Well said Ron Huldai...

[Shusha]

I think we all know what the reason is for Israel refusing to 'free' Gaza... Security... My problem is that this 'reason', I'm avoiding using the word 'excuse' here...

Security is a very GOOD reason, in fact the ONLY reason, for a nation to take military action against another entity (in this case, not quite a nation, though it has fulfilled all the requirements to be one, imo). Why do you call it an "excuse"? You do realize that Israeli citizens are, in reality, being threatened by the belligerent acts committed by Hamas, do you not?

Unfortunately, I can't agree that there is unilateral control within their own state...

Yes, sorry, I don't agree... Israel still controls land, air and seas of Gaza... Israel Has done a pretty good job of "bombing the shit out of them" over the years... Israel regularly has military incursions into Gaza... Israel regularly fires across border into Gaza...

You have yet to digest the difference between internal control and control over borders shared with another nation. Israel controls nothing internally. You've fallen back into the old, common talking points instead of thinking this through and responding in a more detailed and objective fashion.

Israel has been exceedingly restrained in its military action against Hamas. Israel does make military incursions into Gaza, as a response high levels of belligerency, such as increased rockets or tunnel activity. And yes, Israel does fire across the border, in response to belligerent actions by Hamas. See the common theme here? Hamas acts with belligerency, threatening the security of Israel's citizens and sovereignty. Israel responds. Cause and effect.

I have never said that Israel doesn't need to defend itself... I am simply stating that having an allied force in Gaza not only monitoring but also being able to 'defend' Israel would make 'press releases' for more favorable for Israel.

My point being that by removing rights and agency from Israel, uniquely of all the world's nations, you are actually undermining Israel rather than supporting Israel. You are creating a sense of justification for why Israel is not capable of holding all of the normal rights of other nations. I suggest that rather than do so, you support Israel's right to her own agency and to defend herself. And not require others to do it for her.

Cessation of hostilities would be a very good first step but I really do not see that happening...

Nor do I. Why? Because Hamas and the people of Gaza who support the ideology which Hamas built itself on, are not invested in their own future and the viability of an independent and prosperous nation. They are still rabidly focused on Israel's destruction. There will be no end to the conflict as long as the people of Gaza hold this ideology. There CAN be no end to the conflict while one party wishes the destruction of the other.

 

[Phoenall]

Nor do I deny it. While it does not meet the legal standard of an "occupation", Israel does lay a heavy hand over the BORDERS (land and sea) it shares with Gaza. Why does Israel do this? What purpose does it serve? What conditions would end this?

I think we all know what the reason is for Israel refusing to 'free' Gaza... Security... My problem is that this 'reason', I'm avoiding using the word 'excuse' here, is that one rarely sees, if ever, a mighty force, armed to the teeth being 'afraid' of a 'non army'...

Firstly, I think the argument that Gaza meets all the requirements for Statehood is strong. I agree they should have unilateral control within their own State. Fortunately, they have already do. What they do not have is good relations with their neighbors. How can that be rectified, do you think?

Unfortunately, I can't agree that there is unilateral control within their own state... Israel is free to carry out incursions into Gaza at ANY time, and they do... Unilateral control within their own state would HAVE to include air and sea, which as you state later in your post, they do not have...

Um. No. There is complete freedom within Gaza. Witness their ability to take 800 million tons of concrete, and counting (much funded by foreign aide specifically for humanitarian projects) and co-opt it for belligerent uses.

The use of materials, or rather, the misuse of materials would not happen under the terms of what I am proposing.

But again, don't you find it conceptually problematic that a sovereign nation which is being attacked regularly is perceived as not "needing" to defend itself?

I have never said that Israel doesn't need to defend itself... I am simply stating that having an allied force in Gaza not only monitoring but also being able to 'defend' Israel would make 'press releases' for more favorable for Israel.

I think you misunderstand. Much of the world is uneducated about Israel. The perception is largely based on demonization of Israel, double standards, ridiculous expectations, and frankly, is rooted, at least partially, in anti-semitism. (We can discuss that reasonably can't we? You and I?)

There is a lot of misunderstanding of Israel... You cannot get a true understanding of Israel unless you visit Israel... You can't say that about too many countries... And even then, it is difficult to quantify, in words, how best to describe israel... Yes I have been to Israel... I found the country enjoyable and pretty chilled out... That doesn't show the underlying 'tension' that is around some of the major cities...

