Arctic sea ice hits a new low for January.

[jc456]

mamooth claims that it has been dealt with in the temperature records.

It's what the science says. You're clearly unfamiliar with the science, given you tried to claim UHI wasn't accounted for in the temperature record. As I live to educate, I'll give you a couple starting points to study up on.

Quantifying the effect of urbanization on U.S. Historical Climatology Network temperature records
Hausfather et al (2013)
Quantifying the effect of urbanization on U.S. Historical Climatology Network temperature records - Hausfather - 2013 - Journal of Geophysical Research: Atmospheres - Wiley Online Library

GLOBAL SURFACE TEMPERATURE CHANGE
Hansen et al (2010)
http://pubs.giss.nasa.gov/docs/2010/2010_Hansen_etal_1.pdf

Barrow Alaska has a measured UHI of ~2C.

Inside the city. The station is 5 miles outside, so it experiences a much smaller UHI.

But wait, there's more. Given you've made Barrow the poster child for your conspiracy, it's worth it to address it further. The study all the deniers quote to get their UHI number is this one, which measured the UHI effect inside of Barrow.

THE URBAN HEAT ISLAND IN WINTER AT BARROW, ALASKA
The urban heat island in winter at Barrow, Alaska - Hinkel - 2003 - International Journal of Climatology - Wiley Online Library
---
The seven coldest sites (also contiguous) are located in the south central region of the study area, away from the effects of the ocean and urbanized area. The average temperature was −25.3°C, or about 2.2°C colder than the urban sites. The average air temperature normal (1971 – 2000), as measured at the NWS Service site in Barrow, is −25.3°C for this 4 month period. The winter of 2002, therefore, appears to have been a typical thermal year.
---

That is, the adjusted results for the "official" NWS Barrow station were exactly the same as the rural temperatures around Barrow, as measured specially by that study. Congratulations, the study showed the Barrow UHI effect was 100% compensated for. Hence, your Barrow conspiracy theory crashes hard.

Others have claimed that windy and calm nights showed little difference therefore there was no UHI.

No, nobody ever said that. Parker 2010 was speaking of UHI trends, not UHI. Again, you have trouble with trend vs. absolute. You should have understood that no scientist would have declared there was no UHI. Alas, you were too emotionally invested in your "Those scientists don't know 'nuffin!" conspiracy.

The official story on UHI is hard to swallow.

Your fantasy about "the official story" is certainly hard to swallow, but as it's only your strawman, nobody in the science cares.

No, nobody ever said that. Parker 2010 was speaking of UHI trends, not UHI. Again, you have trouble with trend vs. absolute. You should have understood that no scientist would have declared there was no UHI. Alas, you were too emotionally invested in your "Those scientists don't know 'nuffin!" conspiracy.
If I recall, he was pointing out the changes made in historical records when not as many people were around to cause UHI trends, so they shouldn't adjust historical records.

 

[alpine]

Oh Gawd......not this shit again!!

It's true...Anyone interested in watching planet will keep on doing so...Anyone that isn't probably will say what you just said.

nobody cares s0n................

Poll: 91% Of Americans Aren’t Worried About Global Warming

Like Ive said......you need some real responsibilities in life so you're not worrying about stoopid stuff. That's the way it works for most people..........

Your daddy is gonna take care of you, so you don't have to worry about anything, son...

Pentagon report: Climate change is an “urgent and growing threat to our national security”

 

[jc456]

Oh Gawd......not this shit again!!

It's true...Anyone interested in watching planet will keep on doing so...Anyone that isn't probably will say what you just said.

nobody cares s0n................

Poll: 91% Of Americans Aren’t Worried About Global Warming

Like Ive said......you need some real responsibilities in life so you're not worrying about stoopid stuff. That's the way it works for most people..........

Your daddy is gonna take care of you, so you don't have to worry about anything, son...

Pentagon report: Climate change is an “urgent and growing threat to our national security”

and?

 

[alpine]

Oh Gawd......not this shit again!!

It's true...Anyone interested in watching planet will keep on doing so...Anyone that isn't probably will say what you just said.

nobody cares s0n................

Poll: 91% Of Americans Aren’t Worried About Global Warming

Like Ive said......you need some real responsibilities in life so you're not worrying about stoopid stuff. That's the way it works for most people..........

Your daddy is gonna take care of you, so you don't have to worry about anything, son...

