Can you be smarter than even “God”?

[BreezeWood]

By any objective measure Christianity has been the greatest force for good in the history of mankind. What has atheism done for mankind besides murder 200 million people in the 20th century?

You have issues with cause and effect

Christians kill in the name of Christianity and to force their faith on others
People who are atheist may kill but not to force atheism

How many babies are killed a year done by atheists.

Babies? None. fetuses are not babies. This is just another, more modern, example of Christian hatred, and the desire to dictate the behaviour of others, including non-Christians, based on their arrogant self-image of moral superiority. Sorry, no adherent of a religion that worships a God who commanded genocide has any business questioning anyone on the "killing of babies".

Yes, and black people are just glorified apes and Jews are vermin and infidels are also subhuman

We get it.

Wow. I didn't know you harboured such hatred for other races. See, there is a difference between dehumanizing different races of actual people, and insisting that a potential person is equivalent to an actual person. If fetuses are people, then we need to start including them on tax rolls, letting them apply for handgun pe3rmits, and give to them all of the other rights, and privileges that we give to actual people. You want to pretend that fetuses are people only so that you can dictate what women can, and cannot do with their own bodies. It's just another example of Christian arrogance, and intolerance.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

and created a carnivorous Garden, have you eaten a steak lately ... why is that. what were Eve and Adam having for dinner, other than Flora.

 

[Czernobog]

You have issues with cause and effect

Christians kill in the name of Christianity and to force their faith on others
People who are atheist may kill but not to force atheism

How many babies are killed a year done by atheists.

Babies? None. fetuses are not babies. This is just another, more modern, example of Christian hatred, and the desire to dictate the behaviour of others, including non-Christians, based on their arrogant self-image of moral superiority. Sorry, no adherent of a religion that worships a God who commanded genocide has any business questioning anyone on the "killing of babies".

Yes, and black people are just glorified apes and Jews are vermin and infidels are also subhuman

We get it.

Wow. I didn't know you harboured such hatred for other races. See, there is a difference between dehumanizing different races of actual people, and insisting that a potential person is equivalent to an actual person. If fetuses are people, then we need to start including them on tax rolls, letting them apply for handgun pe3rmits, and give to them all of the other rights, and privileges that we give to actual people. You want to pretend that fetuses are people only so that you can dictate what women can, and cannot do with their own bodies. It's just another example of Christian arrogance, and intolerance.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

and created a carnivorous Garden, have you eaten a steak lately ... why is that. what were Eve and Adam having for dinner, other than Flora.

Wellll...I try to stay away from the stories in Genesis. Most Christians, today, agree that the stories in the First Book are more allegorical. So, it is difficult to ascribe any historical significance to them. The order to kill all of the women, and children of the Amalekites, on the other hand, is found in one of the actual books of History, and a bit more difficult to just write off as allegory.

 

[ding]

When did this place turn into such a hate christian forum ?

Sent from my SM-G386T1 using Tapatalk

It's not about hating Christianity; it's about recognising that Christianity does more harm, than good. There is a poster here who will happily come, and list all of the things that Christianity has "done" in order to "advance" western civilisation. Unfortunately most of those things humans would have done without Christianity. We know this, because many of those advances were also attained in the East, under non-Christian influences. Also, it must be remembered that for everything that Christianity "accomplished", it did so along side a culture of conquest, blood, terror, and death.

No one can deny that many good things have grown out of western civilisation while under the yolk of Christianity. However, it is easily arguable that those things could have been accomplished without Christianity, and with a great deal less bloodshed.

By any objective measure Christianity has been the greatest force for good in the history of mankind. What has atheism done for mankind besides murder 200 million people in the 20th century?

It sure has...as long as we ignore the Inquisition, the jailing, and killing of any scientist during the middle ages who dared top suggest something that opposed Christian dogma, the Conquistadors, the Crusades. Other than that, Christianity has been brilliant.

That sure does seem like a long time ago. Don't you have more recent reasons to hate religion other than you are a militant atheist?

 

[ding]

after the christians were killing for 200 years, in fact since their beginning in the late 4th century to modern times, people like Stalin and Mao were just making up for lost time ....

the tyrants of the 20th century were active only short periods of time before the reformers were able to take control, equating modern history to the past is disingenuous at best.

