Average teachers pay vs average pay.

[eagle1462010]

https://www.alabamaachieves.org/wp-...ativeTestCoordinatorManualSpring2022_V1.0.pdf

 

[WorldWatcher]

https://alva.k12.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/9/2024/07/alva-parent-and-student-handbook-24-25.pdf#:~:text=• Attendance and participation at required state and school testing;&text=Students are also required to pass the,Test in the United States Government class

Page 35 and 36. Mandatory tests WHICH ARE REQUIRED BY THE FED

Thank you very much.

I reviewed the pages. And nothing says that there is a federal test that Alabama students are required to take.

There is a reference to STAR assessments by commercial company call Renaissance that the state uses.

ACT testing isn't Federally mandates, it's a college prep test.

And ACAP is an Alabama assessment tool. (https://www.alabamaachieves.org/assessment/acap/)

Now that I can see the full test of the link as part of the reply.

The text in the after "#:~test =" shows that the inclusion was part of the Google search, not that it was actually contained in the resulting PDF file. It shows that you got a response back based on what you searched for, not that the document actually supports what was searched for.

In other words, be careful what you search for and proof your results. What is reduced may not support what you hope it does.


WW

 

[todd down under]

Monday, March 17th: three posts
Tuesday, March 18th: five posts
Wednesday, March 19th: one post
Thursday, March 20th: one post
Friday, March 21st: no posts

Never any posts between the hours of about 8 AM EST and 4:30 PM EST.

So pound sand

You didn't itemize your other 51 weeks. Ya know, where you average 15 posts/day.

 

[eagle1462010]

ALL students attending public school must be provided the opportunity to participate in the ACAP. The
U.S. Department of Education requires that each school, district, and group (students in the aggregate and
each subgroup) have at least a 95% participation rate on assessments.



If they dont teach the tests then Fed can cut funding. My sisters used to complain about teaching the test. Had to prep kids for it and it was the lessin plan

 

[eagle1462010]

Thank you very much.

I reviewed the pages. And nothing says that there is a federal test that Alabama students are required to take.

There is a reference to STAR assessments by commercial company call Renaissance that the state uses.

ACT testing isn't Federally mandates, it's a college prep test.

And ACAP is an Alabama assessment tool. (https://www.alabamaachieves.org/assessment/acap/)

View attachment 1093352

Now that I can see the full test of the link as part of the reply.

The text in the after "#:~test =" shows that the inclusion was part of the Google search, not that it was actually contained in the resulting PDF file. It shows that you got a response back based on what you searched for, not that the document actually supports what was searched for.

In other words, be careful what you search for and proof your results. What is reduced may not support what you hope it does.


WW

Ive since posted another article. Why woupdnt I search the test requirements??

That is precisely what you asked me. My sisters used to complain about it. They said teach the test and Im simply saying what they told me over time.

Said they were pushed to get good standardized scores so they based all teaching on that test.

Last article I read was if a low pass rate ACAP parents can move kids and the school will lose funding from the Fed as its on a per child basis.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Ive since posted another article. Why woupdnt I search the test requirements??

That is precisely what you asked me. My sisters used to complain about it. They said teach the test and Im simply saying what they told me over time.

Said they were pushed to get good standardized scores so they based all teaching on that test.

Last article I read was if a low pass rate ACAP parents can move kids and the school will lose funding from the Fed as its on a per child basis.

In your last link the word "Federal" appears once in the context of:

"The ALSDE is also responsible for enforcing Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which prohibits discrimination in programs and activities that receive federal financial assistance. These Title VI regulatory requirements prohibit denial of equal access to education because of a student’s limited proficiency in English, causing the possible inability to participate in or benefit from regular or special education instructional programs."

The world "Funding" doesn't appear at all.

Where in the 44 page document does it say that Federal funding will be lost unless the state administers a federal test?


