Atheism And Ceasing To Exist Oblivion.

[ding]

Well that would be one sick, immoral sky daddy that made that arrangement. Gross.

Why? What's wrong with giving people what they wish for?

 

[Grumblenuts]

Questions regarding "Ceasing To Exist Oblivion":
:
Suppose you slip, fall, bang your head, and drown in a pool, stop breathing, have no heartbeat, your pupils dilate and become unresponsive to light..
Has your spirit arrived at the Pearly Gates yet?

Now say your neighbor sees you laying there in your kid's pool, runs over, gets no response from her handy dandy EEG machine, keeps administering CPR like a pro anyway, and presto, you're back to normal, not counting all the coughing up of water, plus your sore head and sudden embarrassment due to being caught dead in your toddler's pool by your sexy neighbor..
Where exactly was your spirit's point of no return?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Why? What's wrong with giving people what they wish for?

Oh, so your scenario is if one just believes there is an afterlife. Well okay. So we know all the small children are going, heh heh

 

[d0gbreath]

I would like to reincarnate as a walrus. No particular reason. I doubt that I'll get a say in the matter.

 

[ding]

Oh, so your scenario is if one just believes there is an afterlife. Well okay. So we know all the small children are going, heh heh

The scenario I posited is what if God is made manifest by faith. In other words, if you live your whole life denying God, what would be wrong in God granting you your wish?

I don't know many small children who live their life like that but maybe yours do because you do.

So ignoring children, what could you possibly have to complain about if God is never made manifest by you? Because I don't think you have much of an argument arguing God is immoral because God gave you what you wished for.

 

[ding]

Suppose you slip, fall, bang your head, and drown in a pool, stop breathing, have no heartbeat, your pupils dilate and become unresponsive to light..
Has your spirit arrived at the Pearly Gates yet?

No idea.

Now say your neighbor sees you laying there in your kid's pool, runs over, gets no response from her handy dandy EEG machine, keeps administering CPR like a pro anyway, and presto, you're back to normal, not counting all the coughing up of water, plus your sore head and sudden embarrassment due to being caught dead in your toddler's pool by your sexy neighbor..
Where exactly was your spirit's point of no return?

No idea. When it's your time, it's your time.

 

[fncceo]

What if it is only manifested because one believes?

Like the fairies in Peter Pan?

 

[Hollie]

Men were the original designer of evil.
But don't worry, the God of the Bible has a plan to get rid of the men that
practice evil. Its not painless, but it will work.
Start here:
Matthew 13:41 following

Best Regards.

JAG


``

I think you should take the time for a critical read of the bible.

Men were not the original designers of evil. Your gods were. The genesis fable clearly spells that out. The tree in the genesis fable is the tree of knowledge of good and evil. That is important because prior to the arrival of A&E, evil already existed. There were no men prior to A of A&E. Your gods had already created evil prior to *poofing* A&E into existence. Have you ever actually studied the genesis fable?

 

[ding]

Like the fairies in Peter Pan?

Not exactly. The physical world is entirely abstract and without ‘actuality’ apart from its linkage to consciousness.

 

[fncceo]

The physical world is entirely abstract and without ‘actuality’ apart from its linkage to consciousness.

Are you thinking of a solipsistic universe?

 

[ding]

Are you thinking of a solipsistic universe?

I don't think so. At least I'm not intending to. What we perceive as reality is a product of consciousness. The behavior of sub atomic particles - for that matter all particles and objects - is inextricably linked to the presence of a conscious observer. Without a conscious observer they exist in an undetermined state of probability waves. Without consciousness matter dwells in an undetermined state of probability. Any universe preceding consciousness only existed in a probability state. The universe is explainable only through consciousness. The universe is finely tuned to support consciousness because consciousness created the universe, not the other way around.

George Wald said it well, "It is primarily physicists who in recent times have expressed most clearly and forthrightly this pervasive relationship between mind and matter, and indeed at times the primacy of mind. Arthur Eddington in 1928 wrote, “the stuff of the world is mind‑stuff ... The mind‑stuff is not spread in space and time.... Recognizing that the physical world is entirely abstract and without ‘actuality’ apart from its linkage to consciousness, we restore consciousness to the fundamental position . . .”

Von Weizsacker in 1971 states as “a new and, I feel, intelligible interpretation of quantum theory” what he calls his “Identity Hypothesis: Consciousness and matter are different aspects of the same reality.”

I like most of all Wolfgang Pauli’s formulation, from 1952: “To us . . . the only acceptable point of view appears to be the one that recognizes both sides of reality -- the quantitative and the qualitative, the physical and the psychical -- as compatible with each other, and can embrace them simultaneously . . . It would be most satisfactory of all if physis and psyche (i.e., matter and mind) could be seen as complementary aspects of the same reality.”

What this kind of thought means essentially is that one has no more basis for considering the existence of matter without its complementary aspect of mind, than for asking that elementary particles not also be waves.