Whether there is any scant truth to your claim or not, the question was the Inquisition, a specific event. The point is that even in 200 years the very WORST of the Christians were not even a hint of the brutality of the leftist humanists.

No one murders with such abandon as Atheists. One Pol Pot out shadows the brutality and evil of every pope in history. One Mao inflicts more suffering and death than the Roman church over 17 centuries. One Stalin shows a depth of depravity incalculable based on the Catholics.

Hitler was a Christian
Christians slaughtered native people in North America and Australia

Christians stopped Hitler.

 

[ding]

When did this place turn into such a hate christian forum ?

Sent from my SM-G386T1 using Tapatalk

It's not about hating Christianity; it's about recognising that Christianity does more harm, than good. There is a poster here who will happily come, and list all of the things that Christianity has "done" in order to "advance" western civilisation. Unfortunately most of those things humans would have done without Christianity. We know this, because many of those advances were also attained in the East, under non-Christian influences. Also, it must be remembered that for everything that Christianity "accomplished", it did so along side a culture of conquest, blood, terror, and death.

No one can deny that many good things have grown out of western civilisation while under the yolk of Christianity. However, it is easily arguable that those things could have been accomplished without Christianity, and with a great deal less bloodshed.

By any objective measure Christianity has been the greatest force for good in the history of mankind. What has atheism done for mankind besides murder 200 million people in the 20th century?

You have issues with cause and effect

Christians kill in the name of Christianity and to force their faith on others
People who are atheist may kill but not to force atheism

How many babies are killed a year done by atheists.

Babies? None. fetuses are not babies. This is just another, more modern, example of Christian hatred, and the desire to dictate the behaviour of others, including non-Christians, based on their arrogant self-image of moral superiority. Sorry, no adherent of a religion that worships a God who commanded genocide has any business questioning anyone on the "killing of babies".

Human life begins at conception. You are rationalizing that it is ok to end their life by dehumanizing them.

 

[ding]

How many babies are killed a year done by atheists.

Babies? None. fetuses are not babies. This is just another, more modern, example of Christian hatred, and the desire to dictate the behaviour of others, including non-Christians, based on their arrogant self-image of moral superiority. Sorry, no adherent of a religion that worships a God who commanded genocide has any business questioning anyone on the "killing of babies".

Yes, and black people are just glorified apes and Jews are vermin and infidels are also subhuman

We get it.

Wow. I didn't know you harboured such hatred for other races. See, there is a difference between dehumanizing different races of actual people, and insisting that a potential person is equivalent to an actual person. If fetuses are people, then we need to start including them on tax rolls, letting them apply for handgun pe3rmits, and give to them all of the other rights, and privileges that we give to actual people. You want to pretend that fetuses are people only so that you can dictate what women can, and cannot do with their own bodies. It's just another example of Christian arrogance, and intolerance.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

and created a carnivorous Garden, have you eaten a steak lately ... why is that. what were Eve and Adam having for dinner, other than Flora.

Wellll...I try to stay away from the stories in Genesis. Most Christians, today, agree that the stories in the First Book are more allegorical. So, it is difficult to ascribe any historical significance to them. The order to kill all of the women, and children of the Amalekites, on the other hand, is found in one of the actual books of History, and a bit more difficult to just write off as allegory.

You mean like the Tower of Babel? Did you know that that was a historical event that was described through allegory?

 

[ding]

By any objective measure Christianity has been the greatest force for good in the history of mankind. What has atheism done for mankind besides murder 200 million people in the 20th century?

You have issues with cause and effect

Christians kill in the name of Christianity and to force their faith on others
People who are atheist may kill but not to force atheism

How many babies are killed a year done by atheists.

Babies? None. fetuses are not babies. This is just another, more modern, example of Christian hatred, and the desire to dictate the behaviour of others, including non-Christians, based on their arrogant self-image of moral superiority. Sorry, no adherent of a religion that worships a God who commanded genocide has any business questioning anyone on the "killing of babies".

Yes, and black people are just glorified apes and Jews are vermin and infidels are also subhuman

We get it.

Wow. I didn't know you harboured such hatred for other races. See, there is a difference between dehumanizing different races of actual people, and insisting that a potential person is equivalent to an actual person. If fetuses are people, then we need to start including them on tax rolls, letting them apply for handgun pe3rmits, and give to them all of the other rights, and privileges that we give to actual people. You want to pretend that fetuses are people only so that you can dictate what women can, and cannot do with their own bodies. It's just another example of Christian arrogance, and intolerance.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

At conception a genetically distinct new human being is created. So says DNA. They have all of the properties that a human should have for that point in their human life cycle. They are not potential human beings they are human beings with potential.

