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What happened to the Catholic Church's concept of Limbo? I think it has been removed or dispelled. What happened to the Church, never wrong? I think the term used 70-some years ago was the Church was built upon a rock. Not a fan for 70 or more years.Infants who die, die in Christ. They have not yet reached the age of accountability and are incapable of committing sin. They are pure in the eyes of God. Infant baptism is a false teaching and is completely unnecessary.
With all due respect, the Book of Mormon is not the Bible.From the Book of Mormon we have the following:
Moroni 8
CHAPTER 8
The baptism of little children is an evil abomination—Little children are alive in Christ because of the Atonement—Faith, repentance, meekness and lowliness of heart, receiving the Holy Ghost, and enduring to the end lead to salvation. About A.D. 401–21.
1 An epistle of my father Mormon, written to me, Moroni; and it was written unto me soon after my calling to the ministry. And on this wise did he write unto me, saying:
2 My beloved son, Moroni, I rejoice exceedingly that your Lord Jesus Christ hath been mindful of you, and hath called you to his ministry, and to his holy work.
3 I am mindful of you always in my prayers, continually praying unto God the Father in the name of his Holy Child, Jesus, that he, through his infinite goodness and grace, will keep you through the endurance of faith on his name to the end.
4 And now, my son, I speak unto you concerning that which grieveth me exceedingly; for it grieveth me that there should disputations rise among you.
5 For, if I have learned the truth, there have been disputations among you concerning the baptism of your little children.
6 And now, my son, I desire that ye should labor diligently, that this gross error should be removed from among you; for, for this intent I have written this epistle.
7 For immediately after I had learned these things of you I inquired of the Lord concerning the matter. And the word of the Lord came to me by the power of the Holy Ghost, saying:
8 Listen to the words of Christ, your Redeemer, your Lord and your God. Behold, I came into the world not to call the righteous but sinners to repentance; the whole need no physician, but they that are sick; wherefore, little children are whole, for they are not capable of committing sin; wherefore the curse of Adam is taken from them in me, that it hath no power over them; and the law of circumcision is done away in me.
9 And after this manner did the Holy Ghost manifest the word of God unto me; wherefore, my beloved son, I know that it is solemn mockery before God, that ye should baptize little children.
10 Behold I say unto you that this thing shall ye teach—repentance and baptism unto those who are accountable and capable of committing sin; yea, teach parents that they must repent and be baptized, and humble themselves as their little children, and they shall all be saved with their little children.
11 And their little children need no repentance, neither baptism. Behold, baptism is unto repentance to the fulfilling the commandments unto the remission of sins.
12 But little children are alive in Christ, even from the foundation of the world; if not so, God is a partial God, and also a changeable God, and a respecter to persons; for how many little children have died without baptism!
13 Wherefore, if little children could not be saved without baptism, these must have gone to an endless hell.
14 Behold I say unto you, that he that supposeth that little children need baptism is in the gall of bitterness and in the bonds of iniquity; for he hath neither faith, hope, nor charity; wherefore, should he be cut off while in the thought, he must go down to hell.
15 For awful is the wickedness to suppose that God saveth one child because of baptism, and the other must perish because he hath no baptism.
16 Wo be unto them that shall pervert the ways of the Lord after this manner, for they shall perish except they repent. Behold, I speak with boldness, having authority from God; and I fear not what man can do; for perfect clove casteth out all fear.
17 And I am filled with charity, which is everlasting love; wherefore, all children are alike unto me; wherefore, I love little children with a perfect love; and they are all alike and partakers of salvation.
18 For I know that God is not a partial God, neither a changeable being; but he is unchangeable from ball eternity to all eternity.
19 Little children cannot repent; wherefore, it is awful wickedness to deny the pure mercies of God unto them, for they are all alive in him because of his mercy.
20 And he that saith that little children need baptism denieth the mercies of Christ, and setteth at naught the atonement of him and the power of his redemption.
21 Wo unto such, for they are in danger of death, hell, and an endless torment. I speak it boldly; God hath commanded me. Listen unto them and give heed, or they stand against you at the judgment-seat of Christ.
