2nd Worst Financial Crisis In History: Who gets credit?

[mayya555]

If Obama really wanted to fix the economy, instead of figuring out how to spend more of our money, he'd work on raising the minimum wage, putting more money into the hands of the people that would spend it, increasing our economy. Of course that won't work until all the illegals are sent home.

I see you criticize Obama for not being SOCIALIST enough. haha, that's sort of funny .

 

[boedicca]

In that case we should make the minimum wage $100/hour immediately. Though I'm sure you both can see the problem that would arise under that situation. The principle remains the same no matter what the minimum wage becomes. Some workers and some jobs simply aren't going to be worth the new price so they'll be eliminated.

Why don't we just print big piles of $100 bills and give everyone $1M of them?

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

In that case we should make the minimum wage $100/hour immediately. Though I'm sure you both can see the problem that would arise under that situation. The principle remains the same no matter what the minimum wage becomes. Some workers and some jobs simply aren't going to be worth the new price so they'll be eliminated.

Why don't we just print big piles of $100 bills and give everyone $1M of them?

I'm sure we could find some "facts" somewhere on the internet that says printing money creates real wealth, so why not?

 

[Againsheila]

In that case we should make the minimum wage $100/hour immediately. Though I'm sure you both can see the problem that would arise under that situation. The principle remains the same no matter what the minimum wage becomes. Some workers and some jobs simply aren't going to be worth the new price so they'll be eliminated.

There is no excuse, in the richest country in the world, for the lowest paid worker not to make enough to live on.

Again, the last several times minimum wage was raised, there was no net loss of jobs. That's a FACT. In 1968 minimum wage had the highest spending power in history today it has the lowest spending power.

UniversalLivingWage.org--Sample Facts & Myths

 

[Againsheila]

One thing to remember. Second worst finiancial disaster....So far...
This isn't over yet folks.

nope, but the worst of what it is is over

I seriously doubt it. Our country now owes more money than ever before in history...hardly and improvement. We have bankrupted our country, it just hasn't been declared yet. Currently each person in the US owes $100,000. I know very few people who even make that much in a year.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

In that case we should make the minimum wage $100/hour immediately. Though I'm sure you both can see the problem that would arise under that situation. The principle remains the same no matter what the minimum wage becomes. Some workers and some jobs simply aren't going to be worth the new price so they'll be eliminated.

There is no excuse, in the richest country in the world, for the lowest paid worker not to make enough to live on.

Again, the last several times minimum wage was raised, there was no net loss of jobs. That's a FACT. In 1968 minimum wage had the highest spending power in history today it has the lowest spending power.

UniversalLivingWage.org--Sample Facts & Myths

There is no excuse, in the supposedly freest country in the world, for workers and employers not to be able to come to a mutually agreeable wage for a job without government interference.

Some jobs simply aren't meant to be lived off of. Flipping burgers and delivering newspapers for instance. Do we really see those as jobs that people should be making enough to own their own home? As I said, some jobs simply aren't going to be worth the minimum wage.

 

[sparky]

I really wish there was an end to this 'moderation' in sight.

But it just doesn't seem like a normal cycle to me

and i find no comfort in sorts painting rainbows in the rain here......

~S~

I feel like it's the early 80s and Reagan is President.

i can recall getting a mortgage at something like 18% then.........~S~

 

[sparky]

In that case we should make the minimum wage $100/hour immediately. Though I'm sure you both can see the problem that would arise under that situation. The principle remains the same no matter what the minimum wage becomes. Some workers and some jobs simply aren't going to be worth the new price so they'll be eliminated.

Why don't we just print big piles of $100 bills and give everyone $1M of them?

what does the 27Trillion we (supposedly, it's a nefarious #) gave to wall st divide into 300 million anyways?

~S~

 

[Againsheila]

In that case we should make the minimum wage $100/hour immediately. Though I'm sure you both can see the problem that would arise under that situation. The principle remains the same no matter what the minimum wage becomes. Some workers and some jobs simply aren't going to be worth the new price so they'll be eliminated.

There is no excuse, in the richest country in the world, for the lowest paid worker not to make enough to live on.

Again, the last several times minimum wage was raised, there was no net loss of jobs. That's a FACT. In 1968 minimum wage had the highest spending power in history today it has the lowest spending power.

UniversalLivingWage.org--Sample Facts & Myths

There is no excuse, in the supposedly freest country in the world, for workers and employers not to be able to come to a mutually agreeable wage for a job without government interference.

Some jobs simply aren't meant to be lived off of. Flipping burgers and delivering newspapers for instance. Do we really see those as jobs that people should be making enough to own their own home? As I said, some jobs simply aren't going to be worth the minimum wage.

As I said, the lowest paid job should be a living wage and everything should go up from there. Why do you think the guy that delivers your newspaper or gives you your burger, shouldn't be able to put a roof over his head or food in his belly?

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

There is no excuse, in the richest country in the world, for the lowest paid worker not to make enough to live on.

Again, the last several times minimum wage was raised, there was no net loss of jobs. That's a FACT. In 1968 minimum wage had the highest spending power in history today it has the lowest spending power.