Pentagon report: Climate change is an “urgent and growing threat to our national security”

and?

And..., nothing.

Just keep going with your irresponsible lives.
You have a "daddy" watching for you, so no need to worry about anything.

 

[jc456]

Oh Gawd......not this shit again!!

It's true...Anyone interested in watching planet will keep on doing so...Anyone that isn't probably will say what you just said.

nobody cares s0n................

Poll: 91% Of Americans Aren’t Worried About Global Warming

Like Ive said......you need some real responsibilities in life so you're not worrying about stoopid stuff. That's the way it works for most people..........

Your daddy is gonna take care of you, so you don't have to worry about anything, son...

Pentagon report: Climate change is an “urgent and growing threat to our national security”

and?

And..., nothing.

Just keep going with your irresponsible lives.
You have a "daddy" watching for you, so no need to worry about anything.

well I want to know what the solution is. Isn't that a fair question?

 

[alpine]

It's true...Anyone interested in watching planet will keep on doing so...Anyone that isn't probably will say what you just said.

nobody cares s0n................

Poll: 91% Of Americans Aren’t Worried About Global Warming

Like Ive said......you need some real responsibilities in life so you're not worrying about stoopid stuff. That's the way it works for most people..........

Your daddy is gonna take care of you, so you don't have to worry about anything, son...

Pentagon report: Climate change is an “urgent and growing threat to our national security”

and?

And..., nothing.

Just keep going with your irresponsible lives.
You have a "daddy" watching for you, so no need to worry about anything.

well I want to know what the solution is. Isn't that a fair question?

Why do you care?

Just dont worry about anything JC
santa is gonna bring you presents in christmas
and tooth fairy will leave a quarters under your pillow...

Just don't think about any of this stuff,
this is for adults...

 

[jc456]

nobody cares s0n................

Poll: 91% Of Americans Aren’t Worried About Global Warming

Like Ive said......you need some real responsibilities in life so you're not worrying about stoopid stuff. That's the way it works for most people..........

Your daddy is gonna take care of you, so you don't have to worry about anything, son...

Pentagon report: Climate change is an “urgent and growing threat to our national security”

and?

And..., nothing.

Just keep going with your irresponsible lives.
You have a "daddy" watching for you, so no need to worry about anything.

well I want to know what the solution is. Isn't that a fair question?

Why do you care?

Just dont worry about anything JC
santa is gonna bring you presents in christmas
and tooth fairy will leave a quarters under your pillow...

Just don't think about any of this stuff,
this is for adults...

so your daddy's got nothing! Just as I expected. Tell him to go out and find his mommy cause he's a fkn loser.

BTW, 91% of the American population don't care. hahahahahahahahaha

 

[alpine]

Your daddy is gonna take care of you, so you don't have to worry about anything, son...

Pentagon report: Climate change is an “urgent and growing threat to our national security”

and?

And..., nothing.

Just keep going with your irresponsible lives.
You have a "daddy" watching for you, so no need to worry about anything.

well I want to know what the solution is. Isn't that a fair question?

Why do you care?

Just dont worry about anything JC
santa is gonna bring you presents in christmas
and tooth fairy will leave a quarters under your pillow...

Just don't think about any of this stuff,
this is for adults...

so your daddy's got nothing! Just as I expected. Tell him to go out and find his mommy cause he's a fkn loser.

BTW, 91% of the American population don't care. hahahahahahahahaha

Daddy knows what to do, and don't expect him to ask for your opinion on this one...

Kids, go play outside, this topic is for adults...

 

[jc456]

and?

And..., nothing.

Just keep going with your irresponsible lives.
You have a "daddy" watching for you, so no need to worry about anything.

well I want to know what the solution is. Isn't that a fair question?

Why do you care?

Just dont worry about anything JC
santa is gonna bring you presents in christmas
and tooth fairy will leave a quarters under your pillow...

Just don't think about any of this stuff,
this is for adults...

so your daddy's got nothing! Just as I expected. Tell him to go out and find his mommy cause he's a fkn loser.

BTW, 91% of the American population don't care. hahahahahahahahaha

Daddy knows what to do, and don't expect him to ask for your opinion on this one...

Kids, go play outside, this topic is for adults...

so daddy's still got nothing. Most likely on wlefare and out of work, has nothing better to do and is stuck with his ass in a chair eating potato chips all day. That's what happens when you got nothing.
BTW, 91% of the American population don't care. hahahahahahahahaha

 

[alpine]

And..., nothing.