Here is the link -->> https://www.alabamaachieves.org/wp-...ativeTestCoordinatorManualSpring2022_V1.0.pdf

WW

 

[Woodznutz]

Yes, and they do it because they say it’s “better” for the special needs kids. In the meantime, it interferes with and reduces the quality of the normal kids.

We should go back to “tracking” - like I had in elementary school in the 60s. For each grade, we had a “bright” class, a couple of “average” classes, and the “slow” class. This way everyone got to work to their potential, rather than dumb things down to the lowest common denominator.

They tried that in my HS in the 1950's. It didn't work and the slow and/or troubled kids were soon removed from the class to everyone's relief. These administrators have never heard of "a rotten apple in the barrel will spoil all."

 

[eagle1462010]

In your last link the word "Federal" appears once in the context of:

"The ALSDE is also responsible for enforcing Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which prohibits discrimination in programs and activities that receive federal financial assistance. These Title VI regulatory requirements prohibit denial of equal access to education because of a student’s limited proficiency in English, causing the possible inability to participate in or benefit from regular or special education instructional programs."

The world "Funding" doesn't appear at all.

Where in the 44 page document does it say that Federal funding will be lost unless the state administers a federal test?


Here is the link -->> https://www.alabamaachieves.org/wp-...ativeTestCoordinatorManualSpring2022_V1.0.pdf

WW

Im going off what my sisters told me over time.

1. Ive shown the DOE mandates testing. Requires 95% taking it to be in compliance.

2. Ive shown articles that state these test are part of stabdardized testng from K1 to K12.

3. Ive shown that schools get a grade for how well they do on the tests. If schools score low they can move kids. Move kids then to me it will Effect funding as I believe fed gives out via number of students.

4. Parents can opt out and refuse their kids taking the teats.


Implied.

My sisters stated they were directed to teach these tests. They complained about it saying it kills teaching.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Im going off what my sisters told me over time.

1. Ive shown the DOE mandates testing. Requires 95% taking it to be in compliance.

2. Ive shown articles that state these test are part of stabdardized testng from K1 to K12.

3. Ive shown that schools get a grade for how well they do on the tests. If schools score low they can move kids. Move kids then to me it will Effect funding as I believe fed gives out via number of students.

4. Parents can opt out and refuse their kids taking the teats.


Implied.

My sisters stated they were directed to teach these tests. They complained about it saying it kills teaching.

1. I don't see where you have shown they are FEDERAL DOE mandates. State DOE? Yes.

2. Standardized test yes. State standardized tests.

3. I'm sorry, with respect, no you haven't. Federal funding ISN'T based on the number of students the main Federal funding for K1-12 schools is based on poverty (Title I) and Special Education.

4. OK

Implied:
I can't comment on what you sister told you.

WW

 

[eagle1462010]

1. I don't see where you have shown they are FEDERAL DOE mandates. State DOE?

Post 344 from that article dept of education

 

[Care4all]

Teachers earn more than those they have educated. So why do they complain about their pay?

Teachers: $66,000
Their graduates: $61,000

Professors, when teaching college level.

Can a newly graduated student teach the courses they took? Not likely. It takes experience and furthering education.

The average college teacher (Professor) should make much much more than $5000 more annually, than the newly graduate...imo!

 

[Lisa558]

They tried that in my HS in the 1950's. It didn't work and the slow and/or troubled kids were soon removed from the class to everyone's relief. These administrators have never heard of "a rotten apple in the barrel will spoil all."

You miss my point. The slow and/or troubled kids would already be in their OWN class. That’s how they did it in the 60s.

I was with the bright kids, ‘cause you know…..I’m Jewish!

 

[Lisa558]

False.

The ED does not set curriculum standards.



Wait what?

You fine with wealth redistribution, taking money from well off states and redistributing that money through the Feds to poorer states?

Nope, just cut the ED and let each state fund it's own education programs. Stop taking money from states like California, New York, New Jersey, etc. and shifting money to Oklahoma, Louisiana, Mississippi, etc.

That way it becomes state choice. Some states will invest in education, others will say screw the children.