If this is true, why are you requiring Israel to NOT defend itself and let someone else do it on her behalf?

I have answered this one on a number of occasions now....

Yes. I do see that. Many others do as well. Many perceive Israel as being a special case because they reject the idea that Israel has the SAME rights as others. What I am wishing you would do is articulate WHY you think Israel is a special case.

Israel is a 'special case', being the homeland for Jews... I may not agree with 'religious states' but if there is a need, a desire, then go for it...

Here we disagree. Israel has exhibited her good intentions by unilaterally disengaging, by thoughtfully creating a Judenrein space for Gazans, by not bombing the shit out of them (and she surely could!), by not reasserting its military strength, by not ousting their government (and she surely could!). Further, she has contributed to Gaza's well-being by providing medical care for Gaza's citizens, by exceeding the required provisions of necessities, especially water, by being flexible with restricted "dual use" materials as the situation warrants, by allowing foreign aide (even though that aide is usurped for belligerent causes).

Yes, sorry, I don't agree... Israel still controls land, air and seas of Gaza... Israel Has done a pretty good job of "bombing the shit out of them" over the years... Israel regularly has military incursions into Gaza... Israel regularly fires across border into Gaza...

Yes, why has Israel never attempted to oust Hamas?

The trouble I am having with your responses, thus far on this thread, as much as I truly appreciate your ability to discuss this objectively and rationally, is your utter lack of assignation of responsibility to Gaza and her government. And your inability to demand that IF Gaza wants peace and trade and Statehood that the VERY FIRST STEP must be a cessation of the hostilities, followed nearly immediately by a true effort to build the infrastructure necessary for a viable nation.

Firstly, I do not support the government of Gaza! Let me make that one very clear! I would suggest that it is VERY difficult for average Gazans to promote 'change' within Gaza under a dictatorial government.

The VERY FIRST STEP is to bring both parties together and agree on an allied force being placed in Gaza... It's very difficult to get one side OR the other to make the FIRST move so, leave the status quo, as has been suggested by one or two people on this board, and get the agreement for an allied force in place...

Cessation of hostilities would be a very good first step but I really do not see that happening... A shame but, it won't happen...

Neither Gaza nor Israel would be willing to make the FIRST concession...

And once again you only put over the islamonazi version of things, and refuse to blame the Palestinians for their failings.

 

[Phoenall]

Subhumanity still can't tell us who was ruling these lands that is now "occupying". Amazing.

I don't need to roodboy...

It is not relevant

That is not what you said, so why change the rules half way through. You said the enforcement of the treaty was to be by International force and not by a deal between Israel and hamas. It was to be an unnegotiated unilateral move by Israel. Cant you read your own posts ?

Oh I'm sorry Phoney...

Sorry that your bigoted, racist hatred mind is incapable of even basic thought...

Please do go and read my posts, and the intelligent posts of others, once you have grasped even the most basic of comprehension of this thread, then please do come back, when you feel ready, and comment...

Until such time, take your blind zionut, neo marxist racism somewhere else, there's a good chap!

Don't you love it, the little jihadi thinks he's smarter than everybody else.

A country mile smarter than you roodboy!

You can't answer because you can't face the truth that the oft repeated "occupation" is a hoax as is the concept of a Palestine or Palestinian people. The land was never controled or ruled by these Arabs who now call themselves "Palestinians".

The question has NO bearing on this thread roodboy...

You are off topic!

It has everything to do with the remit of this board as it shows the Palestinians are living a LIE, and you have bought into that LIE so you can attack the Jews openly. When did the arab muslims get legal sovereignty of the land, and who granted it to them ?

 

[Phoenall]

Subhumanity still can't tell us who was ruling these lands that is now "occupying". Amazing.

I don't need to roodboy...

It is not relevant

That is not what you said, so why change the rules half way through. You said the enforcement of the treaty was to be by International force and not by a deal between Israel and hamas. It was to be an unnegotiated unilateral move by Israel. Cant you read your own posts ?

Oh I'm sorry Phoney...

Sorry that your bigoted, racist hatred mind is incapable of even basic thought...

