932 Moton ended being accommodating and when he finished, the damage he did to the republican party has lasted to this very day. Moton withdrew his support for Hoover and switched to the Democratic Party. His move created a historic shift as African Americans began to abandon the Republicans Party, the party of Lincoln, the party of the Emancipation Proclamation, and turned to the Democratic Party.

But a few stragglers stayed faithful to the Republican party still after 70 years of the party ignoring blacks and breaking promises. Until 1964. That was when a democrat that signed what amounted to our second Emancipation Proclamation when President Lyndon Johnson signed the Civil Rights Act. Members of todays republican party spin a disingenuous tale about republican support for the Civil Rights and voting rights act. They tell about a democratic filibuster and will tell us that more democrats opposed these bills than republicans. These things are true. But they only tell part of the story. According to Merriam-Webster the definition of disingenuous is, “lacking in candor: giving a false appearance of simple frankness.” In the house, 221 democrats voted for the Voting Rights Act, 112 republicans did. In the senate, 47 democrats voted for the Voting Rights Act, 30 republicans did.

It’s time for the sellouts and Uncle Toms to fall back. Because the house negro does not own the house and once they think they do, they get removed. Earlier I quoted Booker T. Washington. Some whites love using his words to counter arguments made by blacks today regarding continuing white racism. To reflect our modern reality, I have modified Washington’s comments.

“There is another class of white people who make a business of keeping the advantages of whites maintained by gaslighting the public into a belief that white racism is now an illusion and that it is whites who face anti white racism. ... Some of these people do not want whites to lose preference, because they do not want to lose their jobs ... There is a certain class of white race-"problem solvers" who don’t want America to get well.”

1964 Republican presidential candidate Barry Goldwater voted against the 1964 Civil Rights Act. By 1964 there were blacks whose families had been republicans for almost 100 years. The Goldwater nomination was a slap in the face of black people. When we got civil rights, republicans decided that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice, turned their backs on us and began letting southern white racists become part of the party. So just cut the crap. The history of the republican party is one of broken promises to black people. All today’s republican establishment does for blacks is throw out Uncle Toms or Aunties and tell us they are the ones we should listen to. Black republicans that do not deny that racism exists are part of the party, but you will not see them on Fox News. We are not republicans because republicans took a knee on us. Now they want us to come back so they can implement policies that will put a chokehold on us. The republican party is anti-affirmative action, anti-civil rights, anti-voting rights, pro maintenance of the memory of the confederacy but we are supposed to run to the republican party because Abraham Lincoln freed slaves from the same confederacy republicans defend today. The shame is that there are blacks in America who are fooled by the gaslighting.

The following statement pretty much sums it up relative to blacks and our experiences with the major political parties. This is a comment from a man who saw the beginning of the first civil rights movement. A man who saw his parents spit on by whites during the days of Jim Crow.

I don’t say that to take sides with democrats, because I'm old enough and have seen MORE than enough to know that NEITHER political party is truly and collectively concerned about the well being of the black citizens of this country. It was no badge of honor to abolish slavery, or pass the civil rights act, the voting act or to even sign affirmative action into law.

Those were the most basic of human rights as well as rights of a tax paying citizen to be treated equally and fairly, so there is ZERO gratitude owed to either party for those so called "historical moments".

The racist history of the Democratic party is well documented. I will not be writing about the 1860 Democratic Party. Hank ran his mouth about using more recent dates. I find is sad and pathetic that when we bring our grievance to the table, “conservatives” provide lectures to us on how long ago slavery was. Yet as they pander to get blacks to join the modern republican party, we are told that we must remember that it was the democrats who were pro slavery. Past dates didn't matter then and so they damn well will be used now to make you dishonest trump supporters of all races understand the truth. Because as I look back over the years since I cast my first ballot (1980), I see a republican party that holds the same ideology as the 1860 Democrats. This ideology comes complete with a wish to secede, defense of the confederacy and some have gone so far as to wish for or openly discuss the idea of a civil war.

References:

Fauntroy, Michael K. (2007), Republicans and the Black vote, Lynne Rienner Publishers .

Henry Louis Gates Jr., Did Lincoln Want to Ship Black People Back to Africa? www.theroot.com/did-lincoln-want-to-ship-black people-back-to-africa-1790858389

The Negro and the Flood, Walter White, The Nation, Vol. 124, No. 3233, April 15,1927.

