It's biblical, pre-biblical, and extrabiblical. It has been seen throughout the world, on every continent except Australia (as far as we know). It predates Islam, Christianity, Judaism and even Hinduism, ALL of whose adherents have engaged in it as well as "pagans" and other animistic religions.
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Burning prisoners to death, a punishment sanctioned in Islam
- Thread starter Roudy
- Start date
It's biblical, pre-biblical, and extrabiblical. It has been seen throughout the world, on every continent except Australia (as far as we know). It predates Islam, Christianity, Judaism and even Hinduism, ALL of whose adherents have engaged in it as well as "pagans" and other animistic religions.
So because someone did it in ancient history that makes it ok for Islamist to do it now. That is your argument right?I have yet to see this video.
I haven't seen it either but I have no need to.
I've seen ones of witch-burnings in Africa and read way more than enough about Inquisitions, plus all that history I linked yesterday as well as the one at the beginning of this thread. It doesn't get any easier.
Apparently they believe that since Christians once burned people at the stake these isis monsters are, you know, just following suit, no biggie.
And again, that fact alone, which is not disputed, following the OP's logic must necessarily mean that "burning alive is 'sanctioned' in the bible". It has to.
"Biggie" doesn't even enter into it. It's not a qualitative judgment, much as summa y'all are obsessed with imagining it is. It's a simple case of calling Bullshit on bad logic. The OP's taking a real story of justifiable outrage and trying to milk blanket bigotry out of it.
And that is Bullshit.
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- Oct 19, 2012
- 61,159
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You naive, strange people who are continuously racking your small brains. looking for moral equivalence of reprehensible Islamic actions, are beyond normal comprehension.
All you are doing is trying to change the subject thereby helping these foul radical savages!
There is no logic whatsoever in your actions.
Instead of looking for excuses for this monstrous burning, why not concentrate on the present, which is the danger of radical Islam as has been proved without a doubt time and time again.
Stop making excuses by attempting to compare actions that are beyond any rational comparison.
Have the courage, decency and common sense to aknowledge these Islamic horrors for what they are instead of always being a willing donkey for radical Islam!
All you are demonstrating is that you seem to have hidden sympathy for all these horrible actions!
Shame on you!
Shame on you?
Shame on you.
Religious extremism sucks. Those that don't recognize it cry "moral equivalency".
African Christians are burning witches and excorsizing kids with acid. Sweet.
Your answer is completely without logic and once again you are descending to moral equivalence, which means you are attempting to change the subject and gloss over its seriousness
Even if your babble about African witches is true ...what possible comparison is there to the Islamic Caliphate State whose religious aim is to dominate the whole world under Sharia Law and maintain its barbaric practices.
Your babble is completly irrelevant!
People who use this moral equivalence garbage, seem to be condoning the actions of radical Islam by saying - "Well so what , a lot of others are doing it, so why shouldn't they?" -
Everybody who makes these disgusting , ignorant comparisons is only helping the enemy by being a useful donkey for radical Islam.
You can be sure that the enemy is fully aware of these "moral equivalence" comments and is greatly encouraged by them.
They are no doubt amazed by all the sympathy they get from the enemy, in other words the enemy is in the necessary state of submission like so many in this thread.
Everybody who makes these disgusting , ignorant comparisons is only helping the enemy by being a useful donkey for radical Islam.
Unfortunately the case still has yet to be made, from the beginning here, that it IS "Islam". As opposed to just another Composition Fallacy.
That's what we've been waiting on the whole time. Without it, the entire premise in the thread's very title falls to the ground.
No, actually it's logic. If you assert a fact you have to back it up. And that hasn't been done.
We had the same Composition Fallacy bullshit trotted out not long ago with bride burning and female genital mutilation. They didn't work either. And it's because they can't be proven to have origins in religion at all, and can be proven to have previous origins in cultural history. Which both Coyote and I did.