Please do go and read my posts, and the intelligent posts of others, once you have grasped even the most basic of comprehension of this thread, then please do come back, when you feel ready, and comment...

Until such time, take your blind zionut, neo marxist racism somewhere else, there's a good chap!

Don't you love it, the little jihadi thinks he's smarter than everybody else.

A country mile smarter than you roodboy!

That smart you act like an 8 year old spoilt brat who cant get their own way. Expect zionut, hasbara and a whole host of other racist terms to be bandied around

Oh dear, it's like an funny double act...

roodboy and phoney....

View attachment 78579

And once again you show you have no answering posts because there is no evidence to support your many racist claims.

 

[Phoenall]

Subhumanity still can't tell us who was ruling these lands that is now "occupying". Amazing.

I don't need to roodboy...

It is not relevant

Don't you love it, the little jihadi thinks he's smarter than everybody else.

A country mile smarter than you roodboy!

You can't answer because you can't face the truth that the oft repeated "occupation" is a hoax as is the concept of a Palestine or Palestinian people. The land was never controled or ruled by these Arabs who now call themselves "Palestinians".

The question has NO bearing on this thread roodboy...

You are off topic!

If it has no bearing then why did you bring up and refer to "the occupation".

These Arabs who now call themselves Palestinians never ruled or controled the land, and are now trying to construct solution to a problem that was caused by the aggression of other Arabs towards the Jews. The truth you can't face is the so called Palestinians aren't deserving of any inherent rights. In fact it can be argued that they aren't deserving of ANYTHING... just refugees of failed wars initiated by fellow Arabs.

I didn't!

Did you even bother to read what this thread is about???

No, unlikely... Just prefer to keep up with your dumbass zionut mantra as usual rather than debating the topic...

Tel Aviv mayor says the occupation is a cause of Palestinian terror

And that is just his personal opinion for which there is no evidence. To the contrary the vast majority of the evidence shows that it is a religious issue of the arab muslims that is the cause of the Palestinian terrorist attacks.

 

[Humanity]

Subhumanity still can't tell us who was ruling these lands that is now "occupying". Amazing.

I don't need to roodboy...

It is not relevant

Oh I'm sorry Phoney...

Sorry that your bigoted, racist hatred mind is incapable of even basic thought...

Please do go and read my posts, and the intelligent posts of others, once you have grasped even the most basic of comprehension of this thread, then please do come back, when you feel ready, and comment...

Until such time, take your blind zionut, neo marxist racism somewhere else, there's a good chap!

Don't you love it, the little jihadi thinks he's smarter than everybody else.

A country mile smarter than you roodboy!

You can't answer because you can't face the truth that the oft repeated "occupation" is a hoax as is the concept of a Palestine or Palestinian people. The land was never controled or ruled by these Arabs who now call themselves "Palestinians".

The question has NO bearing on this thread roodboy...

You are off topic!

It has everything to do with the remit of this board as it shows the Palestinians are living a LIE, and you have bought into that LIE so you can attack the Jews openly. When did the arab muslims get legal sovereignty of the land, and who granted it to them ?

Yet has nothing to do with this thread... Which makes these comments by you and roodboy OFF TOPIC!

Are you guys seeing each other? You know, planning to attend the next parade in Tel Aviv TOGETHER?

You both post off topic/no content crap like a comedy tag team...

Just asking....

 

[Humanity]

Oh.... Shusha

I will get round to replying tomorrow.. Promise

 

[Roudy]

Subhumanity still can't tell us who was ruling these lands that is now "occupying". Amazing.

I don't need to roodboy...

It is not relevant

Don't you love it, the little jihadi thinks he's smarter than everybody else.

A country mile smarter than you roodboy!

You can't answer because you can't face the truth that the oft repeated "occupation" is a hoax as is the concept of a Palestine or Palestinian people. The land was never controled or ruled by these Arabs who now call themselves "Palestinians".

The question has NO bearing on this thread roodboy...

You are off topic!

It has everything to do with the remit of this board as it shows the Palestinians are living a LIE, and you have bought into that LIE so you can attack the Jews openly. When did the arab muslims get legal sovereignty of the land, and who granted it to them ?

