Why Do "Desperate Democrats" Strongly Appose Voter Photo I.D. Requirement For 2012 ?

[Londoner]

This is not complicated.

Republicans want to limit the voting of the poor/elderly/students. Democrats want these groups to vote.

This is pure self-interest on both sides of aisle.

Here is one thing that is absolutely certain: this issue has nothing to do with preserving the sanctity of voting. Neither side cares about rules. They only push for rules which benefit them.

Republicans are trying to make their transparent electoral strategy seem like a noble concern for rules and fairness. Please. Are we forgetting that they are politicians? Politicians don't care about anything but getting power and exercising it on behalf of the special interests who put them in office. The only people who believe that politicians care about noble voting causes are Republican voters. They trust dear leader. They believe dear leader cares about the sanctity of the voting process. When it comes right down to it - whether it be going into Iraq or the voting booth - Republicans always believe what their party leaders say. They trust government. Democrats, on the other hand, left politics when LBJ upped the ante in Vietnam. Now their party is weak and disorganized. One wonders if GOP voters would ever rebel against their government leaders like the Left did in the 60s & 70s.

 

[Uncensored2008]

they can't vote under a fictitious name.....

Of course they can, and do, by the thousands.

they are not given a voter's registration card from Acorn, or anyone, whenever anyone registers to vote, the State office for voter registration VETS each registration, before they issue a voter registration card to them.

They "vet' by verifying that the property exists. End of process. ACORN uses real addresses, and registers fake names.

And no one can just come in to any polling place and say I want to vote here, if their name is not on the registered voter list at the place,

So?

Their name IS on the list, ACORN registered the fake name and thousands like it months earlier.

they could be given a provisional ballot to vote, but provisional ballots are not counted unless the State can verify that the voter was already registered legally and that the voter had not voted early or through an absentee ballot etc...

Not relevant.

They ARE on the registered list, ACORN registered the name.

NONE of the voters that acorn employees registered fraudulently to vote, ever made it through the State office vetting, and never were registered to vote.

None of the names that the State caught from ACORN made it through, the hundreds of thousands they didn't catch did...

Seriously, this is like claiming that no one ever speeds, because the CHP gave a guy a speeding ticket on the 60 last month.

For every 1 caught, 10,000 don't get caught.

 

[Uncensored2008]

You can't prove this.

That you fight the use of ID proves it.

If there were no fraud, you wouldn't care. You depend on fraud to win elections. Thus, you'll fight anything that limits fraud.

 

[Uncensored2008]

This is not complicated.

Republicans want to limit the voting of the poor/elderly/students. Democrats want these groups to vote.

How does showing ID keep them from voting?

This is pure self-interest on both sides of aisle.

This is purely about fraud.

democrats depend on fraud in elections.

Here is one thing that is absolutely certain: this issue has nothing to do with preserving the sanctity of voting.

That's all it has to do with, as you know.

The left depends on fraud and fears that even common methods such as ID, which you need to rent a video or use a credit card, will interfere with stealing elections.

Both sides care only about winning. Republicans are trying to make their transparent electoral strategy seem like a noble concern for rules and fairness. Please. Are we forgetting that they are politicians? Politicians don't care about anything but getting power and exercising it on behalf of the special interests who put them in office. The only people who believe that politicians care about noble voting causes are Republican voters. They trust dear leader. They believe dear leader cares about the sanctity of the voting process. When it comes right down to it - whether it be going into Iraq or the voting booth - Republicans always believe what their party leaders say. They trust government.

You depend on fraud as a major part of your election strategy, ID thwarts your plans.

Simple as that, and we ALL know it.

 

[LoneLaugher]

You can't prove this.

That you fight the use of ID proves it.

If there were no fraud, you wouldn't care. You depend on fraud to win elections. Thus, you'll fight anything that limits fraud.

I'm hoping that you are smart enough to know that your argument is lame and disingenuous. I think it is more acceptable to argue with a fucked up liar than it is to argue with an idiot.

 

[Care4all]

You can't prove this.

That you fight the use of ID proves it.