At some point one has to come to terms with the fact that an OP may be lying to everybody and that just because somebody creates a thread it doesn't mean they've created a fact.
We had the same Composition Fallacy bullshit trotted out not long ago with bride burning and female genital mutilation. They didn't work either. And it's because they can't be proven to have origins in religion at all, and can be proven to have previous origins in cultural history. Which both Coyote and I did.
At some point one has to come to terms with the fact that an OP may be lying to everybody and that just because somebody creates a thread it doesn't mean they've created a fact.
You naive, strange people who are continuously racking your small brains. looking for moral equivalence of reprehensible Islamic actions, are beyond normal comprehension.
All you are doing is trying to change the subject thereby helping these foul radical savages!
There is no logic whatsoever in your actions.
Instead of looking for excuses for this monstrous burning, why not concentrate on the present, which is the danger of radical Islam as has been proved without a doubt time and time again.
Stop making excuses by attempting to compare actions that are beyond any rational comparison.
Have the courage, decency and common sense to aknowledge these Islamic horrors for what they are instead of always being a willing donkey for radical Islam!
All you are demonstrating is that you seem to have hidden sympathy for all these horrible actions!
Shame on you!
Shame on you?
Shame on you.
Religious extremism sucks. Those that don't recognize it cry "moral equivalency".
African Christians are burning witches and excorsizing kids with acid. Sweet.
Your answer is completely without logic and once again you are descending to moral equivalence, which means you are attempting to change the subject and gloss over its seriousness
Even if your babble about African witches is true ...what possible comparison is there to the Islamic Caliphate State whose religious aim is to dominate the whole world under Sharia Law and maintain its barbaric practices.
Your babble is completly irrelevant!
People who use this moral equivalence garbage, seem to be condoning the actions of radical Islam by saying - "Well so what , a lot of others are doing it, so why shouldn't they?" -
Everybody who makes these disgusting , ignorant comparisons is only helping the enemy by being a useful donkey for radical Islam.
You can be sure that the enemy is fully aware of these "moral equivalence" comments and is greatly encouraged by them.
They are no doubt amazed by all the sympathy they get from the enemy, in other words the enemy is in the necessary state of submission like so many in this thread.
sky----the word "ENEMY" is relative ----relative to the person being considered. Al Qaeda may be YOUR enemy----but it
is not the enemy of coyote----nor is "isis" Placing a young pilot in a cage and setting him on fire may seem
like an atrocity and a crime to YOU-----but it is not so for coyote RELATIVE to WHO is doing the 'setting on fire'
and to what end. Your problem, sky----is that you do not
enjoy obscene sophistry
Nosmo King
Gold Member
Back when Christians burned folks at the stake, occasionally they would take mercy on the condemned and hang a bag of gunpowder around the neck.
Most of the people accused of witchcraft in 1692 Salem Massachusetts were hanged. One was placed under a plank and stones were added atop said plank until the victim was crushed. These were executions carried out in America and part of our history.
Most of the people accused of witchcraft in 1692 Salem Massachusetts were hanged. One was placed under a plank and stones were added atop said plank until the victim was crushed. These were executions carried out in America and part of our history.
I don't give a fuck if it's cultural or religious the Muslims are doing it in the name of their religion. They are the ones who say it's religious motivation whether it's actually is cultural or not is really immaterial. Make it stop. Kill them until there is no one left alive that thinks the way they do.No, actually it's logic. If you assert a fact you have to back it up. And that hasn't been done.
We had the same Composition Fallacy bullshit trotted out not long ago with bride burning and female genital mutilation. They didn't work either. And it's because they can't be proven to have origins in religion at all, and can be proven to have previous origins in cultural history. Which both Coyote and I did.
At some point one has to come to terms with the fact that an OP may be lying to everybody and that just because somebody creates a thread it doesn't mean they've created a fact.
No, actually it's logic. If you assert a fact you have to back it up. And that hasn't been done.
