Why teachers need more pay

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

When are one of you going to mention that alot of low performing schools have alot of kids with so much baggage they struggle to just to get by and their homelives are a wreck. Add to that they see zero value in education. Then you want them to score high on tests they will not prepare for because they dont put in any effort. So you blame the teacher for this. Until YOU fix the broken family nothing is going to change. Did you ever consider many kids dont want to learn and they know darn well nobody can force them too. How are you going to fix this? Ok send them to private schools. Then watch those test score averages. Then watch those private school parents go wild wanting troublesome students removed. Whats the fix?

Where do you see me blaming teachers for this?

Again... my problem with teachers and teachers unions is that they defend the system that isn't working, and their typical default answer is "more money". That's my problem with teachers and teachers unions.

If you read my previous post, my mother had an issue with a child exactly like you described, and that child made her life a living hell. There was nothing she could do for such a student. Nothing. And not only was the student making her life miserable, but the kid was making it hard for other kids to learn anything, because my mother was dealing with her out of control behavior.

The solution was to have her removed. The city actually changed the district lines, and had the section 8 housing she was from, moved to Columbus public, so her and the other students like her, were sent to their schools instead of the school my mother taught at.

The key difference between that system and a private school, is that the problem can be dealt with quicker, and with less damage. But the idea you can somehow force kids to learn is crazy. You can't force kids to learn. The only thing you can do, is banish them. For a private school, that means expulsion. For a public school, it means sending them to the office every single day, and eventually redrawing the district lines. Which of course only works one you have a few students from a specific problem area.

The private school system is better, because the only one affected is the person refusing to learn. In the public system, you send everyone from an particular area to another school district, when it is likely some kids from there were actually really good kids doing their best, but because the school doesn't want to get sued by bad parents, they can't just expel the bad kids.

The problem here is that left-wingers do not want a solution that has the most good for the most people. Instead they want the magic "everyone succeeds" solution. But there is no such solution.

In Finland, problem students are sent to a special school for losers. That of course is my non-politically correct title, but it is a school for children who can't, or who refuse to keep up with their peers, or have 'behavior problems' (aka losers). They are separated from quality students.

Why? Because problem students are like infections. If you don't cut the infection out, it spreads. The only way to have "No child left behind" is to lower the standards so no kids have to learn.

And FYI..... I lived this first hand.

Tell the truth. When was the last time you sat through an entire class period in a public school.

 

[Aponi]

Have you talked to a highschool student these days .
One thing is sure they are whining little assholes that have no common sense and cry constantly. I think teachers or should I say the school system is why

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Have you talked to a highschool student these days .
One thing is sure they are whining little assholes that have no common sense and cry constantly. I think teachers or should I say the school system is why

Why would you ever blame teachers? Are you one of those whining little assholes too?

You cannot make chicken salad out of chicken shit!

 

[JoeMoma]

When are one of you going to mention that alot of low performing schools have alot of kids with so much baggage they struggle to just to get by and their homelives are a wreck. Add to that they see zero value in education. Then you want them to score high on tests they will not prepare for because they dont put in any effort. So you blame the teacher for this. Until YOU fix the broken family nothing is going to change. Did you ever consider many kids dont want to learn and they know darn well nobody can force them too. How are you going to fix this? Ok send them to private schools. Then watch those test score averages. Then watch those private school parents go wild wanting troublesome students removed. Whats the fix?

Often times private schools aren't better schools other than they receive far less troubled students and have a higher percentage of involved parents. Some students in public high school are simply serving their time until graduation. D for diploma

 

[EasyPeasy]

When are one of you going to mention that alot of low performing schools have alot of kids with so much baggage they struggle to just to get by and their homelives are a wreck. Add to that they see zero value in education. Then you want them to score high on tests they will not prepare for because they dont put in any effort. So you blame the teacher for this. Until YOU fix the broken family nothing is going to change. Did you ever consider many kids dont want to learn and they know darn well nobody can force them too. How are you going to fix this? Ok send them to private schools. Then watch those test score averages. Then watch those private school parents go wild wanting troublesome students removed. Whats the fix?

