China Halts All Boeing Deliveries (and More)

[Missourian]

...

Airbus appears to be the immediate alternative since it already maintains a significant presence in China.

Long term, China is also investing heavily in its domestic aircraft manufacturer COMAC to reduce reliance on foreign suppliers.

ChatGPT: "What options does China have for replacing its Boeing aircraft purchases?"

...and China will steal Airbus's intellectual property and manufacturing processes, and build a cheap knockoff built by slave labor at 40% of the cost.

 

[georgephillip]

If so, then we take a hit in our standard of living, then as wages rise as we take more of OUR market back, we become of a more balanced and healthy society.

If a pair of sneakers made in China retails for $150 in the US, how much would those same shoes cost if made here?

American workers could not afford a roof over their families' heads if they toiled for Chinese wages.

Trump appears to believe he can bring back American manufacturing to 1950s levels without any industrial policy, so I'm tempted to believe he's lying about improving condition for US workers (as opposed to billionaires).

 

[Stryder50]

Dupe, but those contracts will be scooped up by other airlines waiting for Boeing aircraft.

If the chi-coms are playing the waiting game they can now wait in the back of the line.

Yup!

Aircraft deliveries can be months to years out in the future.
If China declines then the other customers get bumped up in the line. China is bumped back should they ever change their mind.

Back in the 1990s when I worked for a Boeing subcontractor, we had to send a few of our people to China to show them how to make some of the composite parts that we made for Boeing. China was playing Boeing against Airbus as to which one gave them the better deal, and allowed them to "acquire"(steal) the technology involved in producing those parts.

FWIW, IMO, never too soon to cut China out of the loop on Western technology and products. Especially since CCP China is building up to start a war with us in the near future.

 

[georgephillip]

So, is China going to buy new planes and scrap their Boeing fleet?

...cuz that's going to take awhile.

Airbus has a final assembly line in Tianjin, China.
Additionally, China is heavily investing in its domestic aircraft industry especially the COMAC C1919 which is intended to compete with Boeing"s 737 and Airbus's A320
China is fully capable of achieving aviation independence.

 

[georgephillip]

...

...and China will steal Airbus's intellectual property and manufacturing processes, and build a cheap knockoff built by slave labor at 40% of the cost.

China would argue foreign companies willingly enter into joint ventures and share technology in exchange for access to China's massive market. Legal reforms like establishment of specialized IP courts, and amendments to IP laws allow higher damage awards for violations. Finally, no one in China put a gun to the corporate chieftains heads' and forced them to build a factory in China.

 

[Missourian]

China would argue foreign companies willingly enter into joint ventures and share technology in exchange for access to China's massive market. Legal reforms like establishment of specialized IP courts, and amendments to IP laws allow higher damage awards for violations. Finally, no one in China put a gun to the corporate chieftains heads' and forced them to build a factory in China.

Which is exactly why he ALL need tariffs to level the playing field.

The SAME people screaming "pay a living wage" cut off there own legs arguing AGAINST tariffs.

It's idiotic.

 

[Missourian]

Which is exactly why he ALL need tariffs to level the playing field.

The SAME people screaming "pay a living wage" cut off there own legs arguing AGAINST tariffs.

It's idiotic.

You can have cheap Chinese shit, or a living wage...but not both.

 

[georgephillip]

Which is exactly why he ALL need tariffs to level the playing field.

The SAME people screaming "pay a living wage" cut off there own legs arguing AGAINST tariffs.

It's idiotic.

Tariffs are a tax paid by consumers.
Workers are consumers.
A living wage has to contrast how much a worker earns with how much he has to spend on necessities.
Trump has no clue about how 90% of Americans live, and he probably cares even less.

Chronicle poll results: Trump’s tariffs

 

[Missourian]

Tariffs are a tax paid by consumers.
Workers are consumers.
A living wage has to contrast how much a worker earns with how much he has to spend on necessities.
Trump has no clue about how 90% of Americans live, and he probably cares even less.

Chronicle poll results: Trump’s tariffs

Business tax is also paid by consumers. Democrats have no issues with that increase...even though the resulting revenue goes the same place.

And do not try to make the argument that business tax isn't passed on the the consumer. It absolutely 100% is.

 

[Missourian]

Tariffs are a tax paid by consumers.
Workers are consumers.
A living wage has to contrast how much a worker earns with how much he has to spend on necessities.
Trump has no clue about how 90% of Americans live, and he probably cares even less.

Chronicle poll results: Trump’s tariffs

Doesn't address the issue. You can't have a living wage AND cheap shit from China.

At least is you buy it here, your money is recirculating in our own economy ... exporting that money to China and it's recirculating in THEIR economy.

 

[georgephillip]

You can have cheap Chinese shit, or a living wage...but not both.

That is true within the American capitalist economic system.

"In a truly globalized system, value creation like branding and logistics happens in rich countries while cost-cutting production is pushed to lower wage economies: this benefits capital owners like shareholders and CEOs far more than workers."