If there were no fraud, you wouldn't care. You depend on fraud to win elections. Thus, you'll fight anything that limits fraud.

that's just partisan bs....uncensored! and naive and foolish.

that's just like me saying republicans can only win by cheating via un-auditable electronic voting machines owned by republican companies or by stopping legal citizens from voting...

that's just playing the game the politicians want us to play uncensored!!!

....be a leader instead of follower and start thinking things through for yourself!

 

[Uncensored2008]

I'm hoping that you are smart enough to know that your argument is lame and disingenuous. I think it is more acceptable to argue with a fucked up liar than it is to argue with an idiot.

My argument is 100% correct, as you know.

Do you oppose showing ID to rent a DVD? Of course not - because defrauding Blockbuster won't get Obama elected. Do you oppose showing ID to cash a check or use a credit card?

You ONLY oppose showing ID to vote. Why? Well, that's pretty obvious.

{Back in April, in a story that did not receive the attention it deserved, a Tunica County, Miss., jury found Lessadolla Sowers, who have been identified as a member of the executive committee of the county’s NAACP chapter, guilty of 10 counts of fraudulently casting absentee ballots in the name of others.

Sowers, The Daily Caller reported Friday, received a five-year prison term for each of the ten counts—for a total of 50 years– but will be allowed to serve those terms concurrently, meaning at the same time.

The problem of voter fraud, despite what the Democrats say, is very, very real. The question is what to do about it. [Check out our editorial cartoons on the Democratic Party.]

A number of states are considering or have passed reforms that make it tougher to cheat at the polls, most of which center on requiring voters to produce a photo ID before they can cast a ballot, a seemingly simple idea taken from everyday life that most people support. After all, you have to show a government-issued photo ID to board an airplane, rent a car, cash a check, buy liquor, enter office buildings in major metropolitan areas, and even before you can get married so why not have to produce a photo ID before you can vote?}

Despite What Democrats Claim, Voter Fraud is Real - Peter Roff (usnews.com)

 

[Uncensored2008]

that's just partisan bs....uncensored!

Funny, I was thinking the same thing about opposition to the us of ID.

and naive and foolish.

I don't think so.

that's just like me saying republicans can only win by cheating via un-auditable electronic voting machines owned by republican companies or by stopping legal citizens from voting...

{(CBS/AP) The owner of a signature-gathering firm has been arrested on suspicion of voter registration fraud, authorities said Sunday.

Mark Anthony Jacoby, who owns the firm Young Political Majors, is accused of registering himself to vote twice - in 2006 and in 2007 - using the address of a childhood home in Los Angeles where he no longer lived.

The Secretary of State's Office said Jacoby used the address to meet a state requirement that signature-gatherers sign a declaration stating that they are either registered to vote in California or are eligible to do so.

State investigators and local police arrested Jacoby shortly before midnight Saturday near an Ontario hotel on a warrant issued by the Los Angeles District Attorney's Office earlier this month.

Jacoby faces four felony charges: two counts of voter registration fraud and two counts of perjury. Voter registration fraud carries a penalty of up to three years in prison.}

Signature-Gatherer Arrested In Voter Fraud - CBS News

Voter fraud as I've described is rampant.

ID is a simple, non-intrusive means of ending about 90% of it. There is no rational reason to oppose it.

that's just playing the game the politicians want us to play uncensored!!!

....be a leader instead of follower and start thinking things through for yourself!

I oppose election fraud, ID is a simple and effective means of curtailing much of it.

 

[LoneLaugher]

I'm hoping that you are smart enough to know that your argument is lame and disingenuous. I think it is more acceptable to argue with a fucked up liar than it is to argue with an idiot.

My argument is 100% correct, as you know.

Do you oppose showing ID to rent a DVD? Of course not - because defrauding Blockbuster won't get Obama elected. Do you oppose showing ID to cash a check or use a credit card?

You ONLY oppose showing ID to vote. Why? Well, that's pretty obvious.

{Back in April, in a story that did not receive the attention it deserved, a Tunica County, Miss., jury found Lessadolla Sowers, who have been identified as a member of the executive committee of the county’s NAACP chapter, guilty of 10 counts of fraudulently casting absentee ballots in the name of others.

Sowers, The Daily Caller reported Friday, received a five-year prison term for each of the ten counts—for a total of 50 years– but will be allowed to serve those terms concurrently, meaning at the same time.

