Why teachers need more pay

wallflower

Rookie
Apr 25, 2014
21
10
1
Okay, so I hope everyone can follow me here. I am going to write about how much teachers should be paid, but not from my own perspective. I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons, I just want to clarify that. But let's, for a second, assume I am the kind of person who says "Teachers jobs are easy, they get summers off, they're just glorified babysitters" and the work we all know teachers need to take home doesn't count.

Let's assume we pay teachers less than what I was paid to babysit in high school. So give them...$4/hour. Let's only pay them for the hours they are in school - let's say 6.5 hours a day. That brings their daily pay to $26.

But teachers don't only teach one student. Let's say the teacher teaches 30 students. Every parent should pay $26 a day for their child to be "babysat" and at thirty students that comes out to $780/day.

Now, 5 day school week brings that to $3,900 a week.
Or, if you want to figure in days, let's say they work 180 days a year (meaning no paid vacations) $780/day for 180 days = $140,000.

The average teacher salary tends to hover between $50,000 - $60,000. So, on the high end of that spectrum, let's figure out how much teachers make per hour per child:
$60,000/180 days = $333.33/day. $333.33 per day/30 students = $11.11 per student per day. Figure in the 6.5 hours and that's $1.71 per hour per student.



So teachers get paid more than they do on average, even in my fictional scenario, where we pay teachers less per hour per child than the average babysitter, and don't pay them for any of the additional work they need to do outside of school hours, and give them no vacation pay.
 
Okay, so I hope everyone can follow me here. I am going to write about how much teachers should be paid, but not from my own perspective. I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons, I just want to clarify that. But let's, for a second, assume I am the kind of person who says "Teachers jobs are easy, they get summers off, they're just glorified babysitters" and the work we all know teachers need to take home doesn't count.

Let's assume we pay teachers less than what I was paid to babysit in high school. So give them...$4/hour. Let's only pay them for the hours they are in school - let's say 6.5 hours a day. That brings their daily pay to $26.

But teachers don't only teach one student. Let's say the teacher teaches 30 students. Every parent should pay $26 a day for their child to be "babysat" and at thirty students that comes out to $780/day.

Now, 5 day school week brings that to $3,900 a week.
Or, if you want to figure in days, let's say they work 180 days a year (meaning no paid vacations) $780/day for 180 days = $140,000.

The average teacher salary tends to hover between $50,000 - $60,000. So, on the high end of that spectrum, let's figure out how much teachers make per hour per child:
$60,000/180 days = $333.33/day. $333.33 per day/30 students = $11.11 per student per day. Figure in the 6.5 hours and that's $1.71 per hour per student.



So teachers get paid more than they do on average, even in my fictional scenario, where we pay teachers less per hour per child than the average babysitter, and don't pay them for any of the additional work they need to do outside of school hours, and give them no vacation pay.

Say what? Pay teachers "per hour per child"? The union would cram a thousand kids into a classroom. Why not deduct a percentage from teachers salaries for every kid that drops out?
 
Good teachers gut fucked because principals administrators and presidents enjoy bloated union salaries.

Good teachers get fucked because tenured bad teachers have priority and seniority.

Good teachers get fucked because they are not related to, nor are they friends of, nor do they go to the same church as... tenured administrative teachers.

Today's schools are fraught with nepotism, cronyism, and favoritism.

The good teachers are cast out for wont of unionized perverts, lesbians, Liberal, family and friend.
 
Pay teachers per hour per kid wasn't my argument at all, if you read my disclaimer. My statement was simply that even those who argue teachers are glorified babysitters who should be paid less than they currently make are wrong. And I'm certainly not arguing for $160,000 paychecks either. That's not sustainable. I was simply making a point that treating them as the "glorified babysitters" some say they are would technically involve higher pay than it does now.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
 
I know I made an odd argument, and I in no way advocate doing what my argument was. That'd be detrimental to the system. I created a hypothetical simply to make a point.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
 
Anyone want to respond who makes a living or has made a living as a classroom teacher? I'm curious.

Yeah- thanks for asking. Wife did that for 4 years. One of the best that school ever had.
Admins told her so.

So...

We assumed she'd get tenure, so I started looking for a house to buy.

Wife shows up for work at the end of the school year and the principal tells her flat out- you're fired.

Reason? None.

None required.

Other than the fact that my wife did not attend a church, did not mingle in school circles, was not close to any other teacher/admin in the district, was not related to same, did not suck cock.

And now... you know, the rest of the story.
 
Nepotism, cronyism, favoritism.

The Holy Trinity of our educational system.

It ruined our lives.

And for that I shall forever hate this country's so-called educational system.
 
Yeah, gotta agree with Mr H on this one.

Regardless of how you feel about unions, the public school unions have made a mess of shit. With a job as important as educating our youngest generation, why would we want our educators given consideration of anything -but- performance?

Why would we allow them to base employment decisions on seniority?

