Christians accepting Muslims?

[MeSSeNJa]

As a Christian conservative and this being my first post I'll start it out with a bang.

You can not be a Christian and be tolerant of Muslims (or any other faith for that matter)

If it sounds like hate speech, you have misinterpreted that statment. Christianity acknowleges Jesus Christ as the son of God and no others. This does not allow for tolerance of other religions. To do so would jeopardize your religious affiliation. In the ten commandments one of them states "You shall honor no other gods before me."

This being said I cannot say that another religion is even remotely correct (they are in fact redundant). Therefore those who take political correctness to the extreme and would label this as hate speech have fallen to what is called MORAL RELATIVISM.

<definition>
Moral relativism: The idea that anything goes (in a nutshell). Take in to consideration that a gay person wants equal tolerance of his sexuality. Someone with common sense would say no. Someone lost to moral relativism would say "Hey bud whatever makes you happy in this life. Live for today man...more power to you." It is the absence of ABSOLUTE TRUTH. An absolute truth would state, "Light exists". Those who argue absolute truths are not exactly logically developed since by stating that there are no absolute truths is in fact...an absolute truth.
</definition>

Now take in to your mind that this is not hate speech. I have a couple muslim friends who I speak with regularly. Though they know that I do not tolerate their faith because mine is correct. This may seem ignorant and I can understand how it may seem that way but keep in mind that it is also the truth.

Moral relativism (by the way) is the basis for the Democratic and Green parties. Their entire policy is based on doing "Whatever you feel like, and whatever makes you happy" not to mention giving respect without actually doing anything to earn it.

So in a nutshell the Muslim faith cannot be tolerated if you are in fact a Christian. If you believe it's ok to accept another's faith of another god as well as the real God then by all means...feel free to post.

I feel as if I've just released a time bomb. Logically based arguements now people!

 

[5stringJeff]

MeSSeNJa,

Welcome to the board. I am also Christian, and conservative, though I don't think that the label "Christian conservative" really fits me.

Anyway, I agree that as Christians, we cannot accept the Muslim religion's claims about God, as they deny the Trinity and believe that Mohammed's words about God are more accurate than Jesus's.

However, I think that we can be tolerant of adherents to Islam. Otherwise, how are we ever going to be able to talk with them about our own faith, and the reasons we believe what we do? It may sound like semantics, but I think there's a big difference there.

Again, welcome!

 

[Zhukov]

Jesus originally said:
Do for other people the same things you want them to do for you.

Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them.

So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you.

Treat other people as you would like them to treat you.

Therefore whatever you want men to do to you, do also to them.

 

[DKSuddeth]

I wanted to come up with some long, drawn out, logical explanation as to why this kind of thinking benefits noone but theres just no way to drum out that kind of inane and ignorant insanity :scratch:

 

[5stringJeff]

Zhukov I totally agree. That's how all people should be treated, regardless of religious belief.

 

[wonderwench]

I agree, Zhukov's response says it all.

Just to add a personal anecdote. When I was in 6th grade, I had close friends who were Jewish and Buddhist. In catechism class one day, I asked my teacher what would happen to them in the after life. She gave a wonderful answer: It is up to God to judge all people and she personally believed that he would recognize good people no matter what religion they followed. Not the official Catholic dogma by any means, but a decent way to view other people who have different ways of living.

 

[MeSSeNJa]

Zhukov you are entirely correct and my point does not conflict with the point you are implying. I am saying that because you are a Christian you cannot tolerate other religions. Do to others ars you would have them do to you (or the golden rule) is supported by my claim. But if you expressly believe that Jesus was God incarnate then you cannot view another as equal. An absolute truth This kind will benefit all because it teaches people to stand for something and believe in something. Liberalism teaches moral relativism.

 

[wonderwench]

I think you completely missing the point of the Golden Rule if you use it as a way to judge other human beings a being somehow lesser beings because they are not Christian.

Your attitude is what breeds religious wars - not unsimilar to the attitude of the Islamic Jihadists towards the West.

 

[MeSSeNJa]

See it's different in this aspect. I don't go kill people on a bus because they have a different religion. My attitude is entirely different because I also do not condone hate. I do believe that you are missing the point...