The problem of voter fraud, despite what the Democrats say, is very, very real. The question is what to do about it. [Check out our editorial cartoons on the Democratic Party.]

A number of states are considering or have passed reforms that make it tougher to cheat at the polls, most of which center on requiring voters to produce a photo ID before they can cast a ballot, a seemingly simple idea taken from everyday life that most people support. After all, you have to show a government-issued photo ID to board an airplane, rent a car, cash a check, buy liquor, enter office buildings in major metropolitan areas, and even before you can get married so why not have to produce a photo ID before you can vote?}

Despite What Democrats Claim, Voter Fraud is Real - Peter Roff (usnews.com)

Are you saying that the US Constitution protects a persons right to rent a DVD?

We are talking about voting here. Do you see any difference?

Your example.....your single example thus far....is one where the fraud absentee ballot related and was criminally prosecuted. Did you see any Democrats protesting the trial? BTW.....I like the way the author thinks his readers are too stupid to know what the term "concurently" means.

You fail.

 

[Teals_Of_Wonder]

When I become the Governor Of Florida in 2020, I will pass a law that will allow all Republicans the option to register one Palm Tree from their lawn to register to vote in all elections.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Are you saying that the US Constitution protects a persons right to rent a DVD?

The US Constitution places the rules of voting in the hands of the states. Have you ever actually SEEN the US Constitution.

We are talking about voting here. Do you see any difference?

Yes, voting is FAR more important than renting a movie, and should be treated as such.

Your example.....your single example thus far....is one where the fraud absentee ballot related and was criminally prosecuted.

But you said that's never happened? In fact, it happens all the time. I don't use ACORN out of the blue, you know...

Did you see any Democrats protesting the trial? BTW.....I like the way the author thinks his readers are too stupid to know what the term "concrently" means.

You fail.

Yawn...

You oppose voters showing ID because.....

It's the fraud, we all know it - particularly you.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Are you saying that the US Constitution protects a persons right to rent a DVD?

The US Constitution places the rules of voting in the hands of the states. Have you ever actually SEEN the US Constitution.

We are talking about voting here. Do you see any difference?

Yes, voting is FAR more important than renting a movie, and should be treated as such.

Your example.....your single example thus far....is one where the fraud absentee ballot related and was criminally prosecuted.

But you said that's never happened? In fact, it happens all the time. I don't use ACORN out of the blue, you know...

Did you see any Democrats protesting the trial? BTW.....I like the way the author thinks his readers are too stupid to know what the term "concrently" means.

You fail.

Yawn...

You oppose voters showing ID because.....

It's the fraud, we all know it - particularly you.

I'll bite. Why particularly me? Whatchya got?

 

[Foxfyre]

For the life of me, I can't think of ANY reason to object to voter ID or making it as difficult as possible in every other way to commit voter fraud other than WANTING there to be voter fraud.

Is one set of candidates so flawed they cannot possibly be elected if elections are honest, fair, and free of corruption and fraud?

Is one set of candidates so unelectable that we MUST beg, bribe, and frighten people into voting for them? Must go out and get them? Show them where to make their mark?

Do some of you honestly think that is the best way to choose our elected leaders?

Or maybe if we re-establish a system in which it will be almost all informed and concerned citizens who vote for our leaders, maybe we might be better off? Would that be such a terrible thing?

For the record I want people to vote who aren't adverse to inconveniencing themselves a bit to do so. I DON'T want people voting who don't have a clue why or for whom they are voting.

All bull. Please.....demonstrate cases of voter fraud that resulted from people not having picture ID at the polling station. Please.

The readiness with which you nutters BELIEVE anything you hear is fucking scary.

I already did earlier in the thread. In 2008 I was in line a few folks behind a woman who shrieked when she started to sign her name on the registry. Her husband had already signed in. With HIS name. Her husband had died 30 days before. If the polling place had required a photo ID, that is highly unlikely to have happened. It is THAT sort of thing that finally got our legislature to agree to Photo ID at the polling place. In 2010, we had far fewer complaints of any kind of irregularities.

Photo ID won't prevent all fraud but it will help along with other measures I have suggested. I would think honest citizens would be in favor of any and all methods to make our elections honest, fair, and as fraud free as possible.