Just keep going with your irresponsible lives.
You have a "daddy" watching for you, so no need to worry about anything.

well I want to know what the solution is. Isn't that a fair question?

Why do you care?

Just dont worry about anything JC
santa is gonna bring you presents in christmas
and tooth fairy will leave a quarters under your pillow...

Just don't think about any of this stuff,
this is for adults...

so your daddy's got nothing! Just as I expected. Tell him to go out and find his mommy cause he's a fkn loser.

BTW, 91% of the American population don't care. hahahahahahahahaha

Daddy knows what to do, and don't expect him to ask for your opinion on this one...

Kids, go play outside, this topic is for adults...

so daddy's still got nothing. Most likely on wlefare and out of work, has nothing better to do and is stuck with his ass in a chair eating potato chips all day. That's what happens when you got nothing.
BTW, 91% of the American population don't care. hahahahahahahahaha

I make 120K a year sitting on a couch eating potato chips

How much you making?

 

[jc456]

well I want to know what the solution is. Isn't that a fair question?

Why do you care?

Just dont worry about anything JC
santa is gonna bring you presents in christmas
and tooth fairy will leave a quarters under your pillow...

Just don't think about any of this stuff,
this is for adults...

so your daddy's got nothing! Just as I expected. Tell him to go out and find his mommy cause he's a fkn loser.

BTW, 91% of the American population don't care. hahahahahahahahaha

Daddy knows what to do, and don't expect him to ask for your opinion on this one...

Kids, go play outside, this topic is for adults...

so daddy's still got nothing. Most likely on wlefare and out of work, has nothing better to do and is stuck with his ass in a chair eating potato chips all day. That's what happens when you got nothing.
BTW, 91% of the American population don't care. hahahahahahahahaha

I make 120K a year sitting on a couch eating potato chips

How much you making?

exactly the same figure for the same thing.

 

[elektra]

More he said she said, more dogs chasing thier tales.

I think people really do not comprehend this huge scam. It is about selling the public Wind Mills and Solar Panels.

They have won.

I think the only thing left be said is the solution being implemented increases the burning of coal dramatically.

300 million wind turbines, billions of tons of materials, the worlds largest heavy industry belching and burning coal 24 hrs a day, 7 days a week, all year long producing the material to be assembled into millions snd millions and millions of wind turbines.

That burns more coal than anything else ever produced in history.

But hey, lets not talk about the elephant in the room

 

[IanC]

mamooth claims that it has been dealt with in the temperature records.

It's what the science says. You're clearly unfamiliar with the science, given you tried to claim UHI wasn't accounted for in the temperature record. As I live to educate, I'll give you a couple starting points to study up on.

Quantifying the effect of urbanization on U.S. Historical Climatology Network temperature records
Hausfather et al (2013)
Quantifying the effect of urbanization on U.S. Historical Climatology Network temperature records - Hausfather - 2013 - Journal of Geophysical Research: Atmospheres - Wiley Online Library

GLOBAL SURFACE TEMPERATURE CHANGE
Hansen et al (2010)
http://pubs.giss.nasa.gov/docs/2010/2010_Hansen_etal_1.pdf

Barrow Alaska has a measured UHI of ~2C.

Inside the city. The station is 5 miles outside, so it experiences a much smaller UHI.

But wait, there's more. Given you've made Barrow the poster child for your conspiracy, it's worth it to address it further. The study all the deniers quote to get their UHI number is this one, which measured the UHI effect inside of Barrow.

THE URBAN HEAT ISLAND IN WINTER AT BARROW, ALASKA
The urban heat island in winter at Barrow, Alaska - Hinkel - 2003 - International Journal of Climatology - Wiley Online Library
---
The seven coldest sites (also contiguous) are located in the south central region of the study area, away from the effects of the ocean and urbanized area. The average temperature was −25.3°C, or about 2.2°C colder than the urban sites. The average air temperature normal (1971 – 2000), as measured at the NWS Service site in Barrow, is −25.3°C for this 4 month period. The winter of 2002, therefore, appears to have been a typical thermal year.
---

That is, the adjusted results for the "official" NWS Barrow station were exactly the same as the rural temperatures around Barrow, as measured specially by that study. Congratulations, the study showed the Barrow UHI effect was 100% compensated for. Hence, your Barrow conspiracy theory crashes hard.