Yet has nothing to do with this thread... Which makes these comments by you and roodboy OFF TOPIC!

Are you guys seeing each other? You know, planning to attend the next parade in Tel Aviv TOGETHER?

You both post off topic/no content crap like a comedy tag team...

Just asking....

View attachment 78608

What are you, an efffing homophobic mod now? Ha ha ha.

You can't even keep up with your own bullshit. You're the one who gave us a long speech about Israel supposedly "occupying", here is your post: Well said Ron Huldai...

So if Israel is occupying this land, who were the people who ruled or controled this land before said occupation? You can't answer because it exposes the hoax you are perpetuating.

Subhumanity:

"I believe that, as Israel is classified as an 'occupier' by most of the world, any attack against those are 'occupied' is seen as simply wrong...

Occupier and attacker combined is not a good combination...

Now, you can argue that Israel does not occupy Gaza, you can argue that attacks against Israel are 'freedom fighters'.... But factually or conceptually, if you like, it remains that Israel does control air, land and sea of Gaza and attacks are carried out against Israel under the 'premise' of this fact..."

******That was soooo deep, man. More IslamoNazi talking points please.

 

[Phoenall]

Subhumanity still can't tell us who was ruling these lands that is now "occupying". Amazing.

I don't need to roodboy...

It is not relevant

Don't you love it, the little jihadi thinks he's smarter than everybody else.

A country mile smarter than you roodboy!

You can't answer because you can't face the truth that the oft repeated "occupation" is a hoax as is the concept of a Palestine or Palestinian people. The land was never controled or ruled by these Arabs who now call themselves "Palestinians".

The question has NO bearing on this thread roodboy...

You are off topic!

It has everything to do with the remit of this board as it shows the Palestinians are living a LIE, and you have bought into that LIE so you can attack the Jews openly. When did the arab muslims get legal sovereignty of the land, and who granted it to them ?

Yet has nothing to do with this thread... Which makes these comments by you and roodboy OFF TOPIC!

Are you guys seeing each other? You know, planning to attend the next parade in Tel Aviv TOGETHER?

You both post off topic/no content crap like a comedy tag team...

Just asking....

View attachment 78608

Projecting again as that is you and monte, why do you try and derail your own posts when they are proven to be wrong ?

 

[Phoenall]

Oh.... Shusha

I will get round to replying tomorrow.. Promise

In other words I hope you will have forgotten this by tomorrow so I can ignore it

 

[Humanity]

Oh.... Shusha

I will get round to replying tomorrow.. Promise

In other words I hope you will have forgotten this by tomorrow so I can ignore it

Wow, great, looks like I picked up my very own stalker

 

[Phoenall]

Oh.... Shusha

I will get round to replying tomorrow.. Promise

In other words I hope you will have forgotten this by tomorrow so I can ignore it

Wow, great, looks like I picked up my very own stalker

Hardly as it is already tomorrow and still no reply, guess you are being true to form again

 

[Challenger]

Challenger, et al,

It does not matter what they want to target, who controls what, or the reason, IT IS ILLEGAL under Security Council decisions.

Actually that's a fair point, if the Zionists do not control Gaza,as they claim, the Gazans should be able to purchase arms and equipment openly for self defence such as AA missiles or guidance equipment so they can actually target military sites without threatening civilians and import them likewise, it all depends on who wants to sell them the weapons.

(OBSERVATIONS)

Decides also that all States shall: (a) Refrain from providing any form of support, active or passive, to entities or persons involved in terrorist acts, including by suppressing recruitment of members of terrorist groups and eliminating the supply of weapons to terrorists;
Source: S/RES/1373

Reaffirms its decision that States shall eliminate the supply of weapons, including small arms and light weapons (SALW), to terrorists, as well as its calls for States to find ways of intensifying and accelerating the exchange of operational information regarding traffic in arms, and to enhance coordination of efforts on national, subregional, regional and international levels;
SOURCE: S/RES/2117 (2013)

General Court case: Hamas
In September 2010, Hamas brought its case before the General Court, challenging its continued presence on the EU terrorist list. In December 2014, the General Court annulled on procedural grounds the Council's decision to maintain Hamas on this list.
HOWEVER:
As of L 334/20 EN Official Journal of the European Union 22.12.2015 (updated accordingly and Decision (CFSP) 2015/1334), Annex of - GROUPS AND ENTITIES the LIST OF PERSONS, GROUPS AND ENTITIES REFERRED TO IN ARTICLE 1

• ‘Hamas’, including ‘Hamas-Izz al-Din al-Qassem’
17. ‘Palestinian Islamic Jihad’ — ‘PIJ’.
18. ‘Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine’ — ‘PFLP’.
19. ‘Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine — General Command’ (a.k.a. ‘PFLP — General Command’).

