Why Do/Don't We Need The Department of Education?

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

emergency funding and food for schools who just dont have enough....

If the school district can't fund itself then it should be dissolved and merged with a neighboring district.

Thank you for playing, but once again you show how stupid you are.

Funny how it's always the stupid people who go around telling everyone else how stupid they are.

 

[The Rabbi]

emergency funding and food for schools who just dont have enough....

If the school district can't fund itself then it should be dissolved and merged with a neighboring district.

Thank you for playing, but once again you show how stupid you are.

Funny how it's always the stupid people who go around telling everyone else how stupid they are.

Why couldn't FEMA provide emergency funding? Why couldn't Interior provide it? Why couldn't a dozen other Federal agencies provide it?
When you can't make points it's time to pull out the stupid. For Scumball that's all he's got.

 

[The Rabbi]

Local School District A:
Intelligent Design, and no classes on evolution
Robert E. Lee school holiday
Readin', Ritin', Rithmatic
Playground littered with jungle gyms, paperclip weapons, and Jarts


Local School District B:
Biology, with heavy emphasis on evolution
Racial/Sexual Diversity Sensitivy mandatory classes.
Spelling not checked in Science papers
Playground littered with glitter, free condoms, and foam play structures


Is that okay with the anti-DoEd people?

From a federal perspective, what's wrong with it?

 

[Badmutha]

It was mentioned in passing in another topic that we do not need the ]Department of Education.

I would like to hear detailed arguments exactly why we do or do not need it.

Convince me.

Thanks.

We dont need it....and eliminating it would probably yield better grades for American students.

But necessity isnt the real question in my book......legality and constitutionaility is.....and nowhere in the Constitution is the Federal Government control of or intrusion into our education system granted. The Founders warned against it........

"If Congress can employ money indefinitely to the general welfare,
and are the sole and supreme judges of the general welfare,
they may take the care of religion into their own hands;
they may appoint teachers in every State, county and parish
and pay them out of their public treasury;
they may take into their own hands the education of children,
establishing in like manner schools throughout the Union;
they may assume the provision of the poor;
they may undertake the regulation of all roads other than post-roads;
in short, every thing, from the highest object of state legislation
down to the most minute object of police,
would be thrown under the power of Congress.... Were the power
of Congress to be established in the latitude contended for,
it would subvert the very foundations, and transmute the very nature
of the limited Government established by the people of America."
--James Madison--Father of the Constitution--Hater of Democrats--Great American


The Federal Government should have NOTHING to do with our education system......

.....the mere existence of the Department of Education today.... is testament to the perversion of our Constitution that has taken place.........as well as the plummeting IQs of our publicly educated populace.
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[rightwinger]

It was mentioned in passing in another topic that we do not need the ]Department of Education.

I would like to hear detailed arguments exactly why we do or do not need it.

Convince me.

Thanks.

We dont need it....and eliminating it would probably yield better grades for American students.

But necessity isnt the real question in my book......legality and constitutionaility is.....and nowhere in the Constitution is the Federal Government control of or intrusion into our education system granted. The Founders warned against it........

"If Congress can employ money indefinitely to the general welfare,
and are the sole and supreme judges of the general welfare,
they may take the care of religion into their own hands;
they may appoint teachers in every State, county and parish
and pay them out of their public treasury;
they may take into their own hands the education of children,
establishing in like manner schools throughout the Union;
they may assume the provision of the poor;
they may undertake the regulation of all roads other than post-roads;
in short, every thing, from the highest object of state legislation
down to the most minute object of police,
would be thrown under the power of Congress.... Were the power
of Congress to be established in the latitude contended for,
it would subvert the very foundations, and transmute the very nature
of the limited Government established by the people of America."
--James Madison--Father of the Constitution--Hater of Democrats--Great American


The Federal Government should have NOTHING to do with our education system......

.....the mere existence of the Department of Education today.... is testament to the perversion of our Constitution that has taken place.........as well as the plummeting IQs of our publicly educated populace.
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.
.
.
.

That is not in our Constitution. It is an opinion

 

[Badmutha]

That is not in our Constitution.

.......well you know what else isnt in the Constituiton...." The Department of Education"

It is an opinion

Yes an opinion from the Father of the Constitution.......explaining what he authored......

......it carries great creedence and should be heeded.
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[chanel]

I started a thread on this a while back. I am a teacher, and I am still on the fence.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/education/198135-national-standards-in-k-12-education.html

 

[rightwinger]

That is not in our Constitution.

.......well you know what else isnt in the Constituiton...." The Department of Education"

It is an opinion

Yes an opinion from the Father of the Constitution.......explaining what he authored......