Often times private schools aren't better schools other than they receive far less troubled students and have a higher percentage of involved parents. Some students in public high school are simply serving their time until graduation. D for diploma

That's what I did.... I had a lot of catching up to do when I started college.

 

[JoeMoma]

When are one of you going to mention that alot of low performing schools have alot of kids with so much baggage they struggle to just to get by and their homelives are a wreck. Add to that they see zero value in education. Then you want them to score high on tests they will not prepare for because they dont put in any effort. So you blame the teacher for this. Until YOU fix the broken family nothing is going to change. Did you ever consider many kids dont want to learn and they know darn well nobody can force them too. How are you going to fix this? Ok send them to private schools. Then watch those test score averages. Then watch those private school parents go wild wanting troublesome students removed. Whats the fix?

Often times private schools aren't better schools other than they receive far less troubled students and have a higher percentage of involved parents. Some students in public high school are simply serving their time until graduation. D for diploma

That's what I did.... I had a lot of catching up to do when I started college.

Was there anything the teachers in High school could have done to get you on track in high school, or was it simply a decision you had to make on your own as you matured?

 

[Andylusion]

I agree with you on alot. However where I live teachers went 6 years in a wage freeze. They recently finally got a little bump. They don't ask for anything but a fair wage. And since I served on the school board i saw the bargaining process work nicely. Now what to do with highly disruptive kids when law says they must be included in the regular classroom?

A fair wage is subjective. I've worked the last 20 years, with a wage freeze. I have never once gotten a raise from simply doing my job for 12 months. When you agree to work for a given wage, that is the wage you agreed to work for. The fact you exist for 12 months, does not somehow entitle you to a wage increase.

If you went to get your oil changed, and the guy doing the oil service to your car said "Hey, you need to pay me $50 more, because I've been doing this for years", would you just pay double the price for an oil change? No? Why not? He's done this job for years, so you should pay him a huge amount of money for a simple oil change!

No, you'll go to the shop down the street that is doing the same oil change for a fraction of the cost.

So if that's how you operate as a customer, why would you think teachers should just automatically get raises for doing the job they signed up to do, for the wage they agreed to work for?

Every time my income has increased, it has been because I moved to a new job that was worth more money.

Now I'm not against teachers getting more money. But don't tell me "They went 6 years in a wage freeze" as if merely working 12 months, means they deserve more money. It doesn't. You should get more, when you are worth more. And just doing your job for 12 months, doesn't mean you are worth more.

As for highly disruptive kids....

Either change the law, or accept destroying the entire educational system, and ruining the lives of millions of students, for the sake of ideals.

Again... we're the only idiotic 1st world country to do this. No other country destroys good students, for the sake of bad students.

And if we can't do that, then we should have universal vouchers, and let parents put their kids into whatever schools they can. This will concentrate all the terrible kids, into the terrible schools, and all the good kids can go to good schools.

 

[Andylusion]

Okay, so I hope everyone can follow me here. I am going to write about how much teachers should be paid, but not from my own perspective. I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons, I just want to clarify that. But let's, for a second, assume I am the kind of person who says "Teachers jobs are easy, they get summers off, they're just glorified babysitters" and the work we all know teachers need to take home doesn't count.

Let's assume we pay teachers less than what I was paid to babysit in high school. So give them...$4/hour. Let's only pay them for the hours they are in school - let's say 6.5 hours a day. That brings their daily pay to $26.

But teachers don't only teach one student. Let's say the teacher teaches 30 students. Every parent should pay $26 a day for their child to be "babysat" and at thirty students that comes out to $780/day.

Now, 5 day school week brings that to $3,900 a week.
Or, if you want to figure in days, let's say they work 180 days a year (meaning no paid vacations) $780/day for 180 days = $140,000.

The average teacher salary tends to hover between $50,000 - $60,000. So, on the high end of that spectrum, let's figure out how much teachers make per hour per child:
$60,000/180 days = $333.33/day. $333.33 per day/30 students = $11.11 per student per day. Figure in the 6.5 hours and that's $1.71 per hour per student.