(COMMENT)

HAMAS, as well as several other affiliated and associate activities and entities, are designed as terrorist.

You cannot supply SALW (or any weapons for that matter) to the Gaza Strip.

A review of HAMAS Policy is that reveals that: "Jihad and armed resistance is the correct and authentic means for the liberation of Palestine and the restoration of all rights" is a open Policy of HAMAS. This liberation objective extends beyond the sovereignty over the territory occupied since 1967; a veiled by direct threat to the sovereign integrity to Israel. A policy, which has become an international and regional threat to Peace.

Most Respectfully,
R

The UN does not designate HAMAS as a terrorist organisation, and HAMAS remains on the EU list pending the result of the appeal. Right now, state and non-state actors can do whatever they please as regards supplying weapons to Gaza and/or Palestine.

 

[RoccoR]

Challenger, et al,

Of course the UN does not designate anyone, as a terrorist. They cannot define the term. It is still in the hands of the domestic enforcers.

Challenger, et al,

It does not matter what they want to target, who controls what, or the reason, IT IS ILLEGAL under Security Council decisions.

Actually that's a fair point, if the Zionists do not control Gaza,as they claim, the Gazans should be able to purchase arms and equipment openly for self defence such as AA missiles or guidance equipment so they can actually target military sites without threatening civilians and import them likewise, it all depends on who wants to sell them the weapons.

(OBSERVATIONS)

Decides also that all States shall: (a) Refrain from providing any form of support, active or passive, to entities or persons involved in terrorist acts, including by suppressing recruitment of members of terrorist groups and eliminating the supply of weapons to terrorists;
Source: S/RES/1373

Reaffirms its decision that States shall eliminate the supply of weapons, including small arms and light weapons (SALW), to terrorists, as well as its calls for States to find ways of intensifying and accelerating the exchange of operational information regarding traffic in arms, and to enhance coordination of efforts on national, subregional, regional and international levels;
SOURCE: S/RES/2117 (2013)

General Court case: Hamas
In September 2010, Hamas brought its case before the General Court, challenging its continued presence on the EU terrorist list. In December 2014, the General Court annulled on procedural grounds the Council's decision to maintain Hamas on this list.
HOWEVER:
As of L 334/20 EN Official Journal of the European Union 22.12.2015 (updated accordingly and Decision (CFSP) 2015/1334), Annex of - GROUPS AND ENTITIES the LIST OF PERSONS, GROUPS AND ENTITIES REFERRED TO IN ARTICLE 1

• ‘Hamas’, including ‘Hamas-Izz al-Din al-Qassem’
17. ‘Palestinian Islamic Jihad’ — ‘PIJ’.
18. ‘Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine’ — ‘PFLP’.
19. ‘Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine — General Command’ (a.k.a. ‘PFLP — General Command’).

(COMMENT)

HAMAS, as well as several other affiliated and associate activities and entities, are designed as terrorist.

You cannot supply SALW (or any weapons for that matter) to the Gaza Strip.

A review of HAMAS Policy is that reveals that: "Jihad and armed resistance is the correct and authentic means for the liberation of Palestine and the restoration of all rights" is a open Policy of HAMAS. This liberation objective extends beyond the sovereignty over the territory occupied since 1967; a veiled by direct threat to the sovereign integrity to Israel. A policy, which has become an international and regional threat to Peace.

Most Respectfully,
R

The UN does not designate HAMAS as a terrorist organisation, and HAMAS remains on the EU list pending the result of the appeal. Right now, state and non-state actors can do whatever they please as regards supplying weapons to Gaza and/or Palestine.