......it carries great creedence and should be heeded.
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There are many things not in our Constitution..an Air Force, NASA, protecting our environment. The Founding Fathers did not envision that they could determine everything a future America would need.....neither should we

Madison is not the sole determinant of what the Constitution is or how future generations would interpret it...that is why we have a court system

 

[Againsheila]

It was mentioned in passing in another topic that we do not need the Department of Education.

I would like to hear detailed arguments exactly why we do or do not need it.

Convince me.

Thanks.

Simple, our educational system isn't anybetter with it that it was without it. Test scores aren't better, there's still crime in schools, still a high drop out rate...Just another way to pay out of work politicians for nothing.

 

[candycorn]

Are you for higher standards or not? I mean, if one district wants their kids to forego any Algebra since "we never use it", would you be okay with that?

How about this perspective:
If a few idiots capture a school district board and eliminate Algebra, the effects of their stupidity will be localized and more easily turned around.

If a few idiots capture a national agency, the effects of their stupidity will be felt nationally and be more deeply entrenched.

That is why there is a Senatorial approval process for cabinet secretaries. We get the Government we deserve in all cases.

So...thats your argument? Localizing disasters? You should be quiet about right now.

 

[candycorn]

Education goes by school district, not state.
But thanks for proving you're an idiot.

So the State Board of Education should be done away with as well? Oh wait, you just said there was no SBoE...nevermind.


Perry.

I actually did not say that.
I didnt know your real name was Perry. Didn't want to know either.

Nah, I was talking about the democrat who ran for President this year...Perry. Ooooh...thats gotta sting.

So if you really want local control of school districts, why not get read of the SBoE's?

 

[candycorn]

Are you for higher standards or not?

I send my child to a private school, so yes.

I mean, if one district wants their kids to forego any Algebra since "we never use it", would you be okay with that?

If that's what the people voted for, then yes. If you don't like the school system, don't live there or send your kid to a private school.

So pay taxes for the schools and pay to send your kids to private schools? Or move away to another district that can change it's standards on whim since there is no minimum standards across the districts any longer. Hmmm....sounds like a Gingrich proposal since it's totally unworkable, implausible, and frankly stupid.

I'm curious...do you feel the same way about the FAA as you do the DOE? Should airplanes not have to meet minimum safety standards? If not why not? If so, whats the difference?

 

[candycorn]

As it is not a function of the federal government, as per the US Constitution, how about why we have one?

Department of Education is, of course, unconstitutional. The Constitution clearly states that powers not granted to the federal government belong to the states.

So where is the impetus for its creation? Unions. The National Education Association (NEA)

“In 1972, the massive union formed a political action committee…released ‘Needed: A Cabinet Department of Education’ in 1975, but its most significant step was to endorse a presidential candidate- Jimmy Carter- for the first time in the history of the organization.” D.T. Stallngs, “A Brief History of the Department of Education: 1979-2002,” p. 3.

When formed, its budget was $13.1 billion (in 2007 dollars) and it employed 450 people. IN 2010, the estimated budget is $107 billion, and there are 4,800 employees. http://crunchycon.nationalreview.co...-department-education-not-radical/mona-charen

“In November 1995, when the federal government shut down over a budget crisis, 89.4 percent of the department’s employees were deemed ‘nonessential’ and sent home.” Beck and Balfe, “Broke,” p.304

Neither was NASA. Should we stop going into Space?
It's arguable that the Air Force wasn't in the Constitution either. Care to give it up?
No FDA...so we can go back to the medicine shows and people selling tonic water as a cure-alls. The life expectancy will go down which may solve the problem of medicare but thats
really a craven way to solve the issue.

Let not the perfect be the enemy of the good.

And I certainly don't think the DoE is an example of either the perfect nor the good.
It is simply featherbedding at the highest government levels.
Do you find your examples to be featherbedding at the highest government levels?
I thought not.

It might not be a bad idea to start a thread on the enumerated powers....

BTW...you might want to find out what 'craven' means.
It certainly doesn't apply in this context.

Lets not let questions stand in the way of your fillibuster. Apparently if it's not in the Constitution from 1781...it shouldn't be in 2012 America...right?

Point to the passage about Space Exploration, would you please?

 

[toxicmedia]

That is not in our Constitution.

.......well you know what else isnt in the Constituiton...." The Department of Education"

It is an opinion

Yes an opinion from the Father of the Constitution.......explaining what he authored......

......it carries great creedence and should be heeded.
.
.
.

There are many things not in our Constitution..an Air Force, NASA, protecting our environment. The Founding Fathers did not envision that they could determine everything a future America would need.....neither should we

Madison is not the sole determinant of what the Constitution is or how future generations would interpret it...that is why we have a court system

The founders would have never invisioned a country where we had limits on immigration. That's why the consitution only addresses naturalization. They could have never envisioned light bulbs, combustion engines, manned flight, etc...on and on...........