Others have claimed that windy and calm nights showed little difference therefore there was no UHI.

No, nobody ever said that. Parker 2010 was speaking of UHI trends, not UHI. Again, you have trouble with trend vs. absolute. You should have understood that no scientist would have declared there was no UHI. Alas, you were too emotionally invested in your "Those scientists don't know 'nuffin!" conspiracy.

The official story on UHI is hard to swallow.

Your fantasy about "the official story" is certainly hard to swallow, but as it's only your strawman, nobody in the science cares.

The weather station is located in the village of Barrow. There is a mention of an alternate site 7.5 km out. It certainly is unfortunate that no comparison is directly made between the two.

Perhaps you can research it and put up the two records side by side.


I don't remember reading Parker 2010 but I have seen Parker 2006 which was an expansion of the Parker 2004 letter. The evidence provided that windy vs calm days should produce a distinct UHI signature is equivocal at best. In the US, with best info, a step jump was found. Globally, with poor info, none was found. That a poorly measured proxy like wind should be accepted while other proxies like energy consumption should be discarded seems paradoxical to me.

Mind you, conclusion first evidence second papers often smell bad. I suppose the same could be said for energy consumption but in that paper dozens of factors were examined, found to be correlated, and energy was found to be the first order variable.

Wasn't there another 'wind' paper? Didn't Santer throw out the satellite and sonde measurements and use wind shear for a proxy of temperature so that he could find the 'hot spot'? It seems like many of the passing wind papers smell bad.

 

[Old Rocks]

I see. So the temperature of that village is melting the Arctic ice. Well now, that certainly makes sense, now, doesn't it?

How about considering what the surrounding ice and permafrost are stating concerning the temperature? I mean, if that increase in Arctic temperatures were only due to placement of the measuring devices, why is the ice and permafrost melting in that vast area where there are no measuring devices?

 

[elektra]

I see. So the temperature of that village is melting the Arctic ice. Well now, that certainly makes sense, now, doesn't it?

How about considering what the surrounding ice and permafrost are stating concerning the temperature? I mean, if that increase in Arctic temperatures were only due to placement of the measuring devices, why is the ice and permafrost melting in that vast area where there are no measuring devices?

What is the permafrost stating Old Crock, go ahead, speak for the Permafrost, this ought to be good, we await your profound reply.

 

[Old Rocks]

Thawing permafrost could have catastrophic consequences, scientists warn

“What’s important about these numbers is that, in theory, we can control deforestation and land use change [and] we can control our fossil fuel emissions — but once permafrost starts to thaw, we cannot control how much carbon dioxide and methane is released by microbes into the atmosphere from thawing permafrost,” Natali says.

Permafrost is ground that remains frozen for two or more consecutive years. In some areas, permafrost has been frozen for as long as 40,000 years. Permafrost regions cover about 25 percent of the northern hemisphere's land area.

Carbon in permafrost is frozen in the form of various types of organic matter. But when permafrost thaws, microbes decompose that organic matter. And just as humans breathe out carbon dioxide, so do microbes. And they also release methane, which is a much more potent greenhouse gas than carbon dioxide.

Current projections indicate a 30 to 70 percent decline in near-surface permafrost by the end of this century, Natali says. That wide range is a result of different emission scenarios. “Under low emission models, we can expect about a 30 percent decline in permafrost. But under our current emissions scenario, up to 70 percent,” she explains.

If 70 percent of the permafrost thaws, scientists expect to lose 130 to 160 billion tons of carbon into the atmosphere by the end of this century. To put that in perspective, in 2013 the United States emitted 1.4 billion tons of carbon from fossil fuel combustion and cement production.

Let us let the men and women who study the permafrost address this matter.

 

[elektra]

Thawing permafrost could have catastrophic consequences, scientists warn

“What’s important about these numbers is that, in theory, we can control deforestation and land use change [and] we can control our fossil fuel emissions — but once permafrost starts to thaw, we cannot control how much carbon dioxide and methane is released by microbes into the atmosphere from thawing permafrost,” Natali says.

Permafrost is ground that remains frozen for two or more consecutive years. In some areas, permafrost has been frozen for as long as 40,000 years. Permafrost regions cover about 25 percent of the northern hemisphere's land area.

Carbon in permafrost is frozen in the form of various types of organic matter. But when permafrost thaws, microbes decompose that organic matter. And just as humans breathe out carbon dioxide, so do microbes. And they also release methane, which is a much more potent greenhouse gas than carbon dioxide.