22 For behold that all little children are alive in Christ, and also all they that are without the law. For the power of redemption cometh on all them that have no law; wherefore, he that is not condemned, or he that is under no condemnation, cannot repent; and unto such baptism availeth nothing—
23 But it is mockery before God, denying the mercies of Christ, and the power of his Holy Spirit, and putting trust in dead works.
24 Behold, my son, this thing ought not to be; for repentance is unto them that are under condemnation and under the curse of a broken law.
25 And the first fruits of repentance is baptism; and baptism cometh by faith unto the fulfilling the commandments; and the fulfilling the commandments bringeth remission of sins;
26 And the remission of sins bringeth meekness, and lowliness of heart; and because of meekness and lowliness of heart cometh the visitation of the Holy Ghost, which Comforter filleth with hope and perfect love, which love endureth by diligence unto prayer, until the end shall come, when all the saints shall dwell with God.
27 Behold, my son, I will write unto you again if I go not out soon against the Lamanites. Behold, the pride of this nation, or the people of the Nephites, hath proven their destruction except they should repent.
28 Pray for them, my son, that repentance may come unto them. But behold, I fear lest the Spirit hath ceased striving with them; and in this part of the land they are also seeking to put down all power and authority which cometh from God; and they are denying the Holy Ghost.
29 And after rejecting so great a knowledge, my son, they must perish soon, unto the fulfilling of the prophecies which were spoken by the prophets, as well as the words of our Savior himself.
30 Farewell, my son, until I shall write unto you, or shall meet you again. Amen.
Thank you for your respect. On the cover, it says "the Book of Mormon, Another Testament of Jesus Christ." Jesus Says in Matt. 18:16, "But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every work may be established." As a Christian, you would agree that the Bible is the "Word" of God, correct? Words come out of the mouth. When we read scripture the Word of God is spoken, is it not? The Bible is one witness. To clarify and support the Bible, a 2nd witness should be welcomed according to Jesus, correct? Why then the contempt of another testament of Jesus Christ which would fulfill this law Jesus gave? Why the gymnastics to try and defame this book that had been sealed for centuries and unearthed and translated by an unlearned man? Isaiah chapter 29. Ezekiel said in chapter37 that a second book of scriptures would be given to bind with the first book and be one testament of the Lord in our hands. We know the Book of Judah is the Bible and thus we believe it is the Word of God as it is translated correctly. The first prophet and head of a family that came to the Americas from Jerusalem, Lehi, is of the tribe of Joseph. The Book of Joseph is the second witness and testament of Jesus Christ. The Book of Mormon has more teachings to believe and have faith in Jesus Christ and His atoning sacrifice than the New Testament.With all due respect, the Book of Mormon is not the Bible.
.Francis vs. Pope Pius XII: The Fate of Aborted Infants
I'm still reading through this but thought I'd share since a poster here brought up the issue of what happens to unbaptized infants, which would include of course the aborted ones
The Book of Mormon is the Bible with a twist.Thank you for your respect. On the cover, it says "the Book of Mormon, Another Testament of Jesus Christ." Jesus Says in Matt. 18:16, "But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every work may be established." As a Christian, you would agree that the Bible is the "Word" of God, correct? Words come out of the mouth. When we read scripture the Word of God is spoken, is it not? The Bible is one witness. To clarify and support the Bible, a 2nd witness should be welcomed according to Jesus, correct? Why then the contempt of another testament of Jesus Christ which would fulfill this law Jesus gave? Why the gymnastics to try and defame this book that had been sealed for centuries and unearthed and translated by an unlearned man? Isaiah chapter 29. Ezekiel said in chapter37 that a second book of scriptures would be given to bind with the first book and be one testament of the Lord in our hands. We know the Book of Judah is the Bible and thus we believe it is the Word of God as it is translated correctly. The first prophet and head of a family that came to the Americas from Jerusalem, Lehi, is of the tribe of Joseph. The Book of Joseph is the second witness and testament of Jesus Christ. The Book of Mormon has more teachings to believe and have faith in Jesus Christ and His atoning sacrifice than the New Testament.