We had the same Composition Fallacy bullshit trotted out not long ago with bride burning and female genital mutilation. They didn't work either. And it's because they can't be proven to have origins in religion at all, and can be proven to have previous origins in cultural history. Which both Coyote and I did.
At some point one has to come to terms with the fact that an OP may be lying to everybody and that just because somebody creates a thread it doesn't mean they've created a fact.
I don't give a fuck if it's cultural or religious the Muslims are doing it in the name of their religion. They are the ones who say it's religious motivation whether it's actually is cultural or not is really immaterial. Make it stop. Kill them until there is no one left alive that thinks the way they do.
And as noted before, the Scott Roeders and Eric Rudolphs do what they do in the name of their religion too. Doesn't make it a valid source and it doesn't make their read correct.
Cherrypicking a loose association and extrapolating a cause-and-effect ..... and no less, taking the word of a terrorist group as gospel in order to make it work.... is a fallacy. And until somebody document's the OP's premise, that's all it remains.
So no, it's hardly "immaterial". It's the entire basis of this thread.
Back when Christians burned folks at the stake, occasionally they would take mercy on the condemned and hang a bag of gunpowder around the neck.
Most of the people accused of witchcraft in 1692 Salem Massachusetts were hanged. One was placed under a plank and stones were added atop said plank until the victim was crushed. These were executions carried out in America and part of our history.
all true-----but now it is a crime. One of the arguments
often presented regarding Islamic barbarity is----"think of
muslims are being 600 years behind Christians in
civilization"
Because I have interacted with muslims in the USA for
a very long time (more than 45 years)---I assure I do
know that muslims do not consider themselves "less
civilized" than anyone on earth----in fact FAR AHEAD.
The subjects of their weekly Khutbah Jumaat feces
fling "sermons" in mosques generally consist of
assertions that islam is THE MOST CIVILIZED and
ADVANCED religion the world has every known----
and actually muhummad INVENTED such concepts
as "women's rights" and "ending slavery" etc etc.
Poor King Abdullah----was so stuck ----he clearly felt
compelled to say "that was not islam...." ------but then
his mother was an English lady... he may not know
Back when Christians burned folks at the stake, occasionally they would take mercy on the condemned and hang a bag of gunpowder around the neck.
And they'd often make the victim's children watch.
Most of the people accused of witchcraft in 1692 Salem Massachusetts were hanged. One was placed under a plank and stones were added atop said plank until the victim was crushed. These were executions carried out in America and part of our history.
I went there last year. That guy was what they call "pressed to death". And it took days.
Sadism knows no religion. It's already part the human psyche. Religion is supposed to curb all that. But like all human inventions it's flawed and doesn't always work.
Back when Christians burned folks at the stake, occasionally they would take mercy on the condemned and hang a bag of gunpowder around the neck.
And they'd often make the victim's children watch.
Most of the people accused of witchcraft in 1692 Salem Massachusetts were hanged. One was placed under a plank and stones were added atop said plank until the victim was crushed. These were executions carried out in America and part of our history.
I went there last year. That guy was what they call "pressed to death". And it took days.
Sadism knows no religion. It's already part the human psyche. Religion is supposed to curb all that. But like all human inventions it's flawed and doesn't always work.
they used that pressing thing both to get confessions and
to kill. -----it was a long time ago and the method
has been repudiated.------it is the legacy of the first reich.---
which is the holy roman empire under it's first emperor ---
CONSTANTINE----Constantine got it from pre-Christian
Rome
Back when Christians burned folks at the stake, occasionally they would take mercy on the condemned and hang a bag of gunpowder around the neck.
And they'd often make the victim's children watch.
Most of the people accused of witchcraft in 1692 Salem Massachusetts were hanged. One was placed under a plank and stones were added atop said plank until the victim was crushed. These were executions carried out in America and part of our history.
I went there last year. That guy was what they call "pressed to death". And it took days.