ChatGPT: "Are there reasons why Americans can not enjoy buying inexpensive Chinese imports and simultaneously earn a living wage"

 

[Missourian]

this benefits capital owners like shareholders and CEOs far more than workers

Well of course it does. That was the whole idea behind offshoring American manufacturing. Reduced labor costs increases profit.

Tariffs are punitive charges that negate the advantages of offshoring manufacturing to take advantage of cheap labor, causing the transportations costs of shipping products across an ocean and then trucking them around a huge landmass like North America an added expense that makes ONSHORING American manufacturing more cost effective.

And I don't need ChatGPT to figure that out.

We SHOULD have pursued these tariffs 50 years ago...but the same oligarchy you rail against lobbied to end tariffs in the name of "free trade". And now we are living with the consequences of those piss poor, shortsighted decision.

 

[georgephillip]

Tariffs are punitive charges that negate the advantages of offshoring manufacturing to take advantage of cheap labor, causing the transportations costs of shipping products across an ocean and then trucking them around a huge landmass like North America an added expense that makes ONSHORING American manufacturing more cost effective.

Who pays those "punitive charges" that negate the enhanced corporate profits that have come from offshoring?

Tariffs are regressive sales taxes falling mainly on working-class and retired Americans including millions of workers who lost their jobs to offshoring.

Trump's "Hail Mary" tariffs confirm what Marx wrote about the final stages of capitalism:

The Economics of a Dying Empire (w/ Richard Wolff) | The Chris Hedges Report

"Unable to expand and generate profits at past levels, the capitalist system will begin to consume the structures that sustain it.

"It will prey upon, in the name of austerity and government efficiency, the working class and the poor, driving them ever deeper into debt and poverty and diminishing the capacity of the state to serve the needs of ordinary citizens."

 

[Correll]

Yeah real but meaningless, when you wake up and realize who the real enemy is.

Nope. It denies me jobs, wages, poliical power. Hell, people have died from that shit.

When Rittenhouse was attacked by teh murder mob led by the literal madman, it was dems that arrested him for defending himself and tried to put him in jail for life.


That's not meaningless. Thatt's real power and real effects on our lives.


Your... obsession whatever it is, is not more important than that.

 

[gipper]

Nope. It denies me jobs, wages, poliical power. Hell, people have died from that shit.

When Rittenhouse was attacked by teh murder mob led by the literal madman, it was dems that arrested him for defending himself and tried to put him in jail for life.


That's not meaningless. Thatt's real power and real effects on our lives.


Your... obsession whatever it is, is not more important than that.

It’s far more important. You just have to be aware.

 

[Correll]

If a pair of sneakers made in China retails for $150 in the US, how much would those same shoes cost if made here?

Depends how much of the cost is labor and how much is bullshit markups.

Could be 155$ Could be 300$.

I'm done feeding the dragon. I was done back in the 90s. We should have changed policy then.

American workers could not afford a roof over their families' heads if they toiled for Chinese wages.

The way to get there, is to continue to have level playing field between American and chinese workers.


DO YOU WANT A WORLD, WHERE PROSPERITY IS DEFINED BY A PAKISTANI BRICKLAYER'S POINT OF VIEW?

Trump appears to believe he can bring back American manufacturing to 1950s levels without any industrial policy,

Now you are just spamming... talking points. He wants more jobs and higher wages.

HOw much more? That's silly to get precise at this point. 1950s? What was that, 30%? LOL.

If we add one million jobs and wages rise so that millions move from poverty to middle class,

you going to pretend that's a failed policy because it didn't get to 1950s levels? Cause that is what you are trying to set the bar for, so yo have an excuse to continue to dis Trump.


And that's bullshit.

so I'm tempted to believe he's lying about improving condition for US workers (as opposed to billionaires).

No, you're TEMPTED to discount everythign and anytyhing from the RIGHT, becasue you are emotionally invested in the LEFT.

And you are succumbing to that temptation.

 

[Correll]

It’s far more important. You just have to be aware.

More important than whether or not an innocent man spends life in prison?

BULLSHIT.

 

[gipper]

More important than whether or not an innocent man spends life in prison?

BULLSHIT.

You’ll never get it.

 

[eagle1462010]

"The Chinese government orders airlines to suspend Boeing aircraft deliveries due to soaring tariffs and rising costs..."

"According to sources reported by Bloomberg, the Chinese government has instructed its airlines to not only suspend the acceptance of new Boeing jets but also to cease all purchases of aerospace equipment and components from U.S. manufacturers.

"This decision is rooted in the skyrocketing costs associated with U.S.-made aircraft, which have more than doubled due to the tariffs, making it financially unfeasible for Chinese airlines to accept new deliveries."

China Halts Boeing Deliveries Amid Trade War Escalation

Trump is probably ignorant of the tens of thousands of Boeing employees in US states like Washington, Missouri, and South Carolina; however, they are not oblivious to his misunderstanding (or worse) of trade as a zero-sum game.

We have 4 times the products to retaliate in return

 

[Correll]

You’ll never get it.

Dude. YOu are dismissing real life and death issues, with... no reasonable explanation why.


That's as convincing as a heart felt call from a nigerian prince who needs your checking account number.