So teachers get paid more than they do on average, even in my fictional scenario, where we pay teachers less per hour per child than the average babysitter, and don't pay them for any of the additional work they need to do outside of school hours, and give them no vacation pay.

the MAIN rerason they need a lot more pay is they got a much tougher job than these pampered spoiled rich brats in pro sports who get MILLIONS just for playing a little boys game.thats bullshit.

Pretty sure most of the people who get paid millions for playing games, come from public schools.

In fact, quite a few of the private schools I know of, don't even have sports teams.

Oh, you are such an ignorant piece of crap!

Check out who wins the state championships in football and basketball in any number of states. Chances are they private schools who magically have scholarships for athletes attending public school to suddenly decide that private school was where their heart (and athletic skills) belonged!

I would love to see how many in the top NFL teams, came from private K-12 schools.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Okay, so I hope everyone can follow me here. I am going to write about how much teachers should be paid, but not from my own perspective. I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons, I just want to clarify that. But let's, for a second, assume I am the kind of person who says "Teachers jobs are easy, they get summers off, they're just glorified babysitters" and the work we all know teachers need to take home doesn't count.

Let's assume we pay teachers less than what I was paid to babysit in high school. So give them...$4/hour. Let's only pay them for the hours they are in school - let's say 6.5 hours a day. That brings their daily pay to $26.

But teachers don't only teach one student. Let's say the teacher teaches 30 students. Every parent should pay $26 a day for their child to be "babysat" and at thirty students that comes out to $780/day.

Now, 5 day school week brings that to $3,900 a week.
Or, if you want to figure in days, let's say they work 180 days a year (meaning no paid vacations) $780/day for 180 days = $140,000.

The average teacher salary tends to hover between $50,000 - $60,000. So, on the high end of that spectrum, let's figure out how much teachers make per hour per child:
$60,000/180 days = $333.33/day. $333.33 per day/30 students = $11.11 per student per day. Figure in the 6.5 hours and that's $1.71 per hour per student.



So teachers get paid more than they do on average, even in my fictional scenario, where we pay teachers less per hour per child than the average babysitter, and don't pay them for any of the additional work they need to do outside of school hours, and give them no vacation pay.

the MAIN rerason they need a lot more pay is they got a much tougher job than these pampered spoiled rich brats in pro sports who get MILLIONS just for playing a little boys game.thats bullshit.

Pretty sure most of the people who get paid millions for playing games, come from public schools.

In fact, quite a few of the private schools I know of, don't even have sports teams.

Oh, you are such an ignorant piece of crap!

Check out who wins the state championships in football and basketball in any number of states. Chances are they private schools who magically have scholarships for athletes attending public school to suddenly decide that private school was where their heart (and athletic skills) belonged!

I would love to see how many in the top NFL teams, came from private K-12 schools.

Not to be racist, but a lot of the white players do!

In the last 12 years, our class 6A state football champion has been a private school 9 times! For class 5A, it was 5 out of the last 12 years and the last 4 in a row.

If you understand anything about statistics at all, you should see the disparity. Probably not!

 

[Andylusion]

When are one of you going to mention that alot of low performing schools have alot of kids with so much baggage they struggle to just to get by and their homelives are a wreck. Add to that they see zero value in education. Then you want them to score high on tests they will not prepare for because they dont put in any effort. So you blame the teacher for this. Until YOU fix the broken family nothing is going to change. Did you ever consider many kids dont want to learn and they know darn well nobody can force them too. How are you going to fix this? Ok send them to private schools. Then watch those test score averages. Then watch those private school parents go wild wanting troublesome students removed. Whats the fix?

Where do you see me blaming teachers for this?

Again... my problem with teachers and teachers unions is that they defend the system that isn't working, and their typical default answer is "more money". That's my problem with teachers and teachers unions.