Sadism knows no religion. It's already part the human psyche. Religion is supposed to curb all that. But like all human inventions it's flawed and doesn't always work.
they used that pressing thing both to get confessions and to kill. -----it was a long time ago and the method has been repudiated.------it is the legacy of the first reich.--- which is the holy roman empire under it's first emperor --- CONSTANTINE----Constantine got it from pre-Christian Rome
No doubt. But how long ago any of these took place is irrelevant in the context here, as the OP maintains it's "sanctioned in Islam", i.e. as an institution --- and to make that case he cites not the Quran but a guy who reportedly committed the act a thousand years before Salem.
--- a name which ironically, means "peace". In both Arabic and Hebrew.
Salem wasn't done by the HRE though. It was religious fanatics (Christians in this case) operating on mass hysteria. Which is the same mob mentality the OP tries to foment with fallacy. Which in turn is why I call Bullshit on it.
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Back when Christians burned folks at the stake, occasionally they would take mercy on the condemned and hang a bag of gunpowder around the neck.
And they'd often make the victim's children watch.
Most of the people accused of witchcraft in 1692 Salem Massachusetts were hanged. One was placed under a plank and stones were added atop said plank until the victim was crushed. These were executions carried out in America and part of our history.
I went there last year. That guy was what they call "pressed to death". And it took days.
Sadism knows no religion. It's already part the human psyche. Religion is supposed to curb all that. But like all human inventions it's flawed and doesn't always work.
they used that pressing thing both to get confessions and
to kill. -----it was a long time ago and the method
has been repudiated.------it is the legacy of the first reich.---
which is the holy roman empire under it's first emperor ---
CONSTANTINE----Constantine got it from pre-Christian
Rome
No doubt. But how long ago any of these took place is irrelevant in the context here, as the OP maintains it's "sanctioned in Islam", i.e. as an institution --- and to make that case he cites not the Quran but a guy who reportedly committed the act it a thousand years before Salem.
--- a name which ironically, means "peace". In both Arabic and Hebrew.
Ok-----I do not know if burning people to death is something
that muslims have done as a criminal penalty either. Historically muslims behead, or they toss people off
high towers or slit their throats. According to shariah law---
a muslim is not executed summarily-----they would have had
to issue an edict of TAKFIR----on this guy---in order to kill
him without a trial ------I have heard of an obscure method
amongst muslims which seems to involve letting a wall fall
on the condemned person------the person to ask is a "QADI"
In war-----a commonly used Islamic method of getting rid
of the enemy in large numbers was starvation siege----
stick them in the wilderness, or shove them on an island and
starve them to death------the Biafran genocide was a
starvation siege------1971-----but the biafrans were
Christians so different rules apply
Burning someone alive is atrocious and savage, it does not compare to a biblical or philosophical metaphor. Anyone who burns someone alive is an animal and should be dealt with accordingly.
somewhere----long ago-----in discussions about executions----
I recall (vaguely) after the discussion of death by hanging----
there came to be a discussion of death by burning. If the person is placed on a pile of burning wood (Inquistion style)---
he actually suffocates very quickly----dying of lack of oxygen--
which really does not take all that long. (well----ideally)---
dousing a person in an accelerant as the animals of isis
did is a real horror----------takes a relatively long time----
he actually felt the BURNING
Burning someone alive is atrocious and savage, it does not compare to a biblical or philosophical metaphor. Anyone who burns someone alive is an animal and should be dealt with accordingly.
somewhere----long ago-----in discussions about executions---- I recall (vaguely) after the discussion of death by hanging---- there came to be a discussion of death by burning. If the person is placed on a pile of burning wood (Inquistion style)--- he actually suffocates very quickly----dying of lack of oxygen-- which really does not take all that long. (well----ideally)---
dousing a person in an accelerant as the animals of isis did is a real horror----------takes a relatively long time---- he actually felt the BURNING
Without having experienced it I'm pretty sure anyone burned alive feels it plenty, oxygen or no oxygen.