It would be a really cool thread if we started one on things that are neccessary that aren't in the consitution, and shouldn't be handled by the states....like DHS

 

[The Rabbi]

So the State Board of Education should be done away with as well? Oh wait, you just said there was no SBoE...nevermind.


Perry.

I actually did not say that.
I didnt know your real name was Perry. Didn't want to know either.

Nah, I was talking about the democrat who ran for President this year...Perry. Ooooh...thats gotta sting.

So if you really want local control of school districts, why not get read of the SBoE's?

Obama is the only Democrat running for president this year. I guess if you have your head up your ass (and who knows who else's) you might have missed that.

If states want to get rid of their state boards of ed that's OK with me.

Frankly I'd be fine with dissolving all government schools and reducing taxes that much. Doubtless that would horrify a rancid statist like yourself, with hysterical claims of "think of the children". But the truth is kids would end up much better educated.

 

[Badmutha]

There are many things not in our Constitution..

Yes its an ever growing list in Post-Constitutional America isnt it?

an Air Force, NASA, protecting our environment. The Founding Fathers did not envision that they could determine everything a future America would need.....neither should we.

...well dont forget $16 muffins, Solyndra, Cowboy Poetry Contests, and $16,000,000,000,000.00 in (D)ebt.

Madison is not the sole determinant of what the Constitution is or how future generations would interpret it...that is why we have a court system

The principles of Freedom and Limited Government do not require interpretation.....unless your looking to subvert them.
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[rightwinger]

There are many things not in our Constitution..

Yes its an ever growing list in Post-Constitutional America isnt it?

an Air Force, NASA, protecting our environment. The Founding Fathers did not envision that they could determine everything a future America would need.....neither should we.

...well dont forget $16 muffins, Solyndra, Cowboy Poetry Contests, and $16,000,000,000,000.00 in (D)ebt.

Madison is not the sole determinant of what the Constitution is or how future generations would interpret it...that is why we have a court system

The principles of Freedom and Limited Government do not require interpretation.....unless your looking to subvert them.
.
.
.

In reading your restrictive views of the Constitution, it is obvious that we need a court system to interpret our Constitution so that we do not need to rely on the opinions of Teabagging message board posters

 

[toxicmedia]

I actually did not say that.
I didnt know your real name was Perry. Didn't want to know either.

Nah, I was talking about the democrat who ran for President this year...Perry. Ooooh...thats gotta sting.

So if you really want local control of school districts, why not get read of the SBoE's?

Obama is the only Democrat running for president this year. I guess if you have your head up your ass (and who knows who else's) you might have missed that.

If states want to get rid of their state boards of ed that's OK with me.

Frankly I'd be fine with dissolving all government schools and reducing taxes that much. Doubtless that would horrify a rancid statist like yourself, with hysterical claims of "think of the children". But the truth is kids would end up much better educated.

The bolded portion above is in sharp contrast to Obama's proclamation last night that manditory education for children up to 18 be enforced.

I can't imagine education NOT being the top priority for young Americans. It sure as shit is for Idians, Chinese, Koreans, Europeans, and everyone else in the world. We're the only country in the world that thinks Joe's Heating and Air College of Burbank will equip our children to compete globally.

 

[The Rabbi]

Nah, I was talking about the democrat who ran for President this year...Perry. Ooooh...thats gotta sting.

So if you really want local control of school districts, why not get read of the SBoE's?

Obama is the only Democrat running for president this year. I guess if you have your head up your ass (and who knows who else's) you might have missed that.

If states want to get rid of their state boards of ed that's OK with me.

Frankly I'd be fine with dissolving all government schools and reducing taxes that much. Doubtless that would horrify a rancid statist like yourself, with hysterical claims of "think of the children". But the truth is kids would end up much better educated.

The bolded portion above is in sharp contrast to Obama's proclamation last night that manditory education for children up to 18 be enforced.

I can't imagine education NOT being the top priority for young Americans. It sure as shit is for Idians, Chinese, Koreans, Europeans, and everyone else in the world. We're the only country in the world that thinks Joe's Heating and Air College of Burbank will equip our children to compete globally.

The fact that is contrasts with Obama's message is a positive, not a negative.
Thank you for slandering heating and air guys. Remember this the next time your furnace goes out and it's -5 degrees.
In your tiny mind doubtless kids would just run around aimlessly without the gov't telling them they have to go to school.

 

[The Rabbi]

emergency funding and food for schools who just dont have enough....

Thank you for playing, but once again you show how stupid you are.

Link?
The Dept of Agriculture provides food. Dipshit.

Try the doe website dipshit. You really dont want to challenge me on this.

You're obviously a boob. Like anyone had any doubt.
National School Lunch Program

And if you tell me DOE provides food too then you've just proven the point that DOE simply duplicated what can be done by other agencies and needs to be eliminated.