 

[ding]

You have issues with cause and effect

Christians kill in the name of Christianity and to force their faith on others
People who are atheist may kill but not to force atheism

How many babies are killed a year done by atheists.

Babies? None. fetuses are not babies. This is just another, more modern, example of Christian hatred, and the desire to dictate the behaviour of others, including non-Christians, based on their arrogant self-image of moral superiority. Sorry, no adherent of a religion that worships a God who commanded genocide has any business questioning anyone on the "killing of babies".

Yes, and black people are just glorified apes and Jews are vermin and infidels are also subhuman

We get it.

Wow. I didn't know you harboured such hatred for other races. See, there is a difference between dehumanizing different races of actual people, and insisting that a potential person is equivalent to an actual person. If fetuses are people, then we need to start including them on tax rolls, letting them apply for handgun pe3rmits, and give to them all of the other rights, and privileges that we give to actual people. You want to pretend that fetuses are people only so that you can dictate what women can, and cannot do with their own bodies. It's just another example of Christian arrogance, and intolerance.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

and created a carnivorous Garden, have you eaten a steak lately ... why is that. what were Eve and Adam having for dinner, other than Flora.

The Bible correctly tells us that the first humans were vegetarians and then later became meat eaters. Another example of historical facts explained through allegory.

 

[ding]

When did this place turn into such a hate christian forum ?

Sent from my SM-G386T1 using Tapatalk

It's not about hating Christianity; it's about recognising that Christianity does more harm, than good. There is a poster here who will happily come, and list all of the things that Christianity has "done" in order to "advance" western civilisation. Unfortunately most of those things humans would have done without Christianity. We know this, because many of those advances were also attained in the East, under non-Christian influences. Also, it must be remembered that for everything that Christianity "accomplished", it did so along side a culture of conquest, blood, terror, and death.

No one can deny that many good things have grown out of western civilisation while under the yolk of Christianity. However, it is easily arguable that those things could have been accomplished without Christianity, and with a great deal less bloodshed.

By any objective measure Christianity has been the greatest force for good in the history of mankind. What has atheism done for mankind besides murder 200 million people in the 20th century?

You have issues with cause and effect

Christians kill in the name of Christianity and to force their faith on others
People who are atheist may kill but not to force atheism

How many babies are killed a year done by atheists.

None

You dehumanize human life to rationalize that wrong is right.

 

[ding]

When did this place turn into such a hate christian forum ?

Sent from my SM-G386T1 using Tapatalk

It's not about hating Christianity; it's about recognising that Christianity does more harm, than good. There is a poster here who will happily come, and list all of the things that Christianity has "done" in order to "advance" western civilisation. Unfortunately most of those things humans would have done without Christianity. We know this, because many of those advances were also attained in the East, under non-Christian influences. Also, it must be remembered that for everything that Christianity "accomplished", it did so along side a culture of conquest, blood, terror, and death.

No one can deny that many good things have grown out of western civilisation while under the yolk of Christianity. However, it is easily arguable that those things could have been accomplished without Christianity, and with a great deal less bloodshed.

By any objective measure Christianity has been the greatest force for good in the history of mankind. What has atheism done for mankind besides murder 200 million people in the 20th century?

You have issues with cause and effect

Christians kill in the name of Christianity and to force their faith on others
People who are atheist may kill but not to force atheism

Do you have any recent examples of this?

 

[ding]

We can't bring forward that god has "infinite foreknowledge" or else of course he would have spoken up and agreed with Scientific Humanism's "no slavery" belief, obviously!

He does not have "foreknowledge", just the knowledge that barbaric men had in barbaric times (slavery is cool, kill gays, women need to shut up in church, women are inferior to men and only worth half a man, etc.) So we believe god was just created by men of those days (not women, by the way.) When a particular unique god cares about us enough to provide a court-room level of evidence that he's more real than the other 5000 gods, then we will consider him being real. Until then, he's not WORTHY of our worship.

Now that you have made yourself a god, what will you do to "save" mankind?

What's the plan Stan?