 

[LoneLaugher]

For the life of me, I can't think of ANY reason to object to voter ID or making it as difficult as possible in every other way to commit voter fraud other than WANTING there to be voter fraud.

Is one set of candidates so flawed they cannot possibly be elected if elections are honest, fair, and free of corruption and fraud?

Is one set of candidates so unelectable that we MUST beg, bribe, and frighten people into voting for them? Must go out and get them? Show them where to make their mark?

Do some of you honestly think that is the best way to choose our elected leaders?

Or maybe if we re-establish a system in which it will be almost all informed and concerned citizens who vote for our leaders, maybe we might be better off? Would that be such a terrible thing?

For the record I want people to vote who aren't adverse to inconveniencing themselves a bit to do so. I DON'T want people voting who don't have a clue why or for whom they are voting.

All bull. Please.....demonstrate cases of voter fraud that resulted from people not having picture ID at the polling station. Please.

The readiness with which you nutters BELIEVE anything you hear is fucking scary.

I already did earlier in the thread. In 2008 I was in line a few folks behind a woman who shrieked when she started to sign her name on the registry. Her husband had already signed in. With HIS name. Her husband had died 30 days before. If the polling place had required a photo ID, that is highly unlikely to have happened. It is THAT sort of thing that finally got our legislature to agree to Photo ID at the polling place. In 2010, we had far fewer complaints of any kind of irregularities.

Photo ID won't prevent all fraud but it will help along with other measures I have suggested. I would think honest citizens would be in favor of any and all methods to make our elections honest, fair, and as fraud free as possible.

Was the first hand case of voter fraud that you witnessed ever investigated?

You said you had far fewer complaints in 2010. How many fewer? How many complaints were there in 2008 as opposed to 2010?

This is NOT a matter of honesty. It is a matter of SOME PEFRECTLY HONEST PEOPLE not being able to get their hands on the required documentation without having to PAY MONEY and/or having to be required to do things that they find inconvenient. It is about the REAL EFFECT that it has of supressing the vote of HONEST PEOPLE. Shit!!!!!

 

[Foxfyre]

All bull. Please.....demonstrate cases of voter fraud that resulted from people not having picture ID at the polling station. Please.

The readiness with which you nutters BELIEVE anything you hear is fucking scary.

I already did earlier in the thread. In 2008 I was in line a few folks behind a woman who shrieked when she started to sign her name on the registry. Her husband had already signed in. With HIS name. Her husband had died 30 days before. If the polling place had required a photo ID, that is highly unlikely to have happened. It is THAT sort of thing that finally got our legislature to agree to Photo ID at the polling place. In 2010, we had far fewer complaints of any kind of irregularities.

Photo ID won't prevent all fraud but it will help along with other measures I have suggested. I would think honest citizens would be in favor of any and all methods to make our elections honest, fair, and as fraud free as possible.

Was the first hand case of voter fraud that you witnessed ever investigated?

You said you had far fewer complaints in 2010. How many fewer? How many complaints were there in 2008 as opposed to 2010?

This is NOT a matter of honesty. It is a matter of SOME PEFRECTLY HONEST PEOPLE not being able to get their hands on the required documentation without having to PAY MONEY and/or having to be required to do things that they find inconvenient. It is about the REAL EFFECT that it has of supressing the vote of HONEST PEOPLE. Shit!!!!!

I am not in the business of investigating election fraud so my knowledge is limited to what I read in the newspaper or get on television re those incidents. But when both the newspaper and television report substantially fewer irregularities, I have to believe the Photo ID helped accomplish that. Those involved in New Mexico elections also reported that they gave Photo ID a lot of the credit.

Why are you so opposed to Photo ID and any and all measures that help to make elections more honest, fair, and free of fraud? Do you think your preferred candidates can't win if elections are honest, fair, and free of fraud?

 

[rightwinger]

When I become the Governor Of Florida in 2020, I will pass a law that will allow all Republicans the option to register one Palm Tree from their lawn to register to vote in all elections.