Current projections indicate a 30 to 70 percent decline in near-surface permafrost by the end of this century, Natali says. That wide range is a result of different emission scenarios. “Under low emission models, we can expect about a 30 percent decline in permafrost. But under our current emissions scenario, up to 70 percent,” she explains.

If 70 percent of the permafrost thaws, scientists expect to lose 130 to 160 billion tons of carbon into the atmosphere by the end of this century. To put that in perspective, in 2013 the United States emitted 1.4 billion tons of carbon from fossil fuel combustion and cement production.

Let us let the men and women who study the permafrost address this matter.

In theory, you can control?

Wow, Old Crock is very powerful, he can control nature.

Nice cut/paste, braniac.

 

[Old Rocks]

Melting Permafrost Threatens Infrastructure, Homes
By Joaqlin Estus, KNBA - Anchorage | December 17, 2014



As we’ll see, the effects of warming temperatures on infrastructure can be costly and sometimes dramatic.



Vm
P


In much of Alaska, bridges, roads, buildings, and runways have been built on permafrost. That’s soil that became frozen during ice ages from 400 to 10,000 years ago, and a few feet down is frozen rock-hard year around.

Geophysics professor Vladimir Romanovsky, of the University of Alaska Fairbanks Geophysical Institute, said that due to human activity that removes the natural ground cover and warming temperatures, permafrost from the Brooks Range south is becoming unstable. He said when permafrost that’s a mix of ice and soil melts, the water often flows away and the surface sinks.


House sinking due to melting permafrost
(Credit kml.gina.alaska.edu)

“It’s not just everything sinking evenly,” said Romanovsky. “But there’s some dips and troughs and all kind of thing develops, which for infrastructure is the worst case scenario.”

The Alaska Department of Transportation and Public Facilities’ chief of maintenance and operations Mike Coffey said as permafrost thaws, it takes more time and money to keep roads in shape.

“When it thaws, then we maintenance and operations spend just about all summer up north fighting the roller coaster ride,” said Coffey. “So, we’re removing pavement, re-leveling, smooth roads, then repaving or chip sealing back over the top to try to smooth roads out.”

Melting Permafrost Threatens Infrastructure, Homes

Now there are many, many articles from the northern nations concerning the effects of the melting of the permafrost. So, instead of demonstrating the depths of ignorance you are attained, why don't you read some of those articles.

 

[jc456]

Melting Permafrost Threatens Infrastructure, Homes
By Joaqlin Estus, KNBA - Anchorage | December 17, 2014



As we’ll see, the effects of warming temperatures on infrastructure can be costly and sometimes dramatic.



Vm
P


In much of Alaska, bridges, roads, buildings, and runways have been built on permafrost. That’s soil that became frozen during ice ages from 400 to 10,000 years ago, and a few feet down is frozen rock-hard year around.

Geophysics professor Vladimir Romanovsky, of the University of Alaska Fairbanks Geophysical Institute, said that due to human activity that removes the natural ground cover and warming temperatures, permafrost from the Brooks Range south is becoming unstable. He said when permafrost that’s a mix of ice and soil melts, the water often flows away and the surface sinks.


House sinking due to melting permafrost
(Credit kml.gina.alaska.edu)

“It’s not just everything sinking evenly,” said Romanovsky. “But there’s some dips and troughs and all kind of thing develops, which for infrastructure is the worst case scenario.”

The Alaska Department of Transportation and Public Facilities’ chief of maintenance and operations Mike Coffey said as permafrost thaws, it takes more time and money to keep roads in shape.

“When it thaws, then we maintenance and operations spend just about all summer up north fighting the roller coaster ride,” said Coffey. “So, we’re removing pavement, re-leveling, smooth roads, then repaving or chip sealing back over the top to try to smooth roads out.”

Melting Permafrost Threatens Infrastructure, Homes

Now there are many, many articles from the northern nations concerning the effects of the melting of the permafrost. So, instead of demonstrating the depths of ignorance you are attained, why don't you read some of those articles.

I call bullshit, LOL prove that house sank cause of permafrost! Is every sink hole permafrost melt? Too stupid

 

[whitehall]

Selective data released for political propaganda purposes to low information lefties to bolster an argument that has no basis in science. What else is new? Every hysterical prediction that the left made in the short ten or fifteen year life of the global warming theory has been found to be laughable.