Nope, not a god, just more ethical than one.
I have a hunch that you are too - let me ask you this question to find out - Votto, which is more moral, throwing Jews into a "lake of fire", or throwing them into ovens?

God's judgment is just because he has all knowledge.

Looking back at Sodom, what would you do to a town that raped any foreigners coming into their city when they are their own law in their own city?

What would you do to the Canaanites who sacrificed their children to pagan gods?

And this is just a small bit as to how evil they were. My guess is that they were far worse.

What would you do to Nazi's who participated in the Holocaust?

Two can play at this game.

I have encountered various evil in my life, and I understand it. It must be snuffed out, but how?

With rocks:

If a new husband accuses his wife of not being a virgin, and her parents can not provide hard evidence otherwise, the new bride must be taken to the doorway of her dad's house and men from the neighborhood throw rocks at her until she is dead.


But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel: Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you.

Deuteronomy 22:20​

No god worth worshipping would be ok with this policy - no god worth worshipping would let this ethical filth get into the main book about him - clearly.

It seems to me that you have this odd belief that there can only be a God if everything is perfect. Can you explain to me the basis for this belief?

And while you are at it do you think you could answer the question you keep dodging about do you believe that beings that know and create arose through natural processes or a creative act from God.

 

[Votto]

By any objective measure Christianity has been the greatest force for good in the history of mankind. What has atheism done for mankind besides murder 200 million people in the 20th century?

You have issues with cause and effect

Christians kill in the name of Christianity and to force their faith on others
People who are atheist may kill but not to force atheism

How many babies are killed a year done by atheists.

Babies? None. fetuses are not babies. This is just another, more modern, example of Christian hatred, and the desire to dictate the behaviour of others, including non-Christians, based on their arrogant self-image of moral superiority. Sorry, no adherent of a religion that worships a God who commanded genocide has any business questioning anyone on the "killing of babies".

Yes, and black people are just glorified apes and Jews are vermin and infidels are also subhuman

We get it.

Wow. I didn't know you harboured such hatred for other races. See, there is a difference between dehumanizing different races of actual people, and insisting that a potential person is equivalent to an actual person. If fetuses are people, then we need to start including them on tax rolls, letting them apply for handgun pe3rmits, and give to them all of the other rights, and privileges that we give to actual people. You want to pretend that fetuses are people only so that you can dictate what women can, and cannot do with their own bodies. It's just another example of Christian arrogance, and intolerance.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

Yes, we know. Unborn babies only become human once the birth fairy waves her magic wand over the fetus as it exits the womb.

 

[Czernobog]

You have issues with cause and effect

Christians kill in the name of Christianity and to force their faith on others
People who are atheist may kill but not to force atheism

How many babies are killed a year done by atheists.

Babies? None. fetuses are not babies. This is just another, more modern, example of Christian hatred, and the desire to dictate the behaviour of others, including non-Christians, based on their arrogant self-image of moral superiority. Sorry, no adherent of a religion that worships a God who commanded genocide has any business questioning anyone on the "killing of babies".

Yes, and black people are just glorified apes and Jews are vermin and infidels are also subhuman

We get it.

Wow. I didn't know you harboured such hatred for other races. See, there is a difference between dehumanizing different races of actual people, and insisting that a potential person is equivalent to an actual person. If fetuses are people, then we need to start including them on tax rolls, letting them apply for handgun pe3rmits, and give to them all of the other rights, and privileges that we give to actual people. You want to pretend that fetuses are people only so that you can dictate what women can, and cannot do with their own bodies. It's just another example of Christian arrogance, and intolerance.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

Yes, we know. Unborn babies only become human once the birth fairy waves her magic wand over the fetus as it exits the womb.

No. No. We know that 100% of all fetuses always go to full term to be birthed. The only reason that a fetus ever doesn't make it to full term is abortion. Further, your argument is specious. No reasonable person suggests that abortion after a fetus is viable, except under the most dire of circumstances, is ever ethical. You want to equate a clump of u8nspecialized cells with a fully formed, independently functioning human being. That is emotional, and irrational, like most of your religion.

 

[ding]

How many babies are killed a year done by atheists.

Babies? None. fetuses are not babies. This is just another, more modern, example of Christian hatred, and the desire to dictate the behaviour of others, including non-Christians, based on their arrogant self-image of moral superiority. Sorry, no adherent of a religion that worships a God who commanded genocide has any business questioning anyone on the "killing of babies".