The Mississippi River Great Flood of 1927, Malik Simba, www.blackpast.org/african-american-history/mississippi-river-great-flood-1927/

The Great Mississippi Flood of 1927-Ain’t Got No Place to Go, Laura Coyle, Published Sept. 7, 2016; updated Jan. 11, 2019, nmaahc.si.edu/explore/stories/collection/great-mississippi-river-flood-1927

Robert Moton and the Colored Advisory Commission, www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/features/flood-moton-cac/

Robert Moton's Second Report, www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/features/flood-moton-second-report/

So slavery, segregation, the KKK, Jim Crow, lynching and cross burning was good for blacks, huh? Yeah, Democrats have been great for them

 

[DukeU]

Democrats hate minorities as proven by one of their favorite policies. Abortion.

End of story.

 

[theHawk]

Here we see a debate with James Baldwin vs. William Buckley on the issue of race. Buckley was soundly defeated. Buckley's message is still the basic philosophy of conservatism.

James Baldwin Debates William F. Buckley (1965)

So slavery, segregation, the KKK, Jim Crow, lynching and cross burning was good for blacks, huh? Yeah, Democrats have been great for them

Same old bird brained fucked up lies.

Today's lesson.

Blacks were Republican for 100 Years

Out of the 155 years since the Emancipation Proclamation, blacks were Republican for 100 of them. Seems that our black trump supporters do not know the true reality of what happened to us while we were republican.

At this time, meaning right now, there are Americans who have chosen to ignore the last 150 years of history. When trying to discuss race with a “conservative” you are almost guaranteed to hear the lecture on why blacks should be republicans today because the Abraham Lincoln was a republican and he freed the slaves. Forgotten in this revised history was the fact Lincoln did not believe in racial equality. Also forgotten as I have already mentioned, was the 100 years of apartheid and the more than 50 years after the civil rights act into today. This distorted reality has the far right talking crazy. It is Teflon history in high definition.

Furthermore, there are some black republicans today who have forgotten the great tradition established by great black republicans of the past. Many black republicans today would be denounced by great black republicans of the past because they disrespect the memory and honor of those same great black republicans. Republicans like Frederick Douglass who stood in front of whites in 1852, more than a decade before the Emancipation Proclamation asking whites “What to the slave is the fourth of July? Or Isabella Baumfree, better known as Sojourner Truth who stood in front of whites at the Seneca Convention and informed them that she was just as much a woman as any of the women at that meeting. I think these two great black republicans would have some choice words for people like Larry Elders and Candice Owens.

Let’s end the lie right here. The party of Lincoln wanted to free blacks and in return we were to be moved back to Africa or somewhere in South America. So let’s drop the lie about the republican party and face the fact that republicans were just as racist and now today the republicans party is the racist party while democrats have become more diverse.

While the far right and some black and non white stooges try pushing the slavery ended then Martin Luther King showed up and finally ended racism fairy tale, the fact is that republicans lost blacks because of their actions after slavery. During reconstruction initially it looked like blacks and whites would be able to get beyond slavery as a nation and perhaps unite. But it did not happen because of a republican backlash to black progress called the lily-white movement.

“The lily-white movement was an all-white faction of the Republican Party in the Southern United States in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. It battled and usually defeated the biracial element called the Black-and-tan faction.

During Reconstruction, following the U.S. Civil War, black leaders in Texas and around the country gained increasing influence in the Republican Party by organizing blacks as an important voting bloc. Conservative whites attempted to eliminate this influence and recover white voters who had defected to the Democratic Party. The effort was largely successful in eliminating African-American influence in the Republican Party leading to black voters predominantly migrating to the Democratic Party for much of the 20th century.

The term lily-white movement was coined by Texas Republican leader Norris Wright Cuney, who used the term in an 1888 Republican convention to describe efforts by white conservatives to oust blacks from positions of Texas party leadership and incite riots to divide the party.[1] The term came to be used nationally to describe this ongoing movement as it further developed in the early 20th century,[2] including through the administration of Herbert Hoover. Localized movements began immediately after the war but by the beginning of the 20th century the effort had become national.” “This movement is largely credited with driving blacks out of the Republican party during the early 20th century, setting the stage for their eventual support of the Democrats.”

Michael K. Fauntroy - Republicans and the Black vote

The racism inherent in much of the current republican base allows a failure to understand that blacks are able to think critically and make decisions without white input. We know what republicans have done. Lincoln signed the Emancipation Proclamation. Rutherford Hayes, a republican, ended reconstruction. We had the republican lily white movement to purge blacks from the party. Republicans endorsed separate but equal, every republican administration in the early to mid 1900's broke promises made to blacks, most notably during the Great Mississippi flood, which resulted in massive black casualties, displacement and basically returning southern blacks back to slave status.