(COMMENT)

This is just not well thought out. There will be very few players that want illicit arms trafficking in that region of the world. While it is a lucrative business there are risks and consequences to shipping more weapons destine for Islamic Radicals and Jihadist in a region already in conflict with more irrational muslims than they know what to do with.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Phoenall]

Challenger, et al,

It does not matter what they want to target, who controls what, or the reason, IT IS ILLEGAL under Security Council decisions.

Actually that's a fair point, if the Zionists do not control Gaza,as they claim, the Gazans should be able to purchase arms and equipment openly for self defence such as AA missiles or guidance equipment so they can actually target military sites without threatening civilians and import them likewise, it all depends on who wants to sell them the weapons.

(OBSERVATIONS)

Decides also that all States shall: (a) Refrain from providing any form of support, active or passive, to entities or persons involved in terrorist acts, including by suppressing recruitment of members of terrorist groups and eliminating the supply of weapons to terrorists;
Source: S/RES/1373

Reaffirms its decision that States shall eliminate the supply of weapons, including small arms and light weapons (SALW), to terrorists, as well as its calls for States to find ways of intensifying and accelerating the exchange of operational information regarding traffic in arms, and to enhance coordination of efforts on national, subregional, regional and international levels;
SOURCE: S/RES/2117 (2013)

General Court case: Hamas
In September 2010, Hamas brought its case before the General Court, challenging its continued presence on the EU terrorist list. In December 2014, the General Court annulled on procedural grounds the Council's decision to maintain Hamas on this list.
HOWEVER:
As of L 334/20 EN Official Journal of the European Union 22.12.2015 (updated accordingly and Decision (CFSP) 2015/1334), Annex of - GROUPS AND ENTITIES the LIST OF PERSONS, GROUPS AND ENTITIES REFERRED TO IN ARTICLE 1

• ‘Hamas’, including ‘Hamas-Izz al-Din al-Qassem’
17. ‘Palestinian Islamic Jihad’ — ‘PIJ’.
18. ‘Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine’ — ‘PFLP’.
19. ‘Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine — General Command’ (a.k.a. ‘PFLP — General Command’).

(COMMENT)

HAMAS, as well as several other affiliated and associate activities and entities, are designed as terrorist.

You cannot supply SALW (or any weapons for that matter) to the Gaza Strip.

A review of HAMAS Policy is that reveals that: "Jihad and armed resistance is the correct and authentic means for the liberation of Palestine and the restoration of all rights" is a open Policy of HAMAS. This liberation objective extends beyond the sovereignty over the territory occupied since 1967; a veiled by direct threat to the sovereign integrity to Israel. A policy, which has become an international and regional threat to Peace.

Most Respectfully,
R

The UN does not designate HAMAS as a terrorist organisation, and HAMAS remains on the EU list pending the result of the appeal. Right now, state and non-state actors can do whatever they please as regards supplying weapons to Gaza and/or Palestine.

Wrong again ratboy as the EU has put hamas back on the list of terrorist organisations, don't you read the posts on here that show this. Or do you just look at ones you can hijack with your Jew hatred and deflect away from the truth

 

[P F Tinmore]

Challenger, et al,

It does not matter what they want to target, who controls what, or the reason, IT IS ILLEGAL under Security Council decisions.

Actually that's a fair point, if the Zionists do not control Gaza,as they claim, the Gazans should be able to purchase arms and equipment openly for self defence such as AA missiles or guidance equipment so they can actually target military sites without threatening civilians and import them likewise, it all depends on who wants to sell them the weapons.

(OBSERVATIONS)

Decides also that all States shall: (a) Refrain from providing any form of support, active or passive, to entities or persons involved in terrorist acts, including by suppressing recruitment of members of terrorist groups and eliminating the supply of weapons to terrorists;
Source: S/RES/1373

Reaffirms its decision that States shall eliminate the supply of weapons, including small arms and light weapons (SALW), to terrorists, as well as its calls for States to find ways of intensifying and accelerating the exchange of operational information regarding traffic in arms, and to enhance coordination of efforts on national, subregional, regional and international levels;
SOURCE: S/RES/2117 (2013)

General Court case: Hamas
In September 2010, Hamas brought its case before the General Court, challenging its continued presence on the EU terrorist list. In December 2014, the General Court annulled on procedural grounds the Council's decision to maintain Hamas on this list.
HOWEVER:
As of L 334/20 EN Official Journal of the European Union 22.12.2015 (updated accordingly and Decision (CFSP) 2015/1334), Annex of - GROUPS AND ENTITIES the LIST OF PERSONS, GROUPS AND ENTITIES REFERRED TO IN ARTICLE 1

• ‘Hamas’, including ‘Hamas-Izz al-Din al-Qassem’
17. ‘Palestinian Islamic Jihad’ — ‘PIJ’.
18. ‘Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine’ — ‘PFLP’.
19. ‘Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine — General Command’ (a.k.a. ‘PFLP — General Command’).