 

[wonderwench]

No, I get your point quite clearly - it is religious intolerance. It doesn't matter if you yourself would become a suicide bomber. When the moderate believers of a religion allow the permeation of intolerance of "others", that intolerance is embraced and fomented into hatred by the fanatics on the fringe.

This is what happend to Islam. Do you want it to happen to Christianity? Well, it actually already has. Look at history and see how many people have been killed in the name of Jesus. It's not a pretty picture. And one he would have abhorred.

 

[eric]

The only reason we don't open our hearts and minds to other people is that they trigger confusion in us that we don't feel brave enough or sane enough to deal with. To the degree that we look clearly and compassionately at ourselves, we feel confident and fearless about looking into someone else's eyes.

 

[DKSuddeth]

Originally posted by MeSSeNJa
Zhukov you are entirely correct and my point does not conflict with the point you are implying. I am saying that because you are a Christian you cannot tolerate other religions. Do to others ars you would have them do to you (or the golden rule) is supported by my claim. But if you expressly believe that Jesus was God incarnate then you cannot view another as equal. An absolute truth This kind will benefit all because it teaches people to stand for something and believe in something. Liberalism teaches moral relativism.

oh great, yet one more person trying to say that religious prejudice is fine and dandy while 'moral relativism' is the same as liberalism is the same as the source of all evil

 

[Annie]

I've always subscribed to the 'Judge not lest ye be judged'. While I believe in Christ, it's not my position to decide who will enter heaven. I've always had problems reconciling the 3rd and 4th commandments. After all, if my parents raised me Jewish or Islamic, aren't I honoring them by following the tenents of their religion?

Problems come when one abdicates their moral choices through their interpretation of whatever religion. If I take the positon of the first poster, I am hateful. Same with suicide bombers and other terrorists, acting in any god's name.

 

[Moi]

I was raised Catholic. I remember quite clearly reading the bible and listening in church. I then continued on to college and graduate school. Somewhere along the way I realized that religion was man-made and that most, if not all, of the rules and rationalizations religion espouses were also man made. Now, that's not to say that I necessarily negate god, but religion itself seems a bit too self serving for me. Rules are set forth, punishments expected. Yet what most religions forget about is the basic humanity behind the rules/regulations- they were created by men to control people. In some instances the rules seem quite rational- don't murder, don't covet your neighbor's goods, honor your parents. In other instances their importance seems quite tricky to grasp- confession? not eating before communion? not using your left hand?

Furthermore, how do you know that the god that the muslims worship isn't the same god as yours? What makes you think that he didn't just give you one set of rules and another to them? Or perhaps what he said was interpreted differently by one set of people? I don't know a single parent who treats their children exactly alike, with rules that are finite and don't change with the talents and needs of each child, meting out punishments in such a concrete way. I would hate to think that the "parent" of humankind was so inflexible.

The fact is you don't know your religion is the only one and 100% correct all the time. You believe. People shouldn't be treated any differently just because of what they believe. Or, for that matter, what we don't believe.

Especially on something as ethereal as religion.

 

[MeSSeNJa]

Ok so you don't agree with me on the religious intolerance aspect. What about moral relativism? I want to hear what you all have to say about that.

 

[wonderwench]

I do agree that the PC agenda within our current culture promotes the practise of Moral Relativism by equating the values of Western Civilization with the complete evil of Totalitarianism.

A frequent one I hear is calling minimum wage earners slaves. Another is equating women being paid less with women being executed for being raped under Sharia law. The list goes on and on. Some value systems are healthier than other. It is quite appropriate to make judgements concerning them.

 

[Zhukov]

Moral relativism is an insidious concept. There is in fact evil and not all actions are morally equivalent. It is good's responsibility to destroy evil, at any cost. The single greatest threat to humanity is human evil and it must be confronted and erradicated wherever it exists.

 

[Annie]

I agree with the majority. Moral relativism is not 'relative' much less correct. The concepts of Locke and Hitler are far apart. Even the ideas of Lenin and Hitler are far apart. The accepted democratic ideals of rule of law as opposed to Sharia are so far apart as to not be in the a common discussion of law.