The Great Mississippi Flood of 1927 was the most destructive river flood in the history of the United States. Twenty-seven thousand square miles of the United States was under water up to 30 feet deep. Because of this flood, the federal government built the system of levees and floodways we see along the Mississippi River today. More than 200,000 African Americans were displaced from their homes along the Mississippi and had to live for lengthy periods in “relief camps.” Calling them relief camps is overly kind as supplies and means of evacuation after flooding were given to primarily to whites. Blacks got whatever was left. African Americans could not receive supplies without providing the name of a white employer or a voucher from somebody white. Blacks were made to work against their will and were not allowed to leave. In some discussions it has been said that blacks were put in concentration camps. Whether or not that is true, blacks were subject to dangerous and inhumane conditions.

Walter White, then the president of the NAACP visited the Mississippi delta. When he returned to New York he had some very choice words for the conditions he saw that blacks had to endure. “Negroes in hundreds of cases were forced to work at the point of guns on the levees long after it was certain that the levees would break. Conscripted Negro labor did practically all of the hard and dangerous work in fighting the flood. Harrowing as many of these stories are, they are the almost inevitable products of a gigantic catastrophe and are part of the normal picture of the industrial and race situation in certain parts of the South. The greatest and most significant injustice is in the denial to Negroes of the right of free movement and of the privilege of selling their services to the highest bidder. That, if persisted in, would recreate and crystallize a new slavery almost as miserable as the old.” White called the facilities the federal troops used to hold until their employers could claim them concentration camps.

Whites report as well as others caught the attention of Herbert Hoover who was serving as Secretary of Commerce. Hoover was charged with the responsibility of flood relief. In classic racist fashion without white oversight, the report from a black person on the condition they saw other blacks enduring would not be good enough for the whites in charge. So Hoover decided he needed to create a Colored Advisory Committee. This committee was appointed to investigate the NAACP’s complaints. The Colored Advisory Committee was chaired by Tuskegee Institute president Robert Moton, with eleven other people from Tuskegee serving as as committee members. Hoover was using black conservatives in hopes that what the came from the Booker T Washington side would be less critical and could be used to discredit the drilling the federal government took from the NAACP. Once again, the Washington philosophy failed black Americans in spectacular fashion.

Before we go further, I think it’s important to know who Robert Moton is. Moton is a very consequential figure in black political history. His political story is a cautionary tale for current blacks who call themselves conservative but whose beliefs align with right wing white racial extremists. His life story shows a fact of slavery that some whites purposefully leave out of the tale of how blacks sold each other into slavery.

Moton was born in 1867. His father had been a wealthy African Cheiftain that got rich by selling slaves. That is until he was sold into slavery. Moton graduated from Hampton Institute in 1890. When Booker T. Washington died in 1915, Moton succeeded Washington as President of Tuskegee. During his time at Tuskegee, Moton expanded the curriculum at Tuskegee to include liberal arts. However, during his time Moton allowed the Tuskegee Experiment to be conducted. Moton by all standards was an impressive man, but he had one flaw, his belief in accommodation.

Like Washington, Moton believed that the best way to advance the cause of African Americans was to convince white people of black people's worth through their exemplary behavior. He didn't fight segregation or challenge white authority. Moton sat on the boards of major philanthropies with the likes of Andrew Carnegie and John D. Rockefeller Jr. It is not overstating that Moton held great influence in the America of that period.

After the NAACP roasted the government, Hoover, who was thinking about a presidential run, was told by advisors to get influential blacks involved in order address the criticism from the NAACP. Such is why Hoover used him to Chair the Colored Advisory Committee. I describe this as using because that’s exactly what Hoover did. The Committee goes to investigate the situation in Mississippi. On December 12, 1927, The Colored Advisory Commission sent Hoover a letter with the findings from their investigation. They reported on the conditions they found on arrival and made 13 recommendations to Hoover.

Moton presented the findings of the commission to Hoover and advocated for immediate assistance to those most in need. Hoover asked Moton to not let information contained in the commission report be leaked to the public. So Moton kept the findings from the public In return for doing that, Hoover hinted to Moton that if he get elected president, Moton and his people would be part of the Hoover administration. Hoover also implied that as president he would to divide the land of planters bankrupted from the flood into African American-owned farms.