WW

The ED has federal standards, and teachers “teach to the test.” That is FAR too much control for a bunch of liberals in federal government to have.

And we had state standards all the way up to the 70s, and kids were better educated. Ever look at an 8th grade test from 1912? Kids had a better education by 8th grade than high school grads have today.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Post 344 from that article dept of education

That's not an article form the Federal Department of Education.

It is not a federal test, ACAP is a State test. The test is not required, but if the state has such a test they must use the assessment evenly to report accurate results. What that means is that the State can't develop a test, then only give the test to top performers to inflate the results.

I was kind of wondering if you would stumble across the Every Student Succeeds Act (ESSA). I kind of apologize for my iffy language, but I wanted to see what would come up. The ESSA IS NOT a mandate by the US Department of Education that creates a federal test. It was an act of CONGRESS passed with bipartisian support in 2015 (Senate 85-12 and House 359-64).

WW
.
.

Every Student Succeeds Act - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[WorldWatcher]

The ED has federal standards, and teachers “teach to the test.” That is FAR too much control for a bunch of liberals in federal government to have.

And we had state standards all the way up to the 70s, and kids were better educated. Ever look at an 8th grade test from 1912? Kids had a better education by 8th grade than high school grads have today.

False, State and Local School Boards set curriculum, not the Federal government.

WW

https://www.findlaw.com/education/curriculum-standards-school-funding/the-roles-of-federal-and-state-governments-in-education.html

 

[Lisa558]

False, State and Local School Boards set curriculum, not the Federal government.

WW

The federal government sets the standards.

What I know is that education has taken a nose-dive since the establishment of the Department of Education. We don’t need them at all.

 

[WorldWatcher]

The federal government sets the standards.

What I know is that education has taken a nose-dive since the establishment of the Department of Education. We don’t need them at all.

False, State and Local School Boards set curriculum, not the Federal government.

WW

https://www.findlaw.com/education/curriculum-standards-school-funding/the-roles-of-federal-and-state-governments-in-education.html

 

[Lisa558]

False, State and Local School Boards set curriculum, not the Federal government.

WW

https://www.findlaw.com/education/curriculum-standards-school-funding/the-roles-of-federal-and-state-governments-in-education.html

Then it sounds like it’s an unnecessary department, given the bloat and $36T in debt.

Move a few hundred staffers over to other departments, and their functions can be absorbed there. Then sell the unused building (nobody showed up to the building anyway, even pre-COVID), and lay off the rest.

 

[DGS49]

States are totally unwilling to impose objective standards on new (and existing) teachers because any meaningful standards would result in...no more teachers, or at best, almost no POC's teaching.

People who major in "education" (not actually a subject) routinely are shown to have the lowest incoming SAT scores of any major. In the states where they have tried competency tests for teachers, they invariably fail because Black and "Hispanic" teachers basically all fail the tests, so they have to be recalibrated into nothingness.

In a perfect world, teachers would have to demonstrate competency both in their subject area and in elements of teaching, and they would be paid handsomely. In a perfect world, there would be no shortage of science and math teachers because people with quantitative degrees could transfer into teaching for a period without the bullshit of having to waste a year studying "education" and student teaching, or start at the bottom of the pay scale.

In this as in many other things, the biggest obstacle to real reform is the teacher's union(s).

I have worked with companies headquartered in Germany, Austria, and other rational countries, and they have professional unions, in which the union works with the employers to maximize productivity and compensation. This model puts to shame the adversarial situation in the U.S. where the teachers' unions act like LABOR unions, fighting for the worst of their employers and screwing the taxpayers who pay their salary.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Then it sounds like it’s an unnecessary department, given the bloat and $36T in debt.

Move a few hundred staffers over to other departments, and their functions can be absorbed there. Then sell the unused building (nobody showed up to the building anyway, even pre-COVID), and lay off the rest.

Delete it 100%.

Not need to move staff or functions. Let red and blue states fund their own education and use the saving to lower the debt.

WW