If you read my previous post, my mother had an issue with a child exactly like you described, and that child made her life a living hell. There was nothing she could do for such a student. Nothing. And not only was the student making her life miserable, but the kid was making it hard for other kids to learn anything, because my mother was dealing with her out of control behavior.

The solution was to have her removed. The city actually changed the district lines, and had the section 8 housing she was from, moved to Columbus public, so her and the other students like her, were sent to their schools instead of the school my mother taught at.

The key difference between that system and a private school, is that the problem can be dealt with quicker, and with less damage. But the idea you can somehow force kids to learn is crazy. You can't force kids to learn. The only thing you can do, is banish them. For a private school, that means expulsion. For a public school, it means sending them to the office every single day, and eventually redrawing the district lines. Which of course only works one you have a few students from a specific problem area.

The private school system is better, because the only one affected is the person refusing to learn. In the public system, you send everyone from an particular area to another school district, when it is likely some kids from there were actually really good kids doing their best, but because the school doesn't want to get sued by bad parents, they can't just expel the bad kids.

The problem here is that left-wingers do not want a solution that has the most good for the most people. Instead they want the magic "everyone succeeds" solution. But there is no such solution.

In Finland, problem students are sent to a special school for losers. That of course is my non-politically correct title, but it is a school for children who can't, or who refuse to keep up with their peers, or have 'behavior problems' (aka losers). They are separated from quality students.

Why? Because problem students are like infections. If you don't cut the infection out, it spreads. The only way to have "No child left behind" is to lower the standards so no kids have to learn.

And FYI..... I lived this first hand.

Tell the truth. When was the last time you sat through an entire class period in a public school.

When I was in high school of course. About 2 decades ago. Are you saying that my experience can't possibly be true today? Because I've heard from a number of people that teach in public schools, that situations are actually worse than back then.

You have no real argument do you?

 

[Unkotare]

When are one of you going to mention that alot of low performing schools have alot of kids with so much baggage they struggle to just to get by and their homelives are a wreck. Add to that they see zero value in education. Then you want them to score high on tests they will not prepare for because they dont put in any effort. So you blame the teacher for this. Until YOU fix the broken family nothing is going to change. Did you ever consider many kids dont want to learn and they know darn well nobody can force them too. How are you going to fix this? Ok send them to private schools. Then watch those test score averages. Then watch those private school parents go wild wanting troublesome students removed. Whats the fix?

Where do you see me blaming teachers for this?

Again... my problem with teachers and teachers unions is that they defend the system that isn't working, and their typical default answer is "more money". That's my problem with teachers and teachers unions.

If you read my previous post, my mother had an issue with a child exactly like you described, and that child made her life a living hell. There was nothing she could do for such a student. Nothing. And not only was the student making her life miserable, but the kid was making it hard for other kids to learn anything, because my mother was dealing with her out of control behavior.

The solution was to have her removed. The city actually changed the district lines, and had the section 8 housing she was from, moved to Columbus public, so her and the other students like her, were sent to their schools instead of the school my mother taught at.

The key difference between that system and a private school, is that the problem can be dealt with quicker, and with less damage. But the idea you can somehow force kids to learn is crazy. You can't force kids to learn. The only thing you can do, is banish them. For a private school, that means expulsion. For a public school, it means sending them to the office every single day, and eventually redrawing the district lines. Which of course only works one you have a few students from a specific problem area.

The private school system is better, because the only one affected is the person refusing to learn. In the public system, you send everyone from an particular area to another school district, when it is likely some kids from there were actually really good kids doing their best, but because the school doesn't want to get sued by bad parents, they can't just expel the bad kids.

The problem here is that left-wingers do not want a solution that has the most good for the most people. Instead they want the magic "everyone succeeds" solution. But there is no such solution.

In Finland, problem students are sent to a special school for losers. That of course is my non-politically correct title, but it is a school for children who can't, or who refuse to keep up with their peers, or have 'behavior problems' (aka losers). They are separated from quality students.

Why? Because problem students are like infections. If you don't cut the infection out, it spreads. The only way to have "No child left behind" is to lower the standards so no kids have to learn.