UniversalLivingWage.org--Sample Facts & Myths

There is no excuse, in the supposedly freest country in the world, for workers and employers not to be able to come to a mutually agreeable wage for a job without government interference.

Some jobs simply aren't meant to be lived off of. Flipping burgers and delivering newspapers for instance. Do we really see those as jobs that people should be making enough to own their own home? As I said, some jobs simply aren't going to be worth the minimum wage.

As I said, the lowest paid job should be a living wage and everything should go up from there. Why do you think the guy that delivers your newspaper or gives you your burger, shouldn't be able to put a roof over his head or food in his belly?

Well it's economically impossible, first and foremost, to give every single person a living wage. Secondly, not all jobs are created equal. Delivering newspapers and flipping burgers are not difficult jobs. They're jobs designed for those who need experience in the job market such as teenagers, or children in the case of newspapers, and those who have little education or skills. These jobs simply aren't worth a living wage.

 

[boedicca]

As I said, the lowest paid job should be a living wage and everything should go up from there. Why do you think the guy that delivers your newspaper or gives you your burger, shouldn't be able to put a roof over his head or food in his belly?

Not every job is not economically worth providing an income for those who do it. Some jobs make sense to be part time, entry level jobs. Fast food and newspaper delivery jobs used to be done by teenagers - providing opportunities for them to develop good work habits. The insistence that such jobs provide "living wages" has created a deadend for adults who hold them, and barriers to the job market for teenagers (who are currently experiencing incredibly high levels of unemployment). Neither of these are desirable outcomes.

 

[Toro]

Many, many people.

 

[☭proletarian☭]

If Obama really wanted to fix the economy, instead of figuring out how to spend more of our money, he'd work on raising the minimum wage, putting more money into the hands of the people that would spend it, increasing our economy. Of course that won't work until all the illegals are sent home.

Actually, he'd require imported goods to meet our environmental laws, crackdown on illegal immigration, invest in American manufacturing, and de-incentiveize outsourcing while cutting taxes to the middle class and slashing federal spending.

 

[☭proletarian☭]

In that case we should make the minimum wage $100/hour immediately. Though I'm sure you both can see the problem that would arise under that situation. The principle remains the same no matter what the minimum wage becomes. Some workers and some jobs simply aren't going to be worth the new price so they'll be eliminated.

So you'd go to the other extreme and out us back where we were when Marx was writing of the workers' lack of payment?

 

[☭proletarian☭]

Well it's economically impossible, first and foremost, to give every single person a living wage.

No, it's not. The only time that would ever be true would be during drought and famine, when enough wealth cannot be produced for the laborers to all receive what they need when the harvest is split amongst them.

Secondly, not all jobs are created equal. Delivering newspapers and flipping burgers are not difficult jobs. They're jobs designed for those who need experience in the job market such as teenagers, or children in the case of newspapers, and those who have little education or skills. These jobs simply aren't worth a living wage.

So a 19-year-old doesn't deserve to eat because he's yet to graduate from college and his daddy wasn't Donald Trump? Someone working at the burger shop 'doesn't deserve' to be paid for his labour at a rate at which he does not starve to death?

 

[☭proletarian☭]

Not every job is not economically worth providing an income for those who do it.

So some people don't deserve to get paid when they work?


Please enumerate the jobs you think should be reserved for slaves.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

I'm curious whether you're still claiming to be an adherent of the Austrian school?

 

[boedicca]

So some people don't deserve to get paid when they work?


Please enumerate the jobs you think should be reserved for slaves.

The claim was that a job should provide a "living wage", i.e. an income sufficient to support a certain lifestyle.

Not all jobs create enough economic benefit to justify that level of expense; they garner wages, albeit not enough to support a "living wage" lifestyle. Why does everything have to be A Career? Some jobs are part time or entry level stepping stones. There is a place in our society for such jobs.

 

[☭proletarian☭]

So some people don't deserve to get paid when they work?


Please enumerate the jobs you think should be reserved for slaves.

The claim was that a job should provide a "living wage", i.e. an income sufficient to support a certain lifestyle.

That's not what you said.

Nor do you mention the 'lifestyle' that all deserve- to not be in poverty, to not go hungry. The 'living wage' is nothing more than a 'minimum wage'. The intent has always been to life people out of poverty ensure that no go hungry. We've seen in history what happens when the poor are left at the mercy of the capitalist. That's why such laws came into being in the first place.

Not all jobs create enough economic benefit to justify that level of expense;

What level of expense are you talking about? a living wage is a wage that lets people live above poverty level. You've said that they don't deserve to be paid enough to live.

they garner wages, albeit not enough to support a "living wage" lifestyle.

A '"living wage"lifestyle'? You mean shopping for food at the dollar store, living paycheck-to-paycheck and praying you don't get sick and lose a week of work and end up homeless?

 

[☭proletarian☭]

Define: Living Wage

Living wage is a term used to describe the minimum hourly wage necessary for shelter (housing and incidentals such as clothing and other basic needs) and nutrition for a person for an extended period of time (lifetime)