Because of these promises, Moton made sure the Commission did not leak the full story of what they saw and were told by blacks who were suffering mightily in the Mississippi delta. Moton then pumped up the Hoover's candidacy in the African American community. Once he was elected President in 1928, Hoover caught a case of amnesia and forgot about the promises he made to Moton and the black community. To quote Ice Cube, Moton got, “fucked out of his green by a white boy with no Vaseline.” In 1932 Moton ended being accommodating and when he finished, the damage he did to the republican party has lasted to this very day. Moton withdrew his support for Hoover and switched to the Democratic Party. His move created a historic shift as African Americans began to abandon the Republicans Party, the party of Lincoln, the party of the Emancipation Proclamation, and turned to the Democratic Party.

But a few stragglers stayed faithful to the Republican party still after 70 years of the party ignoring blacks and breaking promises. Until 1964. That was when a democrat that signed what amounted to our second Emancipation Proclamation when President Lyndon Johnson signed the Civil Rights Act. Members of todays republican party spin a disingenuous tale about republican support for the Civil Rights and voting rights act. They tell about a democratic filibuster and will tell us that more democrats opposed these bills than republicans. These things are true. But they only tell part of the story. According to Merriam-Webster the definition of disingenuous is, “lacking in candor: giving a false appearance of simple frankness.” In the house, 221 democrats voted for the Voting Rights Act, 112 republicans did. In the senate, 47 democrats voted for the Voting Rights Act, 30 republicans did.

It’s time for the sellouts and Uncle Toms to fall back. Because the house negro does not own the house and once they think they do, they get removed. Earlier I quoted Booker T. Washington. Some whites love using his words to counter arguments made by blacks today regarding continuing white racism. To reflect our modern reality, I have modified Washington’s comments.

“There is another class of white people who make a business of keeping the advantages of whites maintained by gaslighting the public into a belief that white racism is now an illusion and that it is whites who face anti white racism. ... Some of these people do not want whites to lose preference, because they do not want to lose their jobs ... There is a certain class of white race-"problem solvers" who don’t want America to get well.”

1964 Republican presidential candidate Barry Goldwater voted against the 1964 Civil Rights Act. By 1964 there were blacks whose families had been republicans for almost 100 years. The Goldwater nomination was a slap in the face of black people. When we got civil rights, republicans decided that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice, turned their backs on us and began letting southern white racists become part of the party. So just cut the crap. The history of the republican party is one of broken promises to black people. All today’s republican establishment does for blacks is throw out Uncle Toms or Aunties and tell us they are the ones we should listen to. Black republicans that do not deny that racism exists are part of the party, but you will not see them on Fox News. We are not republicans because republicans took a knee on us. Now they want us to come back so they can implement policies that will put a chokehold on us. The republican party is anti-affirmative action, anti-civil rights, anti-voting rights, pro maintenance of the memory of the confederacy but we are supposed to run to the republican party because Abraham Lincoln freed slaves from the same confederacy republicans defend today. The shame is that there are blacks in America who are fooled by the gaslighting.

The following statement pretty much sums it up relative to blacks and our experiences with the major political parties. This is a comment from a man who saw the beginning of the first civil rights movement. A man who saw his parents spit on by whites during the days of Jim Crow.

I don’t say that to take sides with democrats, because I'm old enough and have seen MORE than enough to know that NEITHER political party is truly and collectively concerned about the well being of the black citizens of this country. It was no badge of honor to abolish slavery, or pass the civil rights act, the voting act or to even sign affirmative action into law.

Those were the most basic of human rights as well as rights of a tax paying citizen to be treated equally and fairly, so there is ZERO gratitude owed to either party for those so called "historical moments".

The racist history of the Democratic party is well documented. I will not be writing about the 1860 Democratic Party. Hank ran his mouth about using more recent dates. I find is sad and pathetic that when we bring our grievance to the table, “conservatives” provide lectures to us on how long ago slavery was. Yet as they pander to get blacks to join the modern republican party, we are told that we must remember that it was the democrats who were pro slavery. Past dates didn't matter then and so they damn well will be used now to make you dishonest trump supporters of all races understand the truth. Because as I look back over the years since I cast my first ballot (1980), I see a republican party that holds the same ideology as the 1860 Democrats. This ideology comes complete with a wish to secede, defense of the confederacy and some have gone so far as to wish for or openly discuss the idea of a civil war.

References:

Fauntroy, Michael K. (2007), Republicans and the Black vote, Lynne Rienner Publishers .

Henry Louis Gates Jr., Did Lincoln Want to Ship Black People Back to Africa? www.theroot.com/did-lincoln-want-to-ship-black people-back-to-africa-1790858389

The Negro and the Flood, Walter White, The Nation, Vol. 124, No. 3233, April 15,1927.