And FYI..... I lived this first hand.

Tell the truth. When was the last time you sat through an entire class period in a public school.

When I was in high school of course. About 2 decades ago. ....

But you do not hesitate to shoot your mouth off as if you were an expert.

 

[Andylusion]

Okay, so I hope everyone can follow me here. I am going to write about how much teachers should be paid, but not from my own perspective. I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons, I just want to clarify that. But let's, for a second, assume I am the kind of person who says "Teachers jobs are easy, they get summers off, they're just glorified babysitters" and the work we all know teachers need to take home doesn't count.

Let's assume we pay teachers less than what I was paid to babysit in high school. So give them...$4/hour. Let's only pay them for the hours they are in school - let's say 6.5 hours a day. That brings their daily pay to $26.

But teachers don't only teach one student. Let's say the teacher teaches 30 students. Every parent should pay $26 a day for their child to be "babysat" and at thirty students that comes out to $780/day.

Now, 5 day school week brings that to $3,900 a week.
Or, if you want to figure in days, let's say they work 180 days a year (meaning no paid vacations) $780/day for 180 days = $140,000.

The average teacher salary tends to hover between $50,000 - $60,000. So, on the high end of that spectrum, let's figure out how much teachers make per hour per child:
$60,000/180 days = $333.33/day. $333.33 per day/30 students = $11.11 per student per day. Figure in the 6.5 hours and that's $1.71 per hour per student.



So teachers get paid more than they do on average, even in my fictional scenario, where we pay teachers less per hour per child than the average babysitter, and don't pay them for any of the additional work they need to do outside of school hours, and give them no vacation pay.

the MAIN rerason they need a lot more pay is they got a much tougher job than these pampered spoiled rich brats in pro sports who get MILLIONS just for playing a little boys game.thats bullshit.

Pretty sure most of the people who get paid millions for playing games, come from public schools.

In fact, quite a few of the private schools I know of, don't even have sports teams.

Oh, you are such an ignorant piece of crap!

Check out who wins the state championships in football and basketball in any number of states. Chances are they private schools who magically have scholarships for athletes attending public school to suddenly decide that private school was where their heart (and athletic skills) belonged!

I would love to see how many in the top NFL teams, came from private K-12 schools.

Not to be racist, but a lot of the white players do!

In the last 12 years, our class 6A state football champion has been a private school 9 times! For class 5A, it was 5 out of the last 12 years and the last 4 in a row.

If you understand anything about statistics at all, you should see the disparity. Probably not!

Out of how many football players, what percentage all went to private K-12?

Regardless, I'm not even sure that makes a point.

Even if you could make the case, and maybe you can I don't know.... so what? Does the school still have higher educational outcomes than public schools? Yes.

So who cares if it offers a free tuition to students with athletic ability, as long as it still requires the same level of educational results?

Most people should be happy that a student can get a better education for being a better athlete. Why not?

I want as many people to do better, as is possible. So if some guy that can run a football, can get a free education at a better school, and have better results.... more power to him.

 

[Andylusion]

Have you talked to a highschool student these days .
One thing is sure they are whining little assholes that have no common sense and cry constantly. I think teachers or should I say the school system is why

Why would you ever blame teachers? Are you one of those whining little assholes too?

You cannot make chicken salad out of chicken shit!

If the way you have acted on this thread is an indication of how teachers act in public schools.... then I think I found part of the reason students come out dumb.

 

[anotherlife]

The problem goes back to taxation. Teacher tenures are possible because all their monies are from your tax. And you are not legally allowed to stop paying your taxes to them. And if you dare propose a tax reduction for next year, then they threaten you with closing their kindergarten services, slashing 10 % down the sales value of your property. A vicious circle. Any ideas how to break it?

Having a situation in which districts fire teachers to lower taxes is a sure route to poorer educational performance.