You would probably end up with better GOP candidates

 

[LoneLaugher]

I already did earlier in the thread. In 2008 I was in line a few folks behind a woman who shrieked when she started to sign her name on the registry. Her husband had already signed in. With HIS name. Her husband had died 30 days before. If the polling place had required a photo ID, that is highly unlikely to have happened. It is THAT sort of thing that finally got our legislature to agree to Photo ID at the polling place. In 2010, we had far fewer complaints of any kind of irregularities.

Photo ID won't prevent all fraud but it will help along with other measures I have suggested. I would think honest citizens would be in favor of any and all methods to make our elections honest, fair, and as fraud free as possible.

Was the first hand case of voter fraud that you witnessed ever investigated?

You said you had far fewer complaints in 2010. How many fewer? How many complaints were there in 2008 as opposed to 2010?

This is NOT a matter of honesty. It is a matter of SOME PEFRECTLY HONEST PEOPLE not being able to get their hands on the required documentation without having to PAY MONEY and/or having to be required to do things that they find inconvenient. It is about the REAL EFFECT that it has of supressing the vote of HONEST PEOPLE. Shit!!!!!

I am not in the business of investigating election fraud so my knowledge is limited to what I read in the newspaper or get on television re those incidents. But when both the newspaper and television report substantially fewer irregularities, I have to believe the Photo ID helped accomplish that. Those involved in New Mexico elections also reported that they gave Photo ID a lot of the credit.

Why are you so opposed to Photo ID and any and all measures that help to make elections more honest, fair, and free of fraud? Do you think your preferred candidates can't win if elections are honest, fair, and free of fraud?

Oh. You got nothing. Are you a person of great integrity and honsety?

 

[Care4all]

that's just partisan bs....uncensored!

Funny, I was thinking the same thing about opposition to the us of ID.

and naive and foolish.

I don't think so.

that's just like me saying republicans can only win by cheating via un-auditable electronic voting machines owned by republican companies or by stopping legal citizens from voting...

{(CBS/AP) The owner of a signature-gathering firm has been arrested on suspicion of voter registration fraud, authorities said Sunday.

Mark Anthony Jacoby, who owns the firm Young Political Majors, is accused of registering himself to vote twice - in 2006 and in 2007 - using the address of a childhood home in Los Angeles where he no longer lived.

The Secretary of State's Office said Jacoby used the address to meet a state requirement that signature-gatherers sign a declaration stating that they are either registered to vote in California or are eligible to do so.

State investigators and local police arrested Jacoby shortly before midnight Saturday near an Ontario hotel on a warrant issued by the Los Angeles District Attorney's Office earlier this month.

Jacoby faces four felony charges: two counts of voter registration fraud and two counts of perjury. Voter registration fraud carries a penalty of up to three years in prison.}

Signature-Gatherer Arrested In Voter Fraud - CBS News

Voter fraud as I've described is rampant.

ID is a simple, non-intrusive means of ending about 90% of it. There is no rational reason to oppose it.

that's just playing the game the politicians want us to play uncensored!!!

....be a leader instead of follower and start thinking things through for yourself!

I oppose election fraud, ID is a simple and effective means of curtailing much of it.

that is voter registration fraud, NOT VOTER FRAUD. there is a difference....

neither is acceptable, but voter registration fraud IS NOT the same as voter fraud.

and this person was caught, as I told you they were caught, by the State office that handles voter registration when the registration was vetted....

How would a picture id have stopped this? I know i keep asking you this, and you keep trying to give your examples of how, but they simply make no sense and are made up scenarios that just don't happen....there is a method to the madness.

and as far as foxfyre's example of the dead man, and someone voting in his spot...how did this person that stole this man's id know what party he belonged to, or that he was dead, and why didn't this person fear being at the poll voting the same time as this dead man's wife, mentioned in the obit if that's where he got the information from, and most importantly, when this old man died, why didn't his name get removed from the voter rolls?

stopping dead people from voting can easily be solved by removing those issued death certificates from the voting roll list.

HOW COME none of the politicians are asking for this to be done?

It is the simple solution to ending the fraudulent votes of dead people...instead they got you and me arguing over a pictured id which will stop nada....other than perhaps stopping citizens, from voting....

I am fine with the pictured id if they pay for the id and pay for the transportation for these people to get the id, if it is not near them and pay for the time they have to miss from work, if they lose pay over it....then there is not a proverbial "poll tax" in order to vote.