Also, you look at how the basic union dynamic works. The union negotiates with the employer to get higher pay, more benefits, and less requirements for the workers they represent. The employer concedes what is required to continue to operate, and the difference is passed onto the consumers.

Public school unions are no different. They aren't representing the children, they're representing the teachers and administrators. They fight to get higher pay and lower expectations for the educators and the consumers are the ones that have to eat the cost. In this case the consumers are the taxpayers and the kids.

Now, in my view, most of our larger educational issues in this country are primarily cultural. It doesn't matter how much you improve the school system, when our popular culture idolizes ignorance and persecutes, as nerds and dorks, anyone with intellectual values and pass times, we're gonna end up with a lot of willfully ignorant dipshits.

That said. . . Ban union seniority rules in public schools and start demanding more accountability and see if shit doesn't improve. I don't know if you realize it, but upping the salary will only put better teachers in the classrooms if the shittier teachers are forced to move aside. With seniority, that latter requirement won't be met. You'll just be paying the current batch of fuck-ups more money to continue fucking up with impunity.

Also, whoever said that we should stop spending so much on the buildings, I also agree with. I wouldn't put the fault on the contractors, though. By definition, a business is looking to maximize its profits. They're just doing their jobs.

The problem is that we've given our government officials too much discretion in how much to blow on individual contracts and there's too little transparency to their spending decisions. Make it harder for criminal enterprises to buy off political contracts and, VOILA!, less criminal enterprises will buy off political contracts. You know why you've never seen a toilet seat in anyone's house that you know that cost 650 bucks? The same reason you've never seen a coffee maker in your friend's kitchen that cost 7 G's. Cuz regular people who have to spend their -own- money don't pay fucking 650 for a toilet seat or 7 G's for a fuckin coffee maker! Throwing money at a problem doesn't fix shit if the people responsible for distributing that money have the integrity and spending habits of meth addicts.
 
Last edited:
Okay, so I hope everyone can follow me here. I am going to write about how much teachers should be paid, but not from my own perspective. I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons, I just want to clarify that. But let's, for a second, assume I am the kind of person who says "Teachers jobs are easy, they get summers off, they're just glorified babysitters" and the work we all know teachers need to take home doesn't count.

Let's assume we pay teachers less than what I was paid to babysit in high school. So give them...$4/hour. Let's only pay them for the hours they are in school - let's say 6.5 hours a day. That brings their daily pay to $26.

But teachers don't only teach one student. Let's say the teacher teaches 30 students. Every parent should pay $26 a day for their child to be "babysat" and at thirty students that comes out to $780/day.

Now, 5 day school week brings that to $3,900 a week.
Or, if you want to figure in days, let's say they work 180 days a year (meaning no paid vacations) $780/day for 180 days = $140,000.

The average teacher salary tends to hover between $50,000 - $60,000. So, on the high end of that spectrum, let's figure out how much teachers make per hour per child:
$60,000/180 days = $333.33/day. $333.33 per day/30 students = $11.11 per student per day. Figure in the 6.5 hours and that's $1.71 per hour per student.



So teachers get paid more than they do on average, even in my fictional scenario, where we pay teachers less per hour per child than the average babysitter, and don't pay them for any of the additional work they need to do outside of school hours, and give them no vacation pay.

First: teachers should never be paid to "babysit". They are there to educate our children, not babysit, not indoctrinate.
Second: as a university professor, I am well aware of the additional hours required to accomplish the job. That is part of what one accepts when one accepts the job.
 
Anyone want to respond who makes a living or has made a living as a classroom teacher? I'm curious.

Yeah- thanks for asking. Wife did that for 4 years. One of the best that school ever had.
Admins told her so.

So...

We assumed she'd get tenure, so I started looking for a house to buy.

Wife shows up for work at the end of the school year and the principal tells her flat out- you're fired.

Reason? None.

None required.

Other than the fact that my wife did not attend a church, did not mingle in school circles, was not close to any other teacher/admin in the district, was not related to same, did not suck cock.

And now... you know, the rest of the story.
One of benefits of being a teacher in Chinese mainland seems that nobody dares to fire a teacher randomly. Surely except those temporary teachers, who do the same jobs, but get less paid, and do not occupy the government's personnel organization.
 
Okay, so I hope everyone can follow me here. I am going to write about how much teachers should be paid, but not from my own perspective. I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons, I just want to clarify that. But let's, for a second, assume I am the kind of person who says "Teachers jobs are easy, they get summers off, they're just glorified babysitters" and the work we all know teachers need to take home doesn't count.



Let's assume we pay teachers less than what I was paid to babysit in high school. So give them...$4/hour. Let's only pay them for the hours they are in school - let's say 6.5 hours a day. That brings their daily pay to $26.



But teachers don't only teach one student. Let's say the teacher teaches 30 students. Every parent should pay $26 a day for their child to be "babysat" and at thirty students that comes out to $780/day.



Now, 5 day school week brings that to $3,900 a week.

Or, if you want to figure in days, let's say they work 180 days a year (meaning no paid vacations) $780/day for 180 days = $140,000.