The Mississippi River Great Flood of 1927, Malik Simba, www.blackpast.org/african-american-history/mississippi-river-great-flood-1927/

The Great Mississippi Flood of 1927-Ain’t Got No Place to Go, Laura Coyle, Published Sept. 7, 2016; updated Jan. 11, 2019, nmaahc.si.edu/explore/stories/collection/great-mississippi-river-flood-1927

Robert Moton and the Colored Advisory Commission, www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/features/flood-moton-cac/

Robert Moton's Second Report, www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/features/flood-moton-second-report/

Complete and total bunk, omitting the actual reasons blacks jumped ship to the Democrats. It was because of the New Deal and their hopes to get welfare during the Great Depression. Democrats won the black vote out of desperation and fear, as they usually do. Except, as usual, the Democrats lied and their programs never helped negroes.

 

[JustAGuy1]

LOL

The OP hates working soooo much that he goes full NAZI to avoid working.........thinks people owe him a living......that others should give up their private possessions to him.........Nothing but a Communist Prick pretending to be righteous............

BLM............BURN LOOT MURDER.

I worked for 43 years. Shut the fuck up.

Being a paid protester doesn't count........Shad up you Racists.........Now RAISE THE FIST like a good little Nazi.

If I was a nazi, I'd be you. Now go on back into your trailer and make that tuna fish sandwich.

Nazi's destroyed anything or anyone who disagrees with them..........Hand salute..type shit...now brain dead left doing the FIST THING..........

You are the Nazi...........own it.

First off, my work ethic shall not be called into question by a member of the race that has been given everything they have by the government. Second it has been shown that white supremacists have been the main ones doing the burning and destroying. So just go on back in your trailer and have a bowl of corn flakes.

LOL, repeat those lies brotha. You don't have any work ethic boi. You're a taker and you always will be.

 

[Indeependent]

Here we see a debate with James Baldwin vs. William Buckley on the issue of race. Buckley was soundly defeated. Buckley's message is still the basic philosophy of conservatism.

James Baldwin Debates William F. Buckley (1965)

I have no problem with welfare based on scholastic achievement.

 

[Grumblenuts]

If I was a nazi, I'd be you. Now go on back into your trailer and make that tuna fish sandwich.

Funny, after forcing myself to listen to Buckley for the first time in decades my first thought was It's like opening some tuna, dumping out the contents, and trying to digest the can.

 

[OKTexas]

Yet it's commiecrat cities where blacks are warehoused and aren't educated. Go figure.

.

Wrong. There was none of this democrat and republican city shit until trump started making excuses for his failure. Conservatism has always been wrong for blacks and this is why:

"Why the South Must Prevail"

https://adamgomez.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/whythesouthmustprevail-1957.pdf

The link is to an editorial by the founder of the conservative movement from the August 24, 1957 issue of National Review,

American conservatism has a fraught relationship with equality, racial or otherwise. But there is a deep legacy in conservative thought of viewing freedom and equality as incompatible—not just in philosophical treatises, but in the day-to-day ideological framing that forms the bread and butter of conservative commentary, from magazines and Fox News to talk radio. In the mid-1960s Harry Jaffa and Frank Meyer engaged in a series of dueling essays in National Review on this question. Meyer, a notorious racist who opposed desegregation, wrote in one of his essays that Jaffa incorrectly “chooses to base his critique of American slavery on the proposition that the American polity is in its essence dedicated to equality.” But “freedom and equality are opposites,” Meyer baldly replied, with a formula that still resonates. “The freer men are the freer they are to demonstrate their inequality.” This is the same basic principle that guided William F. Buckley’s infamous 1957 editorial “Why the South Must Prevail,” in which he argued that, the question “of the rights of American citizens, born Equal” aside, the “White community in the South is entitled to take . . . measures as are necessary to prevail, politically and culturally, in areas in which it does not predominate numerically.” In his 1619 contribution, Jamelle Bouie refers to this very argument of Buckley’s: “It is a strikingly blunt defense of Jim Crow and affirmation of white supremacy from the father of the conservative movement.”

Newt Gingrich, represented a largely white suburban Atlanta district. Gingrich holds a PhD in history from Tulane University; his 1971 dissertation was a full-throated defense of the infamously brutal Belgian colonial record in Congo. On its second page, the future congressman stresses the need for “awareness of the good as well as the bad aspects of colonialism,” suggesting that “the colonial powers performed a painful but positive function in disrupting traditional society” of “the natives.”

The Fragile Patriotism of the American Conservative

Poor little ill-informed commie, commiecrat cities have been objects of discussion for decades, primarily for their high crime rates. Since you want to go down memory lane, just take a look at the cities where riots have occurred long before Trump. Watts, LA, Detroit, NYC, Baltimore and the list goes on.