I differ with others that think it is good to make it harder for a citizen to vote.....I don't believe I should have the right to vote just because I am more educated on the candidates.....there are plenty of people here who think they are more knowledgeable than people like my mother in law, who would have found it difficult to get a photo id....but i can assure them that MOST of the people who do have id and do have a car that vote, are more than likely clueless as well... I don't think I get to decide nor should I decide who is a worthless citizen voter...that's just uppity elitism in my opinion.

 

[Foxfyre]

that's just partisan bs....uncensored!

Funny, I was thinking the same thing about opposition to the us of ID.



I don't think so.

{(CBS/AP) The owner of a signature-gathering firm has been arrested on suspicion of voter registration fraud, authorities said Sunday.

Mark Anthony Jacoby, who owns the firm Young Political Majors, is accused of registering himself to vote twice - in 2006 and in 2007 - using the address of a childhood home in Los Angeles where he no longer lived.

The Secretary of State's Office said Jacoby used the address to meet a state requirement that signature-gatherers sign a declaration stating that they are either registered to vote in California or are eligible to do so.

State investigators and local police arrested Jacoby shortly before midnight Saturday near an Ontario hotel on a warrant issued by the Los Angeles District Attorney's Office earlier this month.

Jacoby faces four felony charges: two counts of voter registration fraud and two counts of perjury. Voter registration fraud carries a penalty of up to three years in prison.}

Signature-Gatherer Arrested In Voter Fraud - CBS News

Voter fraud as I've described is rampant.

ID is a simple, non-intrusive means of ending about 90% of it. There is no rational reason to oppose it.

that's just playing the game the politicians want us to play uncensored!!!

....be a leader instead of follower and start thinking things through for yourself!

I oppose election fraud, ID is a simple and effective means of curtailing much of it.

that is voter registration fraud, NOT VOTER FRAUD. there is a difference....

neither is acceptable, but voter registration fraud IS NOT the same as voter fraud.

and this person was caught, as I told you they were caught, by the State office that handles voter registration when the registration was vetted....

How would a picture id have stopped this? I know i keep asking you this, and you keep trying to give your examples of how, but they simply make no sense and are made up scenarios that just don't happen....there is a method to the madness.

and as far as foxfyre's example of the dead man, and someone voting in his spot...how did this person that stole this man's id know what party he belonged to, or that he was dead, and why didn't this person fear being at the poll voting the same time as this dead man's wife, mentioned in the obit if that's where he got the information from, and most importantly, when this old man died, why didn't his name get removed from the voter rolls?

stopping dead people from voting can easily be solved by removing those issued death certificates from the voting roll list.

HOW COME none of the politicians are asking for this to be done?

It is the simple solution to ending the fraudulent votes of dead people...instead they got you and me arguing over a pictured id which will stop nada....other than perhaps stopping citizens, from voting....

I am fine with the pictured id if they pay for the id and pay for the transportation for these people to get the id, if it is not near them and pay for the time they have to miss from work, if they lose pay over it....then there is not a proverbial "poll tax" in order to vote.

I differ with others that think it is good to make it harder for a citizen to vote.....I don't believe I should have the right to vote just because I am more educated on the candidates.....there are plenty of people here who think they are more knowledgeable than people like my mother in law, who would have found it difficult to get a photo id....but i can assure them that MOST of the people who do have id and do have a car that vote, are more than likely clueless as well... I don't think I get to decide nor should I decide who is a worthless citizen voter...that's just uppity elitism in my opinion.

But in the thousands of cases of voter registration fraud attributed to ACORN and others, are you that confident that none of those fraudulent registrations were used to cast an illegal vote? Are you absolutely certain in your own mind that they caught every single one of those before election day? If so, what provides such confidence?

And why would it be difficult for your mother-in-law to get a photo ID when it is almost impossible to get into any secure public place without one any more?

 

[Teals_Of_Wonder]

This Just In From NBC News: President Obama has just signed into law the "Dead Democrats Voting Act". Beginning January 2012, All dead democrats are still eligible to vote. Joe Biden will figure out a way to get them to the polls on November 6th,2012.