The Wiki link to death by burning I posted yesterday includes this entry:
The manner in which Johannes Thomas[55] was executed is described as following, 13 July that year. Some feet above the actual pyre, attached to a stake, a wooden chamber had been constructed, into which the delinquent was placed. Pipes or chimneys, filled with sulphuric material led up to the chamber, and that was first lit, so that Thomas died from inhaling the sulphuric smoke, rather than being strictly burnt alive, before his body was consumed by the general fire. Some 20.000 people had gathered to watch Thomas' execution.[56]
This was 1804 by the way, and a civil penalty-- not even related to religion.
Last edited:
- Mar 16, 2012
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- Thread starter
- #159
More lame deflection. Clearly you guys have run out of arrows and are shooting spit balls. No one said "all Muslims believe" but what is clear is that ISIS, like the Taliban and Boko Haram and any number of Jihadi gangs find not only religious justification for their actions but an obligation to impose their Islam by all and any means ... especially violence.hey now, one guy said it was okay - that means that no matter what anyone else says, it's okay and indicative of what all muslims believe.
It was the OP -- you know the one you're acting as apologist for --- who ran out of arrows in claiming "burning prisoners to death [is] sanctioned by Islam" -- an assertion neither he nor you nor anyone else has been able to back up.
As for "religious justification" found subjectively by ISIS or anyone else, hey, Scott Roeder and Eric Rudolph and any number of other terrorists did exactly the same thing subjectively -- shall we conclude "shooting doctors to death and bombing lesbian bars is sanctioned by Christianism"?
How about Hatuey, that story I posted at the beginning of this thread? Shall we conclude from that that "burning alive is 'sanctioned' by Christianism" as well? I mean it's not an isolated case -- you've got the Inquisitions of the past, slave burnings of colonial times, African "witches" right now...
Hey, it's the same logic.
OK then. Back in your Bullshit hole.
Actually it looks like you're the one full of it. I showed you specifically how Islam sanctions it, and a cleric explaining the religious reasons for burning as opposed to beheading. And thats when you guys went off on your false equivalency rants about the crusades, people burning watches, US dropping bombs etc. błah blah blah....
You people are totally deranged.
Burning someone alive is atrocious and savage, it does not compare to a biblical or philosophical metaphor. Anyone who burns someone alive is an animal and should be dealt with accordingly.
somewhere----long ago-----in discussions about executions---- I recall (vaguely) after the discussion of death by hanging---- there came to be a discussion of death by burning. If the person is placed on a pile of burning wood (Inquistion style)--- he actually suffocates very quickly----dying of lack of oxygen-- which really does not take all that long. (well----ideally)---
dousing a person in an accelerant as the animals of isis did is a real horror----------takes a relatively long time---- he actually felt the BURNING
Without having experienced it I'm pretty sure anyone burned alive feels it plenty, oxygen or no oxygen.
The Wiki link to death by burning I posted yesterday includes this entry:
The manner in which Johannes Thomas[55] was executed is described as following, 13 July that year. Some feet above the actual pyre, attached to a stake, a wooden chamber had been constructed, into which the delinquent was placed. Pipes or chimneys, filled with sulphuric material led up to the chamber, and that was first lit, so that Thomas died from inhaling the sulphuric smoke, rather than being strictly burnt alive, before his body was consumed by the general fire. Some 20.000 people had gathered to watch Thomas' execution.[56]This was 1804 by the way, and a civil penalty-- not even related to religion.
I have no idea what "sulphuric smoke" does to anyone---
what he probably inhaled was------NOT ENOUGH OXYGEN.
---sulphur in the air is simply the smell of rotten eggs-----
in traditional thinking it is the smell of HELL----which is probably the issue that the nuts had in mind. What had
THOMAS done? ------------uhm----keep in mind----
the Europeans brought the INQUISITION to the USA----
<<<< a rarely recognized factoid. "civil penalty"??? no
crime?
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