But here's a little bit of info for ya race baiter, this is 2020 and not the same country it was in the 40s, 50s and 60s. Your pretending somehow nothing has changed just makes you a liar and a propagandist.

.

 

[JustAGuy1]

Yet it's commiecrat cities where blacks are warehoused and aren't educated. Go figure.

.

Wrong. There was none of this democrat and republican city shit until trump started making excuses for his failure. Conservatism has always been wrong for blacks and this is why:

"Why the South Must Prevail"

https://adamgomez.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/whythesouthmustprevail-1957.pdf

The link is to an editorial by the founder of the conservative movement from the August 24, 1957 issue of National Review,

American conservatism has a fraught relationship with equality, racial or otherwise. But there is a deep legacy in conservative thought of viewing freedom and equality as incompatible—not just in philosophical treatises, but in the day-to-day ideological framing that forms the bread and butter of conservative commentary, from magazines and Fox News to talk radio. In the mid-1960s Harry Jaffa and Frank Meyer engaged in a series of dueling essays in National Review on this question. Meyer, a notorious racist who opposed desegregation, wrote in one of his essays that Jaffa incorrectly “chooses to base his critique of American slavery on the proposition that the American polity is in its essence dedicated to equality.” But “freedom and equality are opposites,” Meyer baldly replied, with a formula that still resonates. “The freer men are the freer they are to demonstrate their inequality.” This is the same basic principle that guided William F. Buckley’s infamous 1957 editorial “Why the South Must Prevail,” in which he argued that, the question “of the rights of American citizens, born Equal” aside, the “White community in the South is entitled to take . . . measures as are necessary to prevail, politically and culturally, in areas in which it does not predominate numerically.” In his 1619 contribution, Jamelle Bouie refers to this very argument of Buckley’s: “It is a strikingly blunt defense of Jim Crow and affirmation of white supremacy from the father of the conservative movement.”

Newt Gingrich, represented a largely white suburban Atlanta district. Gingrich holds a PhD in history from Tulane University; his 1971 dissertation was a full-throated defense of the infamously brutal Belgian colonial record in Congo. On its second page, the future congressman stresses the need for “awareness of the good as well as the bad aspects of colonialism,” suggesting that “the colonial powers performed a painful but positive function in disrupting traditional society” of “the natives.”

The Fragile Patriotism of the American Conservative

Poor little ill-informed commie, commiecrat cities have been objects of discussion for decades, primarily for their high crime rates. Since you want to go down memory lane, just take a look at the cities where riots have occurred long before Trump. Watts, LA, Detroit, NYC, Baltimore and the list goes on.

But here's a little bit of info for ya race baiter, this is 2020 and not the same country it was in the 40s, 50s and 60s. Your pretending somehow nothing has changed just makes you a liar and a propagandist.

.

I almost feel bad for him, all that self loathing.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Conservatism Has Always Been Wrong for Blacks

Leftist policies have done wonders for you people in urban America

 

[DrLove]

Here we see a debate with James Baldwin vs. William Buckley on the issue of race. Buckley was soundly defeated. Buckley's message is still the basic philosophy of conservatism.

James Baldwin Debates William F. Buckley (1965)

Debate bookmarked for later. That should be FASCINATING and James Baldwin was a genius, but I'd disagree with you on one point. Republicans tossed Buckley and intellectual conservatism under the bus years ago.

 

[Godboy]

Here we see a debate with James Baldwin vs. William Buckley on the issue of race. Buckley was soundly defeated. Buckley's message is still the basic philosophy of conservatism.

James Baldwin Debates William F. Buckley (1965)

Conservatism is bad because you thought some dude won a random debate a long time ago?

 

[JustAGuy1]

Here we see a debate with James Baldwin vs. William Buckley on the issue of race. Buckley was soundly defeated. Buckley's message is still the basic philosophy of conservatism.

James Baldwin Debates William F. Buckley (1965)

You got it right but for the wrong reasons. You and those like just don't want to work.

 

[eagle1462010]

LOL

The OP hates working soooo much that he goes full NAZI to avoid working.........thinks people owe him a living......that others should give up their private possessions to him.........Nothing but a Communist Prick pretending to be righteous............

BLM............BURN LOOT MURDER.

I worked for 43 years. Shut the fuck up.

Being a paid protester doesn't count........Shad up you Racists.........Now RAISE THE FIST like a good little Nazi.

If I was a nazi, I'd be you. Now go on back into your trailer and make that tuna fish sandwich.