(COMMENT)

HAMAS, as well as several other affiliated and associate activities and entities, are designed as terrorist.

You cannot supply SALW (or any weapons for that matter) to the Gaza Strip.

A review of HAMAS Policy is that reveals that: "Jihad and armed resistance is the correct and authentic means for the liberation of Palestine and the restoration of all rights" is a open Policy of HAMAS. This liberation objective extends beyond the sovereignty over the territory occupied since 1967; a veiled by direct threat to the sovereign integrity to Israel. A policy, which has become an international and regional threat to Peace.

Most Respectfully,
R

The UN does not designate HAMAS as a terrorist organisation, and HAMAS remains on the EU list pending the result of the appeal. Right now, state and non-state actors can do whatever they please as regards supplying weapons to Gaza and/or Palestine.

Wrong again ratboy as the EU has put hamas back on the list of terrorist organisations, don't you read the posts on here that show this. Or do you just look at ones you can hijack with your Jew hatred and deflect away from the truth

Did they use the same bogus information they used the first time?

 

[Hollie]

Challenger, et al,

It does not matter what they want to target, who controls what, or the reason, IT IS ILLEGAL under Security Council decisions.

Actually that's a fair point, if the Zionists do not control Gaza,as they claim, the Gazans should be able to purchase arms and equipment openly for self defence such as AA missiles or guidance equipment so they can actually target military sites without threatening civilians and import them likewise, it all depends on who wants to sell them the weapons.

(OBSERVATIONS)

Decides also that all States shall: (a) Refrain from providing any form of support, active or passive, to entities or persons involved in terrorist acts, including by suppressing recruitment of members of terrorist groups and eliminating the supply of weapons to terrorists;
Source: S/RES/1373

Reaffirms its decision that States shall eliminate the supply of weapons, including small arms and light weapons (SALW), to terrorists, as well as its calls for States to find ways of intensifying and accelerating the exchange of operational information regarding traffic in arms, and to enhance coordination of efforts on national, subregional, regional and international levels;
SOURCE: S/RES/2117 (2013)

General Court case: Hamas
In September 2010, Hamas brought its case before the General Court, challenging its continued presence on the EU terrorist list. In December 2014, the General Court annulled on procedural grounds the Council's decision to maintain Hamas on this list.
HOWEVER:
As of L 334/20 EN Official Journal of the European Union 22.12.2015 (updated accordingly and Decision (CFSP) 2015/1334), Annex of - GROUPS AND ENTITIES the LIST OF PERSONS, GROUPS AND ENTITIES REFERRED TO IN ARTICLE 1

• ‘Hamas’, including ‘Hamas-Izz al-Din al-Qassem’
17. ‘Palestinian Islamic Jihad’ — ‘PIJ’.
18. ‘Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine’ — ‘PFLP’.
19. ‘Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine — General Command’ (a.k.a. ‘PFLP — General Command’).

(COMMENT)

HAMAS, as well as several other affiliated and associate activities and entities, are designed as terrorist.

You cannot supply SALW (or any weapons for that matter) to the Gaza Strip.

A review of HAMAS Policy is that reveals that: "Jihad and armed resistance is the correct and authentic means for the liberation of Palestine and the restoration of all rights" is a open Policy of HAMAS. This liberation objective extends beyond the sovereignty over the territory occupied since 1967; a veiled by direct threat to the sovereign integrity to Israel. A policy, which has become an international and regional threat to Peace.

Most Respectfully,
R

The UN does not designate HAMAS as a terrorist organisation, and HAMAS remains on the EU list pending the result of the appeal. Right now, state and non-state actors can do whatever they please as regards supplying weapons to Gaza and/or Palestine.