The more sources of income for a school district the better. Common sources are property taxes, sales taxes, federal funds, and fees. Changing allocation between property taxes and sales is difficult. Federal funds are for specific projects such free and reduce lunches but there are always funds available for various new instructional programs. Encouraging more federal grant writing might help a bit. Then there are fees. Depending on state laws, school districts can levy fees for all kinds of services which can raise quite a bit of money. These fees can be student fee and fees charged to other districts or private schools for district services. The right person as director of finance or superintendent of finance can make a big difference.

The problem is that 90 % of all those monies never reach the school, but only bypass the school and go to teacher pensions instead of the school. Therefore the taxation element needs to be eliminated. That is the only part that is dominant because that is a guaranteed cash. As long as schools can levy taxes, they don't have to perform. If the tax based income is migrated to be fee based, then the teacher unions no longer have their hegemonic totalitarian power.

I don't know what you mean when say 90 % of all those monies never reach the school, but only bypass the school and go to teacher pensions. By far the greatest expense of schools is teacher salaries of which retirement is a part of their compensation. So yes, it does reach the schools. Employer contributions to teacher retirement varies widely by state. Texas is the lowest at about 4%. Utah is highest at about 20%.

Schools can not raise taxes, school districts can and they are responsible to the tax payer. In some states, district levies are capped by the state.

Also schools do have to perform. Schools with low standardize test scores are penalized today. This begins with a probationary period in which the school get additional help from the state or district. If the school does not improve, there will be changes in school administration, student transfers, and even school closure.

So I agree, different school systems have varying fiscal situations.

However, total compensation is on average, much higher than just the salary. By most estimates, almost 33% higher. A teacher earning $60K, is actually collecting $90K in compensation.

Public School Teachers Are Paid More Than Commonly Reported

But even then, I think sometimes the budgets are obscuring the costs. For example, just for fun I punched up Columbus Public School budget report. On the 3rd page of school funds, at the bottom of the report, I found a line item for $45 Million dollars, paid directly to the pension system. That in itself wasn't too surprising, except that the funding wasn't from the general school funds, but rather a bond levy. So the city sold bonds, to pay the pension system. But bonds.... have to be paid back.

So essentially they used a credit card to pay off their student loan.

This of course isn't listed as a cost of school system, because it was "income" from the bonds.

But more than that, I see a number of expensive waste in the system. This is the short list of obvious examples.

$2 Million for college credit programs. Why? Private schools don't do that, and the students take placement tests that allow them to skip classes they don't need.
$2 Million for retention of legal services.
$1 Million for formative assessment program.
$1.2 Million for college advisers. Colleges already have full time college advisers on staff. Let the students go to them.
$1.5 Million for YMCA Truancy Centers.
$4.7 Million for "reading adoption program". I'm sorry... I was told I had to read books and give reports on them. I never had a special program to get me to adopt reading.

And I could go on to the 'at-risk' programs for students, which if they worked at all, then we should have the least risky students in the world.

Point is, there are many many programs that essentially proclaim to do what.... the school system should be doing anyway.

So I think his basic point is correct. We are spending millions on millions, on things that are not salaries or on schools.

They need that money to protect themselves from being sued by idiots.

I find your logic lacking in everything you post. $1 million is just 10 people using the compensation figures you chose to use. My school district's budget in Florida was $6 billion! You are arguing about chump change because you don't see the need. It is there, whether you like it or not!

I have no knowledge about the actual numbers, only about the lack of affordability of it and about its organizational entitlement nature.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

When are one of you going to mention that alot of low performing schools have alot of kids with so much baggage they struggle to just to get by and their homelives are a wreck. Add to that they see zero value in education. Then you want them to score high on tests they will not prepare for because they dont put in any effort. So you blame the teacher for this. Until YOU fix the broken family nothing is going to change. Did you ever consider many kids dont want to learn and they know darn well nobody can force them too. How are you going to fix this? Ok send them to private schools. Then watch those test score averages. Then watch those private school parents go wild wanting troublesome students removed. Whats the fix?

Where do you see me blaming teachers for this?

Again... my problem with teachers and teachers unions is that they defend the system that isn't working, and their typical default answer is "more money". That's my problem with teachers and teachers unions.