Nazi's destroyed anything or anyone who disagrees with them..........Hand salute..type shit...now brain dead left doing the FIST THING..........

You are the Nazi...........own it.

First off, my work ethic shall not be called into question by a member of the race that has been given everything they have by the government. Second it has been shown that white supremacists have been the main ones doing the burning and destroying. So just go on back in your trailer and have a bowl of corn flakes.

Given everything by the government............Silver spoon for everyone white and you are an oppressed slave..............

Step away from the drugs and seek councilling............you havne't seen shit about oppression.......Oppression is going to a country where a dead body lays on the street longer than a dead dog does here........I've seen that.....how about you.

So STFU and stop acting like a bunch of Hitler Youth.........Raise the fist or else............versus You will convert to Islam or else.........

Both terrorist.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Yet it's commiecrat cities where blacks are warehoused and aren't educated. Go figure.

.

Wrong. There was none of this democrat and republican city shit until trump started making excuses for his failure. Conservatism has always been wrong for blacks and this is why:

"Why the South Must Prevail"

https://adamgomez.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/whythesouthmustprevail-1957.pdf

The link is to an editorial by the founder of the conservative movement from the August 24, 1957 issue of National Review,

American conservatism has a fraught relationship with equality, racial or otherwise. But there is a deep legacy in conservative thought of viewing freedom and equality as incompatible—not just in philosophical treatises, but in the day-to-day ideological framing that forms the bread and butter of conservative commentary, from magazines and Fox News to talk radio. In the mid-1960s Harry Jaffa and Frank Meyer engaged in a series of dueling essays in National Review on this question. Meyer, a notorious racist who opposed desegregation, wrote in one of his essays that Jaffa incorrectly “chooses to base his critique of American slavery on the proposition that the American polity is in its essence dedicated to equality.” But “freedom and equality are opposites,” Meyer baldly replied, with a formula that still resonates. “The freer men are the freer they are to demonstrate their inequality.” This is the same basic principle that guided William F. Buckley’s infamous 1957 editorial “Why the South Must Prevail,” in which he argued that, the question “of the rights of American citizens, born Equal” aside, the “White community in the South is entitled to take . . . measures as are necessary to prevail, politically and culturally, in areas in which it does not predominate numerically.” In his 1619 contribution, Jamelle Bouie refers to this very argument of Buckley’s: “It is a strikingly blunt defense of Jim Crow and affirmation of white supremacy from the father of the conservative movement.”

Newt Gingrich, represented a largely white suburban Atlanta district. Gingrich holds a PhD in history from Tulane University; his 1971 dissertation was a full-throated defense of the infamously brutal Belgian colonial record in Congo. On its second page, the future congressman stresses the need for “awareness of the good as well as the bad aspects of colonialism,” suggesting that “the colonial powers performed a painful but positive function in disrupting traditional society” of “the natives.”

The Fragile Patriotism of the American Conservative

You're a delusional fool.

Well before Trump we bitched about the crime ridden leftist shitholes and compared them to Giulianis New York.

You are so wrapped up in your excuses you have no clue how stupid the shit you say sounds. You morons all act like life started in January 2016.

Unbelievably stupid

 

[theHawk]

The premise of this thread is a lie from the start. Buckley and Baldwin’s “debate” wasn’t about conservatism in the black community at all. It was a pretty lame charge of The American Dream coming at the expense of blacks.

This idea, that wealth is created only at the expense of another, is a Marxist lie. Baldwin is suggesting that the American Dream couldn’t exist without blacks. If that’s true, then why would conservatives favor relocating negroes back to Africa? Wouldn’t they need that cheap labor to exploit in America? IM2 needs to explain that one.

Wealth is built off one’s own labors. It can be exploited from others, as Democrats did with their African slaves, but that does not mean all wealth is created at the expense of others. To suggest whites are against blacks being prosperous is assuming all whites believe this nonsense, that if all blacks were to prosper, it would be at the expense of whites.
But the fact of the matter is, only white liberals that subscribe to these Marxist notions, not conservatives who reject Marxism. Another little conundrum IM2 can explain.

 

[IM2]

Conservatism Has Always Been Wrong for Blacks

Leftist policies have done wonders for you people in urban America

The fact you continue posting that right wing drivel shows that you're a fool. Blacks have fared worse in mid sized and rural areas controlled by conservatives. I know that because I have lived in both and currently live in a Kansas town of 60-70 thousand run by conservatives that offers little opportunity for blacks and is racist as hell.

 

[IM2]

The premise of this thread is a lie from the start. Buckley and Baldwin’s “debate” wasn’t about conservatism in the black community at all. It was a pretty lame charge of The American Dream coming at the expense of blacks.