Yes, and black people are just glorified apes and Jews are vermin and infidels are also subhuman

We get it.

Wow. I didn't know you harboured such hatred for other races. See, there is a difference between dehumanizing different races of actual people, and insisting that a potential person is equivalent to an actual person. If fetuses are people, then we need to start including them on tax rolls, letting them apply for handgun pe3rmits, and give to them all of the other rights, and privileges that we give to actual people. You want to pretend that fetuses are people only so that you can dictate what women can, and cannot do with their own bodies. It's just another example of Christian arrogance, and intolerance.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

Yes, we know. Unborn babies only become human once the birth fairy waves her magic wand over the fetus as it exits the womb.

No. No. We know that 100% of all fetuses always go to full term to be birthed. The only reason that a fetus ever doesn't make it to full term is abortion. Further, your argument is specious. No reasonable person suggests that abortion after a fetus is viable, except under the most dire of circumstances, is ever ethical. You want to equate a clump of u8nspecialized cells with a fully formed, independently functioning human being. That is emotional, and irrational, like most of your religion.

That has nothing whatsoever to do with the fact that it is wrong to end a human life.

 

[BreezeWood]

.

That has nothing whatsoever to do with the fact that it is wrong to end a human life.

what life is right to end any more than the woman's choice to separate herself from an unplanned pregnancy.

how many cows will pay the price for religious zealotry ...

 

[ding]

.

That has nothing whatsoever to do with the fact that it is wrong to end a human life.

what life is right to end any more than the woman's choice to separate herself from an unplanned pregnancy.

how many cows will pay the price for religious zealotry ...

“In that fraction of a second when the chromosomes form pairs, the sex of the new child will be determined, hereditary characteristics received from each parent will be set, and a new life will have begun.”

Kaluger, G., and Kaluger, M., Human Development: The Span of Life, page 28-29, The C.V. Mosby Co., St. Louis, 1974.

 

[BreezeWood]

.

That has nothing whatsoever to do with the fact that it is wrong to end a human life.

what life is right to end any more than the woman's choice to separate herself from an unplanned pregnancy.

how many cows will pay the price for religious zealotry ...

“In that fraction of a second when the chromosomes form pairs, the sex of the new child will be determined, hereditary characteristics received from each parent will be set, and a new life will have begun.”

Kaluger, G., and Kaluger, M., Human Development: The Span of Life, page 28-29, The C.V. Mosby Co., St. Louis, 1974.

.

“In that fraction of a second when the chromosomes form pairs, the sex of the new child will be determined, hereditary characteristics received from each parent will be set, and a new life will have begun.”

.

theirs is fully engaged - why do you want to murder the innocent lamb, hundreds of them, zealot.

 

[Czernobog]

Babies? None. fetuses are not babies. This is just another, more modern, example of Christian hatred, and the desire to dictate the behaviour of others, including non-Christians, based on their arrogant self-image of moral superiority. Sorry, no adherent of a religion that worships a God who commanded genocide has any business questioning anyone on the "killing of babies".

Yes, and black people are just glorified apes and Jews are vermin and infidels are also subhuman

We get it.

Wow. I didn't know you harboured such hatred for other races. See, there is a difference between dehumanizing different races of actual people, and insisting that a potential person is equivalent to an actual person. If fetuses are people, then we need to start including them on tax rolls, letting them apply for handgun pe3rmits, and give to them all of the other rights, and privileges that we give to actual people. You want to pretend that fetuses are people only so that you can dictate what women can, and cannot do with their own bodies. It's just another example of Christian arrogance, and intolerance.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

and created a carnivorous Garden, have you eaten a steak lately ... why is that. what were Eve and Adam having for dinner, other than Flora.

Wellll...I try to stay away from the stories in Genesis. Most Christians, today, agree that the stories in the First Book are more allegorical. So, it is difficult to ascribe any historical significance to them. The order to kill all of the women, and children of the Amalekites, on the other hand, is found in one of the actual books of History, and a bit more difficult to just write off as allegory.

You mean like the Tower of Babel? Did you know that that was a historical event that was described through allegory?