If you read my previous post, my mother had an issue with a child exactly like you described, and that child made her life a living hell. There was nothing she could do for such a student. Nothing. And not only was the student making her life miserable, but the kid was making it hard for other kids to learn anything, because my mother was dealing with her out of control behavior.

The solution was to have her removed. The city actually changed the district lines, and had the section 8 housing she was from, moved to Columbus public, so her and the other students like her, were sent to their schools instead of the school my mother taught at.

The key difference between that system and a private school, is that the problem can be dealt with quicker, and with less damage. But the idea you can somehow force kids to learn is crazy. You can't force kids to learn. The only thing you can do, is banish them. For a private school, that means expulsion. For a public school, it means sending them to the office every single day, and eventually redrawing the district lines. Which of course only works one you have a few students from a specific problem area.

The private school system is better, because the only one affected is the person refusing to learn. In the public system, you send everyone from an particular area to another school district, when it is likely some kids from there were actually really good kids doing their best, but because the school doesn't want to get sued by bad parents, they can't just expel the bad kids.

The problem here is that left-wingers do not want a solution that has the most good for the most people. Instead they want the magic "everyone succeeds" solution. But there is no such solution.

In Finland, problem students are sent to a special school for losers. That of course is my non-politically correct title, but it is a school for children who can't, or who refuse to keep up with their peers, or have 'behavior problems' (aka losers). They are separated from quality students.

Why? Because problem students are like infections. If you don't cut the infection out, it spreads. The only way to have "No child left behind" is to lower the standards so no kids have to learn.

And FYI..... I lived this first hand.

Tell the truth. When was the last time you sat through an entire class period in a public school.

When I was in high school of course. About 2 decades ago. Are you saying that my experience can't possibly be true today? Because I've heard from a number of people that teach in public schools, that situations are actually worse than back then.

You have no real argument do you?

Yes, because for those two decades education has been changing, so you have no frame of reference. How I taught in 1996 was completely different than how I taught in 2018. THAT is your problem.

You "heard" is meaning less because those people are probably just like you and haven't been in a school in 20 years.

That is my argument for your uniformed opinions on the matter.

Clueless.

 

[BS Filter]

 

[Unkotare]

the MAIN rerason they need a lot more pay is they got a much tougher job than these pampered spoiled rich brats in pro sports who get MILLIONS just for playing a little boys game.thats bullshit.

Pretty sure most of the people who get paid millions for playing games, come from public schools.

In fact, quite a few of the private schools I know of, don't even have sports teams.

Oh, you are such an ignorant piece of crap!

Check out who wins the state championships in football and basketball in any number of states. Chances are they private schools who magically have scholarships for athletes attending public school to suddenly decide that private school was where their heart (and athletic skills) belonged!

I would love to see how many in the top NFL teams, came from private K-12 schools.

Not to be racist, but a lot of the white players do!

In the last 12 years, our class 6A state football champion has been a private school 9 times! For class 5A, it was 5 out of the last 12 years and the last 4 in a row.

If you understand anything about statistics at all, you should see the disparity. Probably not!

...

So who cares if it offers a free tuition to students with athletic ability, as long as it still requires the same level of educational results?

Most people should be happy that a student can get a better education for being a better athlete. Why not?

I want as many people to do better, as is possible. So if some guy that can run a football, can get a free education at a better school, and have better results.... more power to him.

Athletics have opened the door to educational opportunities for a great many young people. One of the many positives associated with sports.

 

[SweetSue92]

I have no excuses for this. My profession are real dunderheads sometimes. Reason number 5,257 I do not belong to the union.

 

[Manonthestreet]

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

That's rich! Show me a high school in the south or midwest that taught those courses 100 years ago. You don't even realize that most high schools didn't even exist!

Most conservatives have this wild dream of what used to be in terms of education, but it never really existed except in their imaginations. I have never met another adult outside of my classmates who took Latin in high school like I did. Considering my age, that shatters your meme.