Wrong again ratboy as the EU has put hamas back on the list of terrorist organisations, don't you read the posts on here that show this. Or do you just look at ones you can hijack with your Jew hatred and deflect away from the truth

Did they use the same bogus information they used the first time?

Though glossed over in your whining, Hamas makes every effort to identify that its conflict with the Jewish State remains deeply ideological. Hamas’s Islamic Terrorist News Network, Al-Aqsa TV has broadcast one of many such raving islamo-Death Cult sermons reaffirming the muhammedan ideology that according to Islam, it is Moslem destiny to exterminate the Jews.

The Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI) has one such sniveling, Death Cult inspired video of an official television broadcast in which a Hamas cleric states:

MEMRI: Hamas Sermon from the Gaza Strip: Our Doctrine Entails Exterminating the Jews

Our belief about fighting you [Jews] is that we will exterminate you, until the last one, and we will not leave of you, even one. For you are the usurpers of the land, foreigners, mercenaries of the present and of all times. Look at history, brothers: Wherever there were Jews, they spread corruption... (Quran): "They spread corruption in the land, and Allah does not like corrupters." Their belief is destructive. Their belief fulfills the prophecy. Our belief is in obtaining our rights on our land, implementing Shari'ah (Islamic law) under Allah's sky.
[Al-Aqsa TV (Hamas), July 25, 2014]

Killing Jews as religious practice is a basic message of Hamas, but as we know, that ideology connects Hamas, Daesh and all the other Islamic Death Cults.

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Oh come now. Is this a sympathy ploy?

Did they use the same bogus information they used the first time?

(COMMENT)

When the time comes for the general population of the world sees HAMAS as an activity that DOES NOT
• Use unlawful act of violence to • Intimidates governments or societies, for the purpose of attaining • Goals to achieve political, religious or ideological objectives, THEN and ONLY THEN can the dialog be started to re-characterized the Jihadist organization that has a long history of past criminal behaves and is still targeting innocent civilians for the purpose of intimidation.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Challenger]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Oh come now. Is this a sympathy ploy?

Did they use the same bogus information they used the first time?

(COMMENT)

When the time comes for the general population of the world sees HAMAS as an activity that DOES NOT
• Use unlawful act of violence to • Intimidates governments or societies, for the purpose of attaining • Goals to achieve political, religious or ideological objectives, THEN and ONLY THEN can the dialog be started to re-characterized the Jihadist organization that has a long history of past criminal behaves and is still targeting innocent civilians for the purpose of intimidation.

Most Respectfully,
R

Acts of resistance to an occupation may have the side effect of intimidation but they're still acts of resistance. Most of the world outside of Western Europe and the USA does not see Hamas as a terrorist organisation.

 

[RoccoR]

Challenger, et al,

The lack of a civil understanding that targeting civilians is NO EXCUSE for the Arab Palestinian to use it as justification. It merely puts Arab Palestinians in the category as poorly developed nations.

P F Tinmore, et al,

Oh come now. Is this a sympathy ploy?

Did they use the same bogus information they used the first time?

(COMMENT)

When the time comes for the general population of the world sees HAMAS as an activity that DOES NOT
• Use unlawful act of violence to • Intimidates governments or societies, for the purpose of attaining • Goals to achieve political, religious or ideological objectives, THEN and ONLY THEN can the dialog be started to re-characterized the Jihadist organization that has a long history of past criminal behaves and is still targeting innocent civilians for the purpose of intimidation.

Most Respectfully,
R

Acts of resistance to an occupation may have the side effect of intimidation but they're still acts of resistance. Most of the world outside of Western Europe and the USA does not see Hamas as a terrorist organisation.

(COMMENT)

There is a broad sense in which terrorism can be understood as “intentionally targeting noncombatants with lethal or severe violence for political purposes”.2 In ethical terms, this formulation seems to capture the salient feature of the practice, the intentional targeting of noncombatants (and not in the context of crime or the like). However, I wish to focus here on terrorism in a narrower sense, as practiced by members of small or weak groups that lack the capacity to field an army and engage in warfare. Henceforth when I speak of terrorism I shall refer to this narrower sense.
SOURCE:

You have to think in braoder strokes.

Most Respectfully,
R