If you say so. "Go kill all of those women, and kids", though? There was nothing allegorical about that. That was direct, specific, and concrete. God said it, and he meant exactly what he said. You worship a God who commanded genocide, and now pretend like you give a shit about fetuses, while being perfectly happy to leave actual babies, starving, homeless, and wanting for healthcare. At best, you are a hypocrite; at worst, a sociopath.

 

[Czernobog]

Babies? None. fetuses are not babies. This is just another, more modern, example of Christian hatred, and the desire to dictate the behaviour of others, including non-Christians, based on their arrogant self-image of moral superiority. Sorry, no adherent of a religion that worships a God who commanded genocide has any business questioning anyone on the "killing of babies".

Yes, and black people are just glorified apes and Jews are vermin and infidels are also subhuman

We get it.

Wow. I didn't know you harboured such hatred for other races. See, there is a difference between dehumanizing different races of actual people, and insisting that a potential person is equivalent to an actual person. If fetuses are people, then we need to start including them on tax rolls, letting them apply for handgun pe3rmits, and give to them all of the other rights, and privileges that we give to actual people. You want to pretend that fetuses are people only so that you can dictate what women can, and cannot do with their own bodies. It's just another example of Christian arrogance, and intolerance.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

Yes, we know. Unborn babies only become human once the birth fairy waves her magic wand over the fetus as it exits the womb.

No. No. We know that 100% of all fetuses always go to full term to be birthed. The only reason that a fetus ever doesn't make it to full term is abortion. Further, your argument is specious. No reasonable person suggests that abortion after a fetus is viable, except under the most dire of circumstances, is ever ethical. You want to equate a clump of u8nspecialized cells with a fully formed, independently functioning human being. That is emotional, and irrational, like most of your religion.

That has nothing whatsoever to do with the fact that it is wrong to end a human life.

It's not wrong to end a human life. We do it all the time. Pulling the plug on vegetative patients, capital punishment, we end human life all the time. It is never a question of "human life"; it is always a question of viable, independently functioning, human life. Wellll...not with capital punishment. That is an entirely different animal. But, you want to pretend that there is some moral imperative against taking a human life, when that is simply not the case.

In the case of abortions, it is simply a question of which matters more - the actual, living, independently functioning human being, or the clump of cells with the potential to become a living, independently functioning human being. Those of us who are rational, and reasoning, have decided that the actuality takes precedent over the possible.

 

[ding]

Yes, and black people are just glorified apes and Jews are vermin and infidels are also subhuman

We get it.

Wow. I didn't know you harboured such hatred for other races. See, there is a difference between dehumanizing different races of actual people, and insisting that a potential person is equivalent to an actual person. If fetuses are people, then we need to start including them on tax rolls, letting them apply for handgun pe3rmits, and give to them all of the other rights, and privileges that we give to actual people. You want to pretend that fetuses are people only so that you can dictate what women can, and cannot do with their own bodies. It's just another example of Christian arrogance, and intolerance.

Again, you worship a god who commanded genocide. Why pretend that you give a shit about "killing babies"?

Yes, we know. Unborn babies only become human once the birth fairy waves her magic wand over the fetus as it exits the womb.

No. No. We know that 100% of all fetuses always go to full term to be birthed. The only reason that a fetus ever doesn't make it to full term is abortion. Further, your argument is specious. No reasonable person suggests that abortion after a fetus is viable, except under the most dire of circumstances, is ever ethical. You want to equate a clump of u8nspecialized cells with a fully formed, independently functioning human being. That is emotional, and irrational, like most of your religion.

That has nothing whatsoever to do with the fact that it is wrong to end a human life.

It's not wrong to end a human life. We do it all the time. Pulling the plug on vegetative patients, capital punishment, we end human life all the time. It is never a question of "human life"; it is always a question of viable, independently functioning, human life. Wellll...not with capital punishment. That is an entirely different animal. But, you want to pretend that there is some moral imperative against taking a human life, when that is simply not the case.

In the case of abortions, it is simply a question of which matters more - the actual, living, independently functioning human being, or the clump of cells with the potential to become a living, independently functioning human being. Those of us who are rational, and reasoning, have decided that the actuality takes precedent over the possible.

First of all I disagree that it isn't always wrong. We've had that discussion before. I'm glad to have it again. As I recall, you ran off after I made my case. Secondly, it isn't a potential human, it is a human with potential. And lastly, you are comparing a human being losing its life to a human being who doesn't want to be inconvenienced.