As for this seeming a strange viewpoint for a scientist -- at least until one gets used to it -- as in so many other instances, what is wanted is not so much an acceptable concept as an acceptable rhetoric. If I say, with Eddington, “the stuff of the world is mind‑stuff,” that has a metaphysical ring. But if I say that ultimate reality is expressed in the solutions of the equations of quantum mechanics, quantum electrodynamics, and quantum field theory -- that sounds like good, modern physics. Yet what are those equations, indeed what is mathematics, but mind‑stuff? -- virtually the ultimate in mind‑stuff and for that reason deeply mysterious."

 

[Uncensored2008]

I would like to reincarnate as a walrus. No particular reason. I doubt that I'll get a say in the matter.

If there is reincarnation based on behavior, you'll be a dung beetle....

 

[fncceo]

If there is reincarnation based on behavior, you'll be a dung beetle....

I'm coming back as a toilet brush.

 

[Uncensored2008]

I'm coming back as a toilet brush.

Not me, I'm coming back as a vibrator......

 

[fncceo]

Not me, I'm coming back as a vibrator......

Rosie O'Donnell's vibrator.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Rosie O'Donnell's vibrator.

Oh come on now...

 

[malikc6]

I'll give my thoughts on this. First off I'd like to say that I'm a pantheist, and pantheism shares some similarities to atheism.

I am under the belief that the personal identity which is the "you", is a collection of information (various personalities and experiences). What makes you "you", is not really you. Human beings much like other primates engage in "Monkey see monkey do". There's a reason why we tell people to be careful what they feed their mind, and to be selective on who you associate with. There's a reason why we ideally want our loved ones to be treated with love and what we think are decent ideals to live by.

Even very stubborn people are susceptible to changing if they're around a certain crowd long enough. Hence brainwashing or convincing peoples minds to change. Even if it's in small ways, a change is a change.

Your brain holds your ego/sense of self, and the brain is constantly undergoing changes. Certain beliefs and ideals varying on the person may be more stubborn and not subject to change while it's the opposite for others. The point I'm trying to make is that the "you" is NOT eternal and everlasting.

People who take mind altering drugs like LSD and shrooms often report undergoing "ego death." Their attachments become damaged to flat out destroyed. They stop caring about many things, and their identity has changed. Physically speaking, the drugs altered the chemicals in their brain leading to a rapid change in what makes them "them." Hell the same thing happens when people get drunk or high in the sense that their behavior has changed. Their identity starts to change due to inhibitions being shut off. Even if we don't use mind altering substances, once again my point is that the brain is constantly undergoing changes. Therefore YOU are always undergoing constant changes.

This is why I find the idea of a soul being the same as one's personal identity to be rather silly. All Christians, Jews, and Muslims subscribe to the idea that our souls ARE the identity. We're souls living in bodies. If this were the case, why are we affected by substances and other forms of information? If the soul is said to be eternal and what we REALLY are, that would make us essentially invulnerable. We should be able to drink and get high all we want without having our sense of self and what we really are being altered. We should all be immune to information as eternal entities are not affected by causality. The reality is, the human identity is ALWAYS subject to change.

If a soul exists (I personally believe in one), the soul has NO affiliation with the sense of self and ego. Buddhists and many Hindus buy into the notion that there's simply ONE soul that encompasses physical reality. When you die, everything that made you "you" dies as well. Your attachments, beliefs, feelings, or anything else of that sort dies. Just like how ego death occurs when taking mind altering drugs, or finding what many Eastern philosophies call "Enlightenment" (which I also believe to be truly a thing), when the brain is destroyed, your ego to goes with it.

However because that one soul encompasses everything, something to in existence will be born. Hence reincarnation. What "you" truly are is in a sense EVERYTHING. You are literally everything (You're made of atoms like everything else if one wants to get technical), but the brain is so complex and mysterious, that it gives us this strong sense of PERSONALITY. This strong sense of IDENTIFICATION.

I personally subscribe to what Allan Watts said about god.

I believe that at the very end of the day, God/Universe/Insert name here is simply just a supermassive ever expanding (possibly infinite) entity that is interacting with itself. Because of this, I truly don't see things as "Life" or "Death." It's just one change to another as we continuously repeat that cycle.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

The scenario I posited is what if God is made manifest by faith.

So you changed the subject. Ding, when you feel like doing that, please be more clear. I spend far too much time playing 20 questions with you to figure out what in the hell you mean to say.

So now you are talking about God, not the afterlife. Uh, okay. I don't have much to say to that... besides the fact that it sounds like kind of a childish scenario. Something exists because we believe it does? Childish.

 

[ding]

So you changed the subject. Ding, when you feel like doing that, please be more clear. I spend far too much time playing 20 questions with you to figure out what in the hell you mean to say.

So now you are talking about God, not the afterlife. Uh, okay. I don't have much to say to that... besides the fact that it sounds like kind of a childish scenario. Something exists because we believe it does? Childish.

Don't believe I did change the subject.

Everything is made manifest through consciousness.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Don't believe I did change the subject.

Everything is made manifest through consciousness.

Unfortunately, no consciousness after you are dead. Just like before you were born.