So, what is baptism for? In the New Testament, it's stated clearly as well as in the Book of Mormon that baptism is for the remission of sins. Not someone else's sins. Your sins. Individual's sins. So, how could an infant, let alone an unborn infant commit a sin? Sin requires knowledge and understanding of the wrong the individual is committing. Not only that, but the consequences of the wrongdoing as well. God gave us a brain that is supposed to be able to reason logically and cognitively. It's impossible for an infant to sin. And, none of us are responsible for Adam and Eve's sin. We are responsible for our own sins and must repent to be forgiven. An infant cannot possibly do that. Please reason logically. With that said, there is nothing in Moroni chapter 8 that is incorrect. And, this supports the Bible as well.
Yes. I was in Catholic school at the time Limbo was being addressed, and were were given the history and summaries of arguments clear back to Augustine. The conclusion: Scripture doesn't address the issue. Apostolic tradition does not address the issue. Therefore the Church was in the state of limbo as regards to this issue; therefore the fate of the babies was also in limbo. Before long, in the minds of people, Limbo was considered to be an actual place, not our condition of not having the answer. Vatican II tried to correct the idea of Limbo being a place. That's my memory of the lesson.Popes don't have the answer, God does, and he hasn't called.
How does the Book of Mormon move it? It supports Jesus is the Christ. As I wrote clearly, the Bible supports the need of another witness and another book. If the Bible can't be moved (whatever that means) then you are moving it by the very law of two or more witnesses and the need for the second book. The Book that is sealed and was brought forward by an unlearned man. What support in and with the Bible to you have? None.The Book of Mormon is the Bible with a twist.
That is the beginning and the end with me.
The Bible is truth, which can't be moved.
The Book of Mormon moves it, hence, the twist.
Is Jesus, God? Does the Book of Mormon believe in the Trinity?How does the Book of Mormon move it? It supports Jesus is the Christ. As I wrote clearly, the Bible supports the need of another witness and another book. If the Bible can't be moved (whatever that means) then you are moving it by the very law of two or more witnesses and the need for the second book. The Book that is sealed and was brought forward by an unlearned man. What support in and with the Bible to you have? None.
Is there a God? Does the Bible believe in the Trinity? Did Jesus actually visit israel? See, I can write stupid things too!Is Jesus, God? Does the Book of Mormon believe in the Trinity?
Did Jesus actually visit the America's.
Believe what you want, I'm not posting to change your mind, but don't try and sell me that
the book of Mormon is the Bible. Not buying that for a nano second.
Is there a God? Does the Bible believe in the Trinity? Did Jesus actually visit israel? See, I can write stupid things too!
You have had a difficult time reading in the past. Do you need cataract surgery? See, I never said the Book of Mormon is the Bible. Did I? "How does the Book of Mormon move it? It supports Jesus is the Christ. As I wrote clearly, the Bible supports the need of another witness and another book. If the Bible can't be moved (whatever that means) then you are moving it by the very law of two or more witnesses and the need for the second book. The Book that is sealed and was brought forward by an unlearned man. What support in and with the Bible to you have? None." So, where in this did I say The Book of Mormon is the Bible? No where. I said it is a second witness to the divinity of Jesus Christ. The Bible demands two or more witnesses of this. The Book of Mormon also teaches that we are Baptized in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost. The Trinity. You have yet disproved the Book of Mormon as another testament of Jesus Christ. A second witness.
What am I doing? Other than speaking truth
You have a real good day, and find your next mark, m'kay?
God sends them back to earth as MAGA supporters.Francis vs. Pope Pius XII: The Fate of Aborted Infants
I'm still reading through this but thought I'd share since a poster here brought up the issue of what happens to unbaptized infants, which would include of course the aborted ones
.God sends them back to earth as MAGA supporters.
they have original sin on their souls... Thats why I think they go to Purgatory, but probably only God knows... I'm not sure the CC ever claimed to really knowInfants who die, die in Christ. They have not yet reached the age of accountability and are incapable of committing sin. They are pure in the eyes of God. Infant baptism is a false teaching and is completely unnecessary.
,they have original sin on their souls... Thats why I think they go to Purgatory, but probably only God knows... I'm not sure the CC ever claimed to really know
they have original sin on their souls like all humans do. But God knows what to do with them so i'm not worried, never really was but someone said St Augustine taught they go to Hell!.
Depends on how many sins those infants, murdered in the womb or born alive, ever committed.
I guess.
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