Zone1 And Jesus said "Depart from me, all you..." What? Evil believers? No, "Evildoers"

[forkintheroad7]

Presenting a different perspective is not waxing superior to Catholic beliefs.

I apologize for posting something incoherent.

weasel responses

 

[hadit]

Points to ponder is that Jesus commanded we spread the Good News. He asked us to love as he loves. He taught God is love. Somehow, telling anyone they won't be forgiven for anything, their goodness will be looked on as filth, falls well short of teaching the love of God and his Good News.

Is that how WE think, or how GOD thinks? Remember that the Word tells us that repentance and forgiveness are linked, that sin MUST be punished, that our own efforts to be good ARE like filthy rags. Sure, we want everybody to be together in harmony forever, one big pink cloud of good feelings, but that would mean that sin has to just be ignored, and God's justice doesn't allow for that.

"Loving" sometimes seems harsh. If I love my children, I don't let them have everything they want all the times, I don't let them do everything they want all the time, etc. They don't like it, but they need it. Ultimately, God is not going to force Himself on anyone, if someone is determined to be disobedient, they will reap what they sow, and there can only be good news (which is the definition of the Gospel) if it replaces bad news (the way they're going). Think of it this way, if God is just going to forgive everything anyway, and not hold anyone accountable for their sin, why did Christ die? Why are we commanded to spread the good news at all?

Yes, God is complete love. He is also complete justice.

 

[forkintheroad7]

Loving people does not mean giving up your truth (esp objective Truth) to make them happy or to keep the peace.

Loving people means telling them Hell exists, so they can take measures to avoid it esp since it DOES last forever...

Love is not some warm, fuzzy feeling (although that can be a side effect of real love)

That said, I do agree w/ MW

here

telling anyone they won't be forgiven for anything, their goodness will be looked on as filth, falls well short of teaching the love of God and his Good News.

That statement reflects what a lot of the anti-Catholic folks at theforum say to Catholics on a regular basis

 

[Meriweather]

weasel responses

Proverbs 15:1

 

[Meriweather]

Is that how WE think, or how GOD thinks? Remember that the Word tells us that repentance and forgiveness are linked, that sin MUST be punished, that our own efforts to be good ARE like filthy rags. Sure, we want everybody to be together in harmony forever, one big pink cloud of good feelings, but that would mean that sin has to just be ignored, and God's justice doesn't allow for that.

Scripture does not say our own efforts to be good are like filthy rags. It is pointing out that some of what leaders/society decides is good are filthy rags before the Lord. In our day, abortion, transgender surgery on teens, overuse of prescription drugs (Ritalin comes to mind), recreational sex outside of marriage are prime examples. Scripture is not saying our kind and selflessness acts are like filthy rags.

No, that does not mean sin has to be ignored. It means sin shall be/must be overcome.

"Loving" sometimes seems harsh. If I love my children, I don't let them have everything they want all the times, I don't let them do everything they want all the time, etc. They don't like it, but they need it. Ultimately, God is not going to force Himself on anyone, if someone is determined to be disobedient, they will reap what they sow, and there can only be good news (which is the definition of the Gospel) if it replaces bad news (the way they're going). Think of it this way, if God is just going to forgive everything anyway, and not hold anyone accountable for their sin, why did Christ die? Why are we commanded to spread the good news at all?

Love is not being a pushover. Love is doing what is best for the other. God promised forgiveness when repentance/turning away from the wrong is accomplished. Christ died to redeem all the world and to open the way of salvation to everyone. That is a prime example of God's love for his people. We are all God's people until we reject him to his face (speaking metaphorically). This means we must first know him in order to reject him.

Those who reject Christ: Do they know enough about him to reject him? Those who accept Christ: Do they know him well enough to know what they are accepting?

 

[hadit]

Scripture does not say our own efforts to be good are like filthy rags. It is pointing out that some of what leaders/society decides is good are filthy rags before the Lord. In our day, abortion, transgender surgery on teens, overuse of prescription drugs (Ritalin comes to mind), recreational sex outside of marriage are prime examples. Scripture is not saying our kind and selflessness acts are like filthy rags.

No, that does not mean sin has to be ignored. It means sin shall be/must be overcome.



Love is not being a pushover. Love is doing what is best for the other. God promised forgiveness when repentance/turning away from the wrong is accomplished. Christ died to redeem all the world and to open the way of salvation to everyone. That is a prime example of God's love for his people. We are all God's people until we reject him to his face (speaking metaphorically). This means we must first know him in order to reject him.

Those who reject Christ: Do they know enough about him to reject him? Those who accept Christ: Do they know him well enough to know what they are accepting?

The Spirit supplies that knowledge. It is the Spirit that draws people to Christ. So, yes, people DO know enough to choose, and it is our command to make disciples of all nations, not hold back so someone can be judged on some good deeds they've done instead of having the faith that pleases God.

 

[forkintheroad7]

Actually, I think the Scripture about filthy rags is exactly what it appears to be saying

our righteousness is .. well, nothing compared to that of Christ. When we do good things, there is usually a lot of SELF involved, hence the term filthy rags..

But that is not the same as saying that we don't have to do any good works