The average teacher salary tends to hover between $50,000 - $60,000. So, on the high end of that spectrum, let's figure out how much teachers make per hour per child:

$60,000/180 days = $333.33/day. $333.33 per day/30 students = $11.11 per student per day. Figure in the 6.5 hours and that's $1.71 per hour per student.







So teachers get paid more than they do on average, even in my fictional scenario, where we pay teachers less per hour per child than the average babysitter, and don't pay them for any of the additional work they need to do outside of school hours, and give them no vacation pay.



First: teachers should never be paid to "babysit". They are there to educate our children, not babysit, not indoctrinate.

Second: as a university professor, I am well aware of the additional hours required to accomplish the job. That is part of what one accepts when one accepts the job.

As I said, I don't actually support paying teachers like that. I created a hypothetical situation in which even those who say teachers don't deserve a lot of money because they're basically babysitters would be shown that most teachers are grossly underpaid right now.

I would never pay a teacher like that, I was using the hypothetical to prove a point.





Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com
 
Okay, so I hope everyone can follow me here. I am going to write about how much teachers should be paid, but not from my own perspective. I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons, I just want to clarify that. But let's, for a second, assume I am the kind of person who says "Teachers jobs are easy, they get summers off, they're just glorified babysitters" and the work we all know teachers need to take home doesn't count.



Let's assume we pay teachers less than what I was paid to babysit in high school. So give them...$4/hour. Let's only pay them for the hours they are in school - let's say 6.5 hours a day. That brings their daily pay to $26.



But teachers don't only teach one student. Let's say the teacher teaches 30 students. Every parent should pay $26 a day for their child to be "babysat" and at thirty students that comes out to $780/day.



Now, 5 day school week brings that to $3,900 a week.

Or, if you want to figure in days, let's say they work 180 days a year (meaning no paid vacations) $780/day for 180 days = $140,000.



The average teacher salary tends to hover between $50,000 - $60,000. So, on the high end of that spectrum, let's figure out how much teachers make per hour per child:

$60,000/180 days = $333.33/day. $333.33 per day/30 students = $11.11 per student per day. Figure in the 6.5 hours and that's $1.71 per hour per student.







So teachers get paid more than they do on average, even in my fictional scenario, where we pay teachers less per hour per child than the average babysitter, and don't pay them for any of the additional work they need to do outside of school hours, and give them no vacation pay.



First: teachers should never be paid to "babysit". They are there to educate our children, not babysit, not indoctrinate.

Second: as a university professor, I am well aware of the additional hours required to accomplish the job. That is part of what one accepts when one accepts the job.

As I said, I don't actually support paying teachers like that. I created a hypothetical situation in which even those who say teachers don't deserve a lot of money because they're basically babysitters would be shown that most teachers are grossly underpaid right now.

I would never pay a teacher like that, I was using the hypothetical to prove a point.





Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

Sorry, I guess I expressed that poorly. I was agreeing with you. Teachers in too many school systems are basically chained to the system approved curriculum and are often minutely managed as to how to teach that curriculum. Too often, teachers who are retained are exactly those who make the best babysitters because they are incapable of creatively bringing knowledge to the young. And teachers who have that ability are too often censored and punished if they dare use it "outside the box".
My brother has been teaching for 33 years and he's often discussed the changes he's encountered over the years. I have been teaching at the university for 14 years and can vouch for the...ahem, quality of the product generated by public schools. I am just glad my job does not include grading their writing and math skills.
Oh, and I realize that a lot of the poor quality of our educational system is not the fault of most teachers.
 
Okay, so I hope everyone can follow me here. I am going to write about how much teachers should be paid, but not from my own perspective. I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons, I just want to clarify that. But let's, for a second, assume I am the kind of person who says "Teachers jobs are easy, they get summers off, they're just glorified babysitters" and the work we all know teachers need to take home doesn't count.

Let's assume we pay teachers less than what I was paid to babysit in high school. So give them...$4/hour. Let's only pay them for the hours they are in school - let's say 6.5 hours a day. That brings their daily pay to $26.

But teachers don't only teach one student. Let's say the teacher teaches 30 students. Every parent should pay $26 a day for their child to be "babysat" and at thirty students that comes out to $780/day.

Now, 5 day school week brings that to $3,900 a week.
Or, if you want to figure in days, let's say they work 180 days a year (meaning no paid vacations) $780/day for 180 days = $140,000.

The average teacher salary tends to hover between $50,000 - $60,000. So, on the high end of that spectrum, let's figure out how much teachers make per hour per child:
$60,000/180 days = $333.33/day. $333.33 per day/30 students = $11.11 per student per day. Figure in the 6.5 hours and that's $1.71 per hour per student.



So teachers get paid more than they do on average, even in my fictional scenario, where we pay teachers less per hour per child than the average babysitter, and don't pay them for any of the additional work they need to do outside of school hours, and give them no vacation pay.



Interesting
 

New Topics

Forum List

Back
Top