This idea, that wealth is created only at the expense of another, is a Marxist lie. Baldwin is suggesting that the American Dream couldn’t exist without blacks. If that’s true, then why would conservatives favor relocating negroes back to Africa? Wouldn’t they need that cheap labor to exploit in America? IM2 needs to explain that one.

Wealth is built off one’s own labors. It can be exploited from others, as Democrats did with their African slaves, but that does not mean all wealth is created at the expense of others. To suggest whites are against blacks being prosperous is assuming all whites believe this nonsense, that if all blacks were to prosper, it would be at the expense of whites.
But the fact of the matter is, only white liberals that subscribe to these Marxist notions, not conservatives who reject Marxism. Another little conundrum IM2 can explain.

Bullshit. Free Black labor built American wealth. Your argument is ignorant and flies in the face of facts. And this line:

"To suggest whites are against blacks being prosperous is assuming all whites believe this nonsense, that if all blacks were to prosper, it would be at the expense of whites."

Is the most stupid statement made in the history of this forum. You are so ignorant that I bet you can't understand how I can say that.

Tonight's lesson:

Baldwin won the Debate 544 for and 164 against. This is one reason why...

“By a conservative estimate, in 1860 the total value of American slaves was $4 billion, far more than the gold and silver then circulating nationally ($228.3 million, “most of it in the North,” the authors add), total currency ($435.4 million), and even the value of the South’s total farmland ($1.92 billion). Slaves were, to slavers, worth more than everything else they could imagine combined.”

Ned & Constance Sublette, The American Slave Coast: A History of the Slave-Breeding Industry​

Slaves were worth more than the total currency plus all the farmland in the South combined yet did not receive a dime. As I write this America has 1.9 trillion dollars of total currency in circulation according to the federal reserve. In 1860 the total value of slaves was 17- and one-half times more than the money circulating in the economy. Giving todays amount of currency in circulation, the same equivalence in comparison to the value of slaves would make slaves worth 33,250,000,000,000 dollars. Remember that slaves were considered property. Because they were, the following activity could occur.

During slavery, more specifically during the 19th century, wealthy slaveowners looking for a way to get additional capital to buy more slaves came up with an idea- slave backed securities. Your eyes are not playing tricks on you. Slaveowners securitized slavery. Cornell professors Edward E. Baptist and Louis Hyman detailed how it was done in an article published by the Chicago Sun-Times on its website dated March 7, 2014. This is from the article:

In the 1830s, powerful Southern slaveowners wanted to import capital into their states so they could buy more slaves. They came up with a new, two-part idea: mortgaging slaves; and then turning the mortgages into bonds that could be marketed all over the world.

First, American planters organized new banks, usually in new states like Mississippi and Louisiana. Drawing up lists of slaves for collateral, the planters then mortgaged them to the banks they had created, enabling themselves to buy additional slaves to expand cotton production. To provide capital for those loans, the banks sold bonds to investors from around the globe — London, New York, Amsterdam, Paris. The bond buyers, many of whom lived in countries where slavery was illegal, didn’t own individual slaves — just bonds backed by their value. Planters’ mortgage payments paid the interest and the principle on these bond payments. Enslaved human beings had been, in modern financial lingo, “securitized.”

As slave-backed mortgages became paper bonds, everybody profited — except, obviously, enslaved African Americans whose forced labor repaid owners’ mortgages. But investors owed a piece of slave-earned income. Older slave states such as Maryland and Virginia sold slaves to the new cotton states, at securitization-inflated prices, resulting in slave asset bubble. Cotton factor firms like the now-defunct Lehman Brothers — founded in Alabama — became wildly successful. Lehman moved to Wall Street, and for all these firms, every transaction in slave-earned money flowing in and out of the U.S. earned Wall Street firms a fee.

The infant American financial industry nourished itself on profits taken from financing slave traders, cotton brokers and underwriting slave-backed bonds. But though slavery ended in 1865, in the years after the Civil War, black entrepreneurs would find themselves excluded from a financial system originally built on their bodies.

Edward E. Baptist and Louis Hyman, American Finance Grew on the Back of Slaves

So when blacks create a system where they accumulate wealth from forcing whites to work for free, for lower wages than everybody else, deny them certain types of employment, or burn, bomb, vandalize and terrorize whites trying to prosper, you can make this argument:

"To suggest whites are against blacks being prosperous is assuming all whites believe this nonsense, that if all blacks were to prosper, it would be at the expense of